42113 Osprey, Mods and improvements

[Toastie]

(I know)

But thanks @Ngoc Nguyen for clarifying here - I believe this is really important. I don't like big ones hiding behind (or better: use) other folks. The story was discussed up and down here and elsewhere. But @DrJB raised this question (totally understandable) and this needs a clear response.

Thanks and all the best
Thorsten

 

[petero]

Of course nobody really knows why LEGO canceled it, because they're not telling. The set has problems with gears being damaged, so that's a possible reason also. @Ngoc Nguyen has made some excellent mods to rectify the problem.

Peter

[roeltheworld]

Hi all,

Little update on the wing design: I've made the structure more compact now being only 2 studs thick on top of the turntable.

That improved version I called version 02, and from this iteration two problems became clear:

1) by turning the wing 90 degrees, the central axes are also turned 90 degrees with it. This will turn the blades and the nacelles, which is BAD because they should stay in place. I have a solution, but let's deal with that problem after we sort the wing. (that involves a hull modification, and it also means that the wing turning cannot be powered by the motor.)

2) the nacelle/flap driver axle is now located behind the prop driver axle, instead of in front of it. Two solutions: A) turn the wing structure around to move it in front, or B) create a different turning mechanism. I've tried option B here in my current version, using a lever mechanism, but it's not ideal. Next I'll try a cog mechanism, but if that doesn't work I'll go for option A above.

Good news: The central axes problem is now solved. Please check the io file and images if you'd like to try to build it!

v03_01 by Roel Cruijff, on Flickr

v03_02 by Roel Cruijff, on Flickr

https://www.mediafire.com/view/llf4g22dgzj7aqs/v03_01.png/file

https://ibb.co/9sgNcHr

https://ibb.co/9sgNcHr

https://www.mediafire.com/view/tm8vcnhfzqzhz1r/03_07_wing.jpg/file

Bottom central axes mechanism: you can see the two blue clutch gears. They turn independently from the central axle. It drives the two large tan flat cogs to the sides, propelling the blades.

03_06 wing by Roel Cruijff, on Flickr

https://www.mediafire.com/view/troa8ot0wh5joje/03_02_bot.jpg/file

This is the top view. The little cog on top is connected to the central axle, driving the small black cogs at the back. This is the flap/nacelle turning axle.

03_07 wing by Roel Cruijff, on Flickr

https://www.mediafire.com/view/rzza28j45b53y22/03_01_top.jpg/file

This is my temporary V03 flap mechanism. Although I love the principle, it's clunky and not smooth. The nacelles are too heavy so they don't move smoothly. I'll try a cog mechanism next in V04:

03_05 flapup by Roel Cruijff, on Flickr

03_04 flapmid by Roel Cruijff, on Flickr

03_03 flapdown by Roel Cruijff, on Flickr

https://www.mediafire.com/view/pvs5p7e8t6s18az/03_05_flapup.jpg/file

https://www.mediafire.com/view/u7ikkt3bihctwua/03_04_flapmid.jpg/file

https://www.mediafire.com/view/a02qe9sug9k8piv/03_03_flapdown.jpg/file

 

V03 IO file: (NB, please rename to .io if mediafire converts it to a zip. This is not a zip, it's an IO file). This version has the improved central structure, but not the best flap configuration.

https://www.mediafire.com/file/29xgyph63bnhk7x/Wing_mech_03.io/file

Edit: how do I get pictures to show up on this forum from a photo hosting site? the regular code doesnt seem to work?

 

 

Edited May 6, 2021 by roeltheworld

[syclone]

@roeltheworld You might want to use Brickshelf/Bricksave/Flickr to share your pictures, as it is they show up as links. Brickshelf and Bricksave also allow to share .io files without the .zip issue. Or use the BBcode option when sharing your image through your current hosting site. 

Good luck with the flaps, amazing how much functionality you were able to fit so far.

Edited May 6, 2021 by syclone

[roeltheworld]

@sycloneThat worked, awesome! Thank you.

[SUPER Max Black]

COOL!

Very nice.

