Custom rods on shapeways

[zephyr1934]

I'm starting to explore the possibility of selling my custom rods on Shapeways. This would be in addition to rather than in place of my Bricklink store. My main reason to explore Shapeways is that it might save European buyers on shipping and duties.

Do any of the Europeans on this forum have any insight, e.g., would $50 of parts from Shapeways (fabricated in the Netherlands I believe) be a lot cheaper in terms of shipping, VAT, customs fees, and any other supplemental costs compared to the exact same value of parts shipped from the US?

The biggest thing I don't like about the Shapeways venue is that I cannot do quality control on the parts, so customers would have to be prepared to drill out the holes as needed. The other thing I don't like is their gray, it is expensive and dark (closer to dark blay than my material that is closer to light blay).

Anyways, consider this a pre-opening test run, I have three lots up, all exclusive to Shapeways at the moment (but I can fabricate any of them through my normal process too). Two are for Holger's locomotives, and an exploration into the post-steam era...

 

Thanks for any feedback on Shapeways in the EU. And for those interested in seeing my Shapeways store in its current configuration, you can find it here.

[JopieK]

They started in The Netherlands but also have facilities around the globe. I visited their Dutch office / production facility last year and got a tour. Their new materials are incredible!!! 

[Electricsteam]

Dang! That looks nice!   I know I've been gone a long while but it's nice to see some new stuff from you! 

[Toastie]

5 hours ago, zephyr1934 said:

Do any of the Europeans on this forum have any insight, e.g., would $50 of parts from Shapeways (fabricated in the Netherlands I believe) be a lot cheaper in terms of shipping, VAT, customs fees, and any other supplemental costs compared to the exact same value of parts shipped from the US?

I am pretty sure that this is the case as the location is within the EU (yeap - just checked - you don't know these days anymore, Netherxit not clearly visible on the horizon ) and thus there are no customs fees, VAT is 21% (standard rate, applies to this type of goods, I believe) and close enough to that of many other EU countries (Luxembourg lowest 17%, Croatia/Sweden hightest 25%); shipping should be a lot less.

Best
Thorsten

[zephyr1934]

Thanks all...

So the within EU VAT is essentially balanced by the customs duties for a similarly valued order that was shipped from outside the EU? Or is there a net tax+fee+duty benefit from purchasing such parts that are fabricated within the EU?

Even if the net fees are about the same, I already know that purchasing from Shapeways in the EU (rather than direct from me in the US) would save on postage and greatly expedite the delivery time for EU customers.

 

 

11 hours ago, Electricsteam said:

Dang! That looks nice!   I know I've been gone a long while but it's nice to see some new stuff from you! 

It's just a rod for a diesel, right? (grin) Seriously though, thank you. The motor sides are more expensive than I would like, but if in spite of that fact there proves to be sufficient demand I could see adding other variants.

[Sven J]

From my experience, I can say that basically there is a small benefit (even though Shapeways' pricing is quite hefty) for buyers in Germany when parts come from the EU, as 19% Import VAT have also to be paid for orders from the US.
But (and it is a big but) this is often more than compensated by the fact that you have to order more parts than needed to get a sufficient number of decently-looking ones: Color consistency for Shapeways' grey is abysmal. Especially longer parts like side rods are often almost black at one end and almost white at the opposite (a bit exaggerated, but you know what I mean).
A 3D printing service that I'm quite happy with is Sculpteo.com from France. They have a nice, consistent light grey, and they also offer a "polishing" service for smoother surfaces. However, I don't know whether it's possible to sell one's designs there.

[Giottist]

Hi zephyr1934

I have some experience with the european branch of Shapeways since I've ordered a heap of wheels there: The parts are printed at Rotterdam in the Netherlands. This is the sender address on the parcels.

The printing quality is so so, but far away from precision. The ordinary surface is rather rough and irregular. We can order better surface quality but this will up the price tag rapidly. Premium quality will double it. Shapeways is very expensive and the designer earns nothing. Ask Shupp, he's thinking about to change to another 3D printing service. Nevertheless, Shupp's wheels are phantastic designs as your rods, i.e. in combination

If I compare the surface and dimension quality of your rods and Shapeways products, your rods are far better.

Before Shapeways rised the prices for dyed parts above the stratosphere, I bought such parts, but it is not worth the money (anymore). Best will be to buy white undyed prints with a better surface finish and dye them by yourself. Best dye for red parts is RAL3020 "traffic red".

[Redimus]

My last order with you got stiffed to the tune of something like £20 in customs, and this is pretty much the normal for stuff from the US now, so I'd be very keen to order your stuff from a more local source (although with f*** knows what will happen after the s***storm that is Brexit finally finishes ruining literally everything, excuse my French).

How would custom orders be handled if we take the Shapeways route?

[zephyr1934]

This is all excellent feedback.

To be clear, this shapeways venture of mine is in addition to my existing bricklink shop, NOT in place of it. As long as a customer prefers the service I provide directly through bricklink that is unchanged, it doesn't matter if they are international.

