Lego David

Is LEGO using the 18+ rating wrong?

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It seems like the new 18+ set rating that LEGO just introduced this year is being used in a pretty strange way. I can understand marking sets like the Mosaics or the Busts as 18+, since they are mostly display pieces that kids probably won't be interested in. Or sets like the Technic Lambourghi Sian, which are very expensive and compilcated to build. But on the same time, they also marked sets like the Elf Clubhouse and 123 Sesame Street as 18+, despite them being sets that could very easily appeal to a general audience. Let's face it, Sesame Street is a puppet show that was mostly intended for little kids, yet they advertise it as "+18 set". It's not even a very expensive or complicated set, so I fail to see why it would be marked as 18+.

What are your thoughts on this? Do you think those sets should or shouldn't be marked as 18+? 

Edited by Lego David

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Well... I'm not someone who cares about age ratings on boxes.

I don't care that they're doing 18+ sets, but it does not feel necessary.

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Generally I am more focused on what's in the box vs what's displayed on the box.  Yes, TLG new 18+ rating is basically a joke, but really doesn't impact my purchases.  IMO liked the more colorful display art in general.

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Regarding 123 Sesame Street, how many kids (by kids, I mean the ones who actually use system pieces) actually watch Sesame Street? That's a show for toddlers and such, who generally are going to be using Duplo. The kids aren't going to be into, generally, such a show. If it was a Spongebob set with the 18+ rating and at the building level of 123 Sesame Street, then I'd agree with you. But this current set is much more for adults riding the nostalgia wave who now have their own kids or are wanting to relive their youth.

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3 minutes ago, KotZ said:

Regarding 123 Sesame Street, how many kids (by kids, I mean the ones who actually use system pieces) actually watch Sesame Street? That's a show for toddlers and such, who generally are going to be using Duplo. The kids aren't going to be into, generally, such a show. If it was a Spongebob set with the 18+ rating and at the building level of 123 Sesame Street, then I'd agree with you. But this current set is much more for adults riding the nostalgia wave who now have their own kids or are wanting to relive their youth.

But isn't it a playset?

Edited by JintaiZ

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26 minutes ago, KotZ said:

Regarding 123 Sesame Street, how many kids (by kids, I mean the ones who actually use system pieces) actually watch Sesame Street? That's a show for toddlers and such, who generally are going to be using Duplo. The kids aren't going to be into, generally, such a show. If it was a Spongebob set with the 18+ rating and at the building level of 123 Sesame Street, then I'd agree with you. But this current set is much more for adults riding the nostalgia wave who now have their own kids or are wanting to relive their youth.

I can get behind the idea that 123 Sesame Street is made in order to attract nostalgic adults, but that still doesn't explain a set like the Elf Clubhouse, which is a set I am pretty sure anyone can enjoy, regardless of age. 

22 minutes ago, JintaiZ said:

But isn't it a playset?

Yes it is. That's one of the reasons why the 18+ rating confuses me. If they really wanted a Sesame Street set that could pass as "18+" they should have made it more like a modular building and less like a playset (like the original LEGO Ideas submission was, for that matter).

Edited by Lego David

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40 minutes ago, JintaiZ said:

But isn't it a playset?

In theory, so is the Treehouse, Barracuda Bay, and the Modulars. Those are all 16+, but I won't be surprised if TLG makes the next wave of Modulars 18+ just for consistency of the new 18+ model going forward.

18 minutes ago, Lego David said:

I can get behind the idea that 123 Sesame Street is made in order to attract nostalgic adults, but that still doesn't explain a set like the Elf Clubhouse, which is a set I am pretty sure anyone can enjoy, regardless of age. 

Yes it is. That's one of the reasons why the 18+ rating confuses me. If they really wanted a Sesame Street set that could pass as "18+" they should have made it more like a modular building and less like a playset (like the original LEGO Ideas submission was, for that matter).

Looking at Elf Clubhouse, their video online is an adult woman building/playing with it. It definitely can be a playset and kids certainly can build and play and love that set, but I think their market research shows the winter village sets are purchased by adults for themselves more than purchased by kids. They're also seasonal items. Think like the nativity scenes that only come out around Christmas time people put up. If adults are purchasing the sets, they might be rotating the holiday themes in their homes.

I agree that Sesame Street should be much more modular like the original submission, but I'm guessing LEGO doesn't want an "unofficial" modular in the line, especially if it's a licensed item, where the average consumer will get confused and wonder why there aren't more licensed modulars and then not purchasing the in-house official ones.

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I just find it funny that it's marked 18+, since here in the US that label is usually reserved for pornography and cigarettes!

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2 minutes ago, Grover said:

I just find it funny that it's marked 18+, since here in the US that label is usually reserved for pornography and cigarettes!

