Heroica: Glory Amongst The Stars RPG - Game Development

[Waterbrick Down]

On 10/15/2019 at 11:53 PM, samurai-turtle said:

Some points on these traits. 

On Hardy it says "Star system" shouldn't it be "ecosystem"? If you think about Earth their is some harsh places and some nice places. 

On Logical it states "does not experience emotions" I was thinking it should say " does not normally experience emotions". But it might just me watching to many sci-fi TV shows / movies. 

For Polymeliac I had an idea for a humanoid character that "rides" around in a Exosuit. Would they qualify for this ability? 

For Telepathic, if a robotic creature used a "radio" is used to communicate with each other. But "regularly" with everyone else would it still be Telepathic? 

This is more in general should the term "race" be used? I think something more broad be used like species or creatures. Io

All good points, these are just examples and aren't the final versions of what I had in mind. If we ever get there, I'd think we'd have a thread going over the different species. There'd be set standard species; Human, Orc, Elf, Dwarf, Halfling, but there's also be the rules to create a new race along with approval by the community for balance and place in the canon.

On 10/16/2019 at 6:06 AM, Faladrin said:

About the item names; I would suggest to stay close to general terms; in order to be usable in any style of game, being medieval or Sci Fi.

For example :

Bandage : a good way to heal a character

Energetic drink : a way to boost a character speed

Ammo : a way to get more ammunitions in a range weapon

I should be clear, I'm intending rules for a sci-fantasy setting. If someone would like to develop a generic rule-set, I'll leave it to them. The down side to generic is it is difficult to keep people motivated as most folks tend to be focused on a specific idea of a game instead of a general system.

21 hours ago, Faladrin said:

When trying to create a character, I found some questions :

- How health is represented? Is it Vitality? You've mentioned both of the terms but in the exemple character you built, it is still Vitality, then it should be mentioned like Xpoints/Xpoints like 7/7 to ease the count the damages your character endures, and this leads me to ask the 2nd question :

- How Vitality and Strength are linked? Is it an automatic count, or can we allow points to Vitality alone? If I have 3 in Strength do I have +1 in Vitality or is it already a +2 ? It seems unclear to me.

- How do you think to include the Race traits? Are the points we can allow to those traits are points we cannot allocate to some Proficiency ? So each race trait is counted like a Proficiency ? It would be logical, but it is not precised yet.

Health and Vitality are the same thing.

Vitality due to Strength is automatically factored into the total Vitality and is always rounded down. So if your character has a Strength of 3, they get +1 Vitality. If they have have a strength of 4, they get a +2 to Vitality.

Points for race creation are independent of character creation points. Most characters would choose a preset race (see post above) whose traits are already set. If they wanted to do a custom race, that race would get approved by the community in a separate Thread.

20 hours ago, Goliath said:

That could definitely work to avoid powerful early game players.

There could be three tiers of boost items.  Tier 1 items could be equipped to a player no matter their proficiency.  Tier 2 items can only be equipped if the player has a proficiency of 5 or higher.  Tier 3 items can only be equipped if the player has a proficiency of 10.  This is assuming 10 is the max proficiency.

Speaking of which, how are additional proficiency points earned?  Leveling up?  Rewarded for completing a quest?

Points are awarded at the end of a quest and can be spent increasing Proficiencies or Attribute scores.

Regarding starting kits that each player can choose upon character creation.

Marine Kit
1 Kinetic or Energy Weapon
1 Kinetic or Energy Armor piece
1 Energy Cell or Shield Battery

Spy Kit
2 Kinetic or Energy Weapons
1 Cloaking Generator
1 Hacking Chip

Researcher Kit
1 Energy or Elemental Weapon
1 Energy Cell
1 Spirit Infusion

Medic Kit
1 Kinetic or Elemental Weapon
1 Nanite Philter
1 Plasma Booster

Diplomat Kit
1 Energy Weapon
1 Translator Cube
25 Gold

Consumables
Energy Cell - Doubles Weapon Modifier for next attack
Plasma Booster - Heals character 1d6 health
Nanite Philter - Removes 1 status effect from character
Shield Battery  - Doubles Armor Modifier for next attack
Hacking Chip - Grants 1 successful Technology or Pilot Proficiency Check
Cloaking Generator - Grants 1 successful Stealth or Pickpocket Proficiency Check
Translator Cube - Grants 1 successful Diplomacy Proficiency or Culture Check
Spirit Infusion - Provides 1 extra spell use.
 

