LEGO Trains 2022

[Tube Map Central]

Let's be clear, I'm not arguing for TLG to cater for the AFOL train market by splurging on a new range of advanced 2000 piece products. This market is far too fragmented and low volume for a company that works like TLG. I personally don't like steam trains or diesels, so I'm only in the market for electrics, and my own MOCs are eight wide. I'm not a set collector and I'm sure all of us would have reasons to only buy a fraction of what was offered.

I'm suggesting that TLG just doesn't understand that if you set up your product range in the right way then that Christmas kids train set will get bigger and bigger and bigger as more and more is added to it. This means a second radius curve, perhaps a play mat (with spaces for buildings to be purchased), logical track packs, availability of individual already-designed train components (locomotives, coaches, trucks) to purchase in more than just one colour, appropriate buildings and minifigure passenger packs*.

Then the kids who get hooked will become AFOLs, MOC their own trains and buildings and encourage the next generation to buy a train set and see where they can go.

The London Transport Museum had a family day once, and one of the attractions was a giant 9v Lego Underground train layout. It was the star of the show: seeing these little trains charge round the layout was really exciting. Trains bring a static display to life like nothing else, surely a way to attract the attention of potential Christmas list compilers.

*and a way of doing platforms that doesn't suck away precious plates and bricks! 

 

https://uk.hornby.com/catalogue/building-and-accessories/platforms-bridges-skaledale

Edited January 20, 2022 by Tube Map Central

[Tube Map Central]

12 hours ago, Lyichir said:

Families tend to want a complete product with a powered train and carriages and a full circuit of track but are generally less interested in expanding their trains or layouts much more than that.

The obvious explanation for that is that the sets are disappointing for some reason. I would bet that the elephant in the room is Powered-Up which is a total not-fit-for-purpose screw-up. Hard to get at unrechargeable batteries. Once the train has gobbled up all the batteries in the house four o'clock Christmas afternoon, what are the parents supposed to do? Empty out the remote controls and hope for another couple of hours to get to bed time?

[Toxic43]

42 minutes ago, Tube Map Central said:

The obvious explanation for that is that the sets are disappointing for some reason. I would bet that the elephant in the room is Powered-Up which is a total not-fit-for-purpose screw-up. Hard to get at unrechargeable batteries. Once the train has gobbled up all the batteries in the house four o'clock Christmas afternoon, what are the parents supposed to do? Empty out the remote controls and hope for another couple of hours to get to bed time?

I must say that this is the biggest drawback for the powered up vs power functions systems. I can run a PF train with two sets of lights and two motors for longer than a single motor and no lights using powered up. My trains with PF keep going while my eldest's PU train seems to need new batteries every couple of hours.

Families would definitely prefer battery life over bluetooth and an app. Also app control is such a gimmick. Kids want a physical controller in their hands. We even put pybricks software in the Lego "app controlled" batmobile so the kids can use a regular controller instead.

[Tube Map Central]

Isn't it ironic that TLG expects kids to have a smartphone in order to interact with Lego, complete with high power battery and USB plug-in recharge facility, but there is no sign of these conveniences on their own side of the equation.

[Feuer Zug]

6 hours ago, Tube Map Central said:

The track pack 60205 is rubbish, with that awful flexible track and curves that no one wants, not a great start. Toy train manufacturers know what to do:

Why not let people buy the trains/trucks from the sets separately so that they can make them longer or get second trains for extra play? Why not in different colours so that kids can add extra colours to their layout gradually without all the outlay of a full train set, which just gets you the same colour train again?

And don't give me any rubbish about all-seeing all-knowing all-profitable TLG knowing what is best, for anyone who tries that argument, I have six letters in reply, VIDIYO!

 

Agreed, 60205 isn't marketed properly. Everything seems to have a curve and/or flexi-track. Give us an option to buy just straights. My nephew has two trains, but virtually no straight track until I handed him some from my stash. His parents noted that made the world of difference in playability.

As for a parts pack with the plates (6x24 with cutouts), bogies and buffers with magnets, that would go incredibly far towards expanding trains. We don't "need" full carriages or other rolling stock, but the ability to build our own with the basics would be nice.

Yeah, I completely agree with the VIDIYO comment. The good idea fairy read the crystal ball all wrong on that debacle.

1 hour ago, Tube Map Central said:

Isn't it ironic that TLG expects kids to have a smartphone in order to interact with Lego, complete with high power battery and USB plug-in recharge facility, but there is no sign of these conveniences on their own side of the equation.

