Are the Dragon Masters and the Black Knights the Same Faction?

[John Cromwell]

2 hours ago, zoth33 said:

They would be human in form but with dragon like features like scale skin, claws, possibly a tail some have them others don't.  Facial features like a dragon.  And obviously dragon armor.  I just something castle soon the blacksmith shop with the black falcon knights that is coming soon is nice but I'm really hoping for a full theme of castle or fantasy.  

Ah... Cool! That sounds interesting. Kinda like Chima?

[AViewToALego]

I always assumed the Dragons Masters to be a bunch of opportunistic traitors who saw an opportunity and embraced the power of magic and dragons, rather than by the numbers and heavy weaponry. In doing so, they went to Majisto and took him under his wing (literally!). It was more or less an opportunistic move so that they could get more influence over the LEGO kingdom the easy route (Magic and dragons). Then it wouldn't matter if they were outnumbered and outgunned. Because should the Black Knights attack their fortress, they knew they had to deal with a friggin' dragon and a lunatic magician in the process!

Also, these guys were very smart and used their skills to arrange traps and other nifty stuff. They were essentially hoarders. Hoarding dragons and jewels. And then buying more dragons or whatever. So they didn't even need a new insignia, they just took whatever they had and swapped the colors. Ta-da! A new faction! It's also pretty clever, because since the Black Knights have existed for some time, the "Dragon Insignia Trademark" is synonymous with Power and Dominance, which means small tribes might confuse the two and would shy away from attacking their keep.

And then we have the Wolf Pack off course. And believe me, they are a nuisance to everyone!

Edited January 12, 2021 by AViewToALego

[John Cromwell]

I like your view on the whole matter, @AViewToALego! That's a perspective I never thought of!

[jtooker]

11 hours ago, John Cromwell said:

Kinda like Chima?

No!  Not enough nostalgia \s.

But seriously, I do find it hard to set aside nostalgia while trying to be an objective judge.  While Dragon Masters certainly took a step toward fantasy with the actual dragons and wizard, architecturally, I thought the sets were similar to what was offered before. Kind of a combination of Black Knights and Forestmen.  They (and Wolfpack) did appear to introduce the BURP for better or worse.  They certainly didn't have a big, traditional castle (Black Knight's Castle was available at the same time and is still the best LEGO castle set I don't own).  What I wouldn't give for official overlapping castle themes right now!

Edited January 12, 2021 by jtooker

[John Cromwell]

19 minutes ago, jtooker said:

But seriously, I do find it hard to set aside nostalgia while trying to be an objective judge.

Don't we all?

20 minutes ago, jtooker said:

Black Knight's Castle was available at the same time and is still the best LEGO castle set I don't own).

Actually, if you are interested in purchasing 6086, I found it is cheaper to buy all of the bricks and minifigures separately, and assemble the castle that way, instead of spending $400 on it! That's who I went about it, anyway.

22 minutes ago, jtooker said:

What I wouldn't give for official overlapping castle themes right now!

That makes two of us!

[Aanchir]

On 1/11/2021 at 2:17 PM, John Cromwell said:

Yeah, and that's why Lego usually caters to the younger generation of builders who like playing with fire-breathing dragons and witches and elven lords, etc. instead of the AFOLS who more than often wish Lego had sets with a bunch of guys in chainmail with different banners marching to war with each other. Oh Lego... 

Even if I'm of a "younger generation", I don't think it's fair to act like AFOLs in general prefer the sorts of grounded scenarios that you describe. I'm turning 30 years old later this year, and yet I STILL overwhelmingly prefer sets, MOCs, and stories based around fantasy characters/creatures and magical adventures compared to ones based around realistic historical military skirmishes.

Just in the past week I've been getting back into writing LEGO Elves fan fiction that picks up where the "official" story left off in 2018, and I've got several MOCs in progress that I intend to accompany these stories. Meanwhile, I've been helping my wife catch up on the LEGO Ninjago TV series (she's nearly caught up to the end of season 2), and so far she's absolutely loving it, including its many cheesy jokes and ridiculous plot twists.

