Do Train Fans Look Down on Harry Potter Trains?

[Artifex]

Everybody seems to love the Emerald Night, but to the eyes of a complete newbie train fan-wanna be like me they look similar. But I've never seen anyone even mention the Hogwarts Express as a good train or a good train model. I know there's no engine, so is that waht puts the HE out of the "train game"?

[kyphur]

In my opinion...

All 3 versions of Hogwarts Express are in the same category as the Toy Story Train, they were all designed not from the angle of making a good train but rather of making a set that fits into the theme (eitervHP or TS). The effect of this is that as a train they are simplistic.

A good example of this is that while both trains are steam engines neither had the steam pistions that drive the wheels on a real steam engine. Now look at the emerald night, it has the drivers. Granted the few steam locomotives from the 90's are also lacking the steam drivers but those models are from 15 plus years ago not the current era like the emerald night.

I think this is the problem with "theme trains", they are more about the theme and don't really care much about being good trains.

This doesn't mean that I look down on any of them, I just don't see them fitting into my LEGO Train collection.

Edited July 4, 2012 by kyphur

[Andy Glascott]

One of the (many) things I love about the 12v era is that you could build, usually small tank-style, steam engines with the working drive rods that came with the 12v motor set. The lack of that detail on subsequent train sets until the EN was a big disappointment for me. (I did try to build larger steam locos in 12v but never had the larger wheels.) Once I discovered BB wheels my imagination went wild!

The HP and TS trains just don't have the detail, as has been said, and for me were never even close to being on my shopping lists.

Andy

Edited July 3, 2012 by Andy Glascott

[lightningtiger]

Hogwarts Express was purely made for kids to push along a carpeted floor, it would take modifying it to the hilt to make it a true Lego train with PF or even 9V motors.

I never brought HE for that reason, all the other later HP sets yes, except for the train.

[LegoSjaak]

My simple answer to your question, Yes, i think trainfans do look down on these trains... I never even thought about buying one.. you triggered me to think about it for the first time, but it didn't take long for me to be sure i wouldn't buy one...

Greetz, LegoSjaak

[domboy]

Um, aren't there four versions?

We have:

4708 Hogwarts Express

4758 Hogwarts Express (2nd edition)

10132 Motorized Hogwarts Express

4841 Hogwarts Express (3rd edition)

10132 at least ought to be considered a "real train". It has real train wheels, came with 9V track, speed regulator, etc. And it was released well before the drivers from the Emerald Night were designed.

I agree the first two versions aren't very good, and they used car wheels instead of train wheels, but 10132 and 4841 fixed that. 4841 should be easy to motorize on 9V, but I agree PF would take a bit more work. It does seem that Lego at least somewhat intended it to be motorized, or why include real train wheels, and why does the item description on Lego.com for the 88002 power functions train motor actually say "May be used to motorize #4841 Hogwart’s Express or #7597 Western Train Chase". (Wasn't sure if it was ok to post the link to the Lego.com site or not.) No, 4841 wasn't intended to be an adult/teen/older child model like the Emerald Night, so I'm not surprised it doesn't include the drivers... that would make it more complicated (unless you leave out the pistons like the Toy Story Train).

All that to say, first two the second two

Of course, I'm not enough of a Harry Potter fan to own any of the sets, but the trains are the most interesting part of the line to me...

Edited July 3, 2012 by domboy

[harnbak]

Maybe I am the only one here owing a 4841 and two additional carriages.

It is true though that my kids and seeing the Potter movies triggered the buy:

it was due to the theme and not the build. I would like to exchange them for the Emerald Night any time...

Motoring the tender with 12v was no problem at all...

[rday1982]

Um, aren't there four versions?

We have:

4708 Hogwarts Express

4758 Hogwarts Express (2nd edition)

10132 Motorized Hogwarts Express

4841 Hogwarts Express (3rd edition)

10132 at least ought to be considered a "real train". It has real train wheels, came with 9V track, speed regulator, etc. And it was released well before the drivers from the Emerald Night were designed.

All that to say, first two the second two

Of course, I'm not enough of a Harry Potter fan to own any of the sets, but the trains are the most interesting part of the line to me...

I definitely agree with this. My Hogwarts Express modification uses a lot of the 3rd Edition set (with big drivers, and a bit more detail. And valve gear, when I get the parts) and a 9V motor under the tender (I'll switch that out at some point as I don't like the look of it, and put the motor in a brake van at the rear of the train).

