Yakuza Family - Day 1

[WhiteFang]

Forgive me if I missed this, but is there any apparent significance in the five genies? Grandpa had a vision about them, and that came true, so is it just to confirm his uh... foresight?

If you and I are thinking the same line, I am not sure if I should attempt to understand the meaning but it appears there might be "5" hiding among us for starters?

Is that what you are thinking too.

[CorneliusMurdock]

Forgive me if I missed this, but is there any apparent significance in the five genies? Grandpa had a vision about them, and that came true, so is it just to confirm his uh... foresight?

I've been wondering the same thing. Perhaps Grandfather is just a dirty old man who has wild dreams. But I don't quite get what happened with the lamp today.

[Peanuts]

I'd guess this lamp thing's intention was to prove the correctness of his prophecies, that the second one must come true if the first one did, like in McBeth, and maybe it's going to be a running gag.

But I'll keep in mind that the number of the genies could hint to the number of Mutineers, but considering we are 32 people in this temple, only 5 Mutineers seems a bit few, doesn't it?

[RileyC]

Damn a lynching situation? Boy do I hate these...

This is certainly a strange situation with Yasu and I agree that is it not normal townie behavior

Basically, my train of thought went like this:

1. 
   
2. Yasu is afraid of suspicion.
   
3. True Townies don't need to act like Townies and try to act in a way that avoids suspicion.
   
4. Townies realize that every Townie should suspect everyone else at this point in the situation. (unless god specifically tells them they can trust someone)
   
5. Therefore, Townies shouldn't be afraid of being suspected.
   
6. Townies shouldn't be afraid of being suspected, and Yasu is afraid of being suspected, therefore, Yasu's behavior is not that of a Townie.

Emi's thinking here is how I thought of it too. Its just odd that she thought we would suspect her And how did she even know there was going to be suspects? How did she know people could get lynched/suspected?

Forgive me if I missed this, but is there any apparent significance in the five genies? Grandpa had a vision about them, and that came true, so is it just to confirm his uh... foresight?

Could it be that the five genies are the mutineers we have to find? If this is true it would mean we have to find 5 mutineers. So not an easy task at all...

[Brickdoctor]

Emi's thinking here is how I thought of it too. Its just odd that she thought we would suspect her And how did she even know there was going to be suspects? How did she know people could get lynched/suspected?

Oh, come now. Let's not pretend that we didn't know based on past situations that there would be suspects and lynches. She knew full well that there would be. (and if she didn't then she really is a Templie who doesn't know what she's doing) And like I said, she should expect to be suspected. That's not what's suspicious. What's suspicious is that she doesn't want us to suspect her and told us not to suspect her, defending herself against suspicion before anyone had accused her.

[Capt. Redblade]

Forgive me if I missed this, but is there any apparent significance in the five genies? Grandpa had a vision about them, and that came true, so is it just to confirm his uh... foresight?

That makes sense. Granted, five seems like a low number, but Grandfather's vision could have been just a rough estimate.

[WhiteFang]

But I'll keep in mind that the number of the genies could hint to the number of Mutineers, but considering we are 32 people in this temple, only 5 Mutineers seems a bit few, doesn't it?

Let's keep an open mind and consider such possibility that 5 is their initial numbers (Mutineers) not including any 3rd party or possible conversions, if any. Our family is big and one of the biggest ever seen in history.

[CorneliusMurdock]

Five seems really low, though. If their goal is outnumber us, it would take quite a while to achieve that. Grandfather's first vision was one he seemed pleased with until it became a harbinger for the other vision. If the number is significant, it may be significant in a different way.

I don't suppose someone could rub the lamp and ask the genies themselves what they represent?

[Fred Daniel Yam]

Everyone, chill! My wife ain't a scum simply cos she hasn't said nothin'. Sis, why are you so sure Yasu is a traitor? Maybe you're tryin' to shift the general consensus on my darlin' wife.

[Brickdoctor]

Everyone, chill! My wife ain't a scum simply cos she hasn't said nothin'.

Nobody said that Yasu was Scum because she said nothing. It has nothing to do with that. What's suspicious is that she specifically told us not to suspect her. There was no reason for her to say that unless she was afraid of being suspected. The only reasons for her to be afraid of being suspected are if she has something to hide or if she's a Templie and doesn't know what she's doing. (because she doesn't realize that true Templies have to suspect everyone else and she's probably also afraid to die even though she can still win in this situation if she dies) Right now, it seems to me that she's either selfish, very inexperienced, or Scum.

