LOTR & The Hobbit 2013 Set Discussion

[deskp]

Really? I think the Rivendell set is pretty weak. The colors are nice, but it's pretty bare-bones and the minifig selection is lackluster - instead of Rivendell Arwen and a rehash Frodo, we could have had a wounded Bruinen Frodo and a travel-outfit Arwen on Asfaloth. Besides the lackluster Orcs, I think the Black Gate and Corsair Ship are far superior sets for the LOTR line. Though Helm's Deep is still the best overall for LOTR.

Arwen is wearing the travel outfit... well its normally called the "chase" outfit

Lego color photoshopped to be mroe correct.

Edited May 1, 2013 by deskp

[Deathleech]

So, in a low end ($40?) set

It's actually even less than that at $30 I believe?

I don't think this was a perfect set by any means, but I really don't think you can knock it for "lackluster minifig selection".

Both Arwen and Elron look great in my opinion, and I would rather have Arwen in her dress than not at all. With that said I do kind of wish either Frodo and Gimli would of been replaced with something more interesting. Another Boromir perhaps? Of course I totally understand why Lego did it. Gimli, despite being in several sets, has only been available in expensive ones thus far (all $80+), and the main character Frodo wouldn't of even been in this wave if not for his inclusion in the council of Elrond set (where he also plays an important role). A different print for Frodo or Gimli, at the least, would of been nice but I can't fault Lego for not doing it. I mean the Frodo print has only appeared one other time and that's closer to the clothing he has during the actual council anyways.

[Maximillian365]

Awesome pictures there!!!

[Str0ngbad]

Not to mention Arwen isn't even a part of 'the Chase' in the books. She took Glorindel's role for the movie. I don't know if anyone else around here feels like me but I find that Gimli's torso is wonderful for generic dwarves. As far as a wounded Frodo, what would that entail? The same Frodo with a blood stain? He already has a face for it. Regardless, this is supposed to be the Council and Rivendell, not the chase outside of it and I'm glad for it. It is awfully high up on my list as well.

[Darth Caedus]

So, in a low end ($40?) set we get brand new arches, foliage in new Autumn colors, an assortment of common but useful pieces, one of the iconic locations from LOTR, a "hero" minifig that has so far only appeared in much more expensive sets, a unique version of Elrond who has so far only been available as a video game promotion, and Arwen - a character who has appeared on every wish list since the first rumors of the LOTR theme started to surface.

And your complaint is that it isn't the RIGHT Arwen.

Your opinion is, of course, your own. But this comment really illustrates that AFOLs can find something to complain about in every set that TLG make. I don't think this was a perfect set by any means, but I really don't think you can knock it for "lackluster minifig selection".

The autumn foliage is nice, I'll give you that. The set doesn't hit the "iconic" box for me though, as rather stunted - a roof and a cramped circle of chairs doesn't really capture the iconic glory of Rivendell, which I think would have been better off as a larger, modular set (I also feel it's a waste of an LOTR slot, as Rivendell is a location that can appear in the Hobbit line, whereas our chances for Gondor stuff are dwindling fast). Also, Gimli's really only there for the goofy action feature, which - let's be honest - nobody's buying this set because it has a Gimli-launcher. It could have been Boromir, or better yet, Aragorn's council outfit. I'll admit bias on the Elrond front since I prefer the aesthetic of the Last Alliance version. But overall, I think Lego's minifigure selection has been notably lackluster in the 2nd LOTR Wave compared the the 1st LOTR wave and the Hobbit wave. Pathetically bad orcs that lack hairpieces for no reason, orcs in places nobody wants or needs them (taking up Corsair slots in the ship), no Army Builder set and Army builder characters in expensive sets (oathbreakers in the ship), cut and paste rehashes of several Fellowship members, and all-in-all sloppy choices (identical Gandalf the Greys in Isengard and the Duel set, while shunting Gandalf the White into the Black Gate - a set intended to be purchased multiple times - rather than a Gondorian, or at the very least, a Rohirrim variant). I harp on it because it's a far cry from the deft distribution of the previous waves. Look at how the Dwarves were well sprinkled throughout the Hobbit sets, which also managed to include just enough Bilbos without it being overkill. Or LOTR wave 1, where you could effectively build up important factions of Uruks and Rohirrim while buffing your Helm's Deep set - and all the Fellowship members were inserted here and there with doubles of the important ones (Aragorn, Frodo, etc.)

