Power Function Rechargeable Battery 8878

[mojot83]

Looks like LEGO have retired the LEGO® Power Functions Rechargeable Battery Box 8878 according to the product pages. Does anyone know if they are replacing this with anything new or whether we just have to use the AAA standard battery box going forward?

Edited February 27, 2019 by mojot83

[Toastie]

Well I don't.

All I know for sure though that this is one of finest pieces of equipment TLG has ever released. As simple as that. The dial, the charging behavior. Perfect.

I have no clue why they discontinue that box - maybe someone has swallowed it. Or found a way to blow out the LiPo. I have no clue. I have several of them and they rock.

All the best,
Thorsten

 

[knotian]

Now this is really a horrible decision. The store shows 'out of stock'. Where did the 'retired' listing come from.

CAN WE HEAR FROM AN OFFICIAL SOURCE LIKE AN AMBASSADOR?

 

[mojot83]

Well according to Lego Customer Services when I quizzed them with the question.

Quote

As of yet we have nothing that I am aware of in the works, but my guess would be we are moving more onto the powered up (Power functions v.2) so who knows what we may be doing for these products?
Keep an eye out on the website and who knows what you may see eventually.
I do apologise that I did not have a definitive answer for you but like mentioned it is most likely due to the introduction of the Powered Up series.

 

[Creativebrick Studio 117]

I was able to pick up one of these from Toys R Us last year before they closed and find it perfect for the train runs.  Not sure how I feel about the new train technology I have not tried out the new sets yet. 

 

Very sad to hear they discontinued these 

[62Bricks]

psst...

LEGO education

[mocbuild101]

Lego could possibly make a rechargeable battery that replaces the battery holder (and possibly the entire bottom) of the PU controller, just like what was done for the NXT and EV3 batteries.

Also, we still don't know the details of the new Control+ coming in 42099 and 42100 - for all we know, it could have a built-in rechargeable battery, just like BuWizz.

[coinoperator]

On 3/6/2019 at 5:07 PM, mojot83 said:

As of yet we have nothing that I am aware of in the works, but my guess would be we are moving more onto the powered up (Power functions v.2) so who knows what we may be doing for these products?
Keep an eye out on the website and who knows what you may see eventually.
I do apologise that I did not have a definitive answer for you but like mentioned it is most likely due to the introduction of the Powered Up series.

Are you sure that this guy is an Lego employee?

"we don't know"
"my guess"
"so who knows"
"who knows what you may see"
 

Edited March 10, 2019 by coinoperator

[mojot83]

Looks like Lego are moving to the PoweredUp way of doing control after doing a bit of research into the new technic sets mentioned below and the new videos from the recent toy fair where Lego announced the tie up with liebherr.

3 hours ago, mocbuild101 said:

Lego could possibly make a rechargeable battery that replaces the battery holder (and possibly the entire bottom) of the PU controller, just like what was done for the NXT and EV3 batteries.

Also, we still don't know the details of the new Control+ coming in 42099 and 42100 - for all we know, it could have a built-in rechargeable battery, just like BuWizz.

It was an official Lego customer service guy I spoke to ... Not sure how much they new about their new products though.

21 minutes ago, coinoperator said:

Are you sure that this guy is an Lego employee?

"we don't know"
"my guess"
"so who knows"
"who knows what you may see"
 

 

[Stash2Sixx]

On 3/9/2019 at 9:34 PM, 62Bricks said:

psst...

LEGO education

Excellent point!

But now they are sold out.

[grum64]

Sorry for bumping an old topic but I’d like to know is anyone knows of a good quality 3rd party charger for the 8878? The official one at a penny under £25 +£3.99 p&p is ridiculously expensive.

Edited June 30, 2019 by grum64

[Toastie]

3 hours ago, grum64 said:

Sorry for bumping an old topic but I’d like to know is anyone knows of a good quality 3rd party charger for the 8878? The official one at a penny under £25 +£3.99 p&p is ridiculously expensive

And it always has been ridiculously expensive ...

Back in the days ... the LEGO LiPo box

You can use any DC power supply (wall wart or the like) putting out a voltage between 9 V and 18 V. So any dirt cheap lets say 12 V DC wall wart will do.

Best
Thorsten  

 

[grum64]

11 hours ago, Toastie said:

And it always has been ridiculously expensive ...

Back in the days ... the LEGO LiPo box

You can use any DC power supply (wall wart or the like) putting out a voltage between 9 V and 18 V. So any dirt cheap lets say 12 V DC wall wart will do.

Best
Thorsten  

 

That's great. Thank you.

[suffocation]

Apologies for going full necro on this thread.

One of my 8878 batteries has just gone belly up. If I plug in the charger, the light next to the charger port flashes away like a demented Christmas tree for hours on end but once I unplug it the battery won't switch on.

So, big question - is there any way to replace the LiPo battery inside? Note that my electrotechnical proficiency on a scale of 1 to 10 is a fat zilch.

[Toastie]

26 minutes ago, suffocation said:

Apologies for going full necro on this thread.

This thread should never go necro as 8878 should live forever.

Yes, yes and yes. However, maybe there are other options before replacement of the cells.

First, what happened and how? There is 8878 and you did what?
(I don't want to sound smart - had a good number of occasions though where I was treating 8878 so badly - and it always recovered)

This may take a couple of iterations ...

Best
Thorsten

[dr_spock]

31 minutes ago, suffocation said:

Apologies for going full necro on this thread.

One of my 8878 batteries has just gone belly up. If I plug in the charger, the light next to the charger port flashes away like a demented Christmas tree for hours on end but once I unplug it the battery won't switch on.