I understand if you judge me for not enjoying stories as "serious" as the sort you're drawn to, but please take care to recognize that there's nothing inherently more "adult" about your preferences than mine! After all, think about all of the adults who have devoted their lives to CREATING fantasy stories… up to and including literary icons like Shakespeare or J.R.R. Tolkien.

For the most part, fantasy writers include fantasy stuff like ghosts, witches, demons, elves, or dragons in their stories out of a genuine passion for that type of subject matter, not as some cynical compromise to turn otherwise serious historical dramas into something more marketable or "kid-friendly". And there's nothing immature about writing (or building) what makes you happy.

8 hours ago, jtooker said:

What I wouldn't give for official overlapping castle themes right now! 

Personally, Wolfpack, Black Knights, Dragon Masters, etc. never felt like "overlapping Castle themes" to me growing up, but rather like new expansions to one ongoing Castle theme. Sort of like how Ninjago tends to feature sets with several different enemy factions on shelves or in catalogs at the same time — like the video game inspired baddies of the "Prime Empire" sets, the D&D inspired foes from the "Master of the Mountain" sets, the Islander-like minifigures from "The Island" sets, and the wide assortment of enemy characters in the "Legacy" sets.

I recognize that the Ninjago approach is slightly different since it has one "main" faction (the ninja themselves) that serve as a sort of connective tissue between the factions that aren't otherwise shown interacting within the same universe as one another. Whereas back in the 80s and 90s when themes like Castle and Space had a similar "evergreen" status to how themes like City, Friends, or Ninjago  are treated today, different "hero" factions would emerge and disappear on a regular basis at around the same rate as "villain" factions (and some, like the Forestmen, couldn't be neatly described as either "heroes" OR "villains", but rather as an independent faction with their own unique motives).

But my point is that all those separate factions never truly felt like "multiple overlapping castle themes" to me — the closest I've ever felt to THAT was in much more recent years, with new "castle" sets simultaneously available from themes that did NOT share a universe with one another, like Nexo Knights, Elves, and Disney.

Edited January 12, 2021 by Aanchir

[zoth33]

21 hours ago, John Cromwell said:

Ah... Cool! That sounds interesting. Kinda like Chima?

Kind of like that.  

1 hour ago, Aanchir said:

Even if I'm of a "younger generation", I don't think it's fair to act like AFOLs in general prefer the sorts of grounded scenarios that you describe. I'm turning 30 years old later this year, and yet I STILL overwhelmingly prefer sets, MOCs, and stories based around fantasy characters/creatures and magical adventures compared to ones based around realistic historical military skirmishes.

Just in the past week I've been getting back into writing LEGO Elves fan fiction that picks up where the "official" story left off in 2018, and I've got several MOCs in progress that I intend to accompany these stories. Meanwhile, I've been helping my wife catch up on the LEGO Ninjago TV series (she's nearly caught up to the end of season 2), and so far she's absolutely loving it, including its many cheesy jokes and ridiculous plot twists.

I understand if you judge me for not enjoying stories as "serious" as the sort you're drawn to, but please take care to recognize that there's nothing inherently more "adult" about your preferences than mine! After all, think about all of the adults who have devoted their lives to CREATING fantasy stories… up to and including literary icons like Shakespeare or J.R.R. Tolkien.

For the most part, fantasy writers include fantasy stuff like ghosts, witches, demons, elves, or dragons in their stories out of a genuine passion for that type of subject matter, not as some cynical compromise to turn otherwise serious historical dramas into something more marketable or "kid-friendly". And there's nothing immature about writing (or building) what makes you happy.

Personally, Wolfpack, Black Knights, Dragon Masters, etc. never felt like "overlapping Castle themes" to me growing up, but rather like new expansions to one ongoing Castle theme. Sort of like how Ninjago tends to feature sets with several different enemy factions on shelves or in catalogs at the same time — like the video game inspired baddies of the "Prime Empire" sets, the D&D inspired foes from the "Master of the Mountain" sets, the Islander-like minifigures from "The Island" sets, and the wide assortment of enemy characters in the "Legacy" sets.

