Unpopular Opinions about LEGO

[Pinnacle]

1 hour ago, Lira_Bricks said:

Bricks like 2x2 dark bley tiles or foliage would be sold out so quickly haha

That is indeed the problem with Bricklink. But as TLG can see that there is a great demand for specific parts; they can start a moulding machine and produce as much as ask for.

Maybe not for every part but for the most common parts like basic bricks and plates.

[koalayummies]

8 hours ago, Pinnacle said:

It is extraordinary that I can order 1000+ 2x4 bricks for on an average ten Euro-cents on BrickLink while the same brick costs 22 Euro-cents by LEGO’ pick a brick. And there is a limit of 999 pieces.

With loose parts (as opposed to unopened sets) Bricklink's 'new' isn't exactly the same as direct-from-Lego and that's reflected in that price difference. Any BL seller can claim that the 103,547 2x4 bricks that they've had for the past twenty-six years are brand new and unused but that isn't like Lego PAB new.

[MAB]

18 hours ago, Flak Maniak said:

How many times do you see a project for a license you don't care about, but the build is so good you support it anyway?

Not very often. But then the same is true for non licensed builds too. I don't vote for good builds that are not licensed if I wouldn't be interested in buying them. 

[Alexandrina]

8 hours ago, MAB said:

Not very often. But then the same is true for non licensed builds too. I don't vote for good builds that are not licensed if I wouldn't be interested in buying them. 

This is probably the best voting strategy for the sake of getting good sets in the long-term. If everyone piled on to vote for a 'favourite' that they never wanted, and then didn't buy it when it came out because it's not their thing, Lego could well decide that the falling sales are due to a lack of sustained interest in the Ideas platform and concept. And while everyone will have some Ideas sets they're not interested in (for me, it's things like the NASA sets or the Sesame Street) the sheer variety means that most AFOLs are probably getting at least one Ideas set every couple of years that appeals to their particular tastes.

[Tube Map Central]

This will be unpopular on a Lego discussion board.

Within the next 20 years Lego will be bust, driven out of business by the clone manufacturers, who will up their design, range and part quality to the point at which TLG won't be able to sustain their business model.

Won't be the first time that a massive toy company collapses, it's the toughest market to operate in.

Edited March 3, 2021 by Tube Map Central
Typo

[MAB]

19 minutes ago, Tube Map Central said:

This will be unpopular on a Lego discussion board.

Within the next 20 years Lego will be bust, driven out of business by the clone manufacturers, who will up their design, range and part quality to the point at which TLG won't be able to sustain their business model.

Won't be the first time that a massive toy company collapses, it's the toughest market to operate in.

You still have to have people turn away from LEGO though. Inertia due to snobbishness over other perceived inferior brands is a thing.

[Tube Map Central]

Agreed, but will there be enough of them to sustain TLG in its current form? Will genuine Lego become a niche pastime?

My 'habitat' is trains and Lego treats its train fans with disdain. We might be a weird minority, but as a group we have to look beyond TLG to get essential parts, such as wheels and track. It is creating the beginnings of a subversive culture. We notice that clone manufacturers are offering huge ranges of trains, ten times as many designs as the scraps TLG throws out to its supporters once in a blue moon. They do look rather tempting.

Try this: https://www.amazon.co.uk/s?k=ausini+train&i=toys&ref=nb_sb_noss_2

What puts us off? Errors in instructions, poor designs, poor quality parts, missing parts, damaged parts, dirty parts. These are all fixable, what then?

This is a source of infection to Lego culture that TLG really shouldn't be ignoring. Hacked-off train fans might start an exodus.

Edited March 3, 2021 by Tube Map Central
Added link

[jimmynick]

Mine is that not every nice MOC has to be an IDEAS submission. Half the time the responses to nice MOCs are "you should submit this on IDEAS" without the recognizing that, generally speaking, it's impracticable to turn truly stellar builds into sets.

[CaptainSerMig]

16 minutes ago, jimmynick said:

Mine is that not every nice MOC has to be an IDEAS submission. Half the time the responses to nice MOCs are "you should submit this on IDEAS" without the recognizing that, generally speaking, it's impracticable to turn truly stellar builds into sets.

TBH I hope it's not that unpopular, considering the state of Ideas in recent years

[Alexandrina]

5 hours ago, Tube Map Central said:

Within the next 20 years Lego will be bust, driven out of business by the clone manufacturers, who will up their design, range and part quality to the point at which TLG won't be able to sustain their business model.

If it were to get to the point that Lego were seeing their business drop because of knock-offs with different business practices, surely Lego would adapt their business model. They're easily the market leader at the moment, and deservedly so - and don't forget that they also have Bricklink as a major hub for part resale, something which as far as I'm aware doesn't exist for other companies' products. It would take sustained exceptional poor performance for Lego to go to the wall within twenty years even if they didn't adapt to counter upcoming rivals.

