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2 hours ago, rskamen said:

Perfect. Thank you for all your hard work, and the work yet to come. Has anyone done a parts comparison between Version 2 and @Berthil Version 3? Just wondering how many parts can be reused in version 3. Certainly a lot of the chains, treads for conveyor belts, gears, axles, etc. I built my Ball Factory in almost all RED. Not sure if it is worth changing all the colors, or mixing colors for those parts that I will need. I have learned that going forward with new projects, I will be building in the LBG and DBG.  https://www.bricksafe.com/pages/rskamen/

Look here for the comparison.

52.6% shared parts

 

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It is good that they offer that feature.

If you include both used and new and go with the traditional colours, that 47.4% costs about £200. Although that is across 13 sellers, so postage costs ahoy :P

Very doable though.

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2 hours ago, Ankoku said:

I suspect the difference in parts is huge. e.g. there are not many liftarms in the original version, where as the new one is mainly liftarms. There were lots of standard bricks in the original, but few in the new version.

The bonus is, the more obscure stuff is replicated. e.g. belts, buckets, curved bricks, that sort of thing.

If I make this version, I won't cannibalise the old one for it. Will probably just share the buckets between the two.

Without using parts from V2, I'd have to purchase almost 100% of the parts, except buckets and balls. Plus, I don't have room for both. I would just use everything possible from V2, keeping the RED theme as much as possible. I love the way my V2 looks, even if at times it can get rather cranky. I think in the long run, I'd rather go for reliability and portability.

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1 hour ago, Jonas said:

I checked the component list provided by Berthil and it seems to me that about a half of the components can be reused from the v2 ball factory.

The solution of the output (and loop-back) track with the hoses seems to be elegant - but rather expensive. I have never used hoses before and I have none at home.I wonder if there is any cheaper replacement.

The loop-back is very clean, uncomplicated, and appears to be totally reliable since it is not a mechanical element. I would like to try to incorporate the conveyor belt in my return system as I have in V2. It runs perfectly with no issues. I am sure it can be raised the required height, use the original input tray for the spiral lift, and keep the conveyor intact. Since timing is not an issue with the return conveyor, I am sure there is a gear and axle that can accessed to make it work. Even if it has to be repositioned slightly and a short run of hose is used to feed it. Are you listening @Berthil? No pressure :) Ball%20Factory%20-%20Red.jpg

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You could do your own solution for the feedback loop. e.g. with the new design, you aren't limited by height or the base plates, which are the two constraining elements of the original.

It makes much easier just to wedge on the belt like your version has.

That isn't possible on the original version with the corrections as there just isn't space. Which is my I am going to raise the whole thing and remove the base plates.

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Posted (edited)

Update posted on Rebrickable with full Part 1 of the building instructions for the Inbox, Spiral Lift and Ball Picker, 121 pages total.
I have to split in multiple BI parts as BI upload on Rebrickable is limited to 100Mb, I expect 3 to 4 BI parts.

Generated with latest version of Studio which looks much better and also managed to bend the ribbed hoses on my iMac with the new version.
Bending long 3mm hoses is nightmare, I don't think I will be able to include these the correct way in the instructions.
Adding axle and brick length indication is not possible in Studio. I've added a size guide on pages with axles but realize this is only useful when the instruction is printed or as reference against other axles in the size guide. Anyway, this build is for experts :)

Studio is getting slow though, it will take a lot of time, I have to wait after every click/change.

Edited by Berthil

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@Berthil Unbelievable work so far. When showing axles at 1 : 1 for size, that would be with the pdf file at 100%? With my old tired eyes, I use an very large monitor and usually view pdf's at 150% or 200%. So far, it looks like you have no need to change or update the parts lists. I am going through my existing Ver2 Ball Factory parts list, and have almost 2,000 reusable parts (many in RED). Once all the instructions are completed, will there be an addendum, or video for setting up the proper timing between modules, although I am pretty good at that by now. I guess we can cross that bridge when we get to it. I would not put too much time in bending hoses in Studio. If we can build the Ball Factory, we can figure out the hose placement and curvature. Keep up this great work.

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Posted (edited)
On 5/4/2019 at 3:02 AM, Berthil said:

Meanwhile I've created a draft of the first 65 pages of an estimated 450 of the building instruction, it's available on Rebrickable.
Please let me know if you see errors or have other tips so I can correct for the final version.

I simply could not resist and started to build according to your instructions. I must say that your new version is really compact and rigid. Thanks to the well designed combination of classic studded (and tough) beams with the studless ones used for bracketing, the construction is strong and robust as never before. The input bin is also very rigid, now.

I found only a few places where I would propose minor changes:

- in step 8, I added a 1x2 brick and a 2x2 plate under the right end of the 2x8 technic plate (otherwise this end of the plate would levitate in the air),

- in step 37, the blue 3L pin should be removed and placed later in step 39

- in the inventory, you have 3 ribbon hoses (those used in the spiral lift), I think there should be 4.