[roeltheworld]

OK, Version 4 is pretty good. Got 4.0 right now, and this is what it looks like:

10_newwing by Roel Cruijff, on Flickr

Flaps up:

09_flat by Roel Cruijff, on Flickr

The cog mechanism:

08_cogs by Roel Cruijff, on Flickr

Suspension:

07_bot by Roel Cruijff, on Flickr

The central axle mechanism as before:

06_top by Roel Cruijff, on Flickr

Flaps middle:

04_flapmid by Roel Cruijff, on Flickr

Flaps down:

03_flapdown by Roel Cruijff, on Flickr

Because the nacelles are driven by the 8-tooth cog, they can spin 360 degrees. However, the flaps keep them in place with maximum and minimum elevation. This 'brake' is not strong enough to hold an engine for prolonged time, so when you move the nacelles you'll need to switch them on and off on time to avoid breaking the 8-tooth cogs... however, breaking 8-tooth cogs seems to be a thing with this model so why not?

This is the maximum elevation; about 100 degrees.

02_vertical by Roel Cruijff, on Flickr

The dihedral is quite realistic:

01_dihedral by Roel Cruijff, on Flickr

 

The only things still to fix with this wing are:

- it is 10 studs long. I'd prefer 9, but let's see what it looks like on the hull, then fix that.

- it's quite wide too. We could mod about 2 studs off if we had to, but like the above, that's just cosmetics and can fix that later.

 

Here is the IO file:

https://www.mediafire.com/file/xi2t0duyjj5lpgk/Wing_mech_04.io/file

Next steps:

- marry the V04 wing to the hull with motorized elevation and blades spinning.

- create system for disengaging drive shaft to central cogs and axle to avoid 90 degree turn when folding wing.

- re-design rotor blade suspension to allow for easy folding and unfolding.

 

[Bartybum]

@roeltheworld damn my dude, you're doing good work here. any chances of a video eventually?

[roeltheworld]

Happiness! I sat down today to work on the hull, and it is done: the driveshaft is driving.

Now I hope my calculations are correct and I got the right height for the turntable, but regardless, it looks right:

Hull_try_01 by Roel Cruijff, on Flickr

Taking the turntable off, you'll see the incredibly straightforward driving mechanism. I didn't change the gear and loading bay functions, after all they ain't broke. I did take out all the gears on the front side, the white square frame, and some of the structural elements in the base model (like the two 9-length standing liftarms).

Driveshaft by Roel Cruijff, on Flickr

In the above picture you see the two mechanisms: the left top axle in the gearbox drives the rotor blades. It connects to the dark grey clutch gear. The right top axle in the gearbox simply extends to the short screw gear. This drives the engine nacelle elevation.

So... here's a video testing the machine. You will see the slow rotation of the red axle (nacelles), and the blue gear still. Then flicking the other switch, the red axle is still but the blue gear spins (rotor blades).

 

 

Finally, I added two pilots from system on two regular chairs from my old system box. Underneath also attached a simple refueling probe.

twoguys by Roel Cruijff, on Flickr

 

In case you are wondering, yes, the IO file is coming later.

My studio:

Taking_shape by Roel Cruijff, on Flickr

 

[roeltheworld]

Update on the rotor blades folding:

This first version has a simple locking mechanism on each of the blades.

rotorhub_03_lock by Roel Cruijff, on Flickr

Just fold the lock back for all three blades, move the blades you want to move, and then fold the locks back into place.

rotorhub_02_lock by Roel Cruijff, on Flickr

This is the lock part in Studio.

The real model (ran out of light grey parts):

rotorhub_04 by Roel Cruijff, on Flickr

Start here.

rotorhub_06 by Roel Cruijff, on Flickr

Fold the locks backwards.

rotorhub_07 by Roel Cruijff, on Flickr

Move the blades into position.

rotorhub_08 by Roel Cruijff, on Flickr

They hinge only on a small part.

rotorhub_10 by Roel Cruijff, on Flickr

Finally fold the locks back.

 

Here is the IO file:

https://www.mediafire.com/file/ctl5tznlhlcnqfk/rotorhub_01.io/file

[Bartybum]

Oh damn, you're going for everything being motorised. Not bad

[1gor]

@roeltheworld did I saw correctly; is there non-lego connector in your second to last image?

Lego connector part usually looks like that:

Edited May 16, 2021 by I_Igor

[roeltheworld]

@Bartybum Actually, I think the wing rotation will be manual. I thought about making the cargo bay manual and diverting the axle to the top, but there's an issue with keeping the central axes in position while rotating the wing, to avoid the nacelles and blades from turning the moment you turn the wing. So... we're not there yet.

