kelceycoe

Nice find. The first video you link to is from 1989 and I never knew belt clips existed with Redbeard and the Governor. The second is from 1992.

You make a good point. We're at that stage where people are just proud to be able to have the set who wants it. Unfortunately unless you buy it sealed or from someone who took very good care of it since they first got it, we're likely faced with "played with" condition, which is unfortunate because those pieces have struggled to survive over the years. Thankfully as an adult I know better about storage and can try and preserve my sets longer than I did as a kid.

First: https://www.ebay.com/itm/267378831449?_skw=6285+lego&epid=13053422059&itmmeta=01KH0F1G4TTF833BZTCC10RJWQ&hash=item3e41053059:g:qKwAAeSwb1doq0pa&itmprp=enc%3AAQALAAAA8GfYFPkwiKCW4ZNSs2u11xA9fUHnLtX0mC4vl92huluV0oiUT5qWqZLgK3jjC%2F%2BrogGZH70CFMiHJ1fPgMCHXAqmwp7%2BFM%2FO%2BmnGU1%2B4bqPOiYbvq9UyJ5n6AcrXFaQvfA6nsMFYv%2FZoQtWop6GSIWCg8Uk2DNQWi8ag8KsnXW07f%2BmrXbTrjS97K9biRQVSCa%2F5dL2Erat4NfV5%2BScn6jeIlBZaIZMVEJ3Yc%2BUEv9qYoxxlCLf35BeexycL84OUTlX%2Fh4m2VndAyq2hy3WxoeZ%2BjmJTXpoS00NEkjDgsZecK3xtIe8TB%2F9sjx4QJnZWEw%3D%3D|tkp%3ABk9SR8qCho-IZw Second (this same seller actually sold 2 copies TO THE SAME BUYER): https://www.ebay.com/itm/317825841141 All 3 copies clearly showed the late 1990 and on disabled version of the cannon sold here in the USA NOT the original shooting cannon many of us got in 1989 here in the USA and that everyone else got throughout the world. The point of bringing this up is because we are at a point where we are hitting critical mass. Sealed copies of these sets are now becoming rarer than ever and original USA versions of these sets are even rarer. Unfortunately, while we can clearly see the cannons in these versions, what we do not know is how later of a version these sets are. Throughout the years, Lego literally changed the molds on many parts - from the heads to the small island base plates to the sharks to the treasure chests and obviously the cannons (it also appears very early European versions had stickers and white flags) and unfortunately the ONLY way to know what year a sealed set was produced is to... gasp... open it! You will be able to date the parts based on these mold changes AND based on the medium shop at home included (<-- the catalog is actually the better way of knowing when that set was produced and over the years the sets from previous years were given updated catalogs in the subsequent years they were released). We also are coming to a time where many users, simply put, no longer care about what's called "period specific" parts, meaning people are not very likely getting the best value for their buck (especially in the case of these sets) and it opens the doors to improper sales and misinformation. It does matter. Not only for authenticity but for the sake of preservation. It definitely matters when choosing the correct head/torso/leg/arms/hands/headgear for some mini-figures, especially the older Black Spaceman from the 1980s. Unfortunately these items are so rare people are practically forced to pay outrageous prices or just simply risk never getting them (i.e., if the seller didn't sell these - and I had seen these expensive versions listed for YEARS and the sellers even getting attacked on Facebook - what would have happened when the seller died - would the family had disposed of these and they become the property of landfills or what?). Scary times folks and a reality to face, eventually nobody gives a crap and that's scary. What' going to happen to unsealed copies of these $1,000 sets in 40 years? Assuming those sets grow the same amount Black Seas had - from $110 (the 1992 version, not the $90 1989 version) to $4,000 in almost 40 years, those $1,000 sets will be worth about $40,000 in 2066. Who in the world will have the money for $40,000 Lego sets? Who even had the money for $8,000 in two sealed Black Seas sets? If you bought these sets and ever plan to open them, PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE make a video of you opening them and ALL OF THE CONTENTS!. This will help many of us in understanding how the parts changed over the years. Bricklink, from my experience, seems to be the more accurate - over Peeron and ReBrickable - in at least noting these changes. Some of my observations are from my memory of owning these sets with some help from looking at sealed sets on Ebay. Also note: This forum seems to have made drastic changes and isn't allowing me to attach images so unfortunately you'll have to use the links. That's why my avatar changed from a rare coin to a generic Jolly Roger flag, my 40KB image was too much for their 1KB limitation, lol.