I recognize that the Ninjago approach is slightly different since it has one "main" faction (the ninja themselves) that serve as a sort of connective tissue between the factions that aren't otherwise shown interacting within the same universe as one another. Whereas back in the 80s and 90s when themes like Castle and Space had a similar "evergreen" status to how themes like City, Friends, or Ninjago  are treated today, different "hero" factions would emerge and disappear on a regular basis at around the same rate as "villain" factions (and some, like the Forestmen, couldn't be neatly described as either "heroes" OR "villains", but rather as an independent faction with their own unique motives).

But my point is that all those separate factions never truly felt like "multiple overlapping castle themes" to me — the closest I've ever felt to THAT was in much more recent years, with new "castle" sets simultaneously available from themes that did NOT share a universe with one another, like Nexo Knights, Elves, and Disney.

Do you like the Ninjago D&D inspired season?  I think the sets are great and I love the skull dragon, just looks so menacing when displayed.  I really did like the elves line and they had some great dragons there too.  I really liked the goblin kings dragon.  But I am hoping lego does do a fantasy theme soon with more dragons and mythical creatures.  Ninjago has some nice dragons but some are to sci-fi or mechanical.  The new Disney Raya the last dragon sets do look nice and remind me of the elves theme.  I also hope the Harry Potter line continues with new molds like the centaur and hopefully make different creatures from the movies or books.  

[John Cromwell]

2 hours ago, Aanchir said:

Even if I'm of a "younger generation", I don't think it's fair to act like AFOLs in general prefer the sorts of grounded scenarios that you describe. I'm turning 30 years old later this year, and yet I STILL overwhelmingly prefer sets, MOCs, and stories based around fantasy characters/creatures and magical adventures compared to ones based around realistic historical military skirmishes.

Just in the past week I've been getting back into writing LEGO Elves fan fiction that picks up where the "official" story left off in 2018, and I've got several MOCs in progress that I intend to accompany these stories. Meanwhile, I've been helping my wife catch up on the LEGO Ninjago TV series (she's nearly caught up to the end of season 2), and so far she's absolutely loving it, including its many cheesy jokes and ridiculous plot twists.

I understand if you judge me for not enjoying stories as "serious" as the sort you're drawn to, but please take care to recognize that there's nothing inherently more "adult" about your preferences than mine! After all, think about all of the adults who have devoted their lives to CREATING fantasy stories… up to and including literary icons like Shakespeare or J.R.R. Tolkien.

For the most part, fantasy writers include fantasy stuff like ghosts, witches, demons, elves, or dragons in their stories out of a genuine passion for that type of subject matter, not as some cynical compromise to turn otherwise serious historical dramas into something more marketable or "kid-friendly". And there's nothing immature about writing (or building) what makes you happy.

I'm sorry my post offended you, @Aanchir.  If you had thoroughly read my post, you would have saw that I said "AFOLS who more than often" , i.e. I left an exception to that statement. Sure, I could have worded it better by saying: "AFOLS who more often than not"

3 hours ago, Aanchir said:

I'm turning 30 years old later this year, and yet I STILL overwhelmingly prefer sets, MOCS, and stories based around fantasy

I never said that the older you become the less of an imagination you have. I'm just at the age to qualify for Eurobricks myself, and I don't completely just like realistic Lego.

3 hours ago, Aanchir said:

I understand if you judge me for not enjoying stories as "serious" as the sort you're drawn to, but please take care to recognize that there's nothing inherently more "adult" about your preferences than mine! After all, think about all of the adults who have devoted their lives to CREATING fantasy stories… up to and including literary icons like Shakespeare or J.R.R. Tolkien.

I never said I was judging you! I am currently collecting the 13 dwarves from The Hobbit sets, and reading the book itself. I am also about to finish watching Lord of the Rings and move onto The Hobbit movies. I've also considered creating my own head-canon on how Lego Castle became what it is today!

