[MOC REVIEW] Grove GMK6400 Mobile Crane

[Rygar]

I notice that the version without suspension doesn't need to "cut" the 5cm axle to get the 2,5 version. Is it absolutely needed to cut the axles in order to have a functioning version?

[afol1969]

I notice that the version without suspension doesn't need to "cut" the 5cm axle to get the 2,5 version. Is it absolutely needed to cut the axles in order to have a functioning version?

For the first version (MKII) with suspension: It's not really needed to take self-made 2,5L axles, the red 2L axles can be used as well. But it's possible they can fall out from the hubs. To be on the secure side, I used 2,5L axles. For the version without suspension (MKIII) you don't need any 2,5L axles.

But it will be fine if TLG will make axles in half length as new parts, it's not the first time I was forced to cut axles. But I have a box with more than 1000 axles in different length, so I can make as many self-made axles as I need.

Greetings

Alex

[Blakbird]

Next instructions: gerger's MK3 carrier without suspension

As I still wait for the ordered parts, I haven't built it. So it's just a quick'n dirty instruction draft. An update will follow as soon as I have built it and controlled all steps.

Thanks again for all your work on this. You will probably be the first person to have built both versions of the carrier. I am very interested to hear someone who has built both compare them. I have built the suspended version and would like to know if it is worth converting it. How much better (or worse) is the solid axle version?

Eventually, I still want to convert the superstructure to use Efferman's giant linear actuator.

[JDL1967]

That sounds like a building mistake, will say a gear problem. Please send me some pictures (with notes) by PM, I've my crane carrier still assembled, so I can try to solve the problem.

Greetings

Alex

Ok i will make some pics, and i wil try to send them by pm to yuo.TNX!!!

Gr. Jesse

[goggel]

Next instructions: gerger's MK3 carrier without suspension

As I still wait for the ordered parts, I haven't built it. So it's just a quick'n dirty instruction draft. An update will follow as soon as I have built it and controlled all steps.

Wow, the instructions are looking really good! Are the made entirely with lpub? Would you be so kind and you share the mpd-file to learn a bit about lpub?

I must say that gerger has made a perfect work in function and design, all part belongs to the defined place to make sense. Especially the LSynth drawing for the electrical wires is very very good :thumbup:

Yes, the LSynth parts and stepping was really great from gerger. The color-coding of the pf-components seems to be lost in your instructions. Was this on purpose?

How much better (or worse) is the solid axle version?

I didn't build the suspensed version, but the solid axle version is really good to play with! 3XL motors and two servos seems to be a good choice, at least without the additional weight of the upper structure.

Edited February 2, 2015 by goggel

[afol1969]

How much better (or worse) is the solid axle version?

If I've built it, I'll give the documentation of it

Eventually, I still want to convert the superstructure to use Efferman's giant linear actuator.

If you need the LDRAW file, I've converted the LDD file. Just download it (see post #358) Maybe you can make some beautiful renders. And I'm interested to build it too. So it's possible that I'll make instructions in future time. For the moment I still work on the superstructure modification to mount the Firgelli actuators. A second one I've ordered and it will arrive at the end of febuary (because out of stock)

Wow, the instructions are looking really good! Are the made entirely with lpub? Would you be so kind and you share the mpd-file to learn a bit about lpub?

I make all in Lpub and export the png files. To create the PDF file, I use ACDSee 6 and Acrobat 9. Before creating the final file, I add some text notes, pictures etc if necessary. Here you find the mpd file:

http://www.bricksafe.com/files/afol1969/GMK6400-Carrier-Mk3.mpd

Yes, the LSynth parts and stepping was really great from gerger. The color-coding of the pf-components seems to be lost in your instructions. Was this on purpose?

Most of the steps I could take as they are, but I'd to add ghosts, changing step orders, make rotations and some more sub-models/steps. I do not use extra colored parts in the instructions, for that I create an extra file for the electrical/mechanic/pneumatic scheme.

And I think too that the solid axle version has a better driving/steering effect - and for the superstructure with heavy counterweight. In the first version I noticed that the suspensions from the rear axle are rather stressed under the heavy weight. So I'm interested to see which version may have the most positive properties,

Greetings

Alex

[DoGoods]

Alex,

Is there a brick stock file for just the carrier of the 6400 with suspension? I'm trying to figure out what parts I need to go from the suspension version to the no suspension version.

[Blakbird]

Here is what the old carrier should look like with Efferman's superstructure:

Of course it would not travel with the counterweight attached, so in travel mode it would look like this:

I think it looks a little odd without the counterweight. I also had not previously noticed that Efferman increased the length of the boom from 5 panels to 6.

Is there a brick stock file for just the carrier of the 6400 with suspension? I'm trying to figure out what parts I need to go from the suspension version to the no suspension version.

I don't have anything like that yet, but I will probably create such a file if I choose to do a conversion.

[afol1969]

Alex,

Is there a brick stock file for just the carrier of the 6400 with suspension? I'm trying to figure out what parts I need to go from the suspension version to the no suspension version.

Nope, sorry. The only part lists I make are them which I create with the BOM command in LPUB. It depends on the model size if I make complete or separate part lists.

@Blakbird: the second carrier version is some studs longer than the first one, I had to increase the page size to show the complete model. So maybe it will look good with effermans' superstructure. It's a very good desing and really looks like an heavy duty vehicle. I think I've to make some more BL orders....

Greetings

Alex

[gerger]

Next instructions: gerger's MK3 carrier without suspension

Download here: http://www.bricksafe...GMK6400-MK3.pdf

As I still wait for the ordered parts, I haven't built it. So it's just a quick'n dirty instruction draft. An update will follow as soon as I have built it and controlled all steps.

Another good work you have done, Alex. And thanks for all the work and refinement. the draft instruction is already perfect to me even you called it as quick n dirty one.. I am really interested to see how the Firgelli actuators work with the superstructure.

Edited February 3, 2015 by gerger

[DrJB]

I can't help but ponder at what'll happen to this fantastic MOC once the new pneumatics are released.

Would we need to re-visit then and retrofit the longer cylinders?

I'm personally tempted to put this project on back-burner until the new cylinders are available. I'm assuming of course that two such cylinders in tandem would develop enough force to lift the boom. Has anyone done such calculation and whether the needed pressure can be handled by the pneumatics?

Edited February 4, 2015 by DrJB

[Blakbird]

I don't think there is any way they'd lift the boom. Too heavy. Unless they've also increased the max pressure. Even the long ones are still far too short to be scale on this crane.

[jantjeuh]

Absolutely no way the boom can be lifted using pneumatics.

[Jelmer]

Lego pneumatics aren't sufficient unless you double them and then it becomes bulky and ugly. If you want to use pneumatics i'd recommend some industrial types from Parker or Univer.

[DrJB]

I'm sure one can do some simple calculations, but for this, one needs the weight and CG location of the new boom, along with the max pressure in the cylinders (can be measured with a Lego manometer). Hence my next question: Is there an option, in any of the available CAD tools to calculate the mass and CG of a given assembly e.g., the new boom? That would sure be very useful information. The rest of the calculations can be done simplistically by hand.

Another thought: Even if the new cylinders won't make it, I'm sure the new turntable would be a welcome upgrade here.

Edited February 4, 2015 by DrJB

[JDL1967]

Is there someone ho now how to upload pcis into this forum?

[DrJB]

Is there someone ho now how to upload pcis into this forum?

Best way is to upload them to Brickshelf or Flicker, and then hot-link them from here. The way I do it, I upload pics to my Brickshelf account, then there, I right-click + Copy Image, then come here and Ctrl+V into a topic. Very easy.

[JDL1967]

My version of the cabin

The contraweight is build in next to the battery-bos. Insted of steel balls i used 1 M8 bold and 7 M8 nuds. I make 3 of these sets and placed them in 3 battery compartments.

[Zimix]

DrJB, CG (center of gravity) of the boom will not help you to much, as you should consider also that you want to expand the boom and you might also want to lift something with it. So CG of the boom retracted is not enough for this application.

[JDL1967]

Best way is to upload them to Brickshelf or Flicker, and then hot-link them from here. The way I do it, I upload pics to my Brickshelf account, then there, I right-click + Copy Image, then come here and Ctrl+V into a topic. Very easy.

Tnx i did it and it works!!

[Karle]

Blakbird, you were going to test the Efferman LAs. If you did, how do they preform?

Edited February 4, 2015 by Karle

[DrJB]

DrJB, CG (center of gravity) of the boom will not help you to much, as you should consider also that you want to expand the boom and you might also want to lift something with it. So CG of the boom retracted is not enough for this application.

Agreed, and I did not imply that the CG was fixed. I was simply asking if the functionality existed in any given software package. If it does, then we need to calculate the position for four extreme configurations, fully retracted vs. fully expanded, and down vs. fully up. Then we need to calculate the force needed for all 4 configurations. Then with those 4 forces, calculate the necessary pressure to be developed in the cylinders/pump. I never implied it was a simple calculation and some extreme configurations have to be analyzed. However, the first requirement is that one must be able to calculate the mass and CG position for a few configurations (4). Note that I'm thinking a simple static calculation will suffice. One will need to add friction effects as a margin. The dynamic effects will most likely be minimum.

That said, do we know of a package that calculates the total mass + CG location of a given assembly?

Edited February 4, 2015 by DrJB

[JDL1967]

Finaly i have finish the crane

More pics at http://www.bricksafe.com/pages/JDL1967

And i must add, with a liitle time and very small ty-rips there is an easy way to hide the cable's from the seats.. I also want to thank Alex for his help with the vieuw problems i had..

[Blakbird]

Blakbird, you were going to test the Efferman LAs. If you did, how do they preform?

I can't try the actuator because it does not fit on the superstructure. First I have to rebuild the superstructure into Efferman's design, and there are no instructions for it yet.

The actuator itself is lovely and I look forward to using it.

[DrJB]

Finaly i have finish the crane

More pics at http://www.bricksafe.com/pages/JDL1967

And i must add, with a liitle time and very small ty-rips there is an easy way to hide the cable's from the seats.. I also want to thank Alex for his help with the vieuw problems i had..

Congratulations, that's such a beautiful masterpiece. I'm sure your post/photos will entice many (including myself) to get on with this project and finish it. One question if I may: The thread you're using for the crane appears to be 'thicker' than the one typically found in Lego sets. Care to share the specs of such thread and where you got it from?

Thanks

Edited February 4, 2015 by DrJB