LEGO expects them to have a high end, new iPhone or Samsung to work with, not just any old smartphone. As for making such options like a built in battery with easy to access charge port, we'll have to wait for Powered Up v2 or it's successor probably.

[TeriXeri]

7 hours ago, McWaffel said:

The croc loco was hugely successful (if you ask retailers), and did we get a replacement for it when it was retired? Nope.

It retired only 20 days ago, same as Disney Train. 

Yes I know many sets unofficially were sold out months before that, but the official end date on both Crocodile and Disney Train still stands at 31-12-2021.

Train sets have a history of not being january releases, or back-to-back availability, there were years long gaps between availability of Santa Fe, Emerald Night  Horizon Express.

The only train sets with consistent releases are the 4-year cycle of City trains.

 

Edited January 20, 2022 by TeriXeri

[TeriXeri]

40 minutes ago, Feuer Zug said:

As for a parts pack with the plates (6x24 with cutouts), bogies and buffers with magnets, that would go incredibly far towards expanding trains. We don't "need" full carriages or other rolling stock, but the ability to build our own with the basics would be nice.

Agree that'd be a great step, I had some hope that LEGO would do more in terms of "expansion" sets when City had people packs and Xtra appeared, but both of those seemed to either have disappeared, or gottten some weird product choice like Road Tape.

Xtra would have had so much potential to be a modern version of the old "SERVICE" type of packs, for accesoires for themes like Trains, Castle , Pirates etc.

Example of what Service offered way back then (late 80s) , combine those in a modern updated rolling stock pack, and people can build what they'd want on top.

 

Now, I know there's Bricks and Pieces merging with Pick a Brick, that will be revamped, so not sure how the price/availability of parts will be.

 

City does have the new road plates as expansion pack but that's only logical when the road baseplates were a mainstream product for 40 years vanished.

Edited January 20, 2022 by TeriXeri

[zephyr1934]

I am starting to suspect that Lego might be getting ready to take another shot at Lego Factory custom sets, which would open up lots of opportunities for well designed train cars.

 

This:

48 minutes ago, TeriXeri said:

Now, I know there's Bricks and Pieces merging with Pick a Brick, that will be revamped, so not sure how the price/availability of parts will be.

 

Plus Stud.io replacing LDD as the official CAD program. B&P solves the limited palette of PAB that severely hindered Factory designs. And it was made worse by the fact that of the roughly 1000 parts available on PAB at the time was turning over every few months so a working model in Factory could quickly became unworkable. While part turnover will be less with B&P, it would still be a problem. The new brick merge/separate on Stud.io (which was probably borrowed from the video game systems) mitigates the evolving parts availability on B&P.

Even if Lego does not officially launch a new version of Factory, I bet Stud.io will include an option to order the parts directly from the new B&P/PAB.

If nothing else, it will allow the folks who are currently selling instructions to also sell the bricks or create a parts list for one stop shopping at the new B&P/PAB (I've been building MOCs for so long that I am always amazed when I build a set and have all of the parts right there without any shopping across dozens of BL stores or pulling from my stash)

[Bartosz]

3 hours ago, Tube Map Central said:

Isn't it ironic that TLG expects kids to have a smartphone in order to interact with Lego,

Even worse, this smartphone is biggest enemy of other toys. Kid annoyed by tiny inconvenience/problems with running train can then just easily turn to some easier entertainment in that very same smartphone.

Edited January 20, 2022 by Bartosz

[Lyichir]

9 hours ago, McWaffel said:

That’s not what I said.

Oof. They’re just corporate workers, bro. Sorry to break it to you. Apple is also not interested in making great products, they just want your money. This is also reflected by the change in the VIP system coming up. Just wait for a monthly subscription service to LEGO for GWPs and discounts.

Or maybe because they don’t care. There’s bigger fish to fry. TLGs whole concept the past few years was to create and establish entirely new customer bases. Their core base is completely neglected. Every system change they do is aimed at new customers. „Built cities with old style road plates for 40 years? Well sucks to be you, we’re doing new ones that are incompatible with everything else we have on the market.“

Okay, let me try to explain this to you in a simple way even though it increasingly feels like talking to a brick wall. The people managing business matters like the VIP system or a potential subscription service aren't the same people as the designers. I know a lot of designers personally. They're creative, passionate people, more often than not former AFOLs themselves and with a lot of the same nostalgia for old themes as you or I have. If they had a foolproof idea for how to make those older themes sell as well as a newer theme or product category, they wouldn't hesitate to make that a reality (and they often do work aspects of that nostalgia into their set designs, when they have the chance). But the reality of what actually sells well doesn't always conform to your nostalgia, and just because you're extra loud and annoying about what you want doesn't make you more important than other buyers.