So, big question - is there any way to replace the LiPo battery inside? Note that my electrotechnical proficiency on a scale of 1 to 10 is a fat zilch.

You would need to be able to solder in order to remove the old LiPO pack and install a new one.  Also care not to short the + / - leads when handling. 

Philo has some pics of its innards:  http://www.brickshelf.com/cgi-bin/gallery.cgi?f=399263

 

[Toastie]

3 minutes ago, dr_spock said:

remove the old LiPO pack and install a new one

Exactly.

But: When I have problems with Windows, the #1 advice is: "Kill it, make a fresh installation". You know what that means. I always try to "cure" Windows - and so far (began with Win3.0) it worked quite well: First run a few gadgets, try, then go tough.

The electronics in that thing a quite capable. Before ripping out the heart, it may be worth to try some sort of defibrillation?

Best
Thorsten

[suffocation]

48 minutes ago, dr_spock said:

You would need to be able to solder in order to remove the old LiPO pack and install a new one.  Also care not to short the + / - leads when handling. 

Philo has some pics of its innards:  http://www.brickshelf.com/cgi-bin/gallery.cgi?f=399263

Thanks! I can probably find someone able to handle the task - if I try it my clumsy self, northern Italy's likely to get wiped off the map

51 minutes ago, Toastie said:

This thread should never go necro as 8878 should live forever. 

Couldn't agree more! At least three of my models would be lost without it.

51 minutes ago, Toastie said:

First, what happened and how? There is 8878 and you did what?

It sat there untouched for three months (bloody lockdown and bloody remote working). I tried using it today but it was drained, so I charged it for a few hours but to no avail.

I do have another one which I also recharged and now works fine, so I'd rule out any problems with the charger.

As I mentioned before, the light next to the charger port does flash when the charger's plugged in, so I assume the circuitry "thinks" it's recharging the battery. Also, the power light does come on if I press the button with the charger plugged in, however the second I remove the charger the whole battery goes dead.

[Toastie]

9 hours ago, suffocation said:

As I mentioned before, the light next to the charger port does flash when the charger's plugged in, so I assume the circuitry "thinks" it's recharging the battery. Also, the power light does come on if I press the button with the charger plugged in, however the second I remove the charger the whole battery goes dead.

3 months is a long time - not for a charged LiPo itself at all, but the electronics inside 8878 drains the LiPo pack as it has to monitor the on/off button all the time. It thus appears as if the LiPo is - as you said - is entirely drained. And may be even close to the threshold that the output voltage should not fall below. 

Regarding the blinking LED: You said it flashes in some sort of weird way; is the blinking "faster" than the LED blinks on the 8878 that you could charge successfully?

Secondly: What charger do you use? The LEGO one, or any other type?    

[suffocation]

28 minutes ago, Toastie said:

You said it flashes in some sort of weird way; is the blinking "faster" than the LED blinks on the 8878 that you could charge successfully?

Actually, the flashing is the same in both battery boxes. The difference is that the dead battery box carries on flashing indefinitely - I left it plugged in overnight and it was still flashing this morning - whereas the working one stops flashing after a couple of hours, as expected.

29 minutes ago, Toastie said:

What charger do you use? The LEGO one, or any other type?    

It's the original Lego charger (could've bought five bottles of Nero d'Avola with that money ).

[Toastie]

2 hours ago, suffocation said:

It's the original Lego charger (could've bought five bottles of Nero d'Avola with that money ).

Or two crates of really good beer, each 20 x 0.5L (I am more into beer )

Is there any chance that you or someone around has a different charger at hand? Any plain vanilla 12V DC wall wart would do; however, the amperage should be 1A or above. It could be that the circuity wants to draw more current as it can with the LEGO charger because of the low residual charge in the LiPo. Don't be afraid of exceeding the 10V - that's just a very good marketing thing from TLG to sell their totally, greedily, ridiculously expensive 10V piece. I bet they just designed that for having people thinking: "Oh may: No other device on this planet runs on 10V DC, I must buy that one from TLG or I'll fry the (very) expensive 8878." That is one of the things I'll never forgive them.

If not, then plugging in for 30 min then removing the charger for a couple of minutes and then do all over for a couple of times may help. Yes did that on one of mine and it helped.

Another question: You said that when the charger is plugged into 8878, it turns on. Does it also deliver power to its PF output socket, i.e., does it operate a motor or so?

When all that is not working, it is time to open 8878 up: Remove the plastic covers hiding the screws of the bottom with a matching sharp drill (no harm is done), remove the screws and lift the top from the bottom. You look at some electronics and the two LiPo cells.

 

[JaBaCaDaBra]

Just now, Toastie said:

more into beer

Aha
Thats why I liked you the first time I saw you.
 
Die beste Wein ist noch immer kein Bier.

I use Ali loaders but I never leave them alone, never trust Chinese cheap electronics.

[MAB]

It is possible to recover over-discharged batteries by first charging them with a low current if they have not been left too long, see here:

PS. do it outside! I've never done it on LEGO ones, as I've never bought them (way overpriced). 

 

[Toastie]

2 hours ago, MAB said:

PS. do it outside! I've never done it on LEGO ones

With such a charger it may certainly work. However, you would have to unsolder the LiPo pack of the 8878 and you need to correctly identify the wiring!!! There are more than just the two output wires, see Philo's BrickShelf folder: http://www.brickshelf.com/cgi-bin/gallery.cgi?i=4082303 as the pack must be balanced.

I'd rather use this approach as a last resort. However, when you intend to open up your faulty 8878, you can measure the remaining voltage of the pack. What would that reading be (provided you have a volt meter)?

 

[MAB]

Yes, I've only ever done it on single cells. So with requiring disassembly, this probably is a last resort before giving up.