For now I am missing 1992-1994, if anyone has these please share. 1995: https://www.ebay.com/itm/365955172425?_trkparms=itmf%3D1%26aid%3D1110006%26rkt%3D10%26algo%3DHOMESPLICE.SIM%26mech%3D1%26algv%3DDefaultOrganicWebWithV11WebTrimmedV3VisualRankerWithKnnV3AndUltBRecallAndCassiniEmbRecall%26pmt%3D0%26amclksrc%3DITM%26sd%3D365949586532%26sid%3DAQAKAAAAEA2KNEfcp1iKplmECCKEyuc%3D%26itm%3D365955172425%26noa%3D1%26brand%3DLEGO%26asc%3D20220405142716%26ao%3D1%26rk%3D1%26pid%3D101506%26b%3D1%26mehot%3Dnone%26lsid%3D0%26meid%3D8bb50d205704423b80486e49c982a4d2%26pg%3D4481478&_trksid=p4481478.c101506.m1851 1996: https://www.ebay.com/itm/365951872514?_skw=lego+1996+dealer+catalog&itmmeta=01KFF6MX3YTXWP2KYTY0XB95FM&hash=item55346e6e02:g:jhsAAeSwXlRpAnWJ&itmprp=enc%3AAQALAAAA0O7PUuNWmJ%2B%2BUShgI9tQz%2Fo6JSIIGsnScBys2h9u2nC8Stqlb6tXDdrOWkUY2l%2FU%2BlUraSCCxQkke8C90Dc%2F2MkuufYNL4KrP--5fR121JHVSFPshTDTTmyDSnys%2FLxob%2B6MhBSP7s7E21o4hKG7L3aqjRrk1Tsoq9q%2BXyR3i%2BTLkU4gTin7ssRC4NIadkDf9EQz8lKVqAkeuoEkiVNTMQ7cvbApCO%2FH8EFQJ3%2BC%2FQsOY7YLlpXr3qmBU%2Bd5p3a2Q2ItKx%2BtboE3vMKkejuzPXY%3D|tkp%3ABk9SR5LS0-b7Zg 1997: https://www.ebay.com/itm/365949586532?_skw=lego+dealer+catalog+1990&itmmeta=01KFESEQSXNYE6A3CBPN6F7YDH&hash=item55344b8c64:g:e9kAAeSw2HRpAQAj&itmprp=enc%3AAQALAAAA0O7PUuNWmJ%2B%2BUShgI9tQz%2Fr6TwFnMpVSGIG%2FdB5DlwT4Kj5%2BjSgpu6XNnZA%2B2Qd3WEj4tTS9AivN7M%2F1ADcsCBQ%2Bo7cR72LmwKblgPrWEET9Z4cbIc%2BOfQNDrywnWlKZUqK1wvUSL9SRX8qXa0fCUMqh71VVdvoC%2BlJPjK%2FiK6oEC%2BHDmkuVD0yuagH5B%2F2QtN72dxWjgBLFFwmP%2Bah5TKJLGFl7gtkpSIkFE7bgIfSjg71P6bvO2hThPL5e14P%2B80SOmDL8EXkN1GRN0uFCVOs%3D|tkp%3ABk9SR5j9utn7Zg 1998: https://www.ebay.com/itm/365947738737?_skw=lego+dealer+catalog+1990&itmmeta=01KFESEQSXBEE3MK14KRN1ZP6X&hash=item55342f5a71:g:TvQAAeSw0cxo~7i8&itmprp=enc%3AAQALAAAA0O7PUuNWmJ%2B%2BUShgI9tQz%2FpCzbRyG90WtwgWYP0lwY1gsbjA6W3weMYPegz2X6miiHPUdEfQZeH0XeVjOLk57woM%2B2yBwxJqW7vHTk%2BZcqQXXWB5SNVojWie%2FdcS8qZFPQaUtZP6He5M6lrMqVKy0Vwt%2BXWLfk%2BNvYztOESM03%2FUmV1KRWYq6DGXpbIMcP%2BHhtnnYZqMvUVc2WyOxHKoPr5etkTSYZOeKJkW0r3p%2B2H8W0H9EkHUPR7mZ0p3u8uM0wioBeRxBcJmLepDYxFc%2Fcw%3D|tkp%3ABk9SR5j9utn7Zg

