[MOC] Castle of Lord Afol

[SleeplessNight]

Hi All!

I'd like to share with you my latest take on the Castle theme. It's called Castle of Lord Afol and the Black Knights. I tried to keep it classic in general appearance, modern in detail, playable and sturdy. The latter features are yet to be proven, as it's still only a digital MOC 

While it may look a bit modest compared to some contemporary MOCs, it is so for a reason - it contains "only" 3000 pieces, which is a limit for Lego Ideas entries. And while some of the MOCs around boast insane shapes, this one is quite solid and, despite the name, I think it could be built without a big problem by a 10-year-old with some practice with Lego.

Tell me what you think about it and if you like it, please comment and support this project also on Lego Ideas: https://ideas.lego.com/projects/f588abaa-4dab-4a56-b7bc-a7e38d018711

Enjoy!

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Wout]

That's a very nice looking castle. The first pic is extra attractive with the classic castle colours from the eighties and it has enough horses, but when I saw the squire next to them I looked if he had coconut shells with them.

The different parts of the castle looks good and add much fun to eachother. The way you can dispose enemies in an extra dirty way by the loo is very creative, but i'm afraid it's maybe too dark for TLC.

Otherwise, the minifigure selection is good with enough different people. I think If TLC choose this and it only looks for 50% on your design many people would be happy with it.

[jimmynick]

You're absolutely right - this has that classic feel to it. I love all the angles you've managed to fit into the castle, giving it a vibrant and active feel. The rockwork is simple and effective, too. Thanks for sharing!

[Merlo]

I both love and hate this at the same time :) The irregular shape is great!

[Grover]

Very nice work!  I am always impressed when people are able to make a good looking LDD MOC.  Mine look like a two year old made them!  The castle has a great classic feel, but isn't a derivative of any one set, which is great.  I can see inspiration from a number of different classic sets, and even some from the Lowenstein castle, too.  The mini build within the castle is hilarious.  I'd love to see more pictures of the interior.  I really like the mix of the stone and tudor textures.  Well done!

[Lyichir]

Very good model! I've already supported it on Lego Ideas. It just has so many amazing features—great detail, an amazingly irregular floor plan, modular design and features you don't often see in Lego castle sets like a toilet (that even incorporates a trapdoor—what a perfect play feature)!

 

[The Brick Boss]

That's amazing! Sorta reminds me of the castle from the old Knights Kingdom theme. Lord I miss that theme. In my fanfiction, King Leo's ultra great grandson, King Leo CCC is the king of Legonia and his castle in Lego City. 

Edited August 7, 2020 by Brandon Pea

[zoth33]

This is a nice model.  I've already supported this in Lego ideas.  I like the classic feel of the castle itself with some rock work thrown in.  The different angles are nice.  I like the tan accents throughout the build.  The figs are great.  

[bungeshea]

I really like the look of this, especially the mix of different styles.

[Wesley D]

When I saw your creation on LEGO IDEAS I was immediately hyped.

The castle looks substantional, it is polished, packed with detail and has the nice feeling of classic castle! It looks it could be an official set right away!

It is a pleasure to browse the pictures! Great job!

I wish you good luck on LEGO IDEAS! I really hope the castle will make it!

[Darnok]

This is awesome!

One question though: is there a secret exit somewhere? That would be all that is left for perfection...

[The_Cook]

I'm about to be (possibly overly) critical. Please don't misinterpret this as me not wanting the design to succeed; instead treat it as trying to make the design better. A typical Lego set isn't just about the aesthetics it also needs to consider playability and manufacturability; the more that these are incorporated into the design, the greater the chance of passing the review phase. Incorporating playability and manufacturability is going to result in compromising the aesthetics; that's the trade-off that the designers at TLG have to make every working day.

Manufacturing : MOC builders tend not to think about manufacturing; but there's a whole army of "nameless" people at TLG that take the models from the "named" designers and turn it into a manufacturable set.

• Brick count.  3000 is the limit imposed by the Ideas platform but that puts it into a price bracket which potentially rules out a lot of prospective purchasers. Could you find a way to remove 500 bricks and move into the same price bracket as  the Creator Modulars (that average about 2500 pieces), could you find a way to remove 1000bricks and move into the same price bracket as the Flagship Sets (that average about 2000 pieces).
• Unique element count. Whilst TLG's manufacturing facilities are an absolute marvel; they're not infiinite. The more unique elements (different bricks, different colours) that are utilised the harder the set is to manufacture. Be careful of using the same brick type in multiple colours (I see 98283 masonry profile bricks in a least 5 colours); the packing machines work on weight and can't differentiate between different colours.
• Printed parts. Pretend that each part adds a dollar to the set (I don't know the exact costs but it's probably close enough) which means higher cost or utilising less bricks to hit a price point.

