Ondra Posted January 21, 2022 Just now, williejm said: Plenty people know the show. It’s massive on Netflix and international. It was never designed or intended to be a flagship or best-seller set. You are clearly not the target audience, though. Between everybody knows and everybody buys is very thick line. This show is on paid on demand service and has very limited potential to be popular with anybody. Mr Bean is just weird mute dude doing funny things, kids understand him non speaking understand him too + its completely free on youtube and after 30 years is still known and loved IP . All these big corporate companies one day understand, that pleasing folks on Twitter is very bad for business standpoint. Especially with set in this price point... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
williejm Posted January 21, 2022 25 minutes ago, Ondra said: Between everybody knows and everybody buys is very thick line. This show is on paid on demand service and has very limited potential to be popular with anybody. Mr Bean is just weird mute dude doing funny things, kids understand him non speaking understand him too + its completely free on youtube and after 30 years is still known and loved IP . All these big corporate companies one day understand, that pleasing folks on Twitter is very bad for business standpoint. Especially with set in this price point... This isn’t a thread about Mr Bean. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ondra Posted January 21, 2022 1 minute ago, williejm said: This isn’t a thread about Mr Bean. You dont get my point. So we dont get anywhere. This set was just one designer dream without anything from business standpoint backing him. I just find it so ironic to actually get lego into legal troubles... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
williejm Posted January 21, 2022 Just now, Ondra said: You dont get my point. So we dont get anywhere. This set was just one designer dream without anything from business standpoint backing him. I just find it so ironic to actually get lego into legal troubles... This set is quite important to a lot of people. You’re not one of them. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
strangely Posted January 21, 2022 42 minutes ago, Ondra said: This set was just one designer dream without anything from business standpoint backing him. Lego does plenty of market research. If they felt that it wouldn't make for a viable set, it wouldn't exist. Clearly the designer was backed by Lego. And it makes sense that it got made considering the large push from Lego to put out adult only sets. They're testing the waters to expand their potential customer base. As for the lawsuit, I can't say I'm overly concerned. This situation is hardly unique. They'll either pay out a licensing fee for the designs or they'll try to fight it. Considering that the design in the set is Legofied, there's a chance the lawsuit won't get very far. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ondra Posted January 21, 2022 1 minute ago, strangely said: Lego does plenty of market research. If they felt that it wouldn't make for a viable set, it wouldn't exist. Clearly the designer was backed by Lego. And it makes sense that it got made considering the large push from Lego to put out adult only sets. They're testing the waters to expand their potential customer base. As for the lawsuit, I can't say I'm overly concerned. This situation is hardly unique. They'll either pay out a licensing fee for the designs or they'll try to fight it. Considering that the design in the set is Legofied, there's a chance the lawsuit won't get very far. LEGO is Being Sued for Copyright Infringement Over Leather Jacket Design - The Fashion Law This is very interesting reading, they supposedly offer him free set to be quiet when nothing arrives because lego stated that they dont give free things(Except for youtubers and fan sites to boost sales) and he gets mad. Lego lawyer states it will be for him uphill battle... Lego takes turn from Emmet to Lord Bussiness . Tell me how believable are these big corporate companies if they try to "Rebuild the world". Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Robert8 Posted January 21, 2022 Whoa whoa whoa They actually offered him a free set and told him to shut his mouth about the whole thing?? What is this??? They almost made it look like the designer was a toddler throwing a tantrum or something They didn't check about reproducing designer clothes and I get it. I mean, that's a mistake. But responding like that..... 12 minutes ago, strangely said: As for the lawsuit, I can't say I'm overly concerned. This situation is hardly unique. They'll either pay out a licensing fee for the designs or they'll try to fight it. Considering that the design in the set is Legofied, there's a chance the lawsuit won't get very far. I know a picture of the cast appears in the leaflet. If someone is actually wearing that jacket or whatever on those pictures, it could be an issue yes Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ondra Posted January 21, 2022 1 minute ago, Robert8 said: Whoa whoa whoa They actually offered him a free set and told him to shut his mouth about the whole thing?? What is this??? They almost made it look like the designer was a toddler throwing a tantrum or something They didn't check about reproducing designer clothes and I get it. I mean, that's a mistake. But responding like that..... Anybody remember ghostbusters firehouse ideas set drama? Designer gets 10 000 votes and many expected to be like Ecto 1 to be labelled under ideas badge and small cut gets also designer like always Guess what, they cut him completely and after backlash they offer him set to be quiet and ideas rules changed. Literally IDEAS became free market research site for them... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
