How to make trains faster

[Legoroni]

Ok, so I was wondering, how can I make a high-speed 9v motor. I just want it to run faster.

Second, what are some tips on a generic high speed train. I'm thinking about getting the red passenger train

and modifying it with close coupling and doors. I'll probably use the faster 9v motor for power and extra seats and the PF internals will be used for the 7939 loco which I will be buying separately from the full set.

Edited July 17, 2011 by Legoroni

[Sokratesz]

With PF you can add a gearbox. Trains are heavy and once running should be able to switch to a higher gear to get more speed.

- Sok.

[vgsprites]

Ok, so I was wondering, how can I make a high-speed 9v motor. I just want it to run faster.

Last October, Railbricks posted this article on how to add more voltage to your 9 volt track.

One simply puts 2 regulators in series with another piece of track.

That steps up the voltage to 18 volts and should feed your speed need.

As for the closeness of cars and doors I've seen a article on using a techinc pin and rubber bands on shared boogies but I can't locate it at the moment.

The red passenger train should be good enough and easily modded especially if you buy mutiples.

[Dan-147]

If you read French or if you can translate it, there's a great article on the FreeLUG site about LGVs (Ligne à Grande Vitesse) or high-speed lines. Here's the link: FreeLUG LGV.

The close-coupling article is available on the Railbricks site, in their reference library: O-Train close-coupling.

Dan-147

[LEGO Guy Bri]

Last October, Railbricks posted this article on how to add more voltage to your 9 volt track.

One simply puts 2 regulators in series with another piece of track.

Hmm... apparently the Railbricks site has expired July 14, 2011 on GoDaddy.com and it's renewal is pending. I was hoping to take a gander at it. I read about attaching 2 9v regs. in a series but, am a little confused as to how you go about making a single circuit between the two regulators. Assuming you are only using Lego connectors, are you attaching one pos. + point to one side of the track, then taking the other neg. - point, attaching it to the pos. + point on the second regulator. Only then can you attach the second regulators neg. - point to the other side of the track. Is that how you'd go about creating a series on the 9V system? I've tried 2 regulators in a parallel just to keep constant power over a long loop but, no extra power to the motor. Also, can upping the power another 9V< damage the motor?

[Legoroni]

Has anyone actually tried the 18 volt trick? I was hoping that there would be some other way than that, because I think speed regulators are too expensive.

[LEGO Guy Bri]

Has anyone actually tried the 18 volt trick? I was hoping that there would be some other way than that, because I think speed regulators are too expensive.

I don't think they're that bad. Have you checked out eBay? Two for $14.99 OR best offer

[Toastie]

Also, can upping the power another 9V< damage the motor?

Hi LGG,

well it depends . Certainly, increasing the operating voltage on a rated 9V DC motor to 18V will affect at least the lifetime of that thing. e-motors are not that much of high tech device, at least not the ones used in the LEGO 9V train motor. They can take 18V. Freely spinning that is.

However, when it comes to serious torque, things are getting nasty. There needs to go a lot of current through all pieces of the motor, including brushes, coals and so on. This is what may shorten the lifetime considerably. If you have a very light, low friction "TGV", than it might not be that bad. But any train design flaw with respect to friction will just cause an epic burn-out.

Regards,

Thorsten

[medib]

I know you'd want increased speed and torque for the straight aways, but on the curves, you don't want that much speed because the higher the speed the increased chance of derailment.

Ben

[vgsprites]

Hmm... apparently the Railbricks site has expired July 14, 2011 on GoDaddy.com and it's renewal is pending. I was hoping to take a gander at it. I read about attaching 2 9v regs. in a series but, am a little confused as to how you go about making a single circuit between the two regulators. Assuming you are only using Lego connectors, are you attaching one pos. + point to one side of the track, then taking the other neg. - point, attaching it to the pos. + point on the second regulator. Only then can you attach the second regulators neg. - point to the other side of the track. Is that how you'd go about creating a series on the 9V system? I've tried 2 regulators in a parallel just to keep constant power over a long loop but, no extra power to the motor. Also, can upping the power another 9V< damage the motor?

Hmm that's a first about the railbricks being down.

LGG you use another piece of track along with the connectors.

You connect pos. to the main loop and then the neg. of connector 1 to the extra piece of track. With connector 2 you attach the pos. to the same side of the extra track as the other connector then the neg. to the negitive side of the main loop. That is the way railbricks showed you to have 18 volts to your main loop with 2 regulators and connectors.

They had a picture and everything. If I was home I would take a pic but I'm at work.

They advised use at your own risk.

Plus FreeLUG who showed and designed this method built banked curves to handle the high speed locos.

Edited July 15, 2011 by vgsprites

[LEGO Guy Bri]

increasing the operating voltage on a rated 9V DC motor to 18V will affect at least the lifetime of that thing.