The Olton Hall is a gorgeous steam locomotive, so the fact that TLG didn't do a good job of the first two sets is pretty galling. I can understand why train AFOLs wouldn't look twice at them. But the third and the motorised version are wonderful train parts packs if nothing else.

I think the best Olton Hall/Hogwarts Express MOC I've seen is the one by Bricktrix. It's got so many nice little details, and manages to capture the shape of the real thing nicely. By contrast, mine is very much an approximation. In fact, it's not even complete.

TLG should never have released it without actual Lego train wheels IMO, and they should have at least had a go at one with the big drivers from the EN once they were released. But the third edition train is very much the right direction, if not QUITE the right balance between realism and KFOL play value (the lack of drivers is almost made up for by them finally getting it to look more-or-less like an actual Hall class locomotive, and little touches like the cab detail/firebox).

I don't "look down on" these trains, but I do think that the way they did them could be further evidence that somebody at TLG has some sort of grudge against AFOL train builders. I mean, the refusal to use the right wheels, the first two hardly looking like trains, and the relatively limited numbers of the motorized version all point to TLG wanting to distance their Hogwarts Express from being a "train set".

Edited July 3, 2012 by rday1982

[Nagyzee]

Everybody seems to love the Emerald Night, but to the eyes of a complete newbie train fan-wanna be like me they look similar. But I've never seen anyone even mention the Hogwarts Express as a good train or a good train model. I know there's no engine, so is that waht puts the HE out of the "train game"?

Just look at the wheels.

[LovinLegoSince97]

I wouldnt consider buying these trains....Nothing against them or anyone who does like them...the reason I state this is because I am trying to create a small city that is realistic and with as many details I can think up and throw in there...The harry potter stuff dosnt do anything for me, unless of course I was building a harry potter themed city...then you take the express to and from the castle and what not...I read a couple Harry Potter books as a child. they are great stories in my opinion. They do not do anything for me Lego wise..

[escortmad79]

It would've received more credibility if it, in particular the last one was a bit more lifelike to go with Emerald Night. It would've made it a lot more appealing to older Lego fans (TFOLS/AFOLS) together with younger fans.

Maybe one day there will be a realistic one released but don't count on it.

[Hrw-Amen]

I think for me the Harry Potter one was simply down to the either non-train wheels or very small train wheels making it look very un-train like.

With the Toy Story one I am actually considering buying it, but have been waiting to see if anyone has it on offer. I am not too keen on all the characters and toy story bits but I do see some potential for the engine being modified into something half passable as a good train with a bit of thought. Not to mention that all those extra bits for rolling stock would be useful.

[Davey]

I wouldn't necessarily say that Train fans "look down on" the Hogwarts Express sets...at least I don't. Personally, I think they are a great set when taken for what they are. They aren't designed to be a D2C direct representation of the Olton Hall engine. What they are, as others have stated, is a nice little set that captures the feel of the Hogwarts Express while still using pieces and building techniques that fit in with the age group (8-14) they are targeting with the set. An 8 year old isn't (generally) going to be able to build something to the level of the Emerald Night. Additionally, they have a price point to hit and these sets do that.

What I love about all of the Hogwarts Express sets is that they give you a starting point to work from. If you look at the version I built, I pretty much took one of the standard sets and set about modifying it to my liking. That's the beauty of LEGO.

So, I don't (nor do I think we should) look down on the standard Hogwarts Express sets. They serve a valid purpose and, if anything, I hope they encourage the younger (8-14) builders to take a look at trains.

- Davey -

[just2good]

This topic spawned question from me... Do train fans look down to the Monster Fighters Ghost Train and the Time Cruiser Twisted Time Train for the same reason?

[stacker9000]

Do train fans look down to the Monster Fighters Ghost Train and the Time Cruiser Twisted Time Train for the same reason?

I would agree with Davey's comment of these sets encourage a younger group and their parents into getting interested in Lego trains.

As a TFOL, I greatly appreciate these sets for helping make known that LEGO trains exist, although I haven't bought any due to the fact that I would rather just but CITY train sets or the sets aimed directly for TFOL's.

Great question though, with interesting answers too!

[Davey]

This topic spawned question from me... Do train fans look down to the Monster Fighters Ghost Train and the Time Cruiser Twisted Time Train for the same reason?

