LEGO 42129 Zetros VS custom-built LEGO trial trucks

[Sariel]

We have a strong local LEGO truck trial scene, so it was only natural to compare how the $300 official LEGO trial truck compares against the stuff these guys build at homes. As a bonus, you get to see what appears to be a fatal design flaw in Zetros' drivetrain.

 

[Ngoc Nguyen]

And the infamous hood continues to pop...

I guess we can say that when this thing was first revealed,

almost no one detects the problem under the hood. #pun

Edited July 25, 2021 by Ngoc Nguyen

[Polarlicht]

Wow, it got absolutely destroyed be the others.

[Anio]

Comparing the achievements of a 4x4 with medium wheels to 6x6 with giant wheels is kinda silly, to say the least.

[Gray Gear]

15 minutes ago, Anio said:

Comparing the achievements of a 4x4 with medium wheels to 6x6 with giant wheels is kinda silly, to say the least.

Well that's what TLG should expect when designing the set. There is a reason these MOC trucks are 6x6 and have bigger tires. TLG chose to not to go that way, and this test shows the results.

 

I knew the Zetros would struggle with its lacking ground clearance. What suprised me most was how bad the turn radius is, like, how can that happen? 

[Akassin]

25 minutes ago, Anio said:

Comparing the achievements of a 4x4 with medium wheels to 6x6 with giant wheels is kinda silly, to say the least.

Why? If lego made, for example, a concrete mixer and compared it with these trucks , it would be stupid. But lego made a trial truck. So they believe that this configuration is the most effective for off-road driving.

I'm increasingly determined to give up this set, because if the only thing it can do is climb on the ironing board, it's not for me.

Edited July 25, 2021 by Akassin

[Anio]

6 minutes ago, Gray Gear said:

Well that's what TLG should expect when designing the set. There is a reason these MOC trucks are 6x6 and have bigger tires. TLG chose to not to go that way, and this test shows the results.

That's obviously not my point.

 

3 minutes ago, Akassin said:

So they believe that this configuration is the most effective for off-road driving.

You can be sure they are clever enough not to believe what you suggest.

[Gray Gear]

6 minutes ago, Anio said:

You can be sure they are not that stupid to think what you suggest.

Well what else is the reason then? Was including two more wheels and a few bricks just too expensive for 300$ set? 

Edited July 25, 2021 by Gray Gear

[Anio]

15 minutes ago, Gray Gear said:

Well what else is the reason then? Was including two more wheels and a few bricks just too expensive for 300$ set? 

Maybe. I would even say that it is very likely so (going for a full extra axle is more than just a few bricks). Still, that is not my point.

Wanna rate/value the achievement of 42129 ? Then go for a similar TT : 4WD, medium size wheels, 2 L motors for driving. And if possible, with detailed/accurate model, and not something that look like it was made 20 years ago (altough this is a minor - but real - aspect when judging pure performances as it affects weight)

[Maaboo the Witch]

14 minutes ago, Gray Gear said:

Well what else is the reason then? Was including two more wheels and a few bricks just too expensive for 300$ set? 

I think it was more to do with the fact that the Zetros 6x6 is designed for and used by the military.

[Igor1]

1 hour ago, Anio said:

Comparing the achievements of a 4x4 with medium wheels to 6x6 with giant wheels is kinda silly, to say the least.

Obviously Sariel specially chose unequal rivals in order to kindle a wild shit here and it will definitely be here! 

The HOT! sign is already on, but I will not participate in this.

Edited July 25, 2021 by Igor1

[howitzer]

I'm actually impressed by the Zetros' performance, considering it's a set designed for the retail market (with all the limitations that brings) and not an independent build pushing parts to their limits and utilizing third party tires and a third axle. The PF XL motors are of course also more powerful than PU L motors, though I'm not sure how much the voltage increase compensates for that (probably significantly). The turning radius is of course still a joke.

This begs the question of how much the Zetros could be improved with additional axle and better tyres.

[Gray Gear]

"ThIs iS noT A fAiR ComParIsoN"

Yes it isn't, and that is the point. The community doesn't need to compare it to other vehicles with similar problems, just because TLG decided a third axle was too expensive.

Sariel put it up to some rear trial trucks to show the weaknesses of the Zetros. And I think TLG could and should have done a lot better for 300$. A 3rd axle would have been a must.

[syclone]

23 minutes ago, Anio said:

Maybe. I would even say that it is very likely so (going for a full extra axle is more than just a few bricks). Still, that is not my point.

Wanna rate/value the achievement of 42129 ? Then go for a similar TT : 4WD, medium size wheels, 2 L motors for driving. And if possible, with detailed/accurate model, and not something that look like it was made 20 years ago (altough this is a minor - but real - aspect when judging pure performances as it affects weight)

Well, I don't think that being "too light" is a problem for competition, rather incompetence in making a proper trial truck from TLG. For all I know, if they made it the way others are made, the price would've been much smaller, and most likely even a 6x6 version would've been cheaper than 300€. 

And honestly, even with "fair play" parameters that you've set for no reason (I don't think in Lego TT competitions there's weigh/tyre size categories) - trying to find something performing as bad as that is a challenge in itself...