We - or at least I, as an AFOL - comment on these things because we know Lego can do better - Lego CAN make "perfect" sets with great elements, a cool model, great minifigs. Look at Uruk-hai Army, or Shelob's Lair, or Bag End (or the Cavalry Builder or Stagecoach over in the Lone Ranger line).

[BlueberryWaffles]

At least Frodo has a new face.

[8BrickMario]

Yeah, the possessed/poisoned face was good for some situations, but not all.

[Lynx]

I love the Rivendell set due to its display value. Beautiful colours and instantly recognisable. I prefer it over a pirate ship (the first LotR set I won't purchase) or a black wall. But I agree on some of the points of critique you elaborated on, Darth Caedus. Mainly, I'd have wished for another figure instead of Gimli. I would have also appreciated an alternative leg piece for Arwen. The problem with LEGO robes is that the make characters taller than those with regular leg pieces. It works really well for Saruman, but seeing Arwen towering over Aragorn does not sit well with me.

[SheepEater]

Just my personal opinion but the Goblin King battle isn't worth it's bricks. I wish I had a do over when it comes to that set.

It had its shortcomings (components not being connected), but this is easily, and cheaply fixed.

http://www.eurobrick...l=+goblin +king

Edited May 2, 2013 by SheepEater

[B34TBOXX5]

why wouldnt they? Theyre the same person.

Exactly!

[Str0ngbad]

It had its shortcomings (components not being connected), but this is easily, and cheaply fixed.

I like what you did with it as the disjointedness of it was an issue but I still dislike the set. I don't fault LEGO for a poor design so much as I just really don't think it was great source material for a set. Ramshackle boards and rocks shoved together can only be so interesting. Regarding the minifigures, I hated the Goblin King in the movie so it's not LEGO's fault I hated the figure but he is probably the reason this set costs more than it looks and feels like it should. TLG did fall short on the goblins though, as I've mentioned before. The 'cap' not covering the face on the back (that really doesn't even need to be there) is just plain sloppy and I don't like the way it makes their foreheads bulge out like Brain from the Animaniacs. I understand why LEGO chose to do a set based on it as it is a very iconic and memorable part of the movie and books but the result is easily my least favorite set I've ever owned; fortunately not everyone feels that way.

Now that I'm finished whining, I really have been unbelievably happy with this line and I don't expect everything that comes out to be according to my preference. LEGO has made the last year a little brighter with these children's toys and for that I am very grateful.

Edited May 2, 2013 by Str0ngbad

[Darth Caedus]

Agree with Strongbad about the Goblintown set. It's a really weak $100 set (weaker than the Corsair ship, in fact) with little visual appeal for what should be a ramshackle swirl of chaos like it is in the film. Connecting the bits helps, but it's almost literally polishing a turd - the set is brown and squashed, with no room to breath. At least the Corsair ship is a solid depiction of an interesting vehicle from the films. Goblintown is such an entertaining messy mass in the film, a better designer would have focused on that (probably would have been better off with two of the rope bridges at different heights to convey the architectural haphazardness). As for the Goblins themselves, I think Lego did the best they could there - the Goblin design in AUJ is just plain bad. They made a terrible decision in straying from fearsome look of the Moria Goblins in Fellowship of the Ring. Just look at the difference:

FOTR: Menacing, spiky, eerie.