[Yzalirk]

@Waterbrick Down Those kits seem nice, I am especially liking the Researcher Kit.  Magic should not be neglected.  Magic seems like it would be very fun to play around with in this setting.  It reminds me of Destiny.

This might be a bit early to ask about but are classes going to work like Heroica 1.0 or differently?  And what about Advanced Classes?

I personally would like to see an Alchemist-type class and a Mechromancer.  I could help with ideas.

[Waterbrick Down]

3 minutes ago, Goliath said:

@Waterbrick Down Those kits seem nice, I am especially liking the Researcher Kit.  Magic should not be neglected.  Magic seems like it would be very fun to play around with in this setting.  It reminds me of Destiny.

This might be a bit early to ask about but are classes going to work like Heroica 1.0 or differently?  And what about Advanced Classes?

I personally would like to see an Alchemist-type class and a Mechromancer.  I could help with ideas.

Not 100% set on how to implement classes yet. The starter quest won't have any classes to begin with to focus more on the mechanics. The idea would be for classes to bolt on to the existing system. They probably won't be as prominent as they were in Heroica 1.0 as a charcter's uniqueness will be more driven by their stats (Attributes/Proficiencies), race, and spell selection. My current train of thought would be for classes to allow characters to perform certain task better (affecting the probabilities of combat actions/skill-checks, etc.), and add one extra combat action unique to their class.

So for an Alchemist:
Trait - Better probabilities when using consumables
Trait - Better costs for consumables
Combat Action - Status Effect causing action or explosion type of attack

For Mechromancers:
Trait - Better probabilities on summoning spells
Trait - Better probabilities on Technology Proficiency Checks
Combat Action - Create enemy thrall or heal enemy thrall

 

[Krol Zmija Sebastian]

Here are some ideas I work with with my own Role-Plays.

A Count vses a Rebel that then becomes a Duke after the Count gets to know of the person and let's them become a Baron (by taking over a Guild or fighting the Count or marrying a Dame).

Dragons have invaded a nation, led by floating pirate ships controlled by magic/sorceresses in hot air balloons. The nation is very knightly and have been slaying dragons, monsters and mage guilds- but they refuse to become wolf riders like the wolf rider tribes also a part of the nation. Those tribes keep the people(the kingdoms) justified, but the mage guilds bend the rules and have begun to insurrect. Eventually a skeletal pirate crew that was left behind for dead, took over crashed ships from a former invasion and catch up to the current invasion. Whether by means of sorceresses/a rival ground army.

With the outcome of the nation in desperate times (because nearly a thousand dragons invade, from ravaging the world- which have made them rather intelligent at last and are fighting amongst themselves which has created them invading nations themselves first and the pirate ships trailing them) dragon riding is the main solution, the other is holding the grounds for marshal reasons.

The other Role-Plays I'm doing are having my spirit animal herald Viper do individual Role-Play modules from Dungeons & Dragons/Pathfinder to work out the details to acquiring a kingdom of my own with just a scythe, hooded cloak, a mercenary steel plate & steel gauntlets.

And the other one is in the Rifts Universe and just finished a Boot Camp module. There're a lot of serie modules/books for that RPG universe but is way out into a future of post-apocalyptic/apocalyptic-post Role-Plays. I really wouldn't know how to begin talking about it.  

But there is one more Role-Play I'm working on on a Fandom Wiki site. It's about joining a Guard Station in a medieval setting, learn some haleberd/bowmanship and fight off these evil warriors of chaos- that end up joining the Magic Guild within the same town where the guards are stationed with their Colonel. The battle gets tumultuous, so I end up joining a legion of black knights and have them take down the Guild.

https://rsroleplay.fandom.com/wiki/Knight_of_the_Kinshra_"Killer_Viper"_Sebastian

[KotZ]

3 hours ago, Waterbrick Down said:

Not 100% set on how to implement classes yet. The starter quest won't have any classes to begin with to focus more on the mechanics. The idea would be for classes to bolt on to the existing system. They probably won't be as prominent as they were in Heroica 1.0 as a charcter's uniqueness will be more driven by their stats (Attributes/Proficiencies), race, and spell selection. My current train of thought would be for classes to allow characters to perform certain task better (affecting the probabilities of combat actions/skill-checks, etc.), and add one extra combat action unique to their class.