Though a lot of adults love 18+ sets, so I guess I know what TLG is doing :tongue:

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Just now, JintaiZ said:

Though a lot of adults love 18+ sets, so I guess I know what TLG is doing :tongue:

We'll know for sure when there's a 21+ architecture set of the Coors factory! :laugh:

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33 minutes ago, Grover said:

I just find it funny that it's marked 18+, since here in the US that label is usually reserved for pornography and cigarettes!

Lego strip club coming soon then? :laugh:

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32 minutes ago, KotZ said:

Lego strip club coming soon then? :laugh:

Perhaps?

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1 hour ago, Grover said:

I just find it funny that it's marked 18+, since here in the US that label is usually reserved for [snip] cigarettes!

21 now. Shotguns and rifles at 18 though. US Minifigures can die in war but they are NOT allowed to drink or smoke. Murica.

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I think so. Yes

There is not a single reason why the Elf Clubhouse and the Sesame St. sets should be +18

 

Sesame St of all licenses! I'm surprised whoever owns that license allowed that

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4 hours ago, Lego David said:

It seems like the new 18+ set rating that LEGO just introduced this year is being used in a pretty strange way. I can understand marking sets like the Mosaics or the Busts as 18+, since they are mostly display pieces that kids probably won't be interested in. Or sets like the Technic Lambourghi Sian, which are very expensive and compilcated to build. But on the same time, they also marked sets like the Elf Clubhouse and 123 Sesame Street as 18+, despite them being sets that could very easily appeal to a general audience. Let's face it, Sesame Street is a puppet show that was mostly intended for little kids, yet they advertise it as "+18 set". It's not even a very expensive or complicated set, so I fail to see why it would be marked as 18+.

What are your thoughts on this? Do you think those sets should or shouldn't be marked as 18+? 

Well, I disagree about the Sesame Street set not being very complicated. New Elementary wrote a review of it that goes into a lot of detail about the building techniques, which include various SNOT techniques and even full stud reversals. Even before LEGO rolled out the new 18+ branding for their "adult" sets, it would have certainly gotten at least a 14+ age recommedation like the Temple of Airjitzu had, if not higher.

You're right that as a show aimed primarily at toddlers and preschoolers, it's a little counter-intuitive that the first LEGO set based on that license would be an adult-targeted item like this. But I wouldn't be surprised if LEGO ended up releasing Sesame Street sets with a 4+ age rating in the future to cater the series' typical viewing audience. Conversely, this particular set is more of a nostalgia item for adults who grew up watching Sesame Street (or whose kids did).

That decision was presumably driven by a combination of factors including the original LEGO Ideas project's level of complexity, the age breakdown of the project's supporters, and the nostalgic value which supporters often expressed in comments, blog posts, and social media posts about the project. If LEGO had downgraded it to a 4+ or even 6+ age range, it would have been a vast departure from the spirit of what people had supported.

As for the Elf Club House, you're right that it could probably be enjoyed by kids as well as adults. But then, the Winter Village sets have always been recommended for ages 12 and up. I think by that age, most builders are perfectly capable of deciding for themselves whether they are capable enough to build sets recommended for older builders, so I don't think raising the recommended age range is too likely to dissuade many of those TFOL buyers.

The designers of the Elf Tree House also appear to have continued the tradition of breaking the instructions into two booklets, so that younger builders can work on the smaller models in the first booklet while their older family members can work on the larger and more detailed ones in the second booklet. In that respect, these sets were already expected to be fun and accessible to builders younger than the age marked on the package.

I suppose next year we'll be able to determine how well this decision went for them based on whether they continue to use 18+ branding on big Ideas sets or Winter Village sets. But I doubt it'll have a huge negative impact on the potential buying audience. In the very least, I can definitely see the logic in having a particular unified packaging style for "premium" products, whether or not the decision to mark them all as "18+" ends up paying off in the long term.

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I think I echo what most folks have said so far: it makes no difference to me personally, but it seems totally inconsistent and almost random with how they're using it.  I mean, TLG must have some data and an idea of what they're doing, but so far about half of the sets labeled as 18+ seem like they'd turn off more of their potential (younger) audience than they would attract an older one.  ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ 

The only consistent determining factor I'm seeing so far might be "this set is somewhat over-priced for what would otherwise be the target demographic, so maybe we make the packaging more stark and older folks with more money will buy it."

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Do we have an official ruling on what exactly 18+ consists of? To add to the list, 10273 Haunted House has quite a play feature that kids will probably love. I wouldn’t say the build is overly complicated, although the mechanics of the tower lift was a bit tricky. Then we have 71374 NES. Definitely not a playset, so more appropriately rated I’d say, much like the SW Helmets. 18+ could simply be an easily marketable way to draw in unknowning adults(which is pretty much the widely accepted definition around here it seems) who would otherwise think “kids toy” when someone mentions LEGO. 