I have also spent much time to study your technically perfect HD pictures that depict the remaining parts of the factory and I must say that you have done a really great job. The transformation of version 2 into version 3 needed a lot of creative thinking.

One detail I am thinking of is, whether it would be possible to replace the two long vertical black beams (on the rear side of the factory) that control the movement of the ball picker mechanism by something more subtle, ideally by long axles with connectors, or by a link of this type It would make the whole design more consistently looking, as all the major push-pull rods would be made in the same style.

Edit: I was writing my comments before you published the new version of instructions.

Edited by Jonas

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Posted (edited)

@Jonas thanks for your feedback and compliments! I just uploaded v1.1 of part 1 but will look into your remarks and update accordingly to v1.2. Inventory has been corrected, thanks.
As for the push-pull rods, these are actually almost everywhere liftarms in the design as per Akiyuki original and am hesitant to replace with axles because these can separate when a ball gets stuck and these liftarm push-pull rods will stay in one piece. But I will look into it. Anyway, you are free to make your changes to your version of course.

6 minutes ago, rskamen said:

@Berthil Unbelievable work so far. When showing axles at 1 : 1 for size, that would be with the pdf file at 100%? With my old tired eyes, I use an very large monitor and usually view pdf's at 150% or 200%. So far, it looks like you have no need to change or update the parts lists. I am going through my existing Ver2 Ball Factory parts list, and have almost 2,000 reusable parts (many in RED). Once all the instructions are completed, will there be an addendum, or video for setting up the proper timing between modules, although I am pretty good at that by now. I guess we can cross that bridge when we get to it. I would not put too much time in bending hoses in Studio. If we can build the Ball Factory, we can figure out the hose placement and curvature. Keep up this great work.

Thanks! That's why I made the remark on the 1:1 Size Guide, only works when printed, not on the screen. I don't have solution for it until Studio adds this to the BI generator. I could add them as separate text but this is a nigthmare. Hence my remark this build is for experienced builders. Timing in the instruction is actually set and if build as in the instruction should be 95% correct and would only need minor corrections. I intend to put text in the instructions what every part does and how to correct but now realize I forgot this in the first part of instructions. I will add this and update to v1.2 together with the suggestions of Jonas.

Edited by Berthil

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Yes, I am aware of the weak point of the axle-built push rods (although Akiyuki uses them frequently, for horizontal rods). I will investigate the idea of using the above mentioned links and I will report my experience.

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Posted (edited)
34 minutes ago, Jonas said:

- in step 8, I added a 1x2 brick and a 2x2 plate under the right end of the 2x8 technic plate (otherwise this end of the plate would levitate in the air),

I checked, the 2x8 technic plate is not really levitating as it is attached to plate above and the 18975 Brick Special 2 x 4 x 1 1/3 with Holes and 2 x 2 Cutout.
But I understand your remark. Best would be some bricks under it and a 2 x 10 plate at the bottom but this looks less good on the sides :)

34 minutes ago, Jonas said:

in step 37, the blue 3L pin should be removed and placed later in step 39

Correct, I will update, thanks. Edit, I see I have corrected this already in v1.1 of part 1 :)
generally I have split into more building steps now.

Edited by Berthil

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Yeah, I had a relatively simple GBC in Stud.io which has 154 Unique items and 3278 parts. It lags when you try and add a piece and I have had it completely lock up on occasions.

It is a more powerful machine that most people have, so I feel as though Stud.io has some serious programming issues they need to overcome. There is no excuse for models this simple.

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@Berthil and @Jonas , you guys are incredible. I too noticed the 3 ribbed hoses, vs the 4 that is needed. In Ver2, a few of the longer push-pull axles with connectors tend to pull apart if there is the slightest friction anywhere in the factory. But I do like the idea of using beams or liftarms as they do not flex as some axles might do. Keep up the good work and dialogue, this is getting rather intense and very interesting. I am going to start acquiring needed parts. Although I must admit, I am a bit reluctant to dismantle my Ver2 Factory just yet.

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Posted (edited)

I hope, that Berthil will not mind if I add a brief comment to the history of the ball factory. (Also, let us fill somehow the waiting time before Berthil completes his highly anticipated instructions.:classic: ) This thread is about version 3, and in the first post, there are links to videos of version 1 and 2. What was before that? Was there any version 0 or even -1?

In one of his rare interviews, Akiyuki said that his ball factory designed and published in 2011 had been inspired by previous work of superbird28. I did some research on internet and found videos on Youtube that show the pioneering work of this author (see his channel.) His videos are from 2007-2009, i.e . from times when Youtube had its strict limits, videomaking was not that easy as today and Lego technic component inventory was much smaller than we have recently. Yet, even today, these ancient videos are fascinating and inspiring. You can find many clever techniques and concepts that were later used (and improved) by Akiyuki. If you want to see at least one of superbird28's creations, watch this.