So for an Alchemist:
Trait - Better probabilities when using consumables
Trait - Better costs for consumables
Combat Action - Status Effect causing action or explosion type of attack

For Mechromancers:
Trait - Better probabilities on summoning spells
Trait - Better probabilities on Technology Proficiency Checks
Combat Action - Create enemy thrall or heal enemy thrall

 

Thoughts on changing classes? I think changing classes can be good, but should be restricted to certain levels or pay a fee otherwise people will trade out between quests.

Also, I love that mechromancer class right there.

[Waterbrick Down]

15 minutes ago, KotZ said:

Thoughts on changing classes? I think changing classes can be good, but should be restricted to certain levels or pay a fee otherwise people will trade out between quests.

Also, I love that mechromancer class right there.

I don't think trading out classes will be such a bad thing in this system as most of a character's main effectiveness is tied to their stats (Attributes/Proficiency). Having the "wizard" class will only make you slightly better/more reliable at Arcane skills, but if you've spec'd your character out to have high spirit and a high casting proficiency (Arcana/Nature/Occult/Religion), you can still take the "rogue" class and cast spells almost as well.

The real question is whether players should be able to respec their Attributes/Proficiency points. I don't think it should be unlimited, but maybe some sort of cost (either in level-up points or currency) could be associated with it.

[KotZ]

6 minutes ago, Waterbrick Down said:

The real question is whether players should be able to respec their Attributes/Proficiency points. I don't think it should be unlimited, but maybe some sort of cost (either in level-up points or currency) could be associated with it.

Absolutely yes to respec and cost. Level up points seems like an interesting option for that. Maybe the respec cost scales? Surely players will amass fortunes in the game, and an easy respec would seem unfair.

[Waterbrick Down]

1 hour ago, KotZ said:

Absolutely yes to respec and cost. Level up points seems like an interesting option for that. Maybe the respec cost scales? Surely players will amass fortunes in the game, and an easy respec would seem unfair.

It's worth potentially arguing what might be unfair about it... If someone gets 4 quests in and decides they really don't enjoy the way their character is, why should they have to invest more time to create something they do enjoy? Yes, if you're constantly swapping your character's attributes/proficiencies, I can see it getting a little difficult to explain from a RP perspective, but if someone wants to decommission their current character, I could see letting them restart with another character of equal point value.

[KotZ]

12 minutes ago, Waterbrick Down said:

It's worth potentially arguing what might be unfair about it... If someone gets 4 quests in and decides they really don't enjoy the way their character is, why should they have to invest more time to create something they do enjoy? Yes, if you're constantly swapping your character's attributes/proficiencies, I can see it getting a little difficult to explain from a RP perspective, but if someone wants to decommission their current character, I could see letting them restart with another character of equal point value.

I mean say it costs 100 coins to respec at level 5, but it costs 500 at level 10, or maybe 1/x of your total gold, if they still wanted to play the same character. Decomissioning makes sense to me.

[Yzalirk]

Perhaps players can get Respec and Class Tokens by achieving Level 10 for free otherwise they would have to buy them for very expensive at the Market.  Unless you want to make it so players have to complete quests to get them too.  So for every 5 quests completed, you get a Respec Token and a Class Token.

That being said, what would make the classes really all that different from each other?  Proficiency boosts?  I think Ultimate abilities would be a fun idea but am at a loss for their implications.

And what about Racial bonuses or abilities?  I want to create a Mechanical race based off of Dragonborn using those Exo Force robots.  My idea is that they have a Breath Weapon ability.  The element of choice is up to the player if they choose to play this race or another race with a Breath Weapon.  But as an example, my element of choice could be Acid which deals -1 to the target’s armor each round.

[KotZ]

8 hours ago, Goliath said:

That being said, what would make the classes really all that different from each other?  Proficiency boosts?  I think Ultimate abilities would be a fun idea but am at a loss for their implications.

And what about Racial bonuses or abilities?  I want to create a Mechanical race based off of Dragonborn using those Exo Force robots.  My idea is that they have a Breath Weapon ability.  The element of choice is up to the player if they choose to play this race or another race with a Breath Weapon.  But as an example, my element of choice could be Acid which deals -1 to the target’s armor each round.

I think the difference is the boosts you get to various traits and actions. H1.0 classes were very rigid and really limited players, especially when they switched classes or went to a faction-earned class. I definitely think this more open system of proficiencies, traits, etc is a breath of fresh air (or hopefully would be) and allow more player agency.