@I_Igor Yes you are correct, this is one of those pieces from compatible brands that got mixed with my collection, probably bought from CADA at some stage. The pilots also are non-Lego, but I just really like the helmets. I like the original piece in your picture much better, so when I'm back in my workshop I'll try to find the better pieces for the final iteration.

[roeltheworld]

Hi all,

It's been a while, but I've found a bit of time to put 1 and 1 together.

Hull07_test by Roel Cruijff, on Flickr

So, the previous pictures show my earlier version, HOWEVER, it was wrong. I put on the wing and found that the blue cog was a stud too high for the wing to fit. So this meant redesigning the entire inside mechanism from scratch...

This is the main column, and the cogs had to be moved down 1 stud...

Ver2_05 by Roel Cruijff, on Flickr

But it's done:

Ver2_08 by Roel Cruijff, on Flickr

Putting on the wing was AWESOME. The thing is gigantic, so to see it in action is pretty incredible.

Hull04_fold by Roel Cruijff, on Flickr

Here is the folded model, and as you can see I took the rotors off. They kept drooping down, so I'm going to design a blocking mechanism for that.

Hull06_folded by Roel Cruijff, on Flickr

This is a close-up from the left side. Here a small gap is left for a cog or wheel to turn the wings with. Right now it is loose, and can simply be pushed.

Hull09_heavy by Roel Cruijff, on Flickr

I put a little fuel probe on the bottom chin:

Hull11_fuel by Roel Cruijff, on Flickr

And check out the gunner at the back!

Hull14_mg by Roel Cruijff, on Flickr

It won't be the only gun, as this bottom bit is where the minigun will come out of. In case you are curious as to 'what minigun?' I am referring to, check out the various online sources regarding the armament updates of MV-22B's. It's pretty wild. Thinking to add some rockets on the side of the nose as well, as some Ospreys have been testing more offensive weaponry. In the picture below you can also see the space for the old battery box. It barely fits and needs a bit of tolerance as it 'hangs' at an angle

Hull15_minigun by Roel Cruijff, on Flickr

Here's a detail from the right side. As you can see I used a system piece. Still, it's kinda cool because you can open the hatch and see a bit of cog on cog action:

Hull16_detail by Roel Cruijff, on Flickr

Here is a shot of the nose with the pilots and the fuel probe. As you can see the wheels come up in folded position. It's a heavy plane. Once the battery box is in it won't do that anymore.

Hull12_nose by Roel Cruijff, on Flickr

So, I'm not very good at filming yet, so honestly I apologize for this poorly shot video. BUT, it's genuine, as I just made it and I was so happy with it I just took a little video of the thing. Also, I don't have a camera/phone stand, and it's a bit tricky to film with one hand while operating the machine with the other.... I'll get better at this I'm sure, but for now this is what I've got:

https://youtu.be/RWG5ky8sTi4

Alright that's it for now, but we're really getting somewhere now.

[Pattspatt]

Great progress! Thanks for the update, and great to see it in-action!

[SNIPE]

In regards, to my old reply here on adding tilting blades like the real thing:

My old idea worked, but it would also slide the parts around on the axle and it there was too much friction in several places.

So I am working on a new way to do it, but getting it small like before is tricky.

I tried sliding the wheel hub instead of the axle, but then it gets pulled to tilt the blades and pushed to flatten them instead of vice versa, and i'm not sure how to attach this to the housing of the pods too.

There have been blade pitch mechanism done in the past but they are all too big. :/

I am considering using the fairly new 50018a minifig weapon with 3 bars, and adding frictionless pins to them, which will allow the connectinrs hoding the blades to pivot.

I'll hopefully find a solution and post it here.

Edited June 30, 2021 by SNIPE

[SNIPE]

I think I'm getting somewhere, I decided to abandon linkages like in the link above because they take up space and because the stupid blades have the pin holes in a stupid orientation which makes it hard to mount especically if you wanna do variable pitch.

I used some "exotic" parts to do this such as x1 50018a, x3 32138, 11010 , and x3 24014 .

This way does not use pushing and pulling, but rather relies purley on rotation.

I think I will have to replace the regular 12 too double bevel gear with a 20 tooth clutch gear and use clutch rings, so that the blade rotation is on the axle and the blade pitch is using the clutch rings

I can replace the 32138 with cross blocks and then attach the blades with easy to remove 32054's sothat the blades can still fold up.

That's all for today.

