Boxes "as" plates?

[Dorayaki]

Over the past years, TLG rarely make newly molded plates for one individual set (the last one seems to be Scorpion Pyramid). They only leave bricks for kids to build and play solely, and we may additionally buy the basic plates: asphalt roads, green grassland or blue sea. At the same time, there is something "large and plastic" that TLC keep producing for years until today--- buckets, which are mostly used in starter sets and the current theme "Junior".

Decade ago, I can remember that most other brick buckets of other brands have studs on their cover, which can be the base for child to build things on. I'm curious about why modern Lego boxes are seldom used in multiple ways, especially being the plates. They buckets are simply toy boxes, which means you can only use it to store toys. Even if there are plates included sometimes, the plates still have nothing to do with the bucket itself.

Here are some similar Lego toys that have plates with product design, as I can remember. If there is something missing, please inform me here.

My First Lego Set: The predecessor of curret Junior series. The bottom boxes are made of cardboard, only the cover is made of plastic brick plate. The example pics also show how can we play with the covers. Even though Junior has no brick-related container designs, surprisingly the starter covers were made in 2013.

Racers miniturbo and fold-out series: the road plate is folded in the box. Consumers can open the plate and then fold it back to a cube. I wonder if they can be used in minifigure-scale City layouts, though I don't have such information.

Thomas at Morgan's Mine: the bricks and Thomas the train are inside the mine, which is simply the whole product with a paper coat.

Speaking of Thomas, there is a not-so-glad-to-hear competitor, MegaBloks, who now owns many Thomas sets using such kind of product design:

Bridge&Train: the products simple make the trains under a cube bridge. The bridge can be used in different ways.

Bucketes with Trails: the trails are molded on the boxes. Not only you can build things on the boxes, but you can make a train route in different heights and layouts.

There could be some reasons why TLC isn't active in such kind of design. Practically, maybe general buckets use plastic that are harder than normal Lego bricks, so TLC can't massively producs such kind of brick covers. Or theoritically, the designers might think that using the buckets as plates or part of big buildings would be inappropriate for children to learn how to play bricks. But in economic aspects, I don't think having a playable boxing/package is a bad thing. What do you guys think?

Edited February 24, 2014 by Dorayaki

[LEGO Historian]

I can't speak for why they don't do this more often, although it would be nice if TLG did make the plastic containers as part of the building landscape.

The first occurrence of using a box part available for building was in USA/Canada in 1961, when Samsonite LEGO sets 702 and 703 were introduced with a tall box with a 10x10 brickplate....

This was followed later by sets 705 Basic Set, 605 Wheel Toy Set, and 905 Doll Set...

[cimddwc]

Maybe they don't do it more often because such packaging is more prone to getting damaged, especially if it's more elaborate than just a big plate on top? If a cardboard box gets dented at a corner, that's not much of a problem, unlike if a plastic piece that's part of the construction gets broken. I don't have any statistical data for how often that happens, though. :)

TLG rarely make newly molded plates for one individual set (the last one seems to be Scorpion Pyramid)

Actually, that plate was used in two (rather ugly) City sets and one Indiana Jones set before.

[Deathleech]

I would assume Lego doesn't do it more often because it greatly increases the price of the packaging. Maybe some people don't want to pay that premium for the package when all they really want are the contents?

[jodawill]

What I really want to know is why they never include baseplates in sets anymore (except the tiny green plates in the tubs and the Lego Store exclusives).

[Dorayaki]

I can't speak for why they don't do this more often, although it would be nice if TLG did make the plastic containers as part of the building landscape.

The first occurrence of using a box part available for building was in USA/Canada in 1961, when Samsonite LEGO sets 702 and 703 were introduced with a tall box with a 10x10 brickplate....

This was followed later by sets 705 Basic Set, 605 Wheel Toy Set, and 905 Doll Set...

Thanx for information. It's not too surprising to know the brick covers have appeared since along time ago. This kind of box looks like a tall building.

Actually, that plate was used in two (rather ugly) City sets and one Indiana Jones set before.

Maybe they don't do it more often because such packaging is more prone to getting damaged, especially if it's more elaborate than just a big plate on top? If a cardboard box gets dented at a corner, that's not much of a problem, unlike if a plastic piece that's part of the construction gets broken. I don't have any statistical data for how often that happens, though. :)

Thanx for info again. The plate for City buildings was okay, though the buildings weren't polished enough.

Yes, that's what I said, maybe using normal bricks to package would be more vulnerable than normal plastics. But at the same time I wonder if the current Junior covers of containers are less vulnerable than covers with plates?

[Faefrost]

I think there was a core user related flaw with using the box top as a build plate. Once the child uses it to build something on, you can no longer use it to keep the remaining Lego in the box. At least not until the child finishes with it. Better to separate the build plate from the Lego containment receptacle.

[LEGO Historian]

One of the coolest use of plastic for baseplate and other uses has to be the 1962-65 Architectural System (continentl Europe only) spare parts pack boxes... 518 (2x4 plates), 519 (2x3 plates), 520 (2x2 plates) and 521 (1x2/1x1 plates). These small parts packs had an outer sleeve that held a trans-clear plastic box (8x11x3) with a gray 8x11 baseplate (unique size only ever found in these parts packs).