I do completely recognize that there is nothing more inherently 'adult' about my preferences than yours, I was just making a generalized statement about the AFOL community. Sheeesh.....

[Aanchir]

2 hours ago, zoth33 said:

Do you like the Ninjago D&D inspired season?  I think the sets are great and I love the skull dragon, just looks so menacing when displayed.

The sets are super great! I haven't had a chance yet to watch the new TV season that goes with them since, as I mentioned, I've mostly been focused on watching some of the older seasons with my wife and helping her get caught up. She hadn't been following the series at all until after we started dating.

I'm honestly kind of surprised and impressed with how much she's been enjoying it, since the storytelling in some parts of the first few seasons can sometimes feel a little rough or uneven in hindsight. Of course, it helps that she's a big fan of lots of shonen manga and anime, which are big influences on a lot of the weirder and wackier aspects of the series, like the way it blends traditional fantasy elements like dragons and magic with more futuristic subject matter like mechs and high-tech vehicles.

1 hour ago, John Cromwell said:

I'm sorry my post offended you, @Aanchir.  If you had thoroughly read my post, you would have saw that I said "AFOLS who more than often" , i.e. I left an exception to that statement. Sure, I could have worded it better by saying: "AFOLS who more often than not"

I never said that the older you become the less of an imagination you have. I'm just at the age to qualify for Eurobricks myself, and I don't completely just like realistic Lego.

I never said I was judging you! I am currently collecting the 13 dwarves from The Hobbit sets, and reading the book itself. I am also about to finish watching Lord of the Rings and move onto The Hobbit movies. I've also considered creating my own head-canon on how Lego Castle became what it is today!

I do completely recognize that there is nothing more inherently 'adult' about my preferences than yours, I was just making a generalized statement about the AFOL community. Sheeesh.....

I didn't mean for my own comment to seem judgmental either. I promise that nothing about your post was upsetting or offensive — I just mistakenly thought you were including yourself in that "generalized statement", and wanted to bring up how rarely generalizations like that tend to hold up in practice based on my own experience (I say that as somebody who's probably made all sorts of generalizations over the years that no longer seem accurate). I apologize if my post seemed to read too much into your comment or sounded needlessly defensive. And thank you for helping me understand your own perspective a little better!

AFOL perspectives have honestly changed way more during my time as part of it than I ever could have imagined, which is a big part of why I'm so hesitant to make the sort of generalizations I did back then. I mean, who'd have thought ten years ago that a $300 Ninjago set would generate so much excitement here on Eurobricks? Back then many AFOLs still expected Ninjago in general to become a Galidor-level failure, and even as a fan, I didn't expect it to last more than a couple of years. But today, even a lot of the negative feedback I've seen regarding the recent Ninjago City Gardens set has been from fans who feel it doesn't measure up to the original Ninjago City set from four years ago, or that it should have focused more on scenes and characters from the TV series!

I guess I was mostly surprised by your generalization about most AFOLs preferring realism because that would have felt so much MORE accurate to me 10–12 years ago than it does today. Currently, I feel almost like for every AFOL who wants the next Castle theme to be realistic, with minimal fantasy influence, there's another hoping for something more like the Fantasy Era sets, but with even more fantasy species like elves and goblins. I wonder how long it's been since anybody made a poll about that sort of thing?

Edited January 13, 2021 by Aanchir

[valon]

12 hours ago, John Cromwell said:

I never said that the older you become the less of an imagination you have. I'm just at the age to qualify for Eurobricks myself, and I don't completely just like realistic Lego.

i am probaby alot younger then you and i like fantasy castle, but knights that i have one minute might be fighting fantasy enemies the next minute be fighting knights and then i might use them in a diffrent game were they fight custom historical factions or Arabs

[John Cromwell]

10 hours ago, Aanchir said:

I didn't mean for my own comment to seem judgmental either.

Thank you.