Sis, why are you so sure Yasu is a traitor? Maybe you're tryin' to shift the general consensus on my darlin' wife.

If you could please go find the statement in which I said I was "so sure Yasu is a traitor", I'd be happy to explain it.

[TheBoyWonder]

I got a bit over excited and thought I would be gone for longer.

I can see why you are doubting me, but it is not exactly the best logic. True people have died for less, but it is unprofound, pushing a lynch on something that has happened outside of the day thread.

I can't stay awake all night to play mafia.

[Brickdoctor]

I can see why you are doubting me, but it is not exactly the best logic. True people have died for less, but it is unprofound, pushing a lynch on something that has happened outside of the day thread.

Why do you think the logic is faulty? Can you point out where it fails?

I'm not sure what a 'day thread' is, but whether or not it should technically be done, the fact remains that you said something suspicious during the time when we were gathering together. In-universe, my character would know of it. I was there when you said it.

I can't stay awake all night to play mafia.

Please tell me I don't have to explain this in two consecutive statements by me.

Nobody said that Yasu was Scum because she said nothing. It has nothing to do with that. What's suspicious is that she specifically told us not to suspect her. There was no reason for her to say that unless she was afraid of being suspected. The only reasons for her to be afraid of being suspected are if she has something to hide or if she's a Templie and doesn't know what she's doing. (because she doesn't realize that true Templies have to suspect everyone else and she's probably also afraid to die even though she can still win in this situation if she dies) Right now, it seems to me that she's either selfish, very inexperienced, or Scum.

I even outlined my suspicions earlier, not once mentioning inactivity:

Basically, my train of thought went like this:

1. 
   
2. Yasu is afraid of suspicion.
   
3. True Townies don't need to act like Townies and try to act in a way that avoids suspicion.
   
4. Townies realize that every Townie should suspect everyone else at this point in the situation. (unless god specifically tells them they can trust someone)
   
5. Therefore, Townies shouldn't be afraid of being suspected.
   
6. Townies shouldn't be afraid of being suspected, and Yasu is afraid of being suspected, therefore, Yasu's behavior is not that of a Townie.

[TheBoyWonder]

I said I would be gone, because I can't be there for the start. I have seen people lynched for quietness.

But l am not experienced in these matters. I make one statment, not even in the day thread, and I am lynched.

Just because I make a comment that is reasonable, as such people have been lynched before.

[Brickdoctor]

I said I would be gone, because I can't be there for the start. I have seen people lynched for quietness.

You're kidding me, right? I have to say this again? You are not suspected for being quiet, and you are not suspected for saying you would be offline asleep.

You are suspicious because you specifically told us not to suspect you. See my previous statements for more details.

I make one statment, not even in the day thread, and I am lynched.

You're not lynched. (yet) You have been given the opportunity to assemble a defense. As of right now, you've basically said that you can't be awake all the time and that, technically, I might be metagaming*. Neither of those 'defenses' directly addresses the accusation against you. Not a single vote has been cast against you. (yet) Why are you acting as if you're as good as dead, instead of defending yourself? (giving up, by the way, is a Scum tell)

*As if this was a game.

[def]

Well, I'm of two notions. One, I don't like this:

And how did she even know there was going to be suspects? How did she know people could get lynched/suspected?

Could it be that the five genies are the mutineers we have to find? If this is true it would mean we have to find 5 mutineers. So not an easy task at all...

Starting on day one, asking how someone knows there would be lynching... It's all a little too much for me. Between that, and the obscene size of their signature (no true Yakuza needs that sort of bling), I think that would be a fair choice, just to send a message to the true Yakuza to be gung ho, right from the start, and avoid all pussyfootin'.

The second choice is this guy:

I said I would be gone, because I can't be there for the start. I have seen people lynched for quietness.

But l am not experienced in these matters. I make one statment, not even in the day thread, and I am lynched.

Just because I make a comment that is reasonable, as such people have been lynched before.

First off, it would be a lesson about not using the C & D for gameplay. The point that it wasn't in the day thread would be the reason to vote that way.

But then...