Thanks for clarifying, I figured it would be harder on the motor. I wander how long a 9V would last with 18< volts running through?

Hmm that's a first about the railbricks being down.

LGG you use another piece of track along with the connectors.

Yeah, I hope Railbricks gets back up soon but, thank you for explaining how they did it. I a little skeptical about trying this because of the extra load. I don't want to destroy any of my 9V's. I suppose a brief experiment won't be to bad

Edit: Eh, good news everyone! Railbricks renewed (if you didn't already know)

Edited July 16, 2011 by Leg Godt Gud

[Sokratesz]

Double the voltage = double the current, four times the power, which means it will be overheating very quickly.

- Sok.

[hoeij]

Double the voltage = double the current, four times the power, which means it will be overheating very quickly.

That's how a resistor works, but it's not at all how a motor works. The current depends linearly on the torque, but is practically independent of the speed or the voltage.

That's why, if you use reasonable voltages, then the lifetime of the motor is affected mostly by the weight of the train, and not by the speed setting that you decide to use.

Of course, 18 volts will drastically reduce the lifetime of the motor, but the way that motor is used matters even more. If you use the high voltage to pull a heavy train, then you'll wear out the motor much faster than if you use it for a light-weight train.

Pulling a long heavy train with a single 9V motor (even at a lower voltage, say 6V) will wear out the motor faster than a high voltage (say 12V) with a light-weight train.

[LEGO Guy Bri]

Sorry a little off topic. But, does anyone have any knowledge or recommendation of how many cars per motor without over stressing it too much? Standard 9V<, of coarse

[ZueriHB]

Double the voltage = double the current, four times the power, which means it will be overheating very quickly.

- Sok.

For the same amount of power output with higher voltage, less current is needed. Fundamentals, dear Watson ;)

[Sokratesz]

I'm not a real physics hero, but assuming he needs the higher speed/power to pull heavy trains, I think it does hold :)

- Sok.

[hoeij]

Sorry a little off topic. But, does anyone have any knowledge or recommendation of how many cars per motor without over stressing it too much? [/img]

It depends mostly on the weight of the train, not on the number of cars. If you have a 6 car train and a 4 car train, with the same total weight, then the load on the motor is the same.

For example, my 4511 train has 6 cars and is 5 feet long. These cars are light-weight, and 1 9V motor can pull it without struggling. This is on a track that is 80% straights. If you have a lot of curves in the track, then I'd take off one of those cars. Pulling 6 cars on the straights is less of a load than pulling 5 (or even 4) cars through the curves. All of the 9V sets are short and light-weight trains, so if you don't add cars, the load on the motor is small, and the motor should last a long time. I see no problem with doubling the load, but I would not go much beyond that. One 9V motor can pull two 4561 trains (two 4561's also makes a 5 feet train) but I would not go beyond that (and again, if the track had a lot of curves, I'd make the train shorter than 5 feet). For longer trains I'd use two 9V motors.

I'd be a little bit careful with 2-motor 9V trains, you have to check up on them every once in a while (i.e. check that they don't get too warm). If one motor were to get damaged and no longer pulls its share of the load, then the other one gets to pull a double load, and then wears out quickly. So one bad motor can cause a good motor to die too.

Anyhow, out of the box, the 9V trains are very light-weight, and it's no problem to add some cars, but I wouldn't overdo it. Just because the train moves does not mean that the motor can handle the load for a significant amount of time.

[I am Lego]

Has anybody looked into replacing the actual electric motor in the "9v motor" with a higher voltage ,higher amp motor? I am currently looking for motors to drive switches with, and it occured to me that perhaps a 12v motor (with higher amp loading ( or even 9v with greater torque) might be an alternative. I haven't looked to see if Philo has any specifications for the original motor, so would any body else out there have a clue as to what the specs and measurements are?

Oggy.

Edited July 18, 2011 by I am Lego

[hoeij]

Has anybody looked into replacing the actual electric motor in the "9v motor" with a higher voltage ,higher amp motor?

I have a 9V motor where the DC motor inside it is broken. I removed the broken DC motor, and I've searched online to find another DC motor of the same size, to replace the broken DC motor. I did find one that I think should fit, but I didn't buy it because it had an axle on only one side (to drive all 4 wheels, you need a DC motor where the axle sticks out on both sides).

There is not really room to put in a bigger (more powerful) motor. But you probably can make it longer-lasting by putting in a higher quality DC motor.

PS. Do not throw away broken 9V motors, they can most likely be repaired (and probably be made even better than the original) at a modest expense. Especially when you're running them at 18 volts, you're likely to break some at some point; don't throw them away.

Edited July 18, 2011 by hoeij