williejm Posted January 21, 2022 Maybe start another thread to have your discussion @ondra ? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ondra Posted January 21, 2022 1 minute ago, williejm said: Maybe start another thread to have your discussion @ondra ? Maybe stop minimod me, OK? Im just giving facts! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
strangely Posted January 21, 2022 (edited) 19 minutes ago, Robert8 said: Whoa whoa whoa They actually offered him a free set and told him to shut his mouth about the whole thing?? I didn't see anything in the lawsuit about shutting his mouth (but i could have missed that), but they did offer the set. If I had to guess, they probably rescinded the offer because it might look like an admission of guilt. In general, I think Lego is in the right in this case. Netflix was responsible for clearing the clothing used in the show and didn't get permission to use it in the show, so I don't see how that's Legos fault. Also, I think the claim of ip infringement is pretty weak. Most of the items on the jacket are different on the minifigure, just in the same relative position. Really the only unique design transferred from the jacket is half a modified Ying Yang symbol. So I don't see this guy winning this lawsuit. Edited January 21, 2022 by strangely Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BrickBob Studpants Posted January 21, 2022 (edited) 22 minutes ago, Ondra said: Anybody remember ghostbusters firehouse ideas set drama? Big sets like that easily take 1.5 years or longer to design, so when the Ideas project was rejected, the official set was already being worked on. Happened with one of the recent Creator cars as well, bad timing I agree with @williejm, that case is not really relevant here. 1 hour ago, Ondra said: I just find it so ironic to actually get lego into legal troubles... I fail to see the irony here If would be ironic if the set was based on a courtroom show 1 hour ago, Ondra said: This set was just one designer dream without anything from business standpoint backing him. How do you know there was no market analysis backing it up? They've worked with Netflix before (Stranger Things), and Queer Eye has 5 seasons or so Even if that was true, so... so what? A designer got one of his dream projects realised, where exactly is the harm in that? Edited January 21, 2022 by BrickBob Studpants Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ondra Posted January 21, 2022 1 minute ago, BrickBob Studpants said: Big sets like that easily take 1.5 years or longer to design, so when the Ideas project was rejected, the official set was already being worked on. Happened with one of the recent Creator cars as well, bad timing I agree with @williejm, that case is not really relevant here. I fail to see the irony here If would be ironic if the set was based on a courtroom show How do you know there was no market analysis backing it up? They've worked with Netflix before (Stranger Things), and Queer Eye has 5 seasons or so Even if that was true, so... so what? A designer got one of his dream project realised, where exactly is the harm in that? I will tell you where is the harm, small shops buy sets directly from lego but when they dont sell there is big money loss for these small shops. They think that this set will sell, because lego presumably do some research so they order some cartons like always or lego tells them to which sets in what quantity they need to order. Its very complicated, its not like lego take these sets back and pay them back. Some star wars figure merchandise from disney era trilogy were big flop, they are still on shelves as seen on few forums. Its like cinemas are having bad times, because most movies are flops... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Trionx Posted January 21, 2022 There was a twitter thread from an IP lawyer in the article. The suing fashion designer was only talking to Lego customer service about his issues, who (seemingly by mistake) said they could send him a set? It doesn't seem like this is gonna go anywhere, its hard to tell if Netflix or Lego is at fault for not clearing the rights (also mentioned that this jacket was used on the show without clearing rights from the designer) but from this thread it seems like there isn't enough similarities between the jackets in the first case. So they might not have much of a case. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BrickBob Studpants Posted January 21, 2022 3 minutes ago, Ondra said: I will tell you where is the harm, small shops buy sets directly from lego but when they dont sell there is big money loss for these small shops. They take that risk with every single set they‘re buying It‘s a single medium-sized set, if a small shop orders 2000 copies it‘s their own fault Isn‘t it an (semi-) exclusive set? 5 minutes ago, Ondra said: Its like cinemas are having bad times, because most movies are flops... Hm, what could POSSIBLY be the reason for that? Escapes me Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