Not a single vote has been cast against you. (yet) Why are you acting as if you're as good as dead, instead of defending yourself? (giving up, by the way, is a Scum tell)

Yeah, pretty much. That's a nutsy reaction to nothing but talk on day one.

So, for day one lynch candidates, I'm leaning toward someone whose behavior isn't helping

[MetroiD]

But l am not experienced in these matters. I make one statment, not even in the day thread, and I am lynched.

You speak as though a decision has already been made. We are all one big family here, remember? Talking things over because Father has foreseen a dark future ahead - not for one, but for all of us. And if there ever was a time for us to settle our differences and understand each other's way of thinking, now's that time. I do not find your attitude befitting of a true Yakuza - you seem to be giving up without even trying to actually defend yourself! Who do you think you're giving up on - this game of life, or your entire Family?

Yasu - once again: your comment was far from reasonable, considering there are 32 of us locked up in this Temple. Did you not notice that almost half of our family has flown in from all different ends of the world just to be (nicely locked up) here today? It's only natural that some would be more exhausted and would need to take their time before they could actually join in on any discussions we are holding here, but I didn't notice anyone asking others not to be suspicious. Anyone else, besides you, that is. Which constitutes a rather suspicious behaviour - so I suggest you start spilling the rice, if there's any rice to be spilt here, or otherwise just show to us in a plausible manner why we should try to have more faith in you again.

It takes years to build up someone's trust, and then no more than a mere moment to fully destroy it. While I must trust each and every one of my children, I am not sure you have done anything to justify my faith in you to begin with. It seems to me that yours are not the Yakuza ways, Yasu, and I pray that you come to your senses...

[Cecilie]

There, finally done disinfecting my little area over here.

For me, I've got some work to do, scrubbing and cleaning the nooks and crannies of this place.

Thanks for helping keeping this place clean

Now, I see Yasu has made herself a suspect today. Not surprising really, that statement to not suspect her really is suspicious.

It appears some of you have already come up with something suspicious. I must say, I don't think it's a scumtell, since scum would usually try to avoid attention like this. So she obviously tried to defend herself even before she was attacked, even before we started to look for the Mutineers among us, although any scum should have known we wouldn't attack someone for being quiet early in the game, since there are different time zones sleep-wake cycles, so nobody would have cared anyway. So, therefore, if there is at least one experienced (or at least logically thinking) scum member they wouldn't have approved of her defending herself in the discussion thread yesterday in the evening. So, I myself think she is just being a paranoid, self-centered, but nonetheless loyal member of the Yakuza (no offence). Why paranoid and self-centered? Because a Yakuza or Mutineer who's not paranoid won't assume they would be accused, and a Yakuza who's not self-centered won't really care if they are accused, they'll simply do their best to defend themselves after reading the accusation and if they fail, they'll die in honor. So they certainly won't care about being under suspicion, either, especially if there's no reason for them to be suspected. They will care about the Family, not about themselves.

I agree with your premiss, but not with your conclusion. In an ideal case, a true Yakuza (why are you talking about "Townies" anyway, we're in a temple, not in a town ) will not try to act innocent, as I said above, but sometimes young aspirants, who still have to learn, care more about themselves than about the Family. They fear being killed so much, that they try to act innocant, and don't realize how they harm the Family that way.

I'm taking note that you're defending her... I doubt that she would have asked her mutineer buddies about saying what she did.

I'd guess this lamp thing's intention was to prove the correctness of his prophecies, that the second one must come true if the first one did, like in McBeth, and maybe it's going to be a running gag.

But I'll keep in mind that the number of the genies could hint to the number of Mutineers, but considering we are 32 people in this temple, only 5 Mutineers seems a bit few, doesn't it?

Only 5 mutineers? If that's the case, it's quite likely they can convert more of us to their ranks

I can't stay awake all night to play mafia.

Nobody expects you to. That's why it's suspicious of you to state that we shouldn't suspect you because you need to sleep.