It would be nice if someone tries to recreate one of his old models to build a memorial of his pioneering work.

Edited by Jonas

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@Jonas, that's very interesting, I will add it to the first post, thanks. Everybody gets inspiration somewhere including Akiyuki.

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Posted (edited)

I posted the superbird28 vids in the Akiyuki thread. He mentions it in the Blog for the factory.

Akiyuki has version 1 and 2. The differences between the two are quite large. Would I say that superbird28's are 0 and -1? Not really. They are very different beasts, especially since they don't use balls.

I find the most interesting bit with superbird28's designs, is that he basically has a main driver area which controls the timings of everything. Having all that in a single area hasn't really been replicated since.

A lot of the factory is there in version 1, but he uses different mechanisms for achieving some of the movements and counter balances stuff more.

The original version with more liftarms!
 

 

Edited by Ankoku

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Posted (edited)

2nd part of the instructions is up with Bob, Wheel rotator and boring supporting base :)
https://rebrickable.com/mocs/MOC-24605/Berthil/akiyuki-ball-factory-new-style-v3/#bi

Edit, just uploaded 2 new versions of both.
Part 1 now also has a Component Chart naming all components as they are referenced in text when timing needs to be set.
File name on Rebrickable has version number in it so you can always see if you have the latest.

Edited by Berthil

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Thanks Berthil!

Great work. How was your visit at the Lego House? 

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Posted (edited)
3 hours ago, t0mster said:

Great work. How was your visit at the Lego House? 

Thanks. LEGO House was nice to visit, lots to see, especially the Green Zone with many inspiring details.
But it was good I was in the neighbourhood and did not drive 1400km just for the LEGO House. The content for adults is too limited to justify such a long drive.
If you have kids that enjoy LEGO you can't go wrong with the LEGO House, many play opportunities. My kids are far too old :)
Here are my pictures for those interested (very good quality and high resolution, very pleased with them). Sorry for the off-topic to others.

Edited by Berthil

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@Berthil The original parts lists had 4,268 parts. Looking at Rebrickable, it is now showing 4,269 parts. Was there a new part added, or was the count on one of the existing parts increased? I am just trying to avoid reprinting 34 pages of parts that I use as a check-off list when salvaging or ordering parts. Amazing work on Part 1, Ver 1.3, and on part 2. As soon as I get back from New York at the end of May, I will begin gathering and ordering parts. You have totally reinvigorated my interest in the Ball Factory. I will also be building your Rotary Dumper for the Train Layout. I just ordered the last of the pieces that I needed. They should be at my house long before I return from my trip.

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Posted (edited)

Nice!. I just enjoyed building the part 2

i only see a problem with number 232. I cant seem to rotate the "bucket emptieer steering rod"
When its in "down" position, the 2 1x5 half beams get stuck

33980962438_d1de1eea16_c.jpg

I can see in your other CAD version, this rod is different

47806020762_f20d0e4363_c.jpg

Edited by t0mster
added previous version

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Posted (edited)
4 hours ago, rskamen said:

The original parts lists had 4,268 parts. Looking at Rebrickable, it is now showing 4,269 parts.

A missing 12L ribbed hose was added, should have been 4 total, was 3.

1 hour ago, t0mster said:

Nice!. I just enjoyed building the part 2

That's fast! :)
What do you think far? I tried to make the machine more accessible to a broader audience by trying to make clear instructions with steps as logical as possible when building by using more steps and callouts. It will never be an easy machine to build but do you think my efforts are worth while or still very complicated with a need to look 10 steps ahead? I know I tend to cramp a lot of parts in a building step but wen putting the parts aside before building and looking carefully where they need to go should help. 

1 hour ago, t0mster said:

i only see a problem with number 232. I cant seem to rotate the "bucket emptieer steering rod"
When its in "down" position, the 2 1x5 half beams get stuck

You are right, just had a look on my build and the two 5L thin liftarms should be on the other side (and the 2L thin liftarms above it too) making the rod no wider than 2L.
Part 2 has been updated, thanks for noticing and reporting.


 

Edited by Berthil

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1 hour ago, Berthil said:

A missing 12L ribbed hose was added, should have been 4 total, was 3

I should have realized that since I did originally notice that you were missing a ribbed hose. Keep those revisions coming. I keep updating as you post them. Thanks

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Fantastic Work. Just a quick question is there a tan gear missing in step 184. Really appreciate your effort and providing us with free instructions. Many Thank. 

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1 minute ago, Ariftakey said:

Fantastic Work. Just a quick question is there a tan gear missing in step 184. Really appreciate your effort and providing us with free instructions. Many Thank. 

Thanks. You are right, there is one missing on the left side. I will add it to the instructions and parts list. Thanks for noticing.

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