Playability :

• Buildability - Can it be built? Are all of the connections legitimate? I think I see some studs pressed into technic bricks which is connection that is not typically found in official sets.
• How do you play with it? Can hands reach inside all parts of the castle? Does it open up to allow access inside? The rooms and central courtyard look hard to access without knocking over towers. The low walls and big courtyards of the early castles might not be historically accurate but it allows play. More modern sets tend to rely on a facade approach of a single wall rather than an enclosing structure.
• Minifigures. 14? The original line of Classic Castles had 12 at most and more recent castle sets (TLG though of them as castle even if the AFOL community didn't) such as Knighton Castle and Jestro's Lair have 10 or 11. Horses are expensive too. There's $60 of minifigures, horses, barding, swords and utensils before getting to a single brick of the castle. All of which push it out of the sweet spot of the Modular price bracket.
• What stories does it tell? All of the minifigures appear to be on the same side; which means that the stories that can be acted out with play are somewhat constrained to domestic stories. There needs to be an opposing faction to create conflict. This was implicitly present back in 6080 Lion Castle, 4 lions, 4 crusaders, the armoured knights have blue or black arms to differentiate them; more modern sets it's even more explicit you're told who is good and who is back. Even the domestic Castle sets had a conflict element to them; it was Blacksmith Attack and Mill Village Raid.

[ArneNielsen]

17 minutes ago, The_Cook said:

There needs to be an opposing faction to create conflict.

While I concur in that the walls are too high, and the courtyard too small in this otherwise fantastic build, there is examples of non-conflict official LEGO sets.

Set 6067 Guarded Inn (one of the most beloved sets from the 80ties) might be guarded, but the 4 minifigs are not in conflict with each other. This set was indeed praised as being the first civilian medieval castle set

[Merlo]

What about 70620 Ninjago City recently voted set of the millenium in one poll? It fails many of these points.

It has an insane brick count of 4867 with some unique elements, it's super hard to reach inside all parts even when opened, it has 17 minifigures and tells no story of conflict but just includes a couple of figures from opposing factions.

Despite all this it's not only awesome, it was remarkably cheap as well! (well, for a Lego set anyway)

[The_Cook]

8 hours ago, ArneNielsen said:

While I concur in that the walls are too high, and the courtyard too small in this otherwise fantastic build, there is examples of non-conflict official LEGO sets.

Set 6067 Guarded Inn (one of the most beloved sets from the 80ties) might be guarded, but the 4 minifigs are not in conflict with each other. This set was indeed praised as being the first civilian medieval castle set

6067 Guarded Inn is also one of my favourite sets but the balance has always been towards some form of conflict. Personally I'm not a great fan of "martial" conflict but it is conflict that drives stories.

I don't remember where I read it (possibly an interview with Mark Stafford a few years back) but historically the target audience for Castle was 10 year old German boys. They want a bit of conflict. These days 10 year old German boys tend to want Superheroes; hence the recent lack of Castle or attempts to "modernise" it...

6 hours ago, Merlo said:

What about 70620 Ninjago City recently voted set of the millenium in one poll? It fails many of these points.

It has an insane brick count of 4867 with some unique elements, it's super hard to reach inside all parts even when opened, it has 17 minifigures and tells no story of conflict but just includes a couple of figures from opposing factions.

Despite all this it's not only awesome, it was remarkably cheap as well! (well, for a Lego set anyway)

There are always going to be exceptions. Could Castle AFOL be one of the exceptions? Maybe; but balance of probabilities is that it needs to be closer to the norm.

Opposing factions is conflict that will drive stories.

Ninjago City also benefits from having a hit television show to leverage as marketing; TLG weren't taking that much of a risk with such a large set given the success of the Ninjago lines over the last few years (almost a decade).

 

Edited August 10, 2020 by The_Cook
Responding to 2nd post

[SleeplessNight]

Thank you, Everybody, for your support and your comments! Sorry for not responding for so long but I took a few days break from the internet (mostly ).

On 8/6/2020 at 11:47 PM, Wout said:

...when I saw the squire next to them I looked if he had coconut shells with them.

 Well, as they have actual horses, they don't need coconuts!

But:

On 8/7/2020 at 6:54 PM, Grover said:

The mini build within the castle is hilarious.

Thanks a lot! Note that it is not uncluded in the original "product idea", it's only a mod, like the winter version or the siege scene. Having said that, why not add it to the final set if it ever becomes reality?

13 hours ago, Darnok said:

...is there a secret exit somewhere? That would be all that is left for perfection...

Unfortunately! Of course I thought of one, I even wanted it operated by moving a branch of a tree, etc., but as this build already took 3000 pieces and countless hours, I had to give up on this one, as well as a few other important details. I was especially afraid of exceeding the 3000 pieces limit - maybe needlessly!