They aren't neglecting their "core base" by coming up with new things like road plates—the reality is that you aren't their "core base" and haven't been since you were in the 4–16 age range. And whining about how it shows that big daddy Lego hates you and has abandoned you? Well, despite making it seem like you have the maturity level of an eight-year-old, it's not going to change the fact that you're no longer representative of the majority of Lego buyers.

34 minutes ago, Bartosz said:

Even worse, this smartphone is biggest enemy of other toys. Kid annoyed by tiny inconvenience/problems with running train can then just easily turn to some easier entertainment in that very same smartphone.

Saying that having a smartphone in the room is going to be the death knell of Lego trains isn't exactly a strong argument for their current relevance. Themes like Ninjago, Friends, Technic or City don't struggle to appeal to kids despite the near omnipresence of smartphones in their lives these days. If a train creates enough annoyance that a kid would abandon them for the allure of Candy Crush, that might just mean it's not a very appealing toy anymore.

That said, do I believe that's actually the case? No. People have been warning that video games and computers would be the death knell of toys like Lego since I was a kid 20 years ago, and yet Lego is bigger and more successful than ever. Smartphones are more than just distraction machines—they allow kids to share their accomplishments, look up tips and ideas related to their favorite hobbies, and connect with peers at a level that simply wasn't possible when I was a kid. Those are all things that can enhance, not just dilute, a kid's passion for Lego.

For train fans, having a smartphone means that if they ran into a trouble running their trains they could simply look up troubleshooting tips as easy as a Google search instead of just accepting that it doesn't work and abandoning it, or having to rely on a parent who may or may not actually have a better understanding of how to fix an issue with their trains.

[Amoreternum]

Thanks Lyichir for that comment. Could not agree more, with basically everything you just said. Never understood why so many people cannot, or don't want to (which I totally understand and can relate too since trains!), distinguish between what they want to see selling well, and what actually sells well and is relevant with the core audience. Just the same with castles and the like. Also agree on the smartphone issue - the Hidden Site sets, for example, are great sets with and without VR support, but were seemingly shunned for the latter ignoring the actual appeal of the designs.

[TeriXeri]

Road plates are the bad thing now because LEGO hates City builders using baseplates ? 

What about Blue rails era, to grey rail era , battery boxes, to central power pickup, to rail based pickup 9V, to IR, to Bluetooth. (much bigger changes the simple width/color changes of road plates during the same time)

I understand people with large road layouts would be costly to replace it with new road plates, same thing basicly happened during the change from blue/grey to 9V sets, not only the power system was incompatible (9v can't run on grey/blue rails), they also officially don't connect. (old 12V trains themselves could still mostly run on 9V era rails using the mid-power system, not sure how switches were compatible, never had them, only 12 and 9V)

Edited January 20, 2022 by TeriXeri

[McWaffel]

17 minutes ago, Lyichir said:

feels like talking to a brick wall.

18 minutes ago, Lyichir said:

just because you're extra loud and annoying

18 minutes ago, Lyichir said:

making it seem like you have the maturity level of an eight-year-old

You need to get your manners and your tone in order. Big time.

 

 

[Feuer Zug]

3 hours ago, TeriXeri said:

Agree that'd be a great step, I had some hope that LEGO would do more in terms of "expansion" sets when City had people packs and Xtra appeared, but both of those seemed to either have disappeared, or gottten some weird product choice like Road Tape.

Xtra would have had so much potential to be a modern version of the old "SERVICE" type of packs, for accesoires for themes like Trains, Castle , Pirates etc.

Example of what Service offered way back then (late 80s) , combine those in a modern updated rolling stock pack, and people can build what they'd want on top.

Yes, the old service packs or Xtra polybags are exactly what I was going for. Those would work especially well if Factory does reappear with Stud.io.

[Legownz]

On 12/8/2021 at 9:43 AM, dr_spock said:

It'll be funny if we are cloning BB models with LEGO. 

I already have with two of their models! They're honestly pretty good designs and relatively not fragile, which I always love to see.

[Toastie]

Hmm - I like to turn this discussion around

Setting: TLG is a globally operating, successful (in terms of financial figures) enterprise. There is competition around the world getting stronger - and certainly not only from Asia. TLG has a considerable overhead - as many globally operating companies have. This overhead is paying myriads of lawyers, business and business administration folks, advertising pros, more lawyers, R&D folks, civil engineers, and so on and so on. Ah, forgot: Designers - and of course The Family.