I've always been a fan or racial bonuses/abilities, as it is maybe the one thing you can't change, aside from a complete respec that has been mentioned. For abilities, I think it might be too much like the old classes, as there are just some abilities/traits players would never be able to access. Of course that's a choice when making a character, but I think at least starting off, rac-based abilities would be a bad idea. If we were to discover down the line that one race's ability was so OP, nerfing it might be more of a headache than just nipping it in the bud now.

I love the Exo-Force robots, they should definitely be used somehow.

[samurai-turtle]

Why do we need a "class"? Maybe make a "background" trait and they get a bonus on a stat. I figured you can have a lot of different background(s) like soldier, wizard, street urchin, far traveler and alchemist for some examples. 

[Tezclatipoca]

22 hours ago, Waterbrick Down said:

All good points, these are just examples and aren't the final versions of what I had in mind. If we ever get there, I'd think we'd have a thread going over the different species. There'd be set standard species; Human, Orc, Elf, Dwarf, Halfling, but there's also be the rules to create a new race along with approval by the community for balance and place in the canon.

I should be clear, I'm intending rules for a sci-fantasy setting. If someone would like to develop a generic rule-set, I'll leave it to them. The down side to generic is it is difficult to keep people motivated as most folks tend to be focused on a specific idea of a game instead of a general system.

Health and Vitality are the same thing.

Vitality due to Strength is automatically factored into the total Vitality and is always rounded down. So if your character has a Strength of 3, they get +1 Vitality. If they have have a strength of 4, they get a +2 to Vitality.

Points for race creation are independent of character creation points. Most characters would choose a preset race (see post above) whose traits are already set. If they wanted to do a custom race, that race would get approved by the community in a separate Thread.

Points are awarded at the end of a quest and can be spent increasing Proficiencies or Attribute scores.

Thank you for the precisions.

Now it is totally clear !

I am still thinking that the race traits should be counted like the proficiencies because it could lead to some inequality between somewhat OP races (with 3 traits) facing normal humans (without any) and this should be avoided. If a character wants to be a "simple human", it is not mandatory he takes any race trait and should compensate this "weakness" by having more Proficiencies instead. Does it make sense ? I am not sure I am totally clear on this idea.

[Waterbrick Down]

18 hours ago, Goliath said:

Perhaps players can get Respec and Class Tokens by achieving Level 10 for free otherwise they would have to buy them for very expensive at the Market.  Unless you want to make it so players have to complete quests to get them too.  So for every 5 quests completed, you get a Respec Token and a Class Token.

That being said, what would make the classes really all that different from each other?  Proficiency boosts?  I think Ultimate abilities would be a fun idea but am at a loss for their implications.

And what about Racial bonuses or abilities?  I want to create a Mechanical race based off of Dragonborn using those Exo Force robots.  My idea is that they have a Breath Weapon ability.  The element of choice is up to the player if they choose to play this race or another race with a Breath Weapon.  But as an example, my element of choice could be Acid which deals -1 to the target’s armor each round.

Just as a heads up, the system as is does not currently incorporate a discrete level system. On the subject of respecing, if we really want it, I think a respec token at every 5 completed quests would work. As the classes are now, I don't see the need to limit respecing classes.

The system significantly decreases the importance of classes. Characters aren't supposed to differentiate each other by their class, but by their stats (Attributes/Proficiencies), racial traits, and spell selection. Classes are an add on for those who want to specialize, but shouldn't be a necessity.

9 hours ago, samurai-turtle said:

Why do we need a "class"? Maybe make a "background" trait and they get a bonus on a stat. I figured you can have a lot of different background(s) like soldier, wizard, street urchin, far traveler and alchemist for some examples. 

The point of character creation is to give everyone the opportunity to shape their own backgrounds by selecting certain starting proficiencies that fit with their backstory. Classes just represent a character's current training/specialization.

1 hour ago, Faladrin said:

Thank you for the precisions.

Now it is totally clear !

I am still thinking that the race traits should be counted like the proficiencies because it could lead to some inequality between somewhat OP races (with 3 traits) facing normal humans (without any) and this should be avoided. If a character wants to be a "simple human", it is not mandatory he takes any race trait and should compensate this "weakness" by having more Proficiencies instead. Does it make sense ? I am not sure I am totally clear on this idea.

The intention would be to have a few starting races already prepared with stats, Humans will certainly have their own traits.

[KotZ]

Bit of a side note, but I bought two Star Wars sets yesterday and there's some great pieces for figs I've got in mind. I can fig barf this weekend.