10 hours ago, The_Cook said:

I'm about to be (possibly overly) critical...

No problem, I appreciate that you care!

Well, I was thinking about many of those issues quite a lot. But we need to bear in mind, that TLG modifies the "Ideas" really dramatically. Compare the Barracuda Bay idea with the final product - if someone didn't know the connections, they would never guess it's "the same thing". Especially the Barracuda set (final) has around 2500 pieces, but it seems more likely that the original entry had around 3500. So if my model counts 3000 pieces (with minifigs each counted as 10 or so separate pieces), it doesn't mean the final product cannot be slightly smaller. At the same time there are sets like Modular Assembly Square, that is 4000+, Ninjago City of nearly 5000, not to mention UCS series. So I don't think it's a blocker. Actually it seems equally possible that the final product will have more and not less bricks. As for 5 colors for each brick, I think this is really a tiny detail, that is very easy to change without breaking the overall looks of the build and it really won't matter much in the selection process. I also believe that single color of bricks 

As for playability, I hope this picture answers most questions:

So, as well as taking floors apart (like in modulars) you can also take each quarter apart and you can just put them next to each other, to have an open layout, which is obviously more playable. This is actually reminiscent of the old castles, only there hinges were used instead of technic joints. I just found that hinges would be troublesome in such a large (and heavy) structure - but it also can be changed in the final design.

As for attaching studs to technic holes, while I do this at home, I can't recall doing it in this model. I really believe that this model has less "illegitimate" techniques and is sturdier than some official Lego sets. Particularly the new Barracuda, which really falls apart very easily - and still everybody loves it, including me!

14 minifigs - again, it's not a final design. If TLG says "12 is max", we'll get rid of one knight and one soldier and that's it. On the other hand, if there could be 11/12 minifigs (and 4 horses) in a set #6086 in 1992, and all sets generally grew in size and part count, then why couldn't we have 14 minifigs? And by the way, there is an opposing faction in person of a Forestman.

All in all:

• I consider this design quite practical
• The final design may differ greatly (as we've seen before)
• TLG may accept or (more likely) reject this project for completely different reasons
• My main worry now is to get 10,000 supperters, as we are still really far from that feat...

Thanks again for all the above comments and of course for supporting this project! 

It would be great if you also commented on Lego Ideas 

 

Edited August 10, 2020 by SleeplessNight

[LEGO Train 12 Volts]

Fantastic castle ...I would buy this set! 

 

[The_Cook]

13 hours ago, SleeplessNight said:

Well, I was thinking about many of those issues quite a lot. But we need to bear in mind, that TLG modifies the "Ideas" really dramatically.

 

The closer that a set is to TLG's standards then the less they will have to modify the Idea. The less an idea is modified the happier the purchasing public tend to be. Barracuda Bay is one of the exceptions where the changes have been regarded by most as an improvement on the original whereas with many earlier Ideas sets there have been complaints of "that's not what I supported." despite all the caveats from Lego that the Ideas are not the final product. I think the least changed of all has been Fishing Store which the designer deliberately tried to follow TLG building standards.

Fixing some of issues now pre-empts potential release day comments of "where's my 14th minifigure?" if it went to production.

As for playability, I hope this picture answers most questions:

Yes it does. That's the sort of photo needed in the orginal set to show how it can be played with.

[Louis of Nutwood]

Ooooh, boy! This is amazing! And could totally be an official set (which I would definitely buy, of course). 

Truly an outstanding work, fellow builder. You should be proud!

[Redhead1982]

This is such a nice design. I really like the traditional look and colors scheme, but a bit more modern in shape and detailing. It looks a bit old-school and nostalgic, but uses a more novel tricks to keep it all less cube-like. Even those not-so-nice printed panels fit in nicely. I would very gladly buy it as an Ideas set. Fingers crossed to make it to 10 000 votes. 

[YellowBrickHead]

Hey SleepLessNight,

I am a CFOL that grew old and a newly AFOL. My son is 3 and a half also in his Duplo age but is just about old enough to play with Dady's "old LEGOs" as we call them 

I absolutely love your model and would absolutely buy it off course !  . I'm sorry I was not approved despite the 10 000 votes. Would you consider publishing/selling a MOC for it? If so, let me know !!!

Cheers,

YellowBrickHead

Edited March 7, 2023 by YellowBrickHead

[SleeplessNight]

Hi, thanks for your interest!

All is not lost - I have submitted another project to Bricklink Designer Program, the voting has just begun, so you're very welcome to support it: https://www.bricklink.com/v3/designer-program/series-1/482/Mountain-Fortress

Something more similar to the original Lord Afol's Castle may follow at a later date.