You could use the trans-clear box as interior support for your building projects, and the 8x11 gray plates for roofs. A very cool combination that was never repeated again by TLG...

From my Collectors Guide chapter on the shortilved and unpopular Architectural Series of sets of 1962-65...

Edited February 26, 2014 by LEGO Historian

[Dorayaki]

I would assume Lego doesn't do it more often because it greatly increases the price of the packaging. Maybe some people don't want to pay that premium for the package when all they really want are the contents?

Uhmm... not sure if the current Junior design or normal flat covers would save much more money than playable packages. If they do, it does possibly affect the prices.

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What I really want to know is why they never include baseplates in sets anymore (except the tiny green plates in the tubs and the Lego Store exclusives).

Maybe for cost of production or for lack of necessity after some market research? I personally think it's economic to have generic plates seperately sold, but I'd like to see more kinds or seperate plates.

[jodawill]

Uhmm... not sure if the current Junior design or normal flat covers would save much more money than playable packages. If they do, it does possibly affect the prices.

.

Maybe for cost of production or for lack of necessity after some market research? I personally think it's economic to have generic plates seperately sold, but I'd like to see more kinds or seperate plates.

Yeah, I'm sure they would have done some research on it before making the decision. But I think it's a big bummer because they used to have a lot of really cool plates. Just in the Wild West theme, they had a road baseplate and a river baseplate. I'd like to see those put back into production with straight ones to match them.

[Cult_Of_Skaro]

What I really want to know is why they never include baseplates in sets anymore (except the tiny green plates in the tubs and the Lego Store exclusives).

Yeah, the only things that have had them in the past five years that I can think of are the Opera house, the modulars, and one space police set. Probably a few more, but not many...

[Lordofdragonss]

What I really want to know is why they never include baseplates in sets anymore (except the tiny green plates in the tubs and the Lego Store exclusives).

Because now the sets that needs them are quite big and pricy already- adding a baseplate would greatly boost the price, and people would not like that.

The better question is...WHY THEY ARE SO DAMN EXPENSIVE?

[Deathleech]

Uhmm... not sure if the current Junior design or normal flat covers would save much more money than playable packages. If they do, it does possibly affect the prices.

I have no idea. I assume the plastic they use for packaging is much cheaper quality than what they use for actual pieces you build with.

As for why Lego doesn't include base plates in sets anymore.. well look at the retail price of them. Just a standard green base plate is what, $5? That's a nice chunk of change to add on to a set. Some of them were unique and cool, but others could get redundant much like the brick separators Lego includes in every larger set now. I would rather be able to just buy the base plate separate if I want it than have it forced on me in a set. Then again we don't really get the cool printed ones we use to, just standard green, blue, or gray base plates now. It would be nice if Lego offered some printed ones for individual sale...

[Dorayaki]

I think there was a core user related flaw with using the box top as a build plate. Once the child uses it to build something on, you can no longer use it to keep the remaining Lego in the box. At least not until the child finishes with it. Better to separate the build plate from the Lego containment receptacle.

It is an issue sometimes, and sometimes not. After all the plate is additional to the general product while boxes are still necessary. Making buildable boxes doesn't affect the integrity of product. Maybe instuctions can tell both how to build things with boxes, and without boxes.

One of the coolest use of plastic for baseplate and other uses has to be the 1962-65 Architectural System (continentl Europe only) spare parts pack boxes... 518 (2x4 plates), 519 (2x3 plates), 520 (2x2 plates) and 521 (1x2/1x1 plates). These small parts packs had an outer sleeve that held a trans-clear plastic box (8x11x3) with a gray 8x11 baseplate (unique size only ever found in these parts packs).

You could use the trans-clear box as interior support for your building projects, and the 8x11 gray plates for roofs. A very cool combination that was never repeated again by TLG...

A big thank for your information. These products look closer to what the topic was about, though still there isn't enough visual information for how to utilize these boxes.

[TheOrcKing]

What I really want to know is why they never include baseplates in sets anymore (except the tiny green plates in the tubs and the Lego Store exclusives).

Modulars and large scale exclusives at the Lego store seem to be the only sets with any sort of baseplate anymore since 2011 or 2012 which is especially frustrating when trying to build your own modular type of house. Considering how many bricks you can get with something like the large Town Hall on top of the 32x32 tan baseplate, including one in a set doesn't always seem to increase price by much. While you can purchase a few 32x32 baseplates separately from Lego, I think trying to find any 16x32 baseplates will just exponentially increase in difficulty quickly and those to me are usually more useful than 32x32's.

Edited March 6, 2014 by TheOrcKing

[jonwil]

I heard that the reason TLG dumped baseplates from City sets and Creator sets and stuff is because the new system (e.g. 8x16 and 16x16 plates) provides a lot more flexibility and playability for the target audience. (even more so in Creator where the new plate style allows more flexibility in the alternate models)

[gedren_y]

The current crop of Juniors sets now have two new base molds that look like they are wonderful building surfaces. The larger piece is offered with some nice printing. These will be quite a boon to MOC builders, I think. Hopefully we will see the parts used for other themes.

[Vee]

The better question is...WHY THEY ARE SO DAMN EXPENSIVE?

Because there are too many people that pay the price so why lower it?