Potential 1/35th Scale Trains

[Craig Strader]

Hey everyone, I know I have not commented let alone posted anything new in quite sometime after the Z-6 V2. But I was wondering what you all would say about 1/35th scale trains kits for sale, from locomotives, to cars and the like. Let me know what you all have to say on the matter

[LordsofMedieval]

I model 1:48, so I would not be game. 1:36 kind of pushes things out of minifig scale.

[XG BC]

is too big imho.

[Craig Strader]

16 hours ago, LordsofMedieval said:

I model 1:48, so I would not be game. 1:36 kind of pushes things out of minifig scale.

Maybe, but to me, 1/48th scale for Lego is too small for the minifigure.

2 hours ago, XG BC said:

is too big imho.

Maybe, but with what I have in mind, the Minifigures would fit right at home with the equipment I have created

[Feuer Zug]

If you have the setup in mind to run at 1:35 scale, it might be interesting to see. I don't know how big the audience would be for kits given the size. Maybe get a small kit out there and judge the demand?

[Craig Strader]

3 hours ago, Feuer Zug said:

If you have the setup in mind to run at 1:35 scale, it might be interesting to see. I don't know how big the audience would be for kits given the size. Maybe get a small kit out there and judge the demand?

What would you start off with, USATC S160 similar to what Brickmania had at one time or a 4-6-4 Hudson used on the Santa Fe?

[brummer]

Maybe the "Jake Stone " figures are fit in 1/35 scale

[LordsofMedieval]

36 minutes ago, brummer said:

Maybe the "Jake Stone " figures are fit in 1/35 scale

Friends figures might be 1/35, actually, now that I think about it.

Edited November 17, 2022 by LordsofMedieval

[XG BC]

the issue with the minifig is that it is too fat for its height. so you have to make a compromise. can you show me pictures how big a normal sized train is at that scale.

[Craig Strader]

34 minutes ago, XG BC said:

the issue with the minifig is that it is too fat for its height. so you have to make a compromise. can you show me pictures how big a normal sized train is at that scale.

Here is a 1/35th scale version of the C&O Allegheny, with the help of Dummy on the walkway in front of the smoke box you can get a good idea of 1/35th scale

Here you can get a good idea of length of the beast

[Craig Strader]

Here is another picture of the locomotive "negotiating" an R104 curve.

[XG BC]

i think you converted me. doesnt look that bad (r40 is the only bad looking thing and that cant be avoided). makes sense for the bigger us locomotives. for european ones i think the smaller scale is better though.

[Hod Carrier]

Scale is always a very personal thing, unless of course you're part of a group, in which case a scale would need to be agreed upon. It something that not even TLG themselves seem to agree upon, as there's a huge difference between the size of various official offerings that might be expected to go together. So in this regard, there is no "wrong scale" for anything. Indeed, we have regular contributors here that build in scales outside of what is considered to be "normal". However, all that said, where scale has not formally been agreed, there is an almost internationally understood formula regarding overall size which allows for flexibility of operation and for cooperation between designers and builders. Anything that falls outside of this removes that capacity.

My own personal view is that the LEGO Minifigure has such unnatural proportions that I wouldn't base any decisions about scale around it. For trains, it would be far more logical to scale according to the track gauge we've been given to use. Employing the back of a fag packet, I worked out that LEGO track gauge is around 1:38 scale. In this case, your designs are probably much closer to scale than most others.

The obvious problems that go with a much larger scale are size and cost. If my eyes are not deceiving me, your Allegheny design is 12-wide, which makes it 50% bigger than a regular 8-wide design and, therefore, at least 50% more expensive. As your render of the loco on R104s shows, it also needs much more space in order to be run. If your proposal is to offer these designs as kits, this may become a limiting factor on their desirability. It's already been proven that larger scale models allow for greater detailing and accuracy, and it may be that the demand for these models will be more for static display rather than for running purposes.

Ultimately it's going to be for the market to decide. It would be interesting to know how you would price the Allegheny once you've included packaging, instructions, marketing, shipping, etc, etc.

6 hours ago, XG BC said:

for european ones i think the smaller scale is better though.

The great thing about scale is that it is universal. If you decide upon a certain scale then you will find that US, European and British models will all appear correctly proportioned when compared to each other. The problem is that the LEGO trains community as a whole has not done this, but rather has decided upon a formula instead which takes no account of scale.

[Craig Strader]

22 minutes ago, Hod Carrier said:

Scale is always a very personal thing, unless of course you're part of a group, in which case a scale would need to be agreed upon. It something that not even TLG themselves seem to agree upon, as there's a huge difference between the size of various official offerings that might be expected to go together. So in this regard, there is no "wrong scale" for anything. Indeed, we have regular contributors here that build in scales outside of what is considered to be "normal". However, all that said, where scale has not formally been agreed, there is an almost internationally understood formula regarding overall size which allows for flexibility of operation and for cooperation between designers and builders. Anything that falls outside of this removes that capacity.

My own personal view is that the LEGO Minifigure has such unnatural proportions that I wouldn't base any decisions about scale around it. For trains, it would be far more logical to scale according to the track gauge we've been given to use. Employing the back of a fag packet, I worked out that LEGO track gauge is around 1:38 scale. In this case, your designs are probably much closer to scale than most others.

The obvious problems that go with a much larger scale are size and cost. If my eyes are not deceiving me, your Allegheny design is 12-wide, which makes it 50% bigger than a regular 8-wide design and, therefore, at least 50% more expensive. As your render of the loco on R104s shows, it also needs much more space in order to be run. If your proposal is to offer these designs as kits, this may become a limiting factor on their desirability. It's already been proven that larger scale models allow for greater detailing and accuracy, and it may be that the demand for these models will be more for static display rather than for running purposes.

Ultimately it's going to be for the market to decide. It would be interesting to know how you would price the Allegheny once you've included packaging, instructions, marketing, shipping, etc, etc.

The great thing about scale is that it is universal. If you decide upon a certain scale then you will find that US, European and British models will all appear correctly proportioned when compared to each other. The problem is that the LEGO trains community as a whole has not done this, but rather has decided upon a formula instead which takes no account of scale.

For the Allegheny it has 6 XL motors. 2 in the boiler with the help of a universal gear to power both sets of drivers and 4 XL motors to power the tender bogies. In order to give that much power, a 12v AA battery system will be used. As for pricing, it is my intent to sell them at a price almost anyone can afford. The idea is to not just be display models, but can actually move.

I will spare you the plan for now for spoilers, but it is in the plan to start selling these as kits by next year. There will be more where the Allegheny came from.

[Feuer Zug]

The scale you're working in is a beast. 6 XL motors! I still build in 6 and 7-wide. The parts count and size alone for your Allegheny 2-6-6-6 easily dwarfs the Hogwarts Express monstrosity. For kits, your market will be quite limited I expect. The cost alone will be a major factor in the number of potential buyers.

[Craig Strader]

24 minutes ago, Feuer Zug said:

The scale you're working in is a beast. 6 XL motors! I still build in 6 and 7-wide. The parts count and size alone for your Allegheny 2-6-6-6 easily dwarfs the Hogwarts Express monstrosity. For kits, your market will be quite limited I expect. The cost alone will be a major factor in the number of potential buyers.

Thanks. And like I said before, I have a plan to make it affordable for almost everyone. At least this beast will be running on conventional Lego Track unlike the Hogwarts meant for display

Edited November 18, 2022 by Craig Strader

[XG BC]

6 hours ago, Hod Carrier said:

The great thing about scale is that it is universal. If you decide upon a certain scale then you will find that US, European and British models will all appear correctly proportioned when compared to each other. The problem is that the LEGO trains community as a whole has not done this, but rather has decided upon a formula instead which takes no account of scale.

that is true although i was thinking more about an exaggeration to the size difference when building larger trains in a larger scale. i know european ones will look smaller at the same scale.

[Selander]

Personally I think your designs look completely out of proportion to be called minifig scale... How do you even calculate 1:35 to be "accurate"?

I lean towards a scale more based on minifig height. The typical minifig is approx 4 cm high, and an average male human approx 180 cm => a scale of approx 1:45.

Typical train wagon overall width (which is approx same in Europe and US !! ) is 300-320 cm. Divide by 45 => 6,6-7,1 cm or 8,3-8,9 studs. Conclusion: an 8 stud width is just alright to be considered "minifig scale".

As for parts count=> added weight => an increase of scale from 1:45 to 1:35, equals in a design which is 2-3 times heavier, provided increase in scale is applied for lenght and width and height.

 

[Shiva]

Regarding the Friends scale, how big are the adults there?

Or are there only adults in the 2023 series and forwards?

Craig Strader, your locomotive looks nice.

[Craig Strader]

12 hours ago, Selander said:

Personally I think your designs look completely out of proportion to be called minifig scale... How do you even calculate 1:35 to be "accurate"?

I lean towards a scale more based on minifig height. The typical minifig is approx 4 cm high, and an average male human approx 180 cm => a scale of approx 1:45.

Typical train wagon overall width (which is approx same in Europe and US !! ) is 300-320 cm. Divide by 45 => 6,6-7,1 cm or 8,3-8,9 studs. Conclusion: an 8 stud width is just alright to be considered "minifig scale".

As for parts count=> added weight => an increase of scale from 1:45 to 1:35, equals in a design which is 2-3 times heavier, provided increase in scale is applied for lenght and width and height.

 

You may be correct, however, I have also taken a few things into consideration as well.

1: My trains were design with running with BALLASTED tracks so as to give it the prototypical look

2: They were also designed to complement Brickmania's equipment because the minifigures look to be the right size imho

3: The width of the minifigure is wider than it is taller, so I mostly took that into consideration for