Starter Questions: Track, Electronics, & Cost

[Zeon]

Hello Everyone!

I have a plan to get involved into trains at some degree. My main goal is to establish a (temporary, since it has to cross some rooms) train line between my classic town and my son's lego city. I would like to have your kind responses in some questions that would help me starting on this project.

- As far as I understand, there are different track "standards", the newest being the non-electronic plastic track (including the flexi track). My educated guess is there are differences between the gauges there. Could you please tell me if a) how do I differentiate between these track types (mostly in BL terms) and b) which is the most budget friendly option for building long single lines (10-20 meters)

- As far as I see from my limited research, there are different electronic sets for the trains, 4.5V, 9V, PF etc. I guess the cheapest option (with the most future upgrades) is the PF one. a) am I right? b) do the PF-operated trains lack the ability to actually have switches on the tracks? (to choose between tracks when forked)

- What would be the cheapest option to start with such a project? I have about 150 system sets to start building, so buying motors, wheels, lights used on BL could be an option. (The alternatives are to buy used sets on BL and buy new sets in retail. I have a little handicap here, since I live in Europe and the Lego sets are 1.5x-2x more expensive.)

- My son is 4 years old, so the trains should be kind of safe for him.

That's it at first, thank you for your kind answers in advance,

Hatalmas

[mattman]

4.5V and 12V

+ cool factor just because they are old and have a very vintage lego look

+ 12V you get fun stuff like remote switches

- cost $$$

9V

+ not as dear as 12V, alot of nicer looking sets

+ still doesn't require a battery box

+ track more readily available than older sets

- track not overly cheap either ($4 each section)

- no longer in production/no new sets

- like 12V the track does have some small current across it (though not enough to harm really)

PF

+ cheap, new sets coming out, readily available

+ cheap track - can buy it off the shelf in your toy store

+ safer being battery operated - nothing nasty exposed

- have to cater for battery boxes as part of train

I personally run 9V just because I had a set from before I really got into it, but I can also run PF on the same track. I'd probably recommend you start in PF if safety and availability of track/new sets is a concern.

Matt

[AndyC]

The 4.5V battery system used seperate left and right rail pieces in blue, held together by plates. The 12V system switched these to individual grey rails and included a central power rail too.

9V brought pre-molded rail sections with sleepers included and with metal rails to transfer power. Finally the RC/PF rails are effectively all plastic versions of the old 9V rails, since they are battery driven systems and don't need the power feed making them cheaper and easier to produce. The PF rails also include the smaller flexi track pieces which are useful for fixing up track layouts that don't quite reach or making longer curves.

In all cases the gauge is the same, so called L-gauge, which has a four studs gap between rails. 9V and RC/PF rails can be connected directly together and with a little ingenuity can be connected to the older 4.5/12V segments too. PF rails are probably your best bet and you needn't worry, as switches are readily available for those tracks too.

[alois]

The 4.5V battery system used seperate left and right rail pieces in blue, held together by plates. The 12V system switched these to individual grey rails and included a central power rail too.

This is not true. The difference between the 4,5 volt and 12 volt system was not the colour of the track. 4,5 and 12 volt track exists in both colours. The only difference is that blue track was made before 1980, and grey track between 1980 and 1990, and has a better coupling between rails and sleepers. So blue 12 volt track with a central power rail does exist, as does grey 4,5 volt track.

[AndyC]

This is not true. The difference between the 4,5 volt and 12 volt system was not the colour of the track. 4,5 and 12 volt track exists in both colours. The only difference is that blue track was made before 1980, and grey track between 1980 and 1990, and has a better coupling between rails and sleepers. So blue 12 volt track with a central power rail does exist, as does grey 4,5 volt track.

Well you learn something every day. So in that case the only real difference between 4.5V and 12V track is the middle rail. In any case it's probably still best avoided for someone just getting into trains as 12V stuff is pretty costly these days and there's no real advantage to using 4.5V track over modern PF pieces.

[Snapshot]

- As far as I see from my limited research, there are different electronic sets for the trains, 4.5V, 9V, PF etc. I guess the cheapest option (with the most future upgrades) is the PF one. a) am I right? b) do the PF-operated trains lack the ability to actually have switches on the tracks? (to choose between tracks when forked)

In my opinion the only rational choice if you're starting from scratch is to use what's currently in production - PF/RC track and PF trains. 7939 is a good starter set as it includes a reasonable amount of track including a couple of switches (they most certainly do exist). You can buy a pack of 8 straights and 16 flexitracks (ugh!) or 2 switches and 4 curves from Lego or you can pick up extra straights, switches and curves on BL. Expect to pay around 1.8 euros per straight and a lot less for curves. Also note that the station and level crossing sets both include 4 sections of straight track.

Edited November 5, 2011 by Snapshot

[Duq]

9V

- like 12V the track does have some small current across it (though not enough to harm really)

PF

+ safer being battery operated - nothing nasty exposed

Sorry, I have comment on this.

First of all, there is no such thing as current across the tracks. There is a potential difference or electric tension between the tracks. Until something connects them there is no current. If that something is an electric motor then the current will run through the motor making it turn. If that something is your fingers then there will be a tiny current running through you but not enough to feel. If you would manage to lick the tracks you would feel a little tingle in your tongue.

So nothing nasty is exposed with 9V or 12V.

For a layout at home PF is fine but I've found that at events, in a larger room with fluorescent lighting, the signal can be a problem, even at only 5 meters.

A big advantage of the PF system for play value is that you can have a number of trains on the same track.

So it depends what you want; for home I would just go PF; as mentioned above it's easily available, track is cheap and it's fun to play with. If you want to take part in events then 9V may be a better choice.

Either way, safety should no play part in your decision.

[Zeon]

Thank you all for your kind and patient responses. I have only one question left: if I'm getting it right, whenever I buy something (7939 looks good for a start, thank you) and that's L-gauge and I can attach it with my (future) existing train, it will work? (I'm sure will have a look at the starter set's wheels and spacing, but are there different kinds of wheels for example?)

Thank you

[Duq]

Yes, wheels have changed over the years, as have the coupling magnets, but the track gauge hasn't. You can buy set 721 from 1969 and it'll run on the same track as last years 7939 and pull its cars as well.

[6studs]

This is not true. The difference between the 4,5 volt and 12 volt system was not the colour of the track. 4,5 and 12 volt track exists in both colours. The only difference is that blue track was made before 1980, and grey track between 1980 and 1990, and has a better coupling between rails and sleepers. So blue 12 volt track with a central power rail does exist, as does grey 4,5 volt track.

You can check a chronological train system table at RailBricks #8 (page 14-15). Indeed the difference is not in the color.

The difference was the target audience. 12V was aimed at an older audience than 4.5V.

It's interesting to see that TLC supported two systems for 20 years. In our modern days, TLC could have supported thesame way both 9V and PFS.

Didier Enjary

Edited November 6, 2011 by 6studs

[Sokratesz]

It's interesting to see that TLC supported two systems for 20 years. In our modern days, TLC could have supported thesame way both 9V and PFS.

Didier Enjary

Except the public now is a lot less forgiving and a lot easier bored than 40 years ago :)