Future Set Wishes and Speculation

[Ngoc Nguyen]

11 minutes ago, Bartybum said:

Motorized ladder - can't discount it as a function for a front loader if it's considered a notable function for a bulldozer

I looked through some of the biggest wheel loaders and none of them have motorized ladders..

 

12 minutes ago, Bartybum said:

But in all seriousness, I agree, but only if you only have space for one hub.

One hub is most likely for a flagship from now on, given that 42131 has space for two but contains only one.

[howitzer]

1 hour ago, Ngoc Nguyen said:

One hub is most likely for a flagship from now on, given that 42131 has space for two but contains only one.

I agree, considering that two hubs and associated motors would raise the cost enormously (regardless of justifications TLG has to consider how the price is perceived) and while 42100 had two hubs, it also was the demonstration set for the new system, beside not really being possible with only one hub, not without serious stripping down of features at least. So I'm predicting only single-hub sets from now on, at least for a couple of years.

[gyenesvi]

With a single-hub 4 motor setup there are only a few possible motor configs to be used:

- 1 motor for switching 4 functions, one for driving functions, and only two remain for drive/steer. That means tracked vehicles with one motor per track, or one motor for drive and one for steering. But wouldn't one motor be a bit weak to drive a larger flagship model? It was barely enough for the Volvo hauler.

- Another setup that hasn't been used yet is two simultaneous gearboxes on two drive motors that could power 4-6 functions besides the drive. Add one separate motor for steering and one for switching the two gearboxes simultaneously. This could require a lot of space for the gearbox (if it's doable at all), and the controls would also become complicated, as they could be used simultaneously in pairs only.

To get out of these limitations, I'd love to see the 6-port hub from Mindstorms introduced into Technic. Though wouldn't be surprised if it never happened because of the rechargeable battery in it.

On a different note, I'd also love to see mid-scale RC models with 2 functions (drive/steer) and the 2-port hub from Spike Essential introduced (though same problem as with the 6-port variant), along with the small angular motor used as servo. Or a model that uses that small motor for an RC gearbox as well (in a 4-port hub, 2-drive, 1 steer, 1 gearbox motor config using two small angular motors for steering/gearbox).

[1gor]

@gyenesvi that all sounds very complicated to me, so I'll wish some smaller manual sets for me...but you got interesting idea for those in Billund...

[Void_S]

Maybe a crazy idea, but with all-computerized C+ hub there is a possibility for on-demand motorized functions: when you press the action button the hub activates the function in a distribution gearbox  and runs the motor. When the button is released the motor stops and gearbox returns back to the neutral position. So, for the user it looks like it has all functions are motorized like with in dividual motors. 

[gyenesvi]

1 hour ago, Void_S said:

Maybe a crazy idea, but with all-computerized C+ hub there is a possibility for on-demand motorized functions: when you press the action button the hub activates the function in a distribution gearbox  and runs the motor. When the button is released the motor stops and gearbox returns back to the neutral position. So, for the user it looks like it has all functions are motorized like with in dividual motors. 

That's what the Volvo hauler and the Cat dozer does, isn't it?

[Void_S]

27 minutes ago, gyenesvi said:

That's what the Volvo hauler and the Cat dozer does, isn't it?

Possibly, I have never touched them yet. If so, it really makes no limits for functions per motor ratio.

[AVCampos]

2 hours ago, gyenesvi said:

- Another setup that hasn't been used yet is two simultaneous gearboxes on two drive motors that could power 4-6 functions besides the drive.

8043 already does something like that, with three 2-position gearboxes switched by a single motor.

 

7 minutes ago, Void_S said:

it really makes no limits for functions per motor ratio.

Actually, it has two disadvantages: the function doesn't run as soon as you press the button (the mechanism has to switch to it first), and still only one function (per gearbox) can run at a time.

[gyenesvi]

5 minutes ago, AVCampos said:

8043 already does something like that, with three 2-position gearboxes switched by a single motor.

True, but the function selector is not RC there, or is it?