[Khorne]

I saw the rules' designs you made some days ago, WBD, and I remembered I still had mock-ups of "space" Heroica rules from back in the day when the "Heroica in space" idea first started floating around.

The background is some artwork that was used in box art or instruction booklets for the 2000s something Space Police line, I think.

If anyone wants, I can maybe send the original PSD file and you can fiddle around with it. I still have it saved on an external HD.

[Waterbrick Down]

1 hour ago, Khorne said:

I saw the rules' designs you made some days ago, WBD, and I remembered I still had mock-ups of "space" Heroica rules from back in the day when the "Heroica in space" idea first started floating around.

The background is some artwork that was used in box art or instruction booklets for the 2000s something Space Police line, I think.

If anyone wants, I can maybe send the original PSD file and you can fiddle around with it. I still have it saved on an external HD.

That would be fantastic! Those are much better than what I'm currently working with.

[KotZ]

Yes please! Those look fantastic. 

[Tezclatipoca]

Woo hoo ! Lovely design ! @Khorne

Even if I think we should be careful at using pictures for the rules.

If the site hosting the pictures with all the rules is changing or closing its service, the pictures could be lost or deleted. We've seen that already with FlickR for example...

Same thing could happen if the main redactor (it appears here to be @Waterbrick Down) is cutting the bridges with Eurobricks and is closing his account, hopefully he will not do this, but we need to consider everything.

The best option; even if it's ugly; is to write the rules directly on the topic ! intertwined with decorum pictures not essentials to make sense in the rules.

 

[KotZ]

3 hours ago, Faladrin said:

Woo hoo ! Lovely design ! @Khorne

Even if I think we should be careful at using pictures for the rules.

If the site hosting the pictures with all the rules is changing or closing its service, the pictures could be lost or deleted. We've seen that already with FlickR for example...

Same thing could happen if the main redactor (it appears here to be @Waterbrick Down) is cutting the bridges with Eurobricks and is closing his account, hopefully he will not do this, but we need to consider everything.

The best option; even if it's ugly; is to write the rules directly on the topic ! intertwined with decorum pictures not essentials to make sense in the rules.

I know whe had that issue with Photobucket on the original run. I do think, like was mentioned way earlier in the thread, that there needs to be a few people running the game so one person doesn't get burnt out. If we want to be sure the images will be saved, we can use EB has the image host, as they allow some uploads.

[Tezclatipoca]

47 minutes ago, KotZ said:

I know whe had that issue with Photobucket on the original run. I do think, like was mentioned way earlier in the thread, that there needs to be a few people running the game so one person doesn't get burnt out. If we want to be sure the images will be saved, we can use EB has the image host, as they allow some uploads.

Indeed.

Like in the other games hosted in here in Eurobricks, it would be better to have more than one people running the game, you're right.

The image hosting in Eurobrick is quite limited though, but it's doable.

[Waterbrick Down]

Rev 2 of the rules set. For the test quest, I think we'll hold off on Race and Classes for now, but the rest of the mechanics should be fairly straight forward.On the subject of keeping things around, I'm hosting on Flickr, but will make a text version of the rules available so we always have them. I'd also second the idea for multiple people keeping the game running. As shown through Heroica 1.0 it was really easy for DM's to get burnt out and people feel they did more to facilitate other people's fun rather than having it themselves. I've got a few ideas for keeping hosting and the actual running the game incentivized, but would certainly appreciate feedback and ideas.

]

[KotZ]

@Waterbrick Down I love it. Although I'm slightly confused by the Equipment idea. Is that just an add on to a weapon/armor/etc, or is it a completely seperate thing?

[Yzalirk]

It looks great!  It could use a few adjustments though.  I think you meant that enemies drop Credits, not Gold. ?

Are there going to be more Status Conditions like Corroding and Frozen?  Corroded can degrade armor for a few turns.  Frozen could be like a longer version of Stunned.

Also wondering what will be the difference between Kinetic, Energy, and Elemental Weapons?  What exactly sets them apart?

[KotZ]

12 minutes ago, Goliath said:

Also wondering what will be the difference between Kinetic, Energy, and Elemental Weapons?  What exactly sets them apart?

Instead of all the elements like we had in H1, there's really only three types of weapons/armor. And specific types can only damage specific resistances. So instead of players having singular loadouts and god-tier individual weapons, they are now having to carry multiple items to destroy enemies.