Edited July 3, 2021 by SNIPE

[carpandean]

I'm a bit late to the 42113 game.  Giving this thread a bump for both my own ideas and so we don't lose track of the awesome mods contained herein.

When I saw mention of the kit recently, but couldn't find it on Bricklink, I searched for it on Google/Youtube.  Lots of videos/pages came up, but I somehow missed that it was two years ago.  Thinking it a recently cancelled kit, I started thinking about how to make it work without buying one. 

I've always loved USCG boats/cutters/aircraft and loved the idea of a USCG V-22 (though, I understand why they don't have them.)  Finding that curved plates #50 and #51 came in red (would have preferred white, but good enough), I started modifying the original parts list, using the instructions to figure out which parts to recolor.  Was nearly ready to order when I found this thread.  It gave me the Studio files to work from, which I quickly updated to my idea (plus a few small mods.)  Hat nod to @efferman for his version.  Ours are different enough, though, to consider the distinct ideas.  Mine is a mix of the MH-60T Jayhawk colors and those of the larger USCG fixed-wing aircraft (e.g., HC-130J), which seemed fitting given the V-22's unique design.  I added a nose radar similar to those found on the MH-60T and the USAF CV-22 Osprey (combat search & rescue), as well as a few minor tweaks to improve a couple of areas.  Once I can procure the parts, I'll put it together.

 

Edited July 5, 2022 by carpandean

[tommyreno]

@carpandean I have to say, that new color scheme looks even better than the original. I was fortunate enough to acquire an osprey without overpaying, and having it built in person, I must say the colors look kind of dull compared to the render you have there. It looks very vibrant and seems more realistic than a drab grey and orange osprey. Well done.

[carpandean]

On 7/7/2022 at 5:22 PM, tommyreno said:

@carpandean I have to say, that new color scheme looks even better than the original. I was fortunate enough to acquire an osprey without overpaying, and having it built in person, I must say the colors look kind of dull compared to the render you have there. It looks very vibrant and seems more realistic than a drab grey and orange osprey. Well done.

Thanks!  I'm hoping to get the pieces soon.  I also picked up an extra Brickmania MH-60T Jayhawk sticker sheet, just in case I find a fit. 

[shroomzofdoom]

I just built the Osprey from my inventory parts and waiting to get a few third party panels. I upgraded using the standard fix with the 6ea 8z gears and all is well. 

The nacelles don't turn in unison and often don't turn at all unless I hold the entire model up or down. I've tried a couple of things like using non-friction pins at the pivots, replacing the 2L pin connector 'clutch' in the wing, etc...no joy.

Reading through the thread, it seems like swapping out the gearing in the nacelle (from 12T/12T to 12T/20T) might do the trick, but before go that route I just wanted to see what you guys thought?

 

EDIT: I swapped out the 2L pin connector 'clutches' in the wing with 4L axles as suggested above by @SNIPE and it worked out well. Now, I'm also noticing that when the tilt limit is reached, the inline torque clutch does it's job and slips. Given these two, somewhat redundant design elements, it's pretty hard to see the original design as anything but slightly flawed in a number of ways but overall, still a really cool model that I wish more Technic fans have the opportunity to enjoy. Will post pics once I get it colored. I went with full, boring DBG kinda like the real world using third party elements in places where there were no Lego parts 

Edited March 15 by shroomzofdoom

[shroomzofdoom]

I started with a PU hub running a Pybricks program that turns on and starts motor with the power button.

The elements are a variant of the one Ngoc mentions here. With mine, I push the left seat back to click the green button and run the program which simply turns the motor on/off.

I went with LBG/DBG color palette which is closer to the original military version. In places where Lego panels were not available in in gray, I used 3rd party parts. I bought a sticker sheet from Brick Sticker Shop and used the gray ones to get it a bit closer to the original. It’s important to use the ‘rescue’ ones to have a story to tell. 😊

I hid almost all visible yellow, brown, red, blue, & orange with analogous Lego parts. The only non-Lego pins used were to replace the 3L friction pins. Change over shifters are still red of course, but I toned them down a bit.

Because I just can’t wait for the blades to arrive from Denmark, I mocked it up using chefkaspa's blade MOC

Overall, I’m happy with the way it came out.

It was a very rewarding build experience and I saved myself about $900 USD by using current inventory and a few various parts from Brickowl and Ali. (next up 8043!)