 

[Anio]

4 minutes ago, Gray Gear said:

Yes it isn't, and that is the point.

Alright, Sir.

[Maaboo the Witch]

One thing I did notice about the 6x6 prototype was the XL motor. I have no idea why TLG didn't go with that motor for drive.

[allanp]

Okay, lets compare.

Cost. The competitors used S-bricks, multiple rechargeable lithium battery boxes, more axles and wheels and are all quite a bit bigger, so they would all be more expensive than the Zetros.

Looks. The competitors all look like hot garbage and lets be honest, if TLG released a set looking like any one of those we would be complaining like crazy.

Performance. Okay, the Zetros loses out here, but when you consider that the others would surely be more expensive and have the freedom to look and be proportioned like however they want (hot garbage apparently), while the Zetros has to look and be proportioned like a Zetros, well I think that explains it, and also explains why an argument can be made for this being an unfair comparison. You could argue that it didn;t have to look like a Zetros, it could have been done without a licence. Well okay, but it would still have to look way better than these, as well as being much cheaper.

Realism. Two of them had their drive motors mounted directly to their axles. Not realistic at all. The Zetros could also be more mechanically realistic, especially the rear axle, but still it's better than these.

Summary. If all four of these where on the shelf I'd choose the Zetros. No, it's not perfect. The PU system just isn't that great yet, and likely won't ever be until we get more powerful motors, hubs with enough grunt to drive more powerful motors, and physical remotes. But while the goal of the others were to be great off road performers, with other factors such as cost, looks and any kind of authenticity not being remotely considered, the Zetros has much more criteria to fill. If looking at one criteria alone, performance, the Zetros loses, but looking at things as a whole, with all other factors considered, the Zetros is the clear winner.

Edited July 25, 2021 by allanp

[Gray Gear]

1 hour ago, allanp said:

The competitors all look like hot garbage

Are you serious? Just proves looks are a question of individual taste. I'd pick the yellow Ural trucks over the Zetros anyday.

The Fiat tho... Well it's a fiat, so yeah, you got a point there 

Edited July 25, 2021 by Gray Gear

[Lukes_Brick_Studio]

I can´t understand all those people who just always want to criticize TLG for everything they do. In my opinion the Zetros can´t be compared with those trail trucks. Yes, they did a much better job, but they didn´t use Lego wheels and all of them are much bigger so it is clear that the Zetros will have it problems with climbing over big obstacles. In my view it is also unfair to compare MOCs with Lego sets, because you can´t expect the same. MOC designers don´t need to follow any rules and there are no limits, the Lego designers have rules and they should create anything which works constantly well (it is a toy and not a RC-vehicle ! / Lego designers can´t put 3x or more XL Motors  just for drive in a set / MOC designers can if they want). Lego designers also need to make a set good looking - those trail trucks didn´t look good in my opinion, they are just for off-road driving.

Another point that is important for me is the overall complexity of the trail trucks. The MOCs they aren´t as complex as the Zetros. Does one of those trail trucks have a remote controlled rear diff-Lock? No. Do they have planetary gear hubs? No. The Lego Zetros has both and uses much more technique inside of it.

I also would like to add, that while reading through this post I felt like that some people here just want to criticize everything TLG do and those people don´t post anything constructive. And if those people really think about it, many of them wouldn´t even buy one these trail trucks build by the MOC designers, because those trucks are also not perfect. (The look is awful and they are not complex). Many people here don´t criticize the Zetros they just criticize TLG for releasing a good set (even better than the old 9398 witch was also not as good at off road terrain as those trail trucks / So good old times are maybe not as good as some of you have it in there memory).

 

Edited July 25, 2021 by Lukes_Brick_Studio

[Gray Gear]

I can't understand all those people who just want to defend TLG for everything they do... Nah, I'll save my breath, you see where this is going.

[Lukes_Brick_Studio]

Ok, it´s your opinion and I can partially understand it.  I want to clarify that I do not defend TLG, (I also don´t like many things they do even some technic sets are very bad an overpriced), but I want to defend the Zetros from unfair comparing. 

[Bartybum]

4 hours ago, Maaboo35 said:

One thing I did notice about the 6x6 prototype was the XL motor. I have no idea why TLG didn't go with that motor for drive.

For some reason both the XL and L PU motors have the same power so there's no point going for the XL motor

[Igor1]

Yes, with all this, L-motor is more compact, so I'm even glad that Lego no longer uses XL themselves, as was the case in the 42099 crawler.

Oh stop. I'm not involved in this.

Edited July 25, 2021 by Igor1

[Maaboo the Witch]

7 minutes ago, Igor1 said:

Yes, with all this, L-motor is more compact, so I'm even glad that Lego no longer uses XL themselves, as was the case in the 42099 crawler.

Can I involve you for a minute more? Okay. The reason the XL was used in 42099 was probably for structural reasons, as the big motor casing lends quite a bit of strength to the chassis.

[Igor1]

@Maaboo35 Okay! Yes, I'm aware that its large size can be used simply for attaching other parts. But in fact XL was not really needed there, because I assembled 42099 on an old PU electrics, using PU L-motors (red on photo below) and I didn't have any problems with body stiffness or something like that.

Edited July 25, 2021 by Igor1