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1 hour ago, deraven said:

The only consistent determining factor I'm seeing so far might be "this set is somewhat over-priced for what would otherwise be the target demographic, so maybe we make the packaging more stark and older folks with more money will buy it."

Yes. 100% Yes.

And other than that they can print whatever age they want on the boxes. I could not care less.

Best
Thorsten

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30 minutes ago, Vindicare said:

Do we have an official ruling on what exactly 18+ consists of? To add to the list, 10273 Haunted House has quite a play feature that kids will probably love. I wouldn’t say the build is overly complicated, although the mechanics of the tower lift was a bit tricky. Then we have 71374 NES. Definitely not a playset, so more appropriately rated I’d say, much like the SW Helmets. 18+ could simply be an easily marketable way to draw in unknowning adults(which is pretty much the widely accepted definition around here it seems) who would otherwise think “kids toy” when someone mentions LEGO. 

I honestly don't see a big difference...

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It's branding to help the non-AFOL adults figure out which sets is meant for them.  Otherwise, they could end up buying Duplo not knowing.  :pir-grin:

 

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56 minutes ago, dr_spock said:

It's branding to help the non-AFOL adults figure out which sets is meant for them.  Otherwise, they could end up buying Duplo not knowing.  :pir-grin:

 

But then again... adults won't buy all 18+ sets... and they buy DUPLO sets if it interest them.

@Lego David - A poll would be nice, because I doubt everyone who views this page wants to comment on it.

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11 hours ago, deraven said:

The only consistent determining factor I'm seeing so far might be "this set is somewhat over-priced for what would otherwise be the target demographic, so maybe we make the packaging more stark and older folks with more money will buy it."

Well put. Indeed the 18+ moniker just seems like a cheap excuse to ramp up pricing for some sets.

11 hours ago, Aanchir said:

Well, I disagree about the Sesame Street set not being very complicated. New Elementary wrote a review of it that goes into a lot of detail about the building techniques, which include various SNOT techniques and even full stud reversals. Even before LEGO rolled out the new 18+ branding for their "adult" sets, it would have certainly gotten at least a 14+ age recommedation like the Temple of Airjitzu had, if not higher.

Frankly, who cares? That's the old gag of LEGO seriously misjudging these things right from the outset. What does a kid even care if a stud is on the sides or upside down as long as its cognitive capabilities allow it to follow the instructions?! You know, it's not like this is rocket science and these days the instructions are so dumbed down with only a bunch of pieces per steps, most people will have no difficulty working things out. That is, of course, if those morons at LEGO wouldn't permanently screw themselves by including errors in the instructions or doing dumb stuff like not choosing a suitable perspective, but that's a topic for another time...

11 hours ago, Aanchir said:

In the very least, I can definitely see the logic in having a particular unified packaging style for "premium" products

You must be kidding?! When did LEGO ever have a "unified packaging style"? I mean even on the 18+ sets we got so far the design philosophies vary hugely from color usage to package sizes to logotype. Nope, 18+ just feels like a cheap sticker slapped on to suggest a higher value where none may actually exist. It's just pretentious.

Mylenium

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I believe there are two lines of thinking here that leads to 18+ rating: first, the obvious display sets like mosaics/helmets/Lamborghini, and the other is licensed sets catering mostly to nostalgia, like Sesame Street. Now, a huge amount of nostalgia sets have been released in the last decade or so, since long before 18+ branding became a thing. I think the 18+ is a new marketing invention and the future nostalgia sets will be released with that label considering they are aimed at adults, and the Sesame Street is the first in this category even if it's technically a kids' show. Elf Clubhouse doesn't fit neatly in these categories, but I believe it's a bit of both. While not drawing on license, it still might be considered more a nostalgia set for adults reminiscing their childhood holiday season and it works very well as a display set too. The Haunted House works in similar fashion.

I also think there might be a little confusion in TLG marketing department on how to properly use this new branding, which will clear in a year or two. I'm guessing that in 2021 or 2022 we'll see the 18+ category being more defined.

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I think 18+ is spot on for Sesame Street. If the set was aged at age appropriate kids, it would be DUPLO not LEGO, or maybe 4+. If they put an age of 12+ or 8+, then it would not be of interest to those kids. Is a 12 year old going to brag to his friends that he is a big fan of Sesame Street and go for this set over something from Ninjago, Monkie Kid or Friends or Technic? I somehow doubt it. Plus put 8+/12+ will mean it is not an adult set and some adults won't buy it due to that. This set is marketed towards adults for nostalgia. It is too complicated for the age group of kids that generally watch the show now, so they might as well go for the adult market.

11 hours ago, Vindicare said:

Do we have an official ruling on what exactly 18+ consists of? 

The only official ruling we are ever likely to get is that it is an 18+ set if it says 18+ on the box.

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