DanNeely

Eurobricks Vassals
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  1. DanNeely

    (mostly) MOC: Another Saturn V tower

    I haven't had a lot to show for the last few days because I've spent most of it trying unsuccessfully to get any of several alternate hinging setups to work out nicely in the taller sections of the tower (principally the 0-30 and 30-60 gaps, but owing to the influence of the roof bricks in the tapers legs the 60-80 foot section's slightly taller than the other 20 foot platforms too). At this point I've fallen back on the old 26407 based anchoring system and have paint pens on order from Amazon; if I can't get good results with them or other paints I'm probably just going to end up with white landings. I do have some limited progress on the 1st arm though, by tilting the piping slightly I was able to connect both output O2 pipes into the one feeding into the arm. Lack of space closer in meant I still had to merge them before going out to the arm. The arm itself has been tweaked with the piping connected a bit nicer now. I do currently have 2 different designs for the tip of the arm, the one above which has a better shape for the white part at the bottom of the arm, but which has it and not the red/yellow upper structure in contact with the rocket and one which has that correct but the wrong orientation for the slope at the bottom of the white part (below). Unless I can squeeze a plate out of the hinge itself though I can't combine the good parts of the two alternates because they use different bricks to rotate the studs back to vertical instead of oriented along the arm. I'm not sure which design I'm going to use yet, but am leaning towards the latter. The actual arm for reference: The last thing I've played with has been the pricing of whatever I use to clad the pipes, it worked out as about $75 to do it with 500 2 brick tall 62462's - which have the liability of a slot on one side - or $105 for 1000 1 stud high 18564's. Not sure which way I'm going to jump at present, I will probably order a dozen or so of the latter (I'll need some for shorter segments either way) and seeing what they actually look like in use.
  2. DanNeely

    (mostly) MOC: Another Saturn V tower

    I've got a first pass at the LOX piping from L30 to Arm #1. The valve complex is still in placeholder purple. Realistically though, although it's nothing but fiddlybits, the scale's almost certainly too small to detail anything there, so it'll end up staying just a box. Biggest disappointment so far is that while I was able to get 2 pipes coming out of the valves the inner one of the two is conflicting with the stairs and can't be ran forward to the arm. I could shift them half a stud in the valve complex itself to avoid that problem, but would then be lacking in any suitably compact way to connect them to the axle the arm's turning on; which would be offset by half a stud. Beyond that, I'll probably end up tweaking the connection to the arm itself to use a universal joint and eliminate the staggered connection at the tip.
  3. DanNeely

    (mostly) MOC: Another Saturn V tower

    Thank you. I've redone the top stair/ladder once again/ This version's a bot less messy looking around the landing. The only way it's not quite perfect is that the top section is sitting on the edge of the stud. I can tilt it back enough that I can fit a tile on top, but that leaves the top section almost vertical.
  4. DanNeely

    (mostly) MOC: Another Saturn V tower

    I've found diagrams for the LH2/LOX piping in the tower itself. Trip Niven is building an extremely detailed model of both the LUT and the surrounding launch complex. He pointed me to the Yahoo Groups LUT_Group, and the extensive collection of engineering drawings that someone had compiled there. Sometime after I'd given up on the group, assuming it completely dead, my request to join was approved. The diagrams there do include ones clearly showing the LH2/LOX piping in the tower. I'm not sure if equivalent detail is available for the ECS piping, but as I linked above I've found images good enough to work that out if need be. I haven't done much on the actual tower the last 2 days, I have come up with a slightly less tortured setup for the ladders to the tower roof/crane though by using a different sort of hinge.
  5. DanNeely