The international customs probably isn't pleasant for anyone. For each package I have to spend 5 min filling out a form and then a minimum of another five min standing there in the post office watching the postal worker enter the data in. But I figure if an international customer has to suffer through the higher postage and potential customs fees, it is the least I can do to absorb the impositions that my government puts on the shipping.

I will probably just upload a couple more common configurations like the EN mod, and then just add other configurations to shapeways as people ask, which could include unusual rods and custom orders (asymmetrical, 1/2 stud offsets, etc).

The fact that you could get Shupp's wheels and my rods in one spot is a bonus of the shapeways option... but their only gray is dark gray and Tenderlok indicates that the consistency isn't great, often being closer to black. The fact that a customer can get red or black rods on demand is nice though, since I do not stock those colors (well... I'll be stocking the red rods for Holger's two sets of locomotive instructions here soon).

There is one mail clerk who keeps telling me that FedEx and UPS are aggressively lobbying congress to get the US Post office out of the business of international shipping. If that ever happens, the international shipping costs could go through the roof and then having a foot in the door at shapeways would be beneficial.

 

[LEGO Train 12 Volts]

I can imagine that the central wheel is still ... but does it create friction on the tracks?

I love your new solution!

[zephyr1934]

1 hour ago, LEGO Train 12 Volts said:

I can imagine that the central wheel is still ... but does it create friction on the tracks?

More than still, it is rigidly fabricated with the frame. The fake wheel is a few mm above the rail and the fake flange is further back from the rail. I did a brickbuilt version of this on a motorized PF truck almost ten years ago (gulp). The middle wheel is high enough not to get in the way. In talking with someone offline about that motor side I have an idea that might bring the price down... but more on that if it works.

[ScotNick]

As @Tenderlok mentioned sculpteo.com - I don't have any experience with said site, but have a suggestion:

I don't know how happy you would be with it, but would there be a way to make some files available so one could upload them and print them there? Not sure if you'd like that though!?

[zephyr1934]

@ScotNick I'll look into Sculpteo and see what I can make of it. So is that generally a better shop for Europeans?

 

[zephyr1934]

I've started exploring Sculpteo. Their storefronts are not nearly as well developed as shapeways and I don't think they lend themselves to being easily discovered. As such, I don't think it would be worth developing a comprehensive "market" there. But if there is someone who wants me to upload specific parts to fabricate on Sculpteo I'm up for exploring it. Just drop me a PM here in EB. Their gray seems a lot nicer than shapeways' gray. Of course any parts you might print from Sculpteo is like shapeways- I cannot do quality control on the parts, so customers would have to be prepared to drill out the holes as needed.

Meanwhile, I have made an advance over the motor truck sides in the first post of this thread, see new thread here. The old version is presently on shapeways (not the new version), but like Sculpteo, I can upload specific parts on demand.

 

[Sven J]

15 minutes ago, zephyr1934 said:

Their gray seems a lot nicer than shapeways' gray.

It is, definitely!

15 minutes ago, zephyr1934 said:

I cannot do quality control on the parts, so customers would have to be prepared to drill out the holes as needed.

From my experience, I can say that pin/axle holes need to be designed with 0.1-0.2 mm more in diameter (compared to Shapeways) to fit properly. For all other dimensions, Sculpteo is very accurate. To be honest, when you order a bulk of identical parts, there is in fact less variation with Sculpteo items (for example, I ordered a bunch of main rods for my Kitson-Meyer from both companies; the Sculpteo parts were all exactly the same length, while the Shapeways rods differed by almost 1 mm!).

Edited September 8, 2019 by Tenderlok

[BrickProject]

Great solution dude!

[ScotNick]

I myself don't have any experience with sculpeo.com but I did order Shupps wheels from shapeways some time ago. While the designs are great, the tolerances differ quite a bit: some axle holes are rather firm, while others slide off easily.
As @Tenderlok shared his experience I thought this might be worth to give a shot.

I have to admit that the price of the customs and postage has always held me off from buying your rods - even though I really would like to have them.
What program do you use to design them? Not sure how much you're willing to give away, but if we can adjust the length of the rods digitally on our own this could also save you some time.

[zephyr1934]

One of the things that I do with the rods that I sell directly is that I actually test every hole (well, except for the one long washers) to make sure they have clutch and free rotation. If they don't, I fix it. I also spot check to make sure the length is correct, but it has been so consistent that I no longer need to check. Regardless, if a problem slipped by, I would refund or replace. (Free replacement also applies to rods that fail in the line of duty as long as they were not abused.)

As we have all seen with great instructions that someone has distributed freely, some scammer then takes them and sells the model or the instructions claiming it was their own. So I do not plan to distribute the artwork. Likewise, I have put a lot of work into developing the designs and the above quality control.

At this point I probably have made every obvious regular arrangements of holes on the rods up to 21 studs long. But I don't charge anything extra to generate unique, uneven spacings as folks need them.

Indeed, putting together the parts for a specific order to post to an online print house would take a little time, but I THINK that would be offset by saving the time it would take me to finish and pack the rods.