AUJ: Obvious CGI, snivelling, way too clean, all-in-all mediocre. The second one looks like a rejected puppet from The Dark Crystal.

Edited May 2, 2013 by Darth Caedus

[Drachmyre]

I don't understand why everyone is down on the corsair. Is a cool looking ship IMO.

[Lynx]

I don't understand why everyone is down on the corsair. Is a cool looking ship IMO.

Personally, I pick sets for their appeal as display pieces. I suppose I am a Tolkien fan first, and LEGO fan second. Having "An unexpected Gathering" or "Battle for Helm's Deep" on the shelf not only looks good but ensures instant recognition. I'd even put "Attack on Weathertop" into that category if I set it up with Nazgul closing in on the hobbits. The corsair ship is certainly a nice ship, and I'd have loved this 25 years ago. Now, however, it is just a large, display-space eating, generic vessel to me. The ship played such a minute part in the movie that I'd have to explain friends why I set this LEGO pirate ship up next to the cool Lord of the Rings sets. I am glad the set does not include any desirable minifigures (for me), so not buying it is a no-brainer for me.

[Gryphon Ink]

The set doesn't hit the "iconic" box for me though, as rather stunted - a roof and a cramped circle of chairs doesn't really capture the iconic glory of Rivendell, which I think would have been better off as a larger, modular set (I also feel it's a waste of an LOTR slot, as Rivendell is a location that can appear in the Hobbit line, whereas our chances for Gondor stuff are dwindling fast). Also, Gimli's really only there for the goofy action feature, which - let's be honest - nobody's buying this set because it has a Gimli-launcher. It could have been Boromir, or better yet, Aragorn's council outfit... But overall, I think Lego's minifigure selection has been notably lackluster in the 2nd LOTR Wave compared the the 1st LOTR wave and the Hobbit wave...

You have some good points there. I don't think anybody would argue with you about the stupid lack of variety in our Orc armies, or that there were better army builders in the last wave and in other themes. I also would love to see a grander version of Rivendell. A 2000 piece Rivendell would be awesome and beautiful. But I probably wouldn't buy it, and I wouldn't be the only one. Look at all the comments on the Orthanc press release. Half of them say "beautiful set, it's a must-have for me" and the other half say "beautiful set, unfortunately costs way too much for me." Hell, I haven't even bought Helm's Deep, which is the centerpiece of the entire theme so far. It just costs too much for me. This Rivendell is something that I can buy, and for that price point I think they did a darn good job. It doesn't capture the glory of Rivendell, as you say, but it does do a good job representing the feeling of the place. Even the most casual LOTR fan will look at that set and know exactly what it is.

As far as the minifigs go in this specific set, I'm really happy that Gimli is there. It would have been good to get Boromir in the group, since there are hardly any scenes left for him to be in. But Gimli is one of the central characters of the whole trilogy, and he's only been in the really expensive sets so far. He has some excellent accessories and is very useful for making custom Dwarves. And yes, all of the Dwarf-hurling play features are pretty silly, but my kids do enjoy those things. There's a valid reason why TLG like to include silly play features in every set - their main target market loves things that go boom.

If anybody in this set is "filler", it's Frodo - and as someone else pointed out, he's there mostly because otherwise he wouldn't be in this wave at all, and an LOTR wave without Frodo would be like a Big Mac without the hamburger.

Edited May 2, 2013 by Gryphon Ink

[Str0ngbad]

I don't understand why everyone is down on the corsair. Is a cool looking ship IMO.

Most people seem to be down on it because it is taking the place of a set they would rather see (read 'Gondorian anything') or because the minifigure selection isn't ideal for them. I don't think many people are actually unhappy with the ship itself. I for one think it looks amazing and I hope it becomes my first ship but it will almost certainly be the last thing I get from this wave, for the exact same reason Lynx mentioned. It's just not as essential or iconic as the other sets. I do, however, want those army of the dead minifigures quite a bit. Does anyone know, are those shields on the ship supposed to be for the Corsairs? There are 14 or more on it!

[Drachmyre]

Ah, I guess I see where you are coming from. I think I like the display factor, and I'm fairly sure the LG knows ships tend to sell well. So it was a way to sneak one in. For a display factor ill likely eventually get several. I saw somewhere else that the dead had a bunch of glow In the dark parts (helms arms faces etc) and if true will be too cool. I can't imagine picking up extra dead folks will be cheap :( .

[Str0ngbad]

Ah, I guess I see where you are coming from. I think I like the display factor, and I'm fairly sure the LG knows ships tend to sell well. So it was a way to sneak one in. For a display factor ill likely eventually get several. I saw somewhere else that the dead had a bunch of glow In the dark parts (helms arms faces etc) and if true will be too cool. I can't imagine picking up extra dead folks will be cheap :( .

I think some of their printing is glow-in-the-dark but I'm sure their helmets aren't. You're right about getting extras, not cheap at all. I'll be content with my three if I get the set.

[Artanis I]

In addition to the "Gimli has only been in expensive sets so far" argument, there aren't too many more sets he could appear in for next year's (assuming there is one) wave. He showed up late for the Minas Tirith battle, I imagine any Pelennor Fields set would have Merry, Eowyn, Witch King, Theoden & perhaps Legolas before him. He didn't really do anything else in ROTK outside of the 2 scenes already covered this wave. (Black Gate & Paths of the Dead) You'd think Rohan has been done, I wouldn't imagine he'd be in a balrog set, and Boromir & Aragorn + hobbits would appear before him in an Amon Hen set.

So we may not even see him again?

[Delta 38]

This would have been a perfect hair for Gandalf, It fits fine in LDD, but sadly not with real bricks, Lego were so close to making something perfect but missed it.

Yeah, it's a shame. The actual parts just barely miss out, but there is a way to make the hair fit by not pushing down the head fully so there's a small gap.

The only downside is that the mouth is visible if your face is printed slightly higher, but at least it's a purist solution to modifying the piece.

[Vindice]

Wow some people really like to complain!

I don't know why people are harping on about the lack of Gondorian sets so much, there is still a chance for at least one more wave of LOTR sets. Hasn't the release of Orthanc proved to people that TLG has made a substantial investment in this line???

If and when there is a wave 3 I expect it will tick everyones boxes with the set selection but TLG has a strict marketing formula on how they put out sets and the price points they are set at. The price of Rivendell will be set and the deisngers have to work within those constraints whilst giving the public more and more minifigures. this takes a way from the amount of bricks (especially if they have to create new molds) they can put into the finished design.

Kids love play features and they love vehicles and this has to be catered for or the sets wont sell well. The corsair ship looks authentic and although it wasn't in the film much it was still an important part and it fits the bill perfectly as a vehicle.

i also agree that this may be one of Gimli's last appearances. I would expect minas tirith will include Eowyn, Witch King, Merry and some Gondorian soldiers. I would also think than a Mumakil is quite likely as a "vehicle" type set with legolas.

I'm not in the least bit surprised that the orcs are so generic. Don't forget we got great representation of the Uruk Hai with both Lurz and a Beserker. We may get Gothmog with Minas tirith or Grishnak with Treebeard. That would be fine for the orcs.

Maybe we should all just be patient and some of us moan a little less, in that way we may one day get one of the designers back on the forum who can give us some insights into how these things are decided.

[Gryphon Ink]

I don't know why people are harping on about the lack of Gondorian sets so much, there is still a chance for at least one more wave of LOTR sets. Hasn't the release of Orthanc proved to people that TLG has made a substantial investment in this line??? If and when there is a wave 3 I expect it will tick everyones boxes with the set selection...