If you look at the Ghost Train, it really is a great "parts pack" for steam trains. What you might not realize (unless you look at the parts inventory on Bricklink) is that not only do you get the 4 Flanged Drivers, you also get 2 Blind Drivers as well. So, you end up with enough wheels to build a 4-6-0 steam engine. Additionally, you get some really nice black macaroni and other "boiler bits". As I mentioned before, the Ghost Train (like the Hogwarts Express) has a different market than the Emerald Night. However, if you look at the components, it really is a fantastic parts pack...especially at its $79.99 price point.

- Davey -

[TheLegoDr]

I'm not a true train fan. This might even be my first post in the train forum. But I was drawn to the Emerald Night. It is so beautiful. Unfortunately I did not procure one before it went discontinued so now I never will get one due to cost. But I do own the Hogwarts Express (huge HP fan) and I found that train to be brilliant. Now, as stated, I am not a train fan so to be "realistic" isn't reason enough for me to not buy it. But it is amazing how the EN will draw in even non-train fans like myself. Lego must have hit themselves out of the park with that model.

[mikka says]

i sort of dont see any of us train fans "looking down" as you perceive it. it's a very nice train.

but as its been there for a while, it uses constuction designs to make it easy for kids to build, not to faithfully represent a steam loco.

but i dont think it makes it any less attractive for train fans.

In all honesty though, i'd love to get the train, (minus car and minifigures) and modify it with some proper wheels and pushrods (big bens Medium ones) and just mod some of the features to make it look like the engine it originally intended to represent.

[peterab]

While I haven't bought any of the Hogwart's trains, I don't really look down on them more than any other train. Since I'm mostly into building mocs, I judge them like any other set.

My normal criteria are 1) does the train appeal to my tastes as a set. 2) Does it have enough useful parts to be a good parts pack.

The last Hogwart's was at least worth considering, but I'm a German train fan so it fails criteria 1). I already have a bunch of red train windows, I don't use a lot of train bases since I build longer 7 wide carriages, and there were no large drivers, so it didn't make criteria 2) either. Being a licensed theme made it a bit pricey too.

[jonwil]

The last Hogwarts set is a good parts pack, especially with the medium blue of the car.

[WesternOutlaw]

Interesting topic. I purchased the 9V HP train a few years back (10132) and actually like it. The station was a fantastic little building that can easily be used for train and town layouts. Aside from the transition to bley track, I think the set was among the best of the HP trains.

My issue with HP/Hogwart trains is that LEGO keeps making different models and still has not created a really detailed model. This train is so iconic that it lends itself to a nicely detailed hobby train like the Emerald Night. I think AFOL would love it as well as HP fans.

[fred67]

I have the latest, and one of the older, HP trains. I wish they'd done a better job, certainly, but I motorized the first one (I have yet to build the second one) and think it's OK as a mediocre train.

Someone else mentioned it being in the same league as the Toy STroy train, but I disagree - the Toy Story train is really cool as a play item, I use it on my Christmas layouts (I wouldn't use it in a "realistic" layout).

As for comparisons with the EN, the EN is a much better version of the Hogwarts Express (although the details don't really match). If only someone did it in red...

I've done this MOD myself - it's the closest "official" set I think you'll ever see to match the Hogwarts Express, unless TLG decides to make a UCS Hogwarts... which would be awesome, but I wouldn't hold my breath.

Edited July 4, 2012 by fred67

[LovinLegoSince97]

I have the latest, and one of the older, HP trains. I wish they'd done a better job, certainly, but I motorized the first one (I have yet to build the second one) and think it's OK as a mediocre train.

Someone else mentioned it being in the same league as the Toy STroy train, but I disagree - the Toy Story train is really cool as a play item, I use it on my Christmas layouts (I wouldn't use it in a "realistic" layout).

As for comparisons with the EN, the EN is a much better version of the Hogwarts Express (although the details don't really match). If only someone did it in red...

I've done this MOD myself - it's the closest "official" set I think you'll ever see to match the Hogwarts Express, unless TLG decides to make a UCS Hogwarts... which would be awesome, but I wouldn't hold my breath.

Very Very Nice fred! props. thanks for the post

[Duq]

As someone earlier said: just look at the wheels. The Hogwarts sets don't look like steam trains, they look like those cars you sometimes see in theme parks, dressed up to look like a train.

I think Lego missed a chance to do a great Hogwarts Express when at the time of the last installment they had the large drivers available.

As a parts pack these sets are a nono for me because of the license price.

The Toy Story Western train at half price (€50) was a great parts pack. I haven't seen a similar reduction on the Hogwarts train sets.