• Hypothesis 1: TLG "hates" A, B, and C, plus trains, and in particular straight tracks. (I am deliberately calling this a hypothesis to encourage positive thinking and "hates" stands for "doesn't like", "is disinterested", "is too stupid to realize it would be so favorable to make")
• Hypothesis 2: TLG is not understanding what they are doing with regard to A, B (and so on)
• Hypothesis 3: Service in terms of service packs in the 1980's was so much nicer than nowadays

[Let's skip the elaborate way of working ourselves through the "hypotheses 101" and just ask ourselves]:

Question: WHY is this happening (not THAT it is happening; I believe there is enough evidence that this is happening in this thread and about 42 others here on EB).

Multiple choice answers are:

• TLG is stupid (hint: There are not that many examples in recent history, where stupidity lead to world leading in a sizeable global market segment)
• TLG does not get it (see hint above)
• TLG does not care (see hint above)
• TLG can do what they want (Tip: WHY can they do that? Be careful; this may result in an endless loop)
• TLG is, since 50+ years, successfully steering its way through consumer behavior and will keep doing so  

What would be your freely voiced answer: WHY are they hurting you?

Best,
Thorsten

[Toastie]

15 hours ago, Tube Map Central said:

And don't give me any rubbish about all-seeing all-knowing all-profitable TLG knowing what is best, for anyone who tries that argument, I have six letters in reply, VIDIYO!

I was thinking about that VIDIYO bit (since a bit longer than this thread exists ).

The other issues you mentioned: It was not meant to be "knowing it better" - no way and never. Calling a reasoning rubbish is your choice, I can surely live with that.

I am always searching for a reason when something happens that I don't understand. Maybe this is the (good/bad) fall-out of earning my money by asking some strange molecules: Why on Earth are you doing that? Why that fast/slowly, and why with what comes out? For me, this scenario is pretty much the same with TLG: Can't see them, don't know them, and they don't talk to me, never. So I try to gauge their "nature" by their "behavior". And then brag here without much (zill zero) proof. Possibly with a tiny bit of experience. TLG is certainly a big company - but the ones we are working with could buy them without getting in too much financial trouble (other than shareholders freaking out like hell) tomorrow morning.

The question that interests me: How could they ever come up with VIDIYO as an envisioned product for the (young) masses?

Could it be that the folks currently responsible for coughing-up new exciting game-changing products and programs grew-up with the internet and cell phones more powerful in computing power than the thing that was used to land Apollo 11 on the moon (and bring it back safely)? The Think-Tank type folks securing the next decades of company existence?

Could be very well a conspiracy thing, but honestly, this is happening everywhere else as well, at least in my perception. We work with companies that have a track record going back to - make it the 1950's. The people founding these companies, the ones who dreamed it all up and make it work - have died or will very soon. These companies operate within a rather conservative environment. Still, they have begun to entertain the idea of cell phone controlled medical devices. Or pressure gauges. I mean: Did they ever work in a laboratory? In there, a cell phone is prone to failure every minute ("Folks get ready, goggles on? I am going to fire this thing without electrical shielding in 10, 9, 8 ... secs").

TLG is none of that, but they need to be up-to-date - they don't make laser stuff or mass specs, they make toys. For kids living in 2022. I have the feeling they simply tried it. As a think-tank outcome, produced by "younger" people. Could that be?

Is it really conceivable that old farts like me thought: "Oh, cool. Let's grab our cell phones, write some nifty Android code running only on the latest OS version (yes there are Apples as well, but who cares)"? As my daughter tells me, when I talk ... "sh*t": "I doub'it ..."

[All just plainly typed into this keyboard with not much reflection. As said, I was thinking about VIDIYO - the big disaster - a lot]

Best,
Thorsten

Edited January 20, 2022 by Toastie
Changed the font color of a never voiced phrase

[JopieK]

On 1/19/2022 at 10:01 PM, McWaffel said:

It’s been going on for years and they have not done anything about it. So obviously they don’t care.

I don't agree with you: believe me, LEGO will also use Ideas to see where market potential lies. That does by no means mean they will allow Ideas train sets, but still they will carefully monitor and notice what kind of projects get 10k support, so even if it is indirect it WILL have an impact on their decisions on train sets.

