Opinions on LEGