WIP Green Schooner

[kurigan]

Green Schooner WIP Redux

I am editing over the old post as I found it wanting. I suppose I could start a new post but that just seems wasteful. I also don’t want to discredit the support which has already been shown. Below is my attempt at a better, more informative, if verbose, WIP topic. If you’re taking an interest, you’ll likely have lots of questions as to how or why I made a lot of the choices I have. For those of you, here it all is. For those less inclined, enjoy the pictures. If anything is still unclear, you have a truly helpful suggestion, or just want to show your support, please feel free to comment. Thanks for your interest in advance, and trust me it’s worth getting all the way though.

When I started this project, about a year ago now, I set forth with a few goals in mind. For one I wanted to frame the entire project within the idea of making an all-out pirate ship based on Skull’s Eye Schooner of Classic Pirates fame. Hither too I had always favored good-guy/hero types with my creations and figured it was about time I provide my mini-verse with some bad-guys to keep ‘em busy. When I was a kid, playing with my Lego ships it always bothered me that SES wasn’t anything like a schooner. I suppose even at that age I already preferred that the intersection where fiction converged with history be more in the neighborhood of realism over fantasy. I used this as inspiration and resolved that whatever came of it, I’d make this next MOC in the style of SES but as an actual schooner.

My other goals involved further refining the “Bent Brick” method I had adopted and adapted (credit to Henrik Hoexbroe). My previous MOC, Ramcat, was rather experimental and in parts suffers from a lack of pre-planning. Though the basic elements are all there and the goal of an all-working-parts-model can be said to have been achieved, much was omitted for space while some things remain historically dubious. Knowing better the demands of this style of building I would be more well prepared with each step to make a more complete and inclusive model this time. Many of the things, like fife rails, left out or left peculiar to that previous venture would be rectified in this construction. Also important to me was to include elements from other builders which could enhance my own effort as well as incorporate other elements from real world examples I had previously shied away from. The final element I’d insist on incorporating would be homage paid to the American privateers of the early 18^th century. In my youth I had considered such vessels to have occurred far too late in history to be truly relevant to my own interests or Pirate lore in general. As I matured, learned and branched out I came to appreciate these historic vessels, and the contemporary replicas thereof, a great deal more. Now, aside from perhaps Frigates and their daring crews of the same era, these are perhaps my favorite over all. For reference I’d look to Lynx and Pride of Baltimore II.

The initial renditions of the project were less than stellar. It seemed that marrying my concept to the parameters of SES likeness was going to be a handicap. For one I didn’t want to destroy any previous builds to reuse parts and change the color scheme but at the same time did not want to go forth and acquire new or more bricks either. On the one hand I felt it a violation of my principal of “use what you have” vs. “order, just, what you’ll need”. On the other it would take some creative budgeting to afford the colors I’d need to do it right. Before I was done, however, I’d commit to both.

After trying several different configurations of color, I decided that green should be the predominant color on the hull accented by gray, rather than the other way around as of SES originally. As for the red elements, I just couldn’t seem to rectify them on my version and abandoned them entirely. The shade of green was the deciding factor in my decision to order parts. The standard Lego green, that bright green of prefab foliage, was just too vibrant for my taste and didn’t give the feeling of pirate ship at all. Instead I had to go with a darker, drabber green which I could afford, but had to be ordered in sets and cannibalized. The gray elements would have to be dark gray and/or blay to compliment the darker green as well, but that I had in stock, abundantly enough. The rest of the ship would wind up black instead of wood colors. While “blacking” was a common practice for practical vessels of this era I also figure it would lend the schooner a more sinister look.

This time around I built the ships sides in a “ribbon” like fashion, flat on the deck then tested it again and again around an armature. After a lot of trial and error of both elements, the ribbon and armature, I came up with a hull shape I found pleasing and accurate (enough). Astern I expounded on a concept I added to Ramcat as more of an afterthought which made attaching the ribbon to the armature particularly difficult. Though I am a little ashamed to admit I do not know the name of, nor can I find any reference to it; I found the lack of curve on the underside of the hull near the stern disenchanting. Even heavily laden ships have a small portion of their hull’s underside above the water line as it narrows to the stern post. On this model I wanted to make this effect more pronounced and better well incorporated in to the transom. Though not entirely successful, I think the scale to small to really work well, I find her stern profile passable. Since the dynamic shape I had envisioned escaped me I took advantage of the increased space and added elements for a working rudder. Only the rudder head and till actually exist as the rest would be below the water line, but all the same, working elements were established early on as a primary goal.

Up forward another working element was integrated when inspiration struck. I always considered the idea of a functional windlass/capstan fundamental. Any round part on an axle will coil a cable. Going years back to Snake, though, I wanted to make something of a more practical model than just round bricks on pins. While looking over pictures of schooners for inspiration I took a closer look at the more advanced, metal, windlasses of 19^th century vessels as such. I saw a lot of similar shapes in common with technic parts and started building. Digging though my bag of gears and such, I found a lot of useful parts and cobbled together some designs that would very much look the part but still not quite work. What I was missing was a ratcheting action. To function it would need cat’s paws but on that scale, how? I found a gear which worked well with a cheese wedge to lock in place but needed a spring. (Purists prepare to cringe) In one rendition I actually tried to use the spring from a retracting ball point pen but it was impossible to keep in place. The smooth surface of Lego bricks failed to create enough friction. After that I tried pieces of flexible material, like card stock and balsa wood, but none of it had the necessary tension. Then out of the blue I thought of closed cell foam. Over the years I had saved plenty of the stuff from the likes of video game console packaging for myriad uses. I even had black which would blend well into the schooner’s décor. With a cheese wedge attached to a clip to make a hinge and pressed up against a wall, the foam acted like a spring and the ratchet worked. I now had a truly functional and practical windlass for my schooner. If I could bring mini-figures to life, they could use the windlass just like the real thing! See Video

Amid ships there was much more work to be done. Mounting masts was nothing new, the same methods from Ramcat would be used over but the railings and deck were going to be a challenge. The belaying pin system I developed for Ramcat would work well, but I would need a lot more pins this time and the same standard would be needed on the new fife rails as well. In this system a clip holds a pin firm in place, rather than loose through a board like the real thing. This is so that a rope to be belayed in place need be only wrapped around the pin once to hold its place while reaching through the web of lines on the model. Then the clip and pin can be removed as one, the line still held in place, and belayed properly; free of the ships rigging where the modeler can work more easily. Once properly tied off the assembly can be replaced on the rack to resume proper tension, taking full advantage of the Lego system.

Then next thing to be incorporated were deck housings. In my previous works I shied away from such construction for lack of deck space. Instead I had tried to compensate for the small scale by leaving hatch ways and gratings flat or even flush. For a basic interpretation this works well enough but is a characteristic more appropriate for much larger vessels. On schooners of this type, raised deck housings helped compensate for a distinct lack of space below deck and are a key characteristic of those ships. The first rendition of these was rudimentary by comparison, but served to develop the hatch ways I kept on the later version. Though they do not open and close freely, these covers and doors can be configured to remain either open or closed. Since the type of model (waterline), scale and construction technique make a below decks space impossible, I figured this is a nice way to allude to one for certain scenes.

I also wanted to take this model to the next level with a planked deck, never much enjoying the studded decks of my previous efforts. A tiled deck may have seemed easier at first but it would have made for a lot more spacing conflicts with the armature and the tiles as planks would be just too wide. Instead I tried out something I had seen here on Classic Pirates. I assembled gray plates on their sides and staggered them to resemble the planks. I feel it worked out rather well. I picked gray over beige or brown, not only because I have no abundance of those other colors but because I wanted to serve that sinister look. Wooden decks not regularly sanded and scrubbed, nor sealed and coated will turn gray when exposed to the weather. Unfortunately I didn’t have enough of any one gray to do all of the deck, so I took a queue from castle builders and started throwing in other grays randomly. My hope was that the different colors would resemble damaged, well worn and/or repaired sections. I think the overall effect worked, but worry that some particular sections may still be distracting.

Still to be worked on:

The wheel, I copied Ram cat’s design but, this time with the intention of actually attaching the line to the till to work the rudder. I had planned on using relieving tackles below deck to give the wheel a more realistic feel. After completing the deck from what was on hand, plates of every dimension from 1 to 4 studs wide, I’m not sure I still have the space. I may have to settle for a direct connection.

The gun flaps are currently held in place with strips of tape. I tried many different configurations of bricks to make a hinge but found none that worked ad still fit the size/scale of the ship. I came up with this idea while pondering how the actual hinges were attached. Purists may cringe, again, but after seeing how well these work and look my intention is to print stickers to replace the taps and look like iron hinges. I actually don’t feel that this is too much of a purism violation, not that I am very much concerned. After all though not for articulation, even Lego uses stickers to decorate their creations at time. Mine will just be a custom sticker.

Belaying pins have been something of a struggle on this build. On Ramcat I simply turned dowel against a file in my hands and that worked well enough. The shape was simple but served the purpose. Purest may again take umbrage but there simply are no parts in the Lego catalog that will work just right. This schooner has so many more pins than Ramcat (26 vs. 44), that I decided that old method would be remarkably impractical. I attempted to makeshift a lathe with my Dremel tool. It worked well enough but I found it difficult to produce consistent shapes. Perhaps with practice or a proper tool, I could do better but that would simply be far more of an investment than I’d like. Instead I tried to design 3D belaying pins to print with Shapeways. My efforts there have hit a hurdle in the form of my lacking experience as well. There are problems with my mesh which will take an investment in self education all its own to correct. On this front, any assistance the community can offer would be appreciated.

There are still scale miles of rigging to be rove, though the masts and spars as complete and ready. Sails will be their own adventure as I moved on from Ramcat before ever making her suit. Though it will require some experimentation, both vessels will likely get their suits at the same time.

I figure at this point that my end goal for this project cannot be reached in the remaining time. I had resolved to complete the project by October 31^st in order to utilize it in a Halloween appropriate scene. After that I had hoped to use her in conjunction with Ramcat and some of my other MOCs in a number of vignettes and perhaps even on display at convention(s). Between changing jobs and getting married, though, I simply haven’t been able to keep up. At this point I fear the project never being completed let alone dragging on any longer. Though I still hold out hope for a finished Ramcat, it was much the same situation and still she collects dust. I may very well be able to broker some free time in the near future I can use towards this cause though. I still don’t’ find the end of the month realistic but I don’t believe any of the local (Philadelphia area) conventions occur till the New Year.

If you made it this far, thanks for your investment and interest. I do appreciate the encouragement I’ve received (most of the time) from this community over the years and that’s probably why I keep coming back. Please leave your comments, but in mind of her incomplete status.

Edited October 6, 2014 by kurigan

[Sebeus I]

I love the color scheme, I've always found green to be a difficult color to use for a ship but dark green works quite well appearently.

The deck is really nice, staying fatefull to the classic gray color of the SES deck and yet so much more detailed.

Building a proper schooner out of the SES crossed my mind a couple of times as well.

As for her name, maybe you can call her the Skull's Eye Schooner .

[ummester]

This does look very nice - the earthy colors suit well. The decking is excellent.

I did study your photobucket KURIGAN and do very much like the exterior look of your builds. The vertical bowing in the stern and the illusion of a below deck's space now incorporated into this build looks great, I wonder if a vertical curvature could somehow be included on the bow also?

That sucks about your bricklink order - surely the USPS have some avenue of complaint if you suspect the package was light due to their service?

Edited May 20, 2014 by ummester

[Kolonialbeamter]

Great job so far, I love the shape and colors, the hatch and windlass are genious, the planking in fifty shades of grey is stunning. One question here: Your deck is one level, cause it's a small sloop. Is it possible to bend the structure a little to adapt this technique for larger ships to create a deck of slightly differents hights but without steps? Not sure I express myself correctly here...

I think you could use a touch of red on the inside of the hull, maybe just some parts like the attachment for the rigging or whatever that is called. The resemblance with the original might become even more striking. Just an idea.

Oh, and I second Sebeus' name suggestion

Good luck on finishing her!

Regards

[kurigan]

I wonder if a vertical curvature could somehow be included on the bow also?

not sure what you mean here. if you mean to continue the tumble home, no i suppose not, but don't see why you would. if anything the curve should be the other way on the bow. In any case the curve on two dimensions would conflict to either, cause the bricks to cover over one another or leave gaps between them respectively.

One question here: Your deck is one level, cause it's a small sloop. Is it possible to bend the structure a little to adapt this technique for larger ships to create a deck of slightly differents hights but without steps? Not sure I express myself correctly here...

I think you could use a touch of red on the inside of the hull, maybe just some parts like the attachment for the rigging or whatever that is called. The resemblance with the original might become even more striking. Just an idea.

I think you mean like a flush deck similar to Constellation, where the single deck very much follows the sheer (vertical curve along the length of the ship). Yes, but to so would be difficult and require a lot of under structure. Essentially you'd be doing something very similar to Revenge.

I had thought of using tape or stickers on the inner wall to add color, likely red (as purest every where grit their teeth). That would certainly bring that element back to the project, but I thought it more a thing for a proper man-of-war. The only other color that would look right would be more gray and why bother? I think the green works, but perhaps I'll try some red on the inner gun flaps.

[Capn Frank]

I really like the build style and the deck of this vessel. It looks pretty good in my opinion.

Belaying pins have been something of a struggle on this build. On Ramcat I simply turned dowel against a file in my hands and that worked well enough. The shape was simple but served the purpose. Purest may again take umbrage but there simply are no parts in the Lego catalog that will work just right. This schooner has so many more pins than Ramcat (26 vs. 44), that I decided that old method would be remarkably impractical.

Would these be close enough for belaying pins?

They're for clone trooper helmets. They're 3mm in diameter, which means they can be clipped.

Billy clubs could also be used, but there doesn't seem to be very many cheap ones available.

[Captain Braunsfeld]

I am surprised to find that I have not yet commented on the Green Schooner.

This is truely an ambitious project - and the pictures show very fine progress to date.

It's going to be excellent - brick on!

I am looking forward to further pics.

I would suggest the inclusion of a monkey in the crew, however, this would not fit to your realistic approach.

[kurigan]

This build has come a long way from its inception. I don’t even feel like it’s the same vessel any longer. For one she now has a name “Nonesuch”. Also her standing rig is all but complete and most everything has been laid for her running rig. A lot of subtle improvements and changes have been made to accommodate her development and a maze of strings. I’ve also incorporated my 3D printed belaying pins with the same system from Ramcat. (The pins were printed by shapeways and will soon be available in my store for anyone. I need to order one more prototype before I’m sure they are Ok for public sale.) I’m well in to the third year with her and it’s been a labor of love, with emphasis on the labor. Though I’m determined that this one won’t go unfinished, completion may still be months off at this point. I’m just where I left off on Ramcat as well, so both ships are now expecting a suit of sails. Right now I’m terribly busy and won’t likely be able to devote the time necessary to do her justice before the spring. With that in mind, even though I wasn’t going to, I’ve decided to update this old WIP topic, despite the conceptual rift I perceive between then and now. I’ve been "talking a big game” around the forum as of late and I wouldn’t be surprised if some members, especially all these new comes, wonder upon what successes I rest my laurels. Well, here she is. My current “grand work” a Baltimore Clipper, the privateer Nonesuch.

Just the one picture for now. For the rest please just go to my photobucket where you can see many more images and get a better feel for her development over time.

Feel free to talk her up, ask question or just show your support. I’m happy to discuss just about anything about her. Thanks for looking.

[Captain Dee]

Kurigan, you have built yourself an absolute masterpiece. The hull technique is fairly straightforward (okay, maybe that's not the best word considering the design... ) but the addition of masts and rigging takes this to the next level. I don't know much about rigging specs but this looks fantastic and I could stare at the details for hours. Your belay pins are nice - hey, we all throw purism out the window with custom sails and rigging anyway, and when the necessary part simply doesn't exist I see no problem with making one yourself. They're just a small part anyway. Your custom guns are lovely as well - any chance you could show a piece-by-piece breakdown? I must confess that I wasn't exactly smitten by the hull shape/color combo in the ealier pics but she looks just about perfect in the last photo. Excellent work!

I hear you about the old Skull's Eye Schooner. I can remember the day I first read about schooner rigging and realized Lego had the name all wrong. Suddenly one of the most appealing sets wasn't so appealing anymore.

You don't have to bare your credentials on my account - I've been an EB member less than a year but started lurking in late 2013. After digging through the entire Classic-Pirates indices I'm well aware of your contributions. And I value your knowledge - perhaps I can learn something along the way.

Good to have you active again. (I think I was the one who kinda brought you back out with my bad speed comparo between frigates and SOTL - remember? )

Keep it up.

[Franco Clarke]

Wow, she's coming along fine, and starting to look like a real boat. She has definitely crossed the line between lego looking ship to real looking ship, a hard line to cross, well done!

[__________________________]

Looks Great! How did you learn so much about different kinds of pirate ships?

[Cousarmy0001]

I hear you about the old Skull's Eye Schooner. I can remember the day I first read about schooner rigging and realized Lego had the name all wrong. Suddenly one of the most appealing sets wasn't so appealing anymore.

The same can be said about a lot of Lego ships. There was nothing clipper in the Caribbean Clipper, either

What gets me about this MOC is that so many of our ships are small ones pretending to be something bigger. This one is exactly what it says it is. The rigging is quite impressive, as are a lot of the smaller details. The planking on the deck is very innovative as well.

[kurigan]

Wow, such high praise. I honestly don’t know what to do with it but say, thank you all. I’ve never had any lack of confidence in her, in fact I plan to offer her for display to the local maritime museum for kid/family friendly events if I ever finish her. Coming from someone else thought it’s something entirely different and up-lifting.

Captain Dee:

I happen to have that handy! Guns

For the largest guns, the one’s made from a jet engine, I’ve taken to using a technic tow ball for a cascabel instead of a stud.

I do recall. Suppose I ought to thank you for that. Thank you.

I honestly have no idea how I’m perceived around here and it’s my tendency to assume the worst. Thanks again for the boost of confidence.

Franco Clarke:

That sir, is a bold statement and one which touches a nerve as well. You’ve hit on exactly what I’ve been going for all this time.

The Lego Expert:

There is no one answer and at the risk of preaching or prosing on I’ll tell you this: it takes an investment of one kind or another. Some people can afford to pay for as well as grasp the information from books, but neither has been my strong suit, so I paid for my education in time and investigation. There is no, one great source. I’ve spent a lot of time searching google (comparing sources), touring replicas and historic ships, going to museums, and picking up on whatever I can whenever it comes along. The most fun I’ve had is entertaining nautical fiction, like the Aubrey/Maturin series, Alan Lewrie’s Naval Adventures (perhaps my favorite) and a host of others. (David Donachie most recently and pleased with. Bloody Jack was good fun but I just plane don’t care for Ramage or Kydd). It’s not so much that those books are meant to be educational, though the writers mentioned do their homework to be sure. It’s more that they provide a context in which some questions are answered while others are presented to be looked up later. Then of course actually applying what you’ve learned, like with my models, is invaluable. I’ve got the cute lil’ badge, which I very much appreciate, but I’m not sure I’m really all that much of an expert. More of an ever constant student, eager to share.

Cousarmy0001:

Well that’s why I’m never very confident calling my stuff "mini-fig-illusion". It's rather difficult to figure scale against mini-figs. The deck, though, is not my idea. I forget who to credit it to, if any one builder is responsible. Thanks though, I’m glad it’s convincing.

[Plaid Beard]

I used your schooner as inspiration when I was working on my own last year. Yours turned out much better than mine, and I did learn a lit trying to figure out some of your methods. I really love the color scheme on this ship, and seeing it with the rigging really blows me away. Well done!

[kurigan]

I used your schooner as inspiration when I was working on my own last year. Yours turned out much better than mine, and I did learn a lit trying to figure out some of your methods. I really love the color scheme on this ship, and seeing it with the rigging really blows me away. Well done!

I remember the build. I looked it up and it seems I never commented on it. Perhaps I was still in my “I quit” phase. Anyway, I’m gonna bump it so meet me over there for that. Otherwise thank you J ironically enough because of you and Mr. Townsend I’m severely tempted to turn my next project into a Marblehead. I’m just afraid I’ll look like a “one trick pony” doing nothing but cutters and schooners. Seems it’s time I move on to square rigs.