    (mostly) MOC: Another Saturn V tower

    It wasn't all doom and gloom today though. I redid the exterior piping using the affordable coupler, painted the bottom of the trusses white, and then went through adjusting out rare/overpriced bricks. With the fences and box trusses (I ordered both of them last month) removed, bricklink priced the remainder of the model at $430 (plus probably $100 in shipping - most parts were from the wrong side of the Atlantic); to that I can probably knock $3-60 or so off because I ordered most of the old A-frame bricks and some assorted ones from higher up to pad out my rare parts orders. Not cheap, but the cost hasn't completely gotten out of hand either, so I'm fairly happy. Still TODO: 1) The platform walls (waiting to see how exactly eiffleman did them for his space shuttle launch platform) 2) Find a way to fit the gearing to connect the two sets of control arms that's out of the way. 3) piping from the sides of the tower to the arms 4) Piping on the arms, along with tweaking their appearance slightly. Probably not to the same level of detail as NathanR's design, partly because the box trusses leave me less freedom to route piping, and partly because I find some of the more tortured construction needed to match the convoluted piping designs rather ugly and am willing to sacrifice realism for aesthetics. 4.5) Access walkways to the arms. 5) Make the crane functional. 5.5) Final decision on functional elevator, and implementation. 6) Redo the tail masts to be retractable, better adjust the hold downs to fit with the larger 14x14 opening (vs the 12x12 they were designed for). 6.5) Add camera platforms (have design, so just need to insert them). 7) Misc external piping. 8) Misc control boxes. 9) Something to simulate the cable runs? These're roughly ordered in terms of priority, but #1's blocked by a 3rd party, #2's still stuck on being annoying and having frustrated me a week ago. #3 is still semi-blocked due to research limitations. For #9, wedging plates vertically between studs looks like it'd work reasonably well for the upper levels, but the 30 foot gaps at the bottom would need a hypothetical 1x9 tile to fit right. Also there doesn't appear to be a way to wedge the tiles in there using either LDD or stud.io (although I know the digital format supports it since the flag tile from the SV set itself is wedged into place). 7-9 are probably going to be done last just because they're going to be in the way of everything else so much. 5.5 may be forced by what I do with the stairs because my concept using bars would block the shaft for a moving car. Beyond that though, if there aren't going to be cars I can extend the floor plates through the shaft making the floor stronger and reducing the total part count. Conversely, if I do have a working elevator, I'd need to open doors all along the shaft, and build a hoist mechanism into the machine room.
  6. DanNeely

    (mostly) MOC: Another Saturn V tower

    Keeping the stair design as it was before but with gray landings turns out not to be an option either. There aren't enough gray 26047's available to do all the stair cases. I played around with a few more variations of my plan C from above, trying an attachment to the 48336 on the bottom, but it needed an extension to the top stairs to have something to hold it in place and is really gappy around the landing. I tried bulking things up to fill in the gap, but the bottom stairs end up really chunky and end up protruding forward an extra stud. That in turn sent me back to an old design that I'd tried and rejected previously, using a bar stuck into the elevator shaft as an anchor for the clips. Having the bar in the way makes a mess of the other stairs though. I'm half tempted to use this but with the stairs installed backwards (with the lower segment against the elevator shaft instead of the upper one) because it'd look a lot better.
  7. DanNeely

    (mostly) MOC: Another Saturn V tower

    My late night idea about how to keep the stairs all red didn't work. The brick attaching them at the top needs to only be 1 stud (or 3 studs) long so there's overlap at the point between the two sections of treads to keep it all together. I came up with this as a plan C, it works but is kinda ugly. Baring some last minute inspiration it looks like at a minimum I'm going to have gray landings for the stairs. I'll probably keep the treads red though just for contrast.
  8. DanNeely

    (mostly) MOC: Another Saturn V tower

    I took a first pass at the propellant/ECS piping, images are available at the linked gallery. I didn't embed them because of excessive scrolling. https://imgur.com/a/nLu6ecv I'm going to have to redo all of it at least nominally because a pricecheck on bricklink put the 2 high axle couplers (6536b) I was using at an average of $1.65 each in white. I can get the 3 high one (28330) for $0.05 each, but swapping them in will require a moderate amount of rework. Axle colors are all placeholders - will be replaced with whatever's cheapest at the given lengths - as are the 32 long axles at the bottom of the propellant lines, those're pending until I create the sidewalls of the platform and can work out exactly how they connect in. They might also briefly go vertical at the 30 foot platform to facilitate connecting the oxygen pipe that goes off on that level. I also discovered one of the pieces I used in the stairs (26047) isn't available in red. It looks like I can make it work by moving the bar to the stairs instead of the landings where I can use a 2 stud plate, but I'm still annoyed with myself for not verifying that the parts were available before rolling them out on each level.
  9. DanNeely

    MOC: Apollo Launch Tower

    Thanks for posting the LDD, that makes it a lot easier to look at what you've done than trying to find a suitable image on the thread/bricksafe. PS you might be able to get cameras onto the camera platforms using a 60849 and a 32002, not sure though because it works in stud.io but not LDD.
  10. DanNeely

