Compact Locomotives with Large Technic Motor 88013

[ejayb]

Can anyone point me to some examples of short locomotives powered by the large technic motor 88013?

I'm imagining it standing up in the cable driving the rear axle and using roads to transfer power to the front.

[JopieK]

Well LEGO suggests to use 88013 for powering the crocodile (10277). See: https://rebrickable.com/instructions/10277-1/ p118+

[ejayb]

45 minutes ago, JopieK said:

Well LEGO suggests to use 88013 for powering the crocodile (10277). See: https://rebrickable.com/instructions/10277-1/ p118+

The crocodiles body is about 20 studs long, a mod based on that might be the easiest and cheapest option.

 

[Hod Carrier]

You may already be aware of this, although I wasn’t until I’d got hold of some 88013 motors. It’s 8 studs long compared to the old PF L-motor which is 7 studs long. Standing one upright is going to make any model quite tall, especially once you’ve added any gearing to drive the axle. 

[Lok24]

2 hours ago, ejayb said:

The crocodiles body is about 20 studs long, a mod based on that might be the easiest and cheapest option.

 

But that's the opposite of a "short" locomotive ?

For a loco only 16 studs long I used the 88008 or the 45303 verticaly in the cabin.

Find more infos her:

https://www.1000steine.de/de/gemeinschaft/forum/?entry=1&id=452684#id452684

[ejayb]

Just now, Lok24 said:

But that's the opposite of a "short" locomotive ?

20 is slightly longer than I'd like, but it's not 30 or 40. I also don't have the skills to design a decent model myself.

Your example is very nice, but I want to use the 88013 motor for the speed (not power) function.

[Lok24]

10 minutes ago, ejayb said:

Your example is very nice, but I want to use the 88013 motor for the speed (not power) function.

That's why I mentioned the 88008...

[ejayb]

I apologise Lok, I thought only the Technic L and XL motors did speed control. 

 

I understand that you have the battery box mounted to two long Technic bricks. How is the motor attached? And what gearing did you use?

 

[Lok24]

6 minutes ago, ejayb said:

I apologise Lok, I thought only the Technic L and XL motors did speed control.

 

As I understood all seven motors support speed - only Train motor and  wedo  45303 do not,  as they have no sensor.

6 minutes ago, ejayb said:

I understand that you have the battery box mounted to two long Technic bricks. How is the motor attached? And what gearing did you use?

 

All infos in the link mentioned above:

https://www.1000steine.de/de/gemeinschaft/forum/?entry=1&id=452684#id452684

Edited July 18, 2021 by Lok24

[ejayb]

Following in, has anyone used the 88008 motor?

[Ts__]

Yes, I have installed 2x the Lego Boost Interactive motor in a shunting locomotive and use the speed feedback to control the constant speed, no matter how many cars are to be pushed/pulled.

The locomotive is of course bigger than what you have in mind. But there are also 2 engines inside. Really small locomotives are difficult with such a setup: HUB 8 studs long, motor with gear 9 studs long.

 

 

Thomas

Edited July 19, 2021 by Ts__

[ejayb]

What kind of wagons are you moving? Was two motors necessary? 

[Ts__]

I want to push many (e.g. 10) freight wagons up a hill, hence the 2 motors. I have never tried out whether it would also work with one.
If more wagons work, it would also be nice. I think I have tried it so far with 9 mixed wagons from 330 grams to almost 1 kg.

All my locomotives so far have at least 2 motors, so the question of whether it would also work with one did not arise.

At the moment, i have only a pic with two wagons. The grey one weighs about 510 grams. The tanker is much lighter.

Thomas

 

 

[ejayb]

Thanks Thomas

I'll be moving less, lighter wagons over level tracks so hopefully 1 will be enough.

What gear ratio did you end up with? What range 'speed' are you usually running in the app? I'm hoping that running the motor closer to full speed reduces the whine from the controller.

Do you have a thread on the build?

[Vilhelm22]

This is actually quite a beneficial topic for me too.  I'm planning on at some point building the DB E69 02, a beautiful little locomotive.  I'm assuming you need at least an L motor to power one of these trains - an M won't be enough I'm guessing.

[zephyr1934]

17 hours ago, ejayb said:

I'll be moving less, lighter wagons over level tracks so hopefully 1 will be enough.

If you are moving lighter wagons on level track with a tiny locomotive you might want to try the train motor first. You won't have the speed control, but you might not need it. You could quickly throw together a motor+controller+coupler to test the pulling power and speed to see if it meets what you need.

Even if the simple train motor works, it sounds like you want the greater functionality anyway. I'm just tossing it out there because you will have a hard time building smaller than what you can do with a train motor as the base.

Anyway, it is an interesting conversation and the insights are helpful.

 

[ejayb]

37 minutes ago, zephyr1934 said:

Even if the simple train motor works, it sounds like you want the greater functionality anyway. 

I do have a train motor loco, I should have mentioned. Using a custom controller in the powered up app PoweredUp, I find that will begin moving on straights at power level 18 (out of 50 I believe?) but will shall on the switches. 21 will get it around the switches but then it's already running too fast. 

[Ts__]

23 hours ago, ejayb said:

I'll be moving less, lighter wagons over level tracks so hopefully 1 will be enough.

Yes, is worth a test

23 hours ago, ejayb said:

What gear ratio did you end up with?

Gear ratio is 1.6667: 1, but I use BigBenWheels M-wheels in the locomotive. So larger than the small train wheels. And faster.
The locomotive is a shunting locomotive and is designed for power, not speed. For a mainline locomotive, you would have to use 1:1 or more with this motor in any case.

 

23 hours ago, ejayb said:

What range 'speed' are you usually running in the app?

My goal was to drive as consistently slow as possible. The locomotive runs with wagons at about 20 revolutions (per minute?). Maximum speed is about 110 revolutions. Values from the APP.
The maximum speed of the locomotive is not very high.

23 hours ago, ejayb said:

Do you have a thread on the build?

Currently, I have shown nothing more of the locomotive here on Eurobricks than the pictures in the thread here. I plan to create videos in August.

 

23 hours ago, Vilhelm22 said:

 I'm assuming you need at least an L motor to power one of these trains - an M won't be enough I'm guessing.

An L motor is 2 studs longer, but much faster and more powerful.
For the V90, I decided against an L-motor for the following reasons:

- I wanted to drive all 4 axles, which is difficult with one motor. For climpl hills with max traction.
- 2 L-motors overstrain the small Lego City PU-Hub -> draw too much current -> overload flashes constantly, batteries immediately empty

For a smaller locomotive surely also an L-engine is enough.

6 hours ago, zephyr1934 said:

tiny locomotive you might want to try the train motor first.

The train engine is a good engine for mainline locomotives. However, it is not good at slow speed and it is difficult to use under/over gear ratios.

5 hours ago, ejayb said:

21 will get it around the switches but then it's already running too fast. 

Yes, the train motor is a fast motor and can´t drive good slowly.

Thomas

 

[ejayb]

Thanks for the reply Ts. One more question, does it have the same annoying whine as the train motor?

 

[Ts__]

Sounds are difficult to describe comparatively. However, the boost motor is not quiet. It has a different sound than the train motor, but not a nice one either.

Currently I have no video of the locomotive with this engine, that will take time.

Thomas

 

[M_slug357]

@ejayb Back in the good ol' days of Power Functions, I tried to tackle a similar idea using the L-motor.

While it wasn't the best solution, I feel it came very close though!

 

[XG BC]

why not just load up studio and try to make the smallest loco possible with this motor you will be surprised how small you can go!