Another sold Ebay listing, not from me: https://www.ebay.com/itm/366022903083?_skw=lego+1991+dealer+catalog&itmmeta=01KFF6K1HC0YMEGDMNMZ7RSKNN&hash=item5538aa452b:g:lRYAAeSw0rRpKExM&itmprp=enc%3AAQALAAAA8O7PUuNWmJ%2B%2BUShgI9tQz%2FpkcOipFwBZVMEM10cEJDTEcxtfXe%2Frw0FgBEe%2FYZtsRWlcSVsBM4erwQV%2B2LHOPa%2BVHF2XkvYBPIdImuBd29Hfz1k58rOG8tyeMHKbW0XcBku32C9Risw1ZG9N6BSsQHi42GoY9VrO4bzDNkkfeDX9pgOmF7%2Bok7QHWCIoBDyKwCRLmT%2B7nlm8Kb89Nt06CXeZyBprt63z2oIp0CXHvSvy8XZJ%2Bg0KUfBDcxWIpF%2B3kXsBrUE8zArYD76NQ8Y%2BFHDPuTtxWqbqLqSp1z6Gj5qOy5npmslPDdLHbgjw%2B1visQ%3D%3D|tkp%3ABk9SR4CZzOb7Zg

I can't find if anyone else posted this but after the top left 2 cannons (firing / black handle), the non-firing cannons on the left use the newer, smaller Lego logo. The ones on the right match the logo seen in the shooting / firing cannons which were issued here in the USA. This information can help you to better pinpoint which group of cannons you may own. You can view all 4 variations here:

I am happy to announce I have found a sold copy of the 1990 Dealer Catalog and am linking the page below - (you will want to save the images before Ebay purges it). This isn't mine and I definitely would never [pay the $425 price wanted. The catalog, in some ways, reaffirms what we already know. Here in the USA, the rest of the Pirates sets were released in 1990. There were two quarters that featured Pirates commercials with Jack the Lego Maniac as part of the LEGOLAND theme - First quarter (December 1989-January) and October-December-1990. Some commercials can be found here: And because I keep reading about the "Inventor" commercials they started years ago, here's one. You can find the rest on Youtube: However, what really made me bawling my eyes out was the actual 20 foot store display sample showing EXACTLY WHERE THE PIRATE SETS WERE SET ON THE SHELVES. I always remembered Black Seas being on the bottom because I always sat down on the store floor and stared at the inlay of the set (even though I already had the set lol). Plus we get some interesting facts about the new and popular Christmas sets from that era, the then-new Build-A-Bunny, and we learn about Impulse sets, Trial Size Promotion Sets. No where in this catalog does it suggest the release date for ANY Legoland set (except the trial size/impulse versions) which means we still don't have hard evidence dating the 1990 Pirate sets, we're only left to assume our memories of buying Pirates sets in early 1990 and thus getting black handled cannons before the later releases that year came with the non-firing single piece cannon (which dominated the USA Pirate and Western market over the next decade). https://www.ebay.com/itm/366025610707?_skw=lego+dealer+catalog+1990&itmmeta=01KFESEQSXSQHMF8Q4ZEGCE4JW&hash=item5538d395d3:g:X-gAAeSw6TVpKgMZ&itmprp=enc%3AAQALAAAA8O7PUuNWmJ%2B%2BUShgI9tQz%2Frp%2FuUnMG41nLnhCSDw%2BurGsv6jHYGZL%2Fi9UDf6OufuRicc2rTslR%2BR8h1Eppge6r6QZl%2F1eOGjEhAyxq7GHN1ob6%2BOMNIvN8YFtVWecoNc5dJBq2eA%2FajZnXQi%2BOKDL7xJNiStcRDgm6ZhMvL99huSEbcvyQy8xWXOwbXjoeD0%2BcIkAa8SqIWA4P%2BJFeqhNZrZy%2FNPOBhvUEJ6Vx%2BmVyUbHtm7Eg%2BXbf6l1lDiVlJFb6wrrD9PYmi9QG%2FqvNzeIKekN6kQvVpom1kYnb2tvarqywWNp29OKlMGtsoOkQT9tg%3D%3D|tkp%3ABk9SR5j9utn7Zg

I may be generalizing too much. You can tell the difference between an American box and boxes that many fans claimed are from the UK but may just as well be European boxes. For the 1989-1992 (about that time) American boxes had the ages listed on the front. European boxes listed these on one of the sides. That's the only way to tell looking at the boxes online. I've never had an European box so I am unable to know much else (like weight difference, dimensions, etc).