10 hours ago, Aanchir said:

I promise that nothing about your post was upsetting or offensive — I just mistakenly thought you were including yourself in that "generalized statement",

No, actually you mistakenly thought I was including you in that generalized statement. If I included myself, why would you get 'offended' and start talking about how you have different appeals than what I mentioned? You wouldn't, because you are not me.

11 hours ago, Aanchir said:

I apologize if my post seemed to read too much into your comment or sounded needlessly defensive. And thank you for helping me understand your own perspective a little better!

Thanks. You are welcome! 

 

If I may offer some advice(which, obviously you are free to ignore) try to leave your emotions out of your comments and just take a minute to re-read the comment you disagree with and think on how you would respond. I have seen many or your type get a little wound-up and excited when coming across something they don't agree with. Just a little advice from a fellow Eurobricks user.

[zoth33]

21 hours ago, Aanchir said:

The sets are super great! I haven't had a chance yet to watch the new TV season that goes with them since, as I mentioned, I've mostly been focused on watching some of the older seasons with my wife and helping her get caught up. She hadn't been following the series at all until after we started dating.

I'm honestly kind of surprised and impressed with how much she's been enjoying it, since the storytelling in some parts of the first few seasons can sometimes feel a little rough or uneven in hindsight. Of course, it helps that she's a big fan of lots of shonen manga and anime, which are big influences on a lot of the weirder and wackier aspects of the series, like the way it blends traditional fantasy elements like dragons and magic with more futuristic subject matter like mechs and high-tech vehicles.

I didn't mean for my own comment to seem judgmental either. I promise that nothing about your post was upsetting or offensive — I just mistakenly thought you were including yourself in that "generalized statement", and wanted to bring up how rarely generalizations like that tend to hold up in practice based on my own experience (I say that as somebody who's probably made all sorts of generalizations over the years that no longer seem accurate). I apologize if my post seemed to read too much into your comment or sounded needlessly defensive. And thank you for helping me understand your own perspective a little better!

AFOL perspectives have honestly changed way more during my time as part of it than I ever could have imagined, which is a big part of why I'm so hesitant to make the sort of generalizations I did back then. I mean, who'd have thought ten years ago that a $300 Ninjago set would generate so much excitement here on Eurobricks? Back then many AFOLs still expected Ninjago in general to become a Galidor-level failure, and even as a fan, I didn't expect it to last more than a couple of years. But today, even a lot of the negative feedback I've seen regarding the recent Ninjago City Gardens set has been from fans who feel it doesn't measure up to the original Ninjago City set from four years ago, or that it should have focused more on scenes and characters from the TV series!

I guess I was mostly surprised by your generalization about most AFOLs preferring realism because that would have felt so much MORE accurate to me 10–12 years ago than it does today. Currently, I feel almost like for every AFOL who wants the next Castle theme to be realistic, with minimal fantasy influence, there's another hoping for something more like the Fantasy Era sets, but with even more fantasy species like elves and goblins. I wonder how long it's been since anybody made a poll about that sort of thing?

Yeah the sets are great.  My youngest son and I are trying to get all the sets so we can play the game.  The show is fun to watch and I hope you and your wife have a good time watching it.  There are actually  a lot of great sets Lego could make from the shows that they haven't made yet.  

[Lukandros]

On 11/24/2020 at 3:16 AM, Eggyslav said:

In my headcanon, Dragon Masters were the successors of Black Knights, hence the similar coat of arms. And the ghost of Black Monarch Castle is Black Monarch himself, who died and left a power vacuum, which was filled by Majisto and his Dragons. As of Dragon Masters and Black Knights fighting eachother, well those are renegade Black Knights, who revolted against Majisto's rule, they kept their old faction's name and heraldry.

Hello! Your theory could make sense... have you seen the LEGO set 6078 Royal Drawbridge? There is Dragon Master General using an oval Black Knights shield but he is clearly a Dragon Master.

I think Black Knights finally split into Dragon Masters and Royal Knights... why Royal Knights? Because of their colors... blue and red, scale armors and ghosts living on their castle.