14 minutes ago, Void_S said:

If so, it really makes no limits for functions per motor ratio.

Theoretically yes, but it's not that simple in practise. For one, a gearbox with more than 4 functions would be quite large. Second, switching functions in the Cat takes 4 seconds, because the switch motor has to do some wiggling motion to first get rid of the tension that can build up in the drivetrain and block the clutch piece. That's a noticeable delay for playability, and I expect that would get even worse if the gearbox was more complex.

Edited January 7, 2022 by gyenesvi

[howitzer]

24 minutes ago, gyenesvi said:

True, but the function selector is not RC there, or is it?

Theoretically yes, but it's not that simple in practise. For one, a gearbox with more than 4 functions would be quite large. Second, switching functions in the Cat takes 4 seconds, because the switch motor has to do some wiggling motion to first get rid of the tension that can build up in the drivetrain and block the clutch piece. That's a noticeable delay for playability, and I expect that would get even worse if the gearbox was more complex.

8043 is fully RC. One motor switches the selection of three function selectors simultaneously and three motors drive the functions. In one position the motors drive both tracks and slewing, in other position they drive digger functions.

[Bartybum]

5 hours ago, Ngoc Nguyen said:

One hub is most likely for a flagship from now on, given that 42131 has space for two but contains only one. 

42100 exists though. It's too early to rule out all future two-hub models, given that we've only had two 4K flagships so far.

Edited January 7, 2022 by Bartybum

[howitzer]

5 minutes ago, Bartybum said:

42100 exists though. It's too early to rule out all future two-hub models, given that we've only had two 4K flagships so far.

Future is a long time, so it's probable that at some point another two-hub model will be released, but I don't expect it to happen any time soon. Certainly not this year and very unlikely to happen 2023 either. Maybe at some point after that.

[Bartybum]

17 minutes ago, howitzer said:

Future is a long time, so it's probable that at some point another two-hub model will be released, but I don't expect it to happen any time soon. Certainly not this year and very unlikely to happen 2023 either. Maybe at some point after that.

This year sure, but why not next year? What do you base that off?

[howitzer]

2 minutes ago, Bartybum said:

This year sure, but why not next year? What do you base that off?

Just my own guess. I don't think there's a good enough reason to make another two-hub model so soon. The Liebherr was clearly a demonstration set for the new system where two hubs were justified, and with the recent inflation the set would get too expensive so unless there was some new electronic parts introduced (lights, pneumatic switches or something along those lines), there's no way TLG can justify a set that would be much more expensive than the Cat.

But this is the speculation topic, so I might be wrong of course. Only time will tell.

[pleegwat]

6 hours ago, howitzer said:

Future is a long time, so it's probable that at some point another two-hub model will be released, but I don't expect it to happen any time soon. Certainly not this year and very unlikely to happen 2023 either. Maybe at some point after that.

Just checked for PF IR receivers, they did release a couple of sets which held two of them over the years. I can't find any with three.

I could see two C+ battery boxes in a future flagship if, like with the liebherr, there are not just too many functions for a gearbox but they cannot reasonably pass through a turntable.

[Ngoc Nguyen]

On 1/5/2022 at 3:52 PM, Bartybum said:

Why no logging truck? An RC model is entirely possible in the Arocs's scale

There's a logging truck in 2H 2022 at 119.99$ for you.

[howitzer]

31 minutes ago, Ngoc Nguyen said:

There's a logging truck in 2H 2022 at 119.99$ for you.

If the Reddit rumor holds true that is...

[Gimmick]

On 1/7/2022 at 7:17 AM, Ngoc Nguyen said:

I looked through some of the biggest wheel loaders and none of them have motorized ladders..

I only checked the CAT 994K, but atleast this model has "motorized" stairs.

On 1/7/2022 at 8:35 AM, howitzer said:

I agree, considering that two hubs and associated motors would raise the cost enormously (regardless of justifications TLG has to consider how the price is perceived) and while 42100 had two hubs, it also was the demonstration set for the new system, beside not really being possible with only one hub, not without serious stripping down of features at least. So I'm predicting only single-hub sets from now on, at least for a couple of years.