After doing some more research, a user on Facebook gave some brief info about the set, saying it was a promotional limited set and gave box pics: https://www.facebook.com/share/p/1DFo2zNeSg/ And the guy who supplied the info for this post talked bout it possibly being a Woolworth exclusive: Quote: My original info is still what I have and had it kind of confirmed by some more online research. The set was only sold during a brief period in 1990 in Woolworths UK. I also heard it got handed out as part of a promo, but that would be contradicted by the price label (so at least no free promo). Maybe it was a set you could get for a low price as a store bonus or something like that. Information is still VERY scarce. If you have any more info (or even photos of other sold sets with price stickers), please let me know!"

Under normal circumstances I'd agree but I cannot when the price is wrong lol. As for 1680... The ONLY evidence in existence that hints it was sold in the UK is the UK box found for this set on Bricklink: And this older listing on facebook complete with a woolworth price sticker: It was sold recently in E-bay from a seller in Bulgaria for over $300 USD - ONLY the parts and instructions and that person did list the full instructions, confirming that version of the set was made in 1990. https://www.ebay.com/itm/277008332939?_skw=lego+1680&epid=9053424680&itmmeta=01K7FWCDEESQ0GC90V68XMYTHS&hash=item407efbb88b:g:9GkAAOSwMKFn8SCn&itmprp=enc%3AAQAKAAAA8FkggFvd1GGDu0w3yXCmi1eNLZvw3DrfpGhZiHaFxIsDua%2BZNLlntY2fTGU75LBj%2BJlwsqkypWea4WOVws2cBbgqOCD52bvbMx8SPWERJZJ0TZ340CVMi%2BDPQ%2B5YeM7tI7yYcEpOs8AGL92eS%2BI5x6FppPSOD%2FIZldIs6259OyPwImUrizd33UyJA5tSQ1T4AI3XrWWvX3%2Fi3z0cdjkq0M3lUeylKbScrWb5TOH3lbxO9DR57szMjgw9WUVsv9GAe39%2BQLmvWyhR2zZ%2B18R51MTnBaDBgMXssqQunhPm00e0HpcvI6%2B4w8NmSMs%2FC4HOLg%3D%3D|tkp%3ABk9SR7DXsfy7Zg Also, in reference to 1877... pretty much any Value Pack I have found back then was only sold in the USA. I did not see it or 1680 in the 1990 UK catalog so

Those were both done by a flat bed scanner. Some of mine were done using a phone because my flat bed scanner has issues.

For 1680, I just bought the 1877 set and bought a separate extra minifigure because it was way cheaper than buying 1680 outright. That sold was sold in stores here in the United States. UPDATE; Photos removed because I linked to the 1989 Value pack set with the cart with the black fences. I cannot find any instance of 1680 in any UK catalog but 1877 does appear in the US Medium catalog on the Futuron page.

That is 100% correct! I had the Black Seas Barracuda, Eldorado Fortress and Forbidden Island in the same year (1989) and mine all had firing cannons!

Yes that is accurate. Those sets came to retail stores officially here in the USA in 1990. I do not know anything about Canada yet. As you will see in the page from the 1989 Shop at Home Catalog here in the United States, these four sets were available to those of us here in the United States starting August 1, 1989: Pirate Mini-Figures, Shipwreck Island, Castaway Raft, and Sabre Island They were also for sale in the Holiday 1989 catalog: https://www.flickr.com/photos/203530674@N07/albums/72177720329114990/with/54797131271/ As mentioned already, Lego Club members here in the United States could ONLY buy Buried Treasure and Harbour Sentry from the club magazine. If you look here, this is a Christmas catalog from Sears USA from 1989. This link should take you directly where the Lego Pirates sets are listed - only the "big four" I call them. They were marketed as having working cannons as well.

I posted somewhere else on this board that, yes while the first 4 big Pirate sets were first made to us in 1989, through the 1989 SAH catalog we could buy most of the other sets the UK got. And that bundle was a cool thing Leo did for club members. To clarify: As far as I can tell, only 6285 Black Seas Barracuda, 6276 Eldorado Fortress, 6270 Forbidden Island and 6274 Caribbean Clipper were actually sold in stores. The others COULD be bought here in the US but either through the 1989 shop at home catalog or that club magazine.