On a longer timescale you might well be correct (though personally I think it's more likely Lego becomes so firmly entrenched as the construction toy brand that they're effectively the Coca-Cola of plastic bricks) but twenty years would be an absolute whirlwind.

[MAB]

4 hours ago, Tube Map Central said:

My 'habitat' is trains and Lego treats its train fans with disdain. We might be a weird minority, but as a group we have to look beyond TLG to get essential parts, such as wheels and track. It is creating the beginnings of a subversive culture. We notice that clone manufacturers are offering huge ranges of trains, ten times as many designs as the scraps TLG throws out to its supporters once in a blue moon. They do look rather tempting.

Everyone wants something more than what is already offered though. Not just trains. And for LEGO to satisfy the wants of one group means not satisfying another group. Of course, LEGO could pump out five trains a year and make multiple different curve sizes. But that may mean they have to cut down on technic or Modulars or something else to divert resources to it. And that would not be worth it, as LEGO is not a train company.

[Tube Map Central]

11 minutes ago, Alexandrina said:

If it were to get to the point that Lego were seeing their business drop because of knock-offs with different business practices, surely Lego would adapt their business model.

You would think, but history is littered with debris from deceased toy companies. The problem is that companies that get into trouble are the ones who are least well qualified to extricate themselves from the trouble. 

21 minutes ago, Alexandrina said:

They're easily the market leader at the moment, and deservedly so - and don't forget that they also have Bricklink as a major hub for part resale,

Bricklink exists because it is such a pain getting parts from Lego, and there are alternatives in the clone world. BlueBrixx for example. I don't use them, or clone bricks, but they are there, gathering strength.

If a manufacturer was to offer a single-source parts service, upload a list and get a delivery of all the parts, good quality, cheap, Lego would take a huge huge hit. We are paying for good quality bricks plus design, but what if the design aspect became generic?

18 minutes ago, MAB said:

Everyone wants something more than what is already offered though. Not just trains. And for LEGO to satisfy the wants of one group means not satisfying another group. Of course, LEGO could pump out five trains a year and make multiple different curve sizes. But that may mean they have to cut down on technic or Modulars or something else to divert resources to it. And that would not be worth it, as LEGO is not a train company.

If there was genuinely no demand for trains, that would be fine, but the clone manufacturers are not releasing massive ranges of trains because they want to lose money. Once they up their game, and they will, with good designs, plentiful choice, and good quality parts, then TLG is in trouble.

[MAB]

2 hours ago, Tube Map Central said:

If a manufacturer was to offer a single-source parts service, upload a list and get a delivery of all the parts, good quality, cheap, Lego would take a huge huge hit. We are paying for good quality bricks plus design, but what if the design aspect became generic?

So now you just need to find a manufacturer that will do an individual pick a brick service of good quality parts cheaper than LEGO. Picking parts is very time consuming, and it is not worth automating a system for individual orders. LEGO already tried that and it wasn't economical. They partially offer it again through bricks and pieces, but they cannot offer it cheaply. 

2 hours ago, Tube Map Central said:

If there was genuinely no demand for trains, that would be fine, but the clone manufacturers are not releasing massive ranges of trains because they want to lose money. Once they up their game, and they will, with good designs, plentiful choice, and good quality parts, then TLG is in trouble.

There is a demand for just about everything though but it cannot all be supplied. If a small company nips away at the fringes, it is not going to destroy LEGO. Sure, a small clone manufacturer can make LEGO compatible trains and do well in a niche market. Whereas presumably it is not worth LEGO putting more effort than they already do into that market as that would take resource away from other more profitable areas. Even if a clone manufacturer completely dominated the area of brick build trains is LEGO in trouble? I doubt it, they would just lose that small part of the business. Although even then, some LEGO fans would probably still buy LEGO trains as they are LEGO first and trains second. There are many small companies that thrive because they make things LEGO do not, such as military parts and minifigures. It is very unlikely that they will take LEGO's core market though.

[The Brick Boss]

City should bring the Res Q subtheme from 1998 back

[icm]

Just now, Brandon Pea said:

City should bring the Res Q subtheme from 1998 back

That's called Coast Guard, they did it in 2017. I wouldn't mind seeing another Coast Guard wave next summer, the 2017 line was really good.

[Tube Map Central]

I'm not wanting anything at all, just observing what sorts of events might lead to the undoing of TLG.

When I say cheap for a brick service, I really just mean cheaper than Bricklink, which wouldn't be difficult. Lego might have failed to get it to work, but that is not the be-all and end-all of everything forever more. Times change and so does technology. When you buy a Lego set, you pay for design costs, a brick service would not carry this overhead. If any manufacturer can crack this cost-effectively, then TLG are in trouble, because the consumer takes control of design, and Lego are just another brick manufacturer.