One or two hubs only depends on the useability of the model - but there are not that many machines like excavators where you need many functions at the same time and since we just got the 42100...

I'm not entirely convinced by the full-RC-thing anyway. Models like 42055 and 42082 are still great and there are ways to benefit from powered up even if the model is not RC.

[howitzer]

9 minutes ago, Gimmick said:

I only checked the CAT 994K, but atleast this model has "motorized" stairs.

One or two hubs only depends on the useability of the model - but there are not that many machines like excavators where you need many functions at the same time and since we just got the 42100...

I'm not entirely convinced by the full-RC-thing anyway. Models like 42055 and 42082 are still great and there are ways to benefit from powered up even if the model is not RC.

Yeah, and with 8043 they managed to make a full-RC excavator with just 4 motors, so even there two hubs isn't absolutely necessary. With 42100 the driveline and shovel required additional motors so the second hub was necessary (and also for the demonstrative purpose of the C+ system). I don't think we're going to see anything similar anytime soon.

[Ngoc Nguyen]

Assuming the leak is true, the flagship will have 2137 parts and cost 249.99$. I think it's a huge machine with 4 wheels. 

What I can think of:

- Backhoe 
- Mining dump truck
- Biggest reach stacker
- Biggest forklift
- Biggest telehandler
- Tractor
- Front loader

The 42129 Zetros is a 4-wheel truck with medium-sized tires and already costs 299.99$. This flagship only costs 249.99$, so I think it won't have any fancy functions.

Edited January 11, 2022 by Ngoc Nguyen

[howitzer]

27 minutes ago, Ngoc Nguyen said:

Assuming the leak is true, the flagship will have 2137 parts and cost 249.99$. I think it's a huge machine with 4 wheels. 

What I can think of:

- Backhoe 
- Mining dump truck
- Biggest reach stacker
- Biggest forklift
- Biggest telehandler
- Tractor
- Front loader

The 42129 Zetros is a 4-wheel truck with medium-sized tires and already costs 299.99$. This flagship only costs 249.99$, so I think it won't have any fancy functions.

Tractor is unlikely, considering there's the small John Deere set. TLG wouldn't probably release two very similar but differently scaled sets in the same year. Dump truck is unlikely too, as the Volvo hauler is still on shelves and functionally almost identical (steering assembly would be different but that's it). The other machines on your list are plausible though. A backhoe would be really great.

[Ngoc Nguyen]

3 minutes ago, howitzer said:

A backhoe would be really great.

On second thought I don't think a backhoe is possible at that price point. In addition to driving and steering, a backhoe has at least 5 functions:

- Front bucket lift
- Front bucket tilt
- Rear arm lift
- Rear bucket tilt
- Rear arm slew
 

Those functions can't be achieved with one hub, and one hub is most likely at that price point.

[howitzer]

5 minutes ago, Ngoc Nguyen said:

On second thought I don't think a backhoe is possible at that price point. In addition to driving and steering, a backhoe has at least 5 functions:

- Front bucket lift
- Front bucket tilt
- Rear arm lift
- Rear bucket tilt
- Rear arm slew
 

Those functions can't be achieved with one hub, and one hub is most likely at that price point.

No way there's two hubs at this price point, but drive and steer could be manual and dumb hub+pneumatics might make for a nice set, or smart hub + gearbox. I'm not holding my breath though, considering how few and far between backhoes have been.

[Ngoc Nguyen]

The possibilities for the model of the heavy lift helicopter are only:

- Traditional helicopter with one main rotor and one tail rotor
- Tandem rotor helicopter
- Skeletal helicopter like the Erickson Skycrane

I've just found out another wacky helicopter: Sikorsky CH-37 Mojave. It's the predecessor of the Skycrane and the Sikorsky CH-53.

 

 

It has openable front doors like mandibles.

 

 

That would make a cool model.

[Dylan M]

How about an Electric Rope Shovel please 🙏(Volvo , Liebher,  CAT...)