 

 

 

Edited January 25, 2021 by Lukandros
Removing media

[John Cromwell]

@Lukandros Welcome to Eurobricks!

5 hours ago, Lukandros said:

I think Black Knights finally split into Dragon Masters and Royal Knights... why Royal Knights? Because of their colors... blue and red, scale armors and ghosts living on their castle.

That's an interesting theory. The colors and style of architecture is very similar. But where did they get the design for the shield? 

 

[GalacticTremor]

These are all interesting ideas but I don't think the dragon master are a spin-off from the black Knights neither are the royal knights. I imagine a land of many factions and in that land the dragon masters live amongst the mountains beyond the dark forest. In a small enclave between the mountains and the dark forest lives the royal knights who are a small faction charged with guarding the only river crossing to the north. Majesto the wizard lives in the mountains and the forest. The dark forest is like a great boundary that separates the land from the south where the lion knights and black falcons live. I've made a map to keep me happy. You gotta have a map.

[Lukandros]

2 hours ago, John Cromwell said:

@Lukandros Welcome to Eurobricks!

That's an interesting theory. The colors and style of architecture is very similar. But where did they get the design for the shield? 

 

Thanks! I am really glad to find this place... I was not believing my eyes when I found this forum... with people talking about the LEGO Castle classic... Hehe

Well... maybe they want to get away of any dragon like reference.
 

One think I am sure... Black Knights are separate faction from the Dragon Masters... but Dragon Masters do have some ex-Dragon Knights in their lines.

This prove big rival between this factions:

 

 

Also I like to think Royal Knights are in some how Black Knights because Dragon Masters win the initial conflict in my opinion.

[John Cromwell]

14 hours ago, GalacticTremor said:

I've made a map to keep me happy.

Any chance you can show us that map of yours? I'm thinking of drawing a map myself depicting all the Castle factions in the near future.

 

13 hours ago, Lukandros said:

Black Knights are separate faction from the Dragon Masters... but Dragon Masters do have some ex-Dragon Knights in their lines

Yes, I completely agree.

[PacificDuck]

These two factions were right in my childhood heyday of lego and I absolutely had them battling each other and Wolfpack.  I had one or two Crusaders and Black Falcons too, but not enough to matter.

I've never thought of ?? Italy and ?? France the same country, so it wasn't unreasonable in my mind for Black Knights and Dragon Knights to be different 

But that is the beauty of Lego....to each their own

[Lukandros]

Most of my LEGO Castle Classic are Black Knights... so whenever the other need to battle them the other factions join forces hehe...

But trying to give a background history to the classic castle sets... I think Black Knights and Crusaders, try to be off the other path. Falcons and Black Knights enemies but joined forces against common enemies as the Forestmen and Wolfmen. And Dragon Masters the biggest Black Knights enemies.

[Hermes Mocs]

FYI, there are two German audio-plays released in the 1990's that featured both Dragon Masters/Knights and Black Knights as well as Wolfpack and Royal Knights. As those were official LEGO products in Germany, I consider them canonic.

The first one is called "Hokuspokus Zauberstab", which translates into "Hocus-Pocus Magic Wand": https://youtu.be/toawPpmUvDA

The second one is called "Der Sohn des Königs" -> "The King's Son": https://youtu.be/It64mOIoYgw

 

In the first audio-play we learn that both Dragon Knights and Black Knights live in a country called Tarenta and that they are loyal to the same king, who, as we learn in the second audio-play, does not live in Tarenta itself, as Tarenta seems to be some kind of a periphery region, plagued by robbers like Wolfpack and that was home to a lot of dragons in the past.

Although loyal to the same king, former best friends Sir Francis and Sir Finnigan, leaders of the Dragon Knights and Black Knights respectively, are holding a personal grudge for reasons that are not disclosed. However, it does not seem as if any warfare has taken place between the two factions. The Dragon Knights are also the keepers of the King's treasure. The great wizard Cerlin (= Majisto) and his dragon Dragomil protect the treasure at all costs, hiding it beneath the dragon's den inside the Dragon Knights' castle.