I believe TLG's plan has always been to ramp up and bring out Gondor in the third wave of the theme, but a lot of fans insist on thinking the theme is over. Every time there isn't any news for a couple of weeks somebody comes in and declares the theme dead or dying. And when there is news, it's also a sign that the theme is about to be cancelled. Small wave of LOTR sets this summer? Because sales were weak and TLG are quietly phasing it out. A new Castle wave coming out this year? TLG were disappointed with LOTR and realised they need a back-up plan. No Tower of Orthanc? Sales were atrocious and TLG will never make a big UCS-style LOTR set. Oh, wait, there is a Tower of Orthanc? Well, that must be LOTR's grand send-off. Mark my words, this can mean no good for fans of this theme.

The fact is if you look at Amazon's top selling building sets (the only sales data that is readily available to the public), LOTR still has three or four in the top 100 and the Hobbit has two (and one of those is Riddles for the Ring, which AFOLs decided was a horrible and pointless set). And the LOTR sets have been in the charts for almost a year, while the likes of Monster Fighters, Batman and the Avengers sell like crazy for a short period and then drop off the edges of the map. LOTR isn't selling as well as Ninjago, Friends or Chima, but you would never expect it to.

Like you, I think that there will be at least one more wave of LOTR sets, and before the theme is over we will have everything we want including the Witch-King, the Balrog, Treebeard and Gondorian forces galore. Meanwhile, this summer's wave is not the BESTEST WAVE EVAR, but it's got a decent selection at a wide range of prices and a whole gang of coveted minifigs in beautiful renditions.

[Only Sinner]

I don't understand all the bashing of the Council Of Elrond set. It is a fantastic set with lots of nice pieces in rare colors, beautiful minifigs, and relatively cheap. The set is not even called Rivendell. Sure, there's some elvish architecture and foliage, but the focus is supposed to be on the one ring on the stone pedastal, just like in the movie.

[Slobey]

I believe TLG's plan has always been to ramp up and bring out Gondor in the third wave of the theme, but a lot of fans insist on thinking the theme is over. Every time there isn't any news for a couple of weeks somebody comes in and declares the theme dead or dying. And when there is news, it's also a sign that the theme is about to be cancelled. Small wave of LOTR sets this summer? Because sales were weak and TLG are quietly phasing it out. A new Castle wave coming out this year? TLG were disappointed with LOTR and realised they need a back-up plan. No Tower of Orthanc? Sales were atrocious and TLG will never make a big UCS-style LOTR set. Oh, wait, there is a Tower of Orthanc? Well, that must be LOTR's grand send-off. Mark my words, this can mean no good for fans of this theme.

The fact is if you look at Amazon's top selling building sets (the only sales data that is readily available to the public), LOTR still has three or four in the top 100 and the Hobbit has two (and one of those is Riddles for the Ring, which AFOLs decided was a horrible and pointless set). And the LOTR sets have been in the charts for almost a year, while the likes of Monster Fighters, Batman and the Avengers sell like crazy for a short period and then drop off the edges of the map. LOTR isn't selling as well as Ninjago, Friends or Chima, but you would never expect it to.

Like you, I think that there will be at least one more wave of LOTR sets, and before the theme is over we will have everything we want including the Witch-King, the Balrog, Treebeard and Gondorian forces galore. Meanwhile, this summer's wave is not the BESTEST WAVE EVAR, but it's got a decent selection at a wide range of prices and a whole gang of coveted minifigs in beautiful renditions.

I couldn't have said it any better......

[Darth Caedus]

I'm not in the least bit surprised that the orcs are so generic. Don't forget we got great representation of the Uruk Hai with both Lurz and a Beserker. We may get Gothmog with Minas tirith or Grishnak with Treebeard. That would be fine for the orcs.

The complaint about the Orcs is that they have Uruk-hai helmets or none at all, both of which are aesthetically meh, when there's a great Orc hairpiece from the first LOTR wave. Why not re-use that? It's not like they have to change the colors or anything - just reuse the one that was in the Orc Forge.