[def]

Only 5 mutineers? If that's the case, it's quite likely they can convert more of us to their ranks

I'd be happy to stick with the 3:1 ratio, meaning that, all together, we'd have about eight enemies to get, and more if there were two factions. I don't know that there are two factions, but with so many of us here, it's a definite possibility. On the other hand, if there were more than one faction, there is a solid chance that it's even easier for the hontonoyakuza (real Yakuza) to prevail, since the factions would have to take out each other too (unless they were to end up combining )

Anyway, until we find out there is more than one faction, I'm sticking with that 3:1 ratio

[Cecilie]

I'd be happy to stick with the 3:1 ratio, meaning that, all together, we'd have about eight enemies to get, and more if there were two factions. I don't know that there are two factions, but with so many of us here, it's a definite possibility. On the other hand, if there were more than one faction, there is a solid chance that it's even easier for the hontonoyakuza (real Yakuza) to prevail, since the factions would have to take out each other too (unless they were to end up combining )

Anyway, until we find out there is more than one faction, I'm sticking with that 3:1 ratio

That's probably a safer assumption. But we should still be wary of conversions... And it's certainly not impossible for there to be two factions in a family this big.

[Rick]

Oh my... I was getting bored waiting for the sun to rise, so I decided to do some studying, and look at everything that's been said already. Sorry for being a little late to discuss our situation.

Aw kuso! That's the crappiest, anti-town rule in the book.

I'm not a fan of that either. Voicing suspicion is something different than being able to back it up with a vote. And it will be much harder to correct any wrong decisions. It will only help the mutineers.

I am rather distressed that part of my family could possibly be trying to break this family apart. It's sad that we're forced to vote off our kin, but it's unfortunately the only way we can manage it. We must obey our grandfather, something I am honored to do.

You're not forced to vote off your Kin. Why would you want to vote off your only son?

Everyone, chill! My wife ain't a scum simply cos she hasn't said nothin'. Sis, why are you so sure Yasu is a traitor? Maybe you're tryin' to shift the general consensus on my darlin' wife.

Clearly Yasu has drawn unneeded attention to herself, but I always get a little suspicious of people who seem to defend other people on day 1.

I got a bit over excited and thought I would be gone for longer.

There are many hours in a day and people have other things to do, like studying or being 'gone' in your case. No one will suspect you solely because of that. Having said that, you have drawn attention to yourself by your action right before the sun rose.

That's probably a safer assumption. But we should still be wary of conversions... And it's certainly not impossible for there to be two factions in a family this big.

I agree, we should just keep all options open at this stage and not 'assume' too much, especially in such a large family.

[Etzel]

I bet this will tun out ugly before the next sunrise.

Yasu has put herself in a difficult position no doubt. I don't know if that is because of paranoia because she is a scum or just inexperience with this kind of situations.

Both Kin and Yushiko points out some persons that is defending Yasu (even before she had defended herself), her husband Minoru and Isamu. I can understand that people don't want to jump to conclusions too quickly but as Kin said, it may not be a good idea trying to defend people on Day 1 when we still have almost no idea of how people are.

[Tachyon]

Do you think the silent people are inactive or lurking?

And why is my husband, Daisuke obsessed with Elvis ???

[Bob]

You're not forced to vote off your Kin. Why would you want to vote off your only son?

Maybe next time you'll respect your elders!

Do you think the silent people are inactive or lurking?

Most likely lurking. With so many of us here, it's not really easy to bring forth new information.

[Fred Daniel Yam]

Clearly Yasu has drawn unneeded attention to herself, but I always get a little suspicious of people who seem to defend other people on day 1.

I'm only defendin' her because she's my wife...

We've got to root them out quickly and efficiently. Float as a butterfly, sting like a bee.

[Peanuts]

Both Kin and Yushiko points out some persons that is defending Yasu (even before she had defended herself), her husband Minoru and Isamu. I can understand that people don't want to jump to conclusions too quickly but as Kin said, it may not be a good idea trying to defend people on Day 1 when we still have almost no idea of how people are.

Just to make that clear, I have not been defending her. I have evaluated her and came to the conclusion she most likely was just an overly paranoid Family member. But I never said I was sure about that, I was simply voicing my opinion about her and about Emi's logic. And voicing opinions is never wrong.

So, she now has "defended" herself, and rather poorly. She didn't address the point Emi made, she was whiny (all that "I can't stay up all night" and "I'm already dead" talk) and she displayed a great lack of understanding for this situation. Yes, people have been lynched before because of inactiveness. But not before at least 48 hours some time has passed, so that we could really say who's quiet and who's sleeping. And, honestly, on day one more often than not people have died who were annoyingly outspoken in a way that didn't help the town at all. Especially her lack of understanding is what makes she rather useless for us, together with her paranoia and selfishness.