With regard for trains, it's not about losing sales, it is about Lego losing its status amongst a significant chunk of fans - trains got 4th place on the recent anniversary vote. These people are not necessarily only building trains. Look at the posts on the trains theme, you will find builders openly discussing non-Lego track, non-Lego wheels, non-Lego couplings, non-Lego batteries, non-Lego rods, and even (thanks to the cost of withdrawn components) non-Lego windows. The fanatical loyalty is diminished in this context, and eroding. Again, if Lego becomes just another Brick manufacturer, then TLG is finished.

[The Brick Boss]

22 minutes ago, icm said:

That's called Coast Guard, they did it in 2017. I wouldn't mind seeing another Coast Guard wave next summer, the 2017 line was really good.

Coast Guard was always there. It never replaced anything. 

Res Q was a more intense subtheme based on resuce mission centered around natural disaster/post natural disaster situations. 

Edited March 3, 2021 by Brandon Pea

[MAB]

2 hours ago, Tube Map Central said:

With regard for trains, it's not about losing sales, it is about Lego losing its status amongst a significant chunk of fans - trains got 4th place on the recent anniversary vote. These people are not necessarily only building trains. Look at the posts on the trains theme, you will find builders openly discussing non-Lego track, non-Lego wheels, non-Lego couplings, non-Lego batteries, non-Lego rods, and even (thanks to the cost of withdrawn components) non-Lego windows. The fanatical loyalty is diminished in this context, and eroding. Again, if Lego becomes just another Brick manufacturer, then TLG is finished.

Right, but then technic / RC car people talk about metal axles, other people are into custom minifigs,  how to use decals, customising parts, etc. LEGO fans have been using custom items for years.

2 hours ago, Tube Map Central said:

When I say cheap for a brick service, I really just mean cheaper than Bricklink, which wouldn't be difficult. 

It sounds like you have a business plan. 

[Alexandrina]

3 hours ago, Tube Map Central said:

When I say cheap for a brick service, I really just mean cheaper than Bricklink, which wouldn't be difficult.

Aren't common parts going for 1p or 2p? It would be hard to get cheaper than that without making a loss - and more obscure parts are necessarily going to be more expensive to cover the production costs of a product with less demand. 

[Lira_Bricks]

I would not be surprised if a competitor of Lego overtook Lego. I already hear people who want to start with Lego as adults buy other brick brands as well.

Opinion 1: the studs with the logo on top should disappear in favour of hollow studs, like the technic bricks have. The fact that that logo takes in place is annoying.

Opinion 2: Studs on the side should be at the same height as the holes of the technic bricks.

So annoying when making a MOC were I need both system and technic lego, and it does not fit tightly just because I used one or the other somewhere in the build...

[Tube Map Central]

34 minutes ago, Alexandrina said:

Aren't common parts going for 1p or 2p? It would be hard to get cheaper than that without making a loss - and more obscure parts are necessarily going to be more expensive to cover the production costs of a product with less demand. 

I just did a quick search for 36 new light bley 1x2 bricks, and the cheapest I could get from a UK supplier was 11p per brick so, um, no. Tan is almost as expensive, reddish brown slightly cheaper, dark bley slightly more expensive.

Plus UK suppliers tend to be medium-sized, so orders have to be spread about, leading to extra postage costs, and the larger suppliers tend to be much more expensive.

Off the top of my head, if you were to part out a Lego set on Bricklink, you would be looking at around three times the price to buy the parts compared with buying the whole set retail.

 

34 minutes ago, Lira_Bricks said:

Opinion 1: the studs with the logo on top should disappear in favour of hollow studs, like the technic bricks have. The fact that that logo takes in place is annoying.

YES!!!!!

[Alexandrina]

8 minutes ago, Tube Map Central said:

I just did a quick search for 36 new light bley 1x2 bricks, and the cheapest I could get from a UK supplier was 11p per brick so, um, no. Tan is almost as expensive, reddish brown slightly cheaper, dark bley slightly more expensive.

Plus UK suppliers tend to be medium-sized, so orders have to be spread about, leading to extra postage costs, and the larger suppliers tend to be much more expensive.

Off the top of my head, if you were to part out a Lego set on Bricklink, you would be looking at around three times the price to buy the parts compared with buying the whole set retail.