    (mostly) MOC: Another Saturn V tower

    The educraft model is useless for what I'm trying to find, and from the 2 images you linked I think you're confused about what I'm after. This picture of the model shows the sort of camera angle I'm looking for in actual photos because it would show the route the pipes take between where they run up the side of the tower and connect to the arms, except that the model doesn't have those segments of pipe in it. http://photobucket.com/gallery/user/EduCraftDiversions/media/cGF0aDpMQVVOQ0ggVU1CSUxJQ0FMIFRPV0VSIDE0NCBTQ0FMRSBLSVQvZSBMVVQgMTBfenBzZHZ3ZTN4Zm0ucG5n/?ref=1 The creator admitted to pure guesswork on the part I'm looking for information on... Looking at all the pictures on kickstarter, it only has the ECS piping (the set of 11 on the side), not the H2/LOX piping (set of 6 on the back, 3 going each way when they reach the platform) within the tower with update #28 listing the latter as still todo. The former I've got good image sources for. I've looked at a number of takeoff videos, none at an angle to show the LOX/H2 piping. The only launch video I've seen at an angle/quality level to clearly show the arms is for Apollo 4. With the exception of the crew arm and #3 which didn't have any piping they all stayed engaged until a few seconds before ignition. The staggered swinging at that point would probably need some form of computer control, which's beyond what I'm interested in trying even if the per arm motors would be small enough to fit. A few seconds of most of them is close enough to simultaneous for me (assuming I'm not overlooking an easy way to stagger their movement from a single control anyway). The Apollo 11 one shows an arm slightly to the side of the main group from a camera looking down from near the top of the tower, that's either the crew service arm, or another one swung slightly past where it'd engage the rocket. Whatever arm that is stays there until very shortly before liftoff, being in place at 34:11 (T-0:09) in the video. 24:49 (T-T10:41) shows an external view with the crew arm not visible folded back to its parking position against the tower. It appears the same 4 minutes later 29:06. At 35:29 (t-0:01) it is clearly visible folded back, from the same camera angle as earlier which has me thinking it was in place until very shortly before lift off in this launch. Apollo 12 actually shows it swinging back, 17 minutes into the video (about T- 5 minutes) For Apollo 13/14, the best I can tell is that the crew arm was retracted at least a minute or two before launch (can't find any footage from earlier). Apollo 15 is interesting in that in the moments before launch it only has 5 arms engaged with the rocket vs the 7 in earlier ones, so NASA was evolving the process over time. Apollo 16 appeared to be the same with the 1st stage disconnected earlier than in prior launches. Apollo 17 was a night launch, and none of the film was good enough to make out which arms were deployed or not at any point. My gearing itself is unchanged from what I posted at the start of the week, I've spent most of it down the rabbit hole hunting for plumbing details. I might take a run at it over the weekend, or I might end up just working on the external piping. If I can't find anything on the details of the LOX/LH2 piping, I'm probably just going to assume the high level schematics from the familiarization pdf I found on save the lut is correct other than having the pipes shown as centered on tower instead of to the side with the arms and that they just run directly forward for the LH2, and the same after entering a box for the LOX lines.
  11. DanNeely

    (mostly) MOC: Another Saturn V tower

    In the Saturn V image category on Wikipedia, but not linked to specific articles someone uploaded a number of high resolution scans of photos. The two landing pages I linked to below are the best for showing the side piping's routes (I'm not embedding images, because only the full size 7 megapixel ones really have enough detail to be useful here.), others look useful for when I add in control boxes and deck cargo. I haven't found anything equivalent for the piping on the back of the tower yet. (Nothing at a suitably uplooking angle with enough illumination to see where they went.) https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Apollo_10_Roll-out_-_GPN-2000-000960.jpg https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Apollo_17_Pre-Launch_-_GPN-2000-000636.jpg
  12. DanNeely

    (mostly) MOC: Another Saturn V tower

    I heard back from Bailey Fullarton, he said his could hold unto around the weight of the capsule/escape system, and suggested I strengthen it along it's length and add a counterweight to the rear to make it better balanced. I could probably fit a stack of coins in the back section somewhere to increase its weight.
  13. yeah, going to have to paint those too, That or just do an old school white tank I suppose.
  14. DanNeely

    (mostly) MOC: Another Saturn V tower

    I was able to give the end of the damper arm a diet, I'm a lot happier with its appearance now. I might be able to get 1 step closer still, not sure if it'll work though. My damper arm's a hair off center with the rocket for some reason and the angle piece on the closer side is conflicting with the escape tower. I haven't been able to get the alignment issue sorted (I suspect it's related to needing to rotate the blocks connecting the arms to the tower by a fraction of a degree to get the spacing right to connect to the blocks on the end), so I'm going to have to test-build to see if the second option actually does work.
  15. DanNeely

    (mostly) MOC: Another Saturn V tower

    The other thing I'd been working on today was gearing. I did the math on the gearing I copied from whatsuptoday's model, and the gears were the wrong ratio to move both arms correctly. Using what @pagicence initially created for NathanR (left 3 axles) and then adding one additional pair of equal sized gears to the last one I was able to get a set of gears that should be able to rotate both arms at the correct rates. My 1.0 implementation has a few functional issues. First, all the gears and support bricks are hanging outside the tower instead of within: Second the gears are blocking one of the support columns compromising stability: I'm going to try fixing it by moving the complex assembly to the crew access arm and connecting the change direction/offset gears to the main service arm axle. EDIT: That only helped slightly with reducing the amount of sticky out gearing, but left the support column equally obstructed. I'm going to have to think on this a bit more.