 

In the first audio-play a Black Knights traitor plans to infiltrate the Dragon Knights' castle and steal the treasure with the help of the Wolfpack faction. Doing so is prevented by Sir Francis' daughter Rusty, the wizard's apprentice Five and the Wolfpack leader's foundling son Dickens. In the end Dragomil convicts the traitor by using the magic wand and Sir Francis and Sir Finnigan make up their controversy.

 

In the second audio-play an old and dying Royal Knights traitor confesses to King Richard that the once abducted infant Prince Henry might still be alive in Tarenta. The king leaves his homeland for Tarenta with a small fellowship but soon is abducted by some of his companion Royal Knights claiming the vacant throne. Two of the Royal Knights traitors however care more about the treasure than the throne and sneak their way into the Dragon Knights' castle. Again Dragomil and Cerlin save the day.

With the help of an old Black Knights librarian, Sir Francis' daughter Rusty, the wizard's apprentice Five and the Wolfpack leader's foundling son Dickens find the ruins the king is held hostage in and save him with the help of Dragomil. King Richard discovers he and Dickens share the same specific mole on their hands and he concludes that Dickens is his long lost son Henry. We don't learn if they return to their homeland, but as the "kingnappers" are defeated, it seems probable.

 

So all in all we learn that almost none of the factions are "monolithic". We have Dickens preventing his adoptive father's coup, we have both Black Knights and Royal Knights traitors and so forth.

Unlike later Pirates, Western and Adventurers audio-plays, we hardly have any hints at actual sets though. For example the dragon's den and the Dragon Knights' castle (6076-1 and 6082-1) do not seem to depict two parts of a single castle. For comparison: In the Adventurers audio-play, the sets' play-features are part of the story, like the exploding Sphinx, cascading rocks, rotating doors etc. So while the Adventurers audio-play is set in actual sets, the Castle audio-plays are not, at least not exclusively.

 

 

OT: If you understand a little German, go hear those audio-plays, they are fantastic! There are 2 Castle, 2 Pirates, 2 Western, 2 Adventurers, 2 City, 3 Time-Cruisers audio-plays... Yes, that's it i think ;) 

BTW the Adventurers audio-plays also confirm that Joe Freeman and his companions are NOT the same characters as Johnny Thunder and his friends :)

Edited September 1, 2022 by Hermes Mocs
Corrected a character's name.

[GalacticTremor]

On 1/22/2021 at 1:47 PM, John Cromwell said:

Any chance you can show us that map of yours? I'm thinking of drawing a map myself depicting all the Castle factions in the near future.

 

Yes, I completely agree.

Do it, I might share my map one day but I'm trying to iron out a story to make sense of it. My map depicts all the structures from the yellow castle era to the royal knights. It's good fun to put it all together logically.

[Lukandros]

On 1/21/2021 at 9:11 AM, Lukandros said:

Hello! Your theory could make sense... have you seen the LEGO set 6078 Royal Drawbridge? There is Dragon Master General using an oval Black Knights shield but he is clearly a Dragon Master.

I think Black Knights finally split into Dragon Masters and Royal Knights... why Royal Knights? Because of their colors... blue and red, scale armors and ghosts living on their castle.

 

 

 

Another set with Dragon Masters using the original Black Knights regular shield... Dark Forests Fortress 6079

On 1/23/2021 at 8:45 PM, Hermes Mocs said:

FYI, there are two German audio-plays released in the 1990's that featured both Dragon Masters/Knights and Black Knights as well as Wolfpack and Royal Knights. As those were official LEGO products in Germany, I consider them canonic.

The first one is called "Hokuspokus Zauberstab", which translates into "Hocus-Pocus Magic Wand": https://youtu.be/toawPpmUvDA

The second one is called "Der Sohn des Königs" -> "The King's Son": https://youtu.be/It64mOIoYgw 

Great information! Thanks for sharing! This is super interesting.