@Toastie: Haha, well maybe you could convince them that the costs of a shrink are probably higher than some LEGO sets/parts ;)

[Toastie]

54 minutes ago, JopieK said:

Haha, well maybe you could convince them that the costs of a shrink are probably higher than some LEGO sets/parts ;)

Why don't I come up with such ideas? Thank you very much @JopieK! This sounds like a very good avenue - let's see ... Birthday is coming up soon ... I believe I am going to pitch that one

With very best regards,
Thorsten

[Lyichir]

4 hours ago, McWaffel said:

You need to get your manners and your tone in order. Big time.

Respect has to be earned. You could start by showing some yourself, and not assuming negligence or malice on the part of Lego's designers just because you aren't personally getting what you want out of the brand.

I grew up as a Bionicle fan, for goodness' sake. I'm very familiar with themes I enjoy getting cancelled outright, and have the cognizance to recognize that no matter how much I personally liked them, my own personal convictions about what is good and high quality and enjoyable don't necessarily mean that those things will actually be financially successful in the wider marketplace. Heck, even Lego's designers can't guarantee success even when they put their best effort forward. Sometimes the timing isn't right, or the many aspects of launching a new theme don't end up fitting together as well as expected. If there were any perfect formula for success, there wouldn't be failures in the first place.

You brought up Vidiyo, which is a perfect example—despite an immense amount of design work on both the physical and digital end of things, it failed to capture an audience. That doesn't mean it shouldn't have been tried, of course, because you can't just lean on what worked 30 years ago and assume that it will work just as well for today's kids. Lego has to try new things, constantly, in order to stay relevant and be able to catch lightning in a bottle when an opportunity arises. If they didn't, you wouldn't see themes that fail like Vidiyo—but you also wouldn't see massive successes like Ninjago, or Friends, or the Modular Buildings or Winter Village sets, that were able to bring something new to the table and turn it into a long-term, reliable pillar of Lego's portfolio.

In the trains category, that has included experimenting with popular licenses for something like the Disney Train or recently re-attempting a standalone, high-detail adult-targeted train set with the Crocodile Locomotive. Whether you want to admit it or not, these are all earnest attempts at revitalizing a category of set that is no longer nearly as broadly popular as it was at its peak, and trying to make it successful for new audiences. What's successful will likely be followed up on. What isn't can be put aside until there's enough change in the culture or expectations of the audience to make it worth attempting again. It's not a fast process, but just because you aren't personally satisfied with it doesn't mean the effort isn't there.

[Djmojo]

The negativity in this post is starting to reach starwars heigths😂 honestly. When i buy a toy for my kid, one of the worst things i know of is ad on packs and extras, when i buy something for him i want a ready to play package. And i think thats what a lot of parents think. And i ceraintly wouldnt buy something you need an outlet to run (its 2022 folks..)  the lego trains they have that meets this criteria is expensive and not shomething you drop into the store to buy impulsively. There is also no way i would sit down and watch my kid thinking, man i wish the gradient of track was different was i not into trains myself. Kids now want action and toys they can relate from youtube,games and movies (if they want toys at all). The decision to make all the things we want just makes no sense in the ecomic department. Yes we are a niche group and yes there would be some market for more trains. But the second we actually get something, i feel its not half as good as some here want it to be (crocodille). There is just so much complaning and negativity in a group who got undoubtelly the best after/custom market for "lego" parts made by people who live and breathe lego trains. I really hope that we get more great trains in the years to come. But i will not hold a grudge against lego if they dont. Second of all. If you actually want more niche trains, go to ideas and suport! More trains reaching the goal, the more of an impact this community will have to legos future development. The crocodille and disney train JUST got shelfed, we still have no idea if 2022 is comming with a new set (thats why this post exists,right?) and if you dont like the niche trains we get, buy them and remodel them ( its a modular system afterall) or simply dont buy it and dont scream about more from the same company you think cannot design.    Really hope the tone in here can change to the better as if i where a freshly starting trainhead reading some of this womit, marklin would still take my business ☺️

[Aanchir]

On 1/18/2022 at 8:52 AM, Feuer Zug said:

Number 1 for the win. Pick you poison, A4 Mallard, DRG class 01, NYC Hudson, ect. Additionally, a rerelease of the Santa Fe 10020 or the Emerald Night would suffice. Really though, give us cars to go with them!

Gosh, I would be psyched if LEGO made an 18+ set of those fancy 1930s Art Deco steam locomotives like the A4 Mallard or NYC Hudson. That's territory that I don't think they've ever really explored in train sets of any era. And Creator Expert/18+ seems like a natural fit for that sort of locomotive, considering how many sets like the Modular Buildings Collection and Winter Village Collection tend to focus on similar early and mid-20th century nostalgia. It'd certainly make a brilliant following act after the Crocodile Locomotive.

DRG Class 01 is cool as well, but for my part I'm especially keen on builds that involve complex, streamlined curves (both in sets and in my own MOCs), so stylish "streamliners" tend to excite me a lot more than the DRG Class 01's rugged industrial look. And certainly with the number of new curve pieces we've seen in sets over the past several years, LEGO is more equipped than ever before to truly do one of those fancy "streamliner" locomotives justice!

[McWaffel]

9 hours ago, JopieK said:

LEGO will also use Ideas to see where market potential lies. That does by no means mean they will allow Ideas train sets, but still they will carefully monitor and notice what kind of projects get 10k support, so even if it is indirect it WILL have an impact on their decisions on train sets.

I would love to agree with that, but the evidence doesn’t support your hypothesis.

Trains have consistently been making it through the support phase of IDEAS. For years. Where does it show that this fact has had any influence on changes in the product lineup?

[Black Knight]

TLG is just a cold, soulless machine. It neither hates anything, nor can it put it's heart and soul into something. It is just speculating on where the most profit will come from and then proceed to do that. Please don't be so dumb and fall for their ads and videos about how much they care for YOU. That is all advertising. They just want your money. That is fine, that is how business works, but please see it, for what it is.

The market for model trains is dwarfed by what TLG does: Märklin has a turnover of 110.000.000 € p.a., TLG has over 6.000.000.000 €! Comparing the EBit would be even worse. Why would anyone at TLG even consider to pick up those breadcrumbs? I consider 10277 already as a huge fan service. TLG probably fired some manager who approved this, because that Star-Wars set they did not make because of the Crocodile would have made soooo much more profit.

[Sunil766]

On 1/18/2022 at 9:10 PM, Toastie said:

There were blue cargos. The old 9V old (beautiful) gray with green accents nailed it for me. No more needs.

Uhm... Which one? 4512? That's a riddle for me. 9v cargo in gray with green accents... 

1 hour ago, McWaffel said:

Where does it show that this fact has had any influence on changes in the product lineup?

The crocodile! Let's not forget that just recently (in lego timeframes) we got something we always wished for, another creator expert train. If you expect to see a clear connection to whether it originated from the apparent train popularity on ideas, you'll know yourself this is impossible to prove.

5 hours ago, Djmojo said:

But the second we actually get something, i feel its not half as good as some here want it to be (crocodille)

Couldn't agree more, all the presumed train fans complaining about those gaps and derailing (which never occurred on my 9v tracks btw) really made me wonder if that's what people think is the right approach to show lego that we want more trains? It's more or less as good as it gets in the lego universe and I hope we all have 1-2 crocs at home to "do our part". Complaining about 10277 is the wrong way IMO (let's save the complaining for the 4 wide thingy in case we don't get anything better ;-) ). I'm happy with it and know it might be a while until we get something comparably good. I mean look at the current lego city sets, if trains go in the same direction I am not optimistic we'll get train set(s) I'll be equally happy with (even though I do like 60197).

@McWaffel to answer your question - I'm not that much into steamers, however would be excited about it for sure, but I'd like to see another creator expert / 18+ cargo train, since I never got my hands on the maersk. More importantly - I need carriages or wagons with it! That's the only thing that bugs me about the crocodile. Give me a 3-in-1 not too simple carriage and I'll buy 5-10.

6 hours ago, Djmojo said:

And i ceraintly wouldnt buy something you need an outlet to run (its 2022 folks..) 

I'm gonna disagree whole heartedly on that one. Its just the smartest and most convenient way to run trains. Unless you give me an objective argument contra outlet/9v, there are none for me (maybe not being able to run two trains on one loop, but that's majorly impacted by the following). The fact that it's 2022 doesn't make it more acceptable for me that I'd need 18 f*n batteries to run TWO trains with remotes. How's that better? 9v is peace of mind. 

Someone else mentioned that Trains have a hard time being accepted because they need so much space (might have been a different thread) - I just wanted to add that modular buildings and whatnot are continuously taking up my shelfspace and can't be disassembled easily. My trains are neatly packed away in 6 Ikea boxes (2 each for trains, tracks, stations/sheds) and only used when needed. In conclusion, but that's just my personal opinion, trains offer - by far - the most play value while needing the least space. Thanks for coming to my Ted talk. 

Best