I'd question the need to buy new, first off. In my experience, used bricks are often indistinguishable from new ones, unless they're suffering from an issue such as scratches, discolouration, etc, which sellers are pretty good at mentioning in the listing. This is also a far bigger issue for old and rare bricks; a lot of sellers discard poor-quality bricks unless they're rare enough to justify listing them anyway. If you're planning on using the bricks, they're not going to stay brand new anyway - so I don't see the need. Thirty-six seems like a very specific number, but there is a UK store carrying more than twice as many light bluish grey 1 x 2 bricks for 7p a brick. If you aren't too fussy about quantity - and pardon me for being presumptuous, but I figure that most AFOLs going to Bricklink for specific parts are going to have a decent collection anyway, with a good supply of 1 x 2 light bluish greys - there are multiple sellers at 3p or 4p, one at 2p. You can even find new condition bricks for 5p. I can't see how any company can get cheaper while matching/surpassing Lego's quality standards and also having to cover the costs of sourcing the plastic, manufacturing the bricks, storing all the different bricks they've manufactured, and also paying employees who will deal with the manufacturing and logistics and take care of picking the bricks for people's orders.

Obviously it's going to be more expensive to part out a set than to buy it. When Lego produce a set, they know the parts will be produced in enough quantity that economies of scale come into play and reduce the costs. The same won't happen for a supplier whose business model revolves around bespoke orders of bricks from a vast library of parts (for a new company to muscle in on Lego, they'd have to be offering every major part Lego do in every colour Lego produce as well as useful new parts, else why would people switch over in the first place?) It does beg the question, though: why would you part out a set in its entirety when the set itself is available for a lower price? It's one thing parting out a set that's no longer produced, or is expensive on the second-hand market, but parting out a currently-available set seems like more trouble than it's worth. And if you only want certain parts from the set, you're not buying all of them anyway, so whether or not it's more expensive to part out the whole set than buy it is moot.

[Tube Map Central]

In my experience with secondhand bricks, you can get anything. As new, faded, bite marks, heavily scratched, home of heavy smokers, unpleasant organic-looking material attached. I've had it all and it is too much a lottery. Sellers are too variable in their descriptions. I now buy new only, except for rare/no longer available parts.

Why 36 bricks? It is a figure I plucked out of the sky that reflects the fact that the cheapest parts come from suppliers with the lowest stock levels. Spread an order around multiple small suppliers and the effective cost per brick increases considerably. 

Why did I make the comparison with the retail price of a set? Because that is a good benchmark for the Bricklink premium. 

 

 

 

[MAB]

12 hours ago, Tube Map Central said:

Off the top of my head, if you were to part out a Lego set on Bricklink, you would be looking at around three times the price to buy the parts compared with buying the whole set retail.

 

It is typically about two times RRP, but that doesn't mean you will make twice RRP if you part a set out. If you are very early, it might be three times RRP but that is often because newly released minifigures go fro crazy amounts to start with and so have an high six month average price for the first few months, and it takes obviously at least six months for any new release bias to be removed from six month averages.

But you have to remember very few sets have 100% desirable parts. Many parts simply do not sell. Even if priced very cheaply, some parts have years worth of stock on BL (measured as qty available / six month sales).

Plus parting out sets and then picking parts for orders is slow work. It is not hard work, but it is time consuming.

[Flak Maniak]

Sure, if you want "exactly set X", you might pay a lot, because there are probably SOME rare parts in that set. But if you just want bulk parts, and you buy opportunistically... Then BrickLink is very cheap. Sure, you might think "Hmm, part X in color A might be nice" and then find that it's expensive. But if you have vague ideas like "I want to do castle-ish builds in colors ABC", and then just go on BL and look at some of the big sellers... You are going to spend a lot of money, but you are gonna get a LOT of parts for your dollar.

I disagree that a "just parts on-demand" service would be easy to run much more cheaply than current services. That's way more SKUs than selling sets. And Lego already does run two of these, and if I'm honest, they ARE quite cheap. (Well, not sure so much about the online pick-a-brick, as I tend to use Bricks & Pieces instead.) When I think about the logistical work required to run it, honestly it's surprising that B&P isn't more expensive than it is. With it and BrickLink I have incredible access to parts, new and old. If another manufacturer wants to snipe Lego on this, they would need an incredibly strong selection, in Lego-matching colors, at a very low price, AND at nigh-indistinguishable quality and plastic finish. If that happens, great; maybe I'll buy from that company. It's not like I'm purist enough to purge the '90s Tyco bricks I have lying around.

As for buying used parts on BrickLink, I usually don't bother to check new vs. used. Most sellers will denote if parts are significantly faulty. Yes, some used parts will be a bit nicked, but I don't particularly mind. If I'm doing some Aquazone build, beat-up old bricks from decades ago, that look like the bricks from my childhood? Those fit right in. I guess I'm just not that picky, because dinged-up bricks feel like the authentic Lego experience to me. I don't like significant discoloration, but nicks and scratches are whatever.

I guess for me, I tend to play the long game, and just buy a lot of parts when I see something interesting and cheap. Which you can say is either prudent bargain-hunting, or wasteful and extravagant, depending on whether you see how full my parts bins are! But I swear, I'll get around to using all those cool parts eventually!