williejm Posted January 21, 2022 23 minutes ago, BrickBob Studpants said: They take that risk with every single set they‘re buying It‘s a single medium-sized set, if a small shop orders 2000 copies it‘s their own fault Isn‘t it an (semi-) exclusive set? Hm, what could POSSIBLY be the reason for that? Escapes me Almost like why are people piling on to woes with *this* set … what could POSSIBLY be the reason? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Robert8 Posted January 21, 2022 (edited) The matter does appear to be settled then But if LEGO is at fault for whatever reason, I hope they'll come up with something better than get a toy and shut up If they bring back the characters for keychains or something, I assume they'll be more careful about what they are wearing. Same with all the sitcom sets they release Edited January 21, 2022 by Robert8 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BrickBob Studpants Posted January 21, 2022 22 minutes ago, Robert8 said: If they bring back the characters for keychains or something, I assume they'll be more careful about what they are wearing. Same with all the sitcom sets they release In this particular case, it's rather simple. The jacket was intended as an extra torso, so they could easily release a keychain of Antoni with his "main" white outfit None of the other torsos look branded or copyright-protected to me (tbf, neither did that jacket) Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
williejm Posted January 21, 2022 3 minutes ago, BrickBob Studpants said: In this particular case, it's rather simple. The jacket was intended as an extra torso, so they could easily release a keychain of Antoni with his "main" white outfit None of the other torsos look branded or copyright-protected to me (tbf, neither did that jacket) Not a problem, fans will be happy with a keychain of Antoni topless. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Lion King Posted January 22, 2022 3 hours ago, williejm said: Not a problem, fans will be happy with a keychain of Antoni topless. I’m sure fans will sigh gay when they see Antoni topless keychain. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Bob Posted January 22, 2022 5 hours ago, Robert8 said: Whoa whoa whoa They actually offered him a free set and told him to shut his mouth about the whole thing?? What is this??? That's actually really funny. "Here, have a free set for your troubles --- just kidding no set for you." Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TheMainBricker Posted January 22, 2022 Well let's face it the set was a massive flop, triple VIP points, reduced on Lego.com within 50 days of release, the decision by Lego to retire the set a year earlier than planned etc. Perhaps this may put an end to internal Lego employee lobbying for particular sets? I always said it was a niche set and had a ridiculous price point. As for the lawsuit, there can be no denying that the design of the Lego jacket is identical to that of the designer's, but the lawsuit probably stands with Netflix and less with Lego. But I find it ironic that he wants a cut of the profits, he'd be in line to make $1! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RichardGoring Posted January 22, 2022 56 minutes ago, TheMainBricker said: Perhaps this may put an end to internal Lego employee lobbying for particular sets? Yes, it's clearly not sold well. But it's a decent set. They just got the pricing and/or production levels wrong. I hope they don't end internal suggestions. Otherwise we wouldn't have had the modular buildings or fairground collection, amongst others. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TheLegoDr Posted January 22, 2022 Even if the set didn't sell well at MSRP, I did end up buying it at 30% off. I've never watched the show. But it does have some neat details and pieces. And new prints on figures is always welcome. So if it had MSRP at the after 30% off price, maybe it would have sold better initially (although taking a cut from initial profits). Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TheMainBricker Posted January 22, 2022 1 hour ago, RichardGoring said: I hope they don't end internal suggestions. Otherwise we wouldn't have had the modular buildings or fairground collection, amongst others. Well technically most of the sets would come from internal suggestions, although stuff like the Adidas trainer and Vidiyo came from corporate partners (Adidas and Universal Music), and Lego clearly look at MOCs too, so there isn't a hard and fast rule over what creates success. Sometimes Lego get it right, or like this set, badly wrong. But hearing about what happened with this set, I would argue that there was probably an abuse of power in that the designer, being Vice-President of Design, could gain access to discussions and people that other designers wouldn't get access to. We had initial reports (that turned out to be false) that Lego were approached by the Queer Eye production company to make a set, when it was actually the other way around. The Lego board weren't sold on the idea but the designer kept doing presentations to the board to get them to agree to the set, I doubt any other designer would get that privilege. If a designer has a strong-enough design and idea a lot of what happened with this set wouldn't be necessary. The fact that Lego then had to produce a PR pack informing LAN of what the series was and why the set existed shows it never got off on the right foot. Every non English website had never heard of the series. 2021 was a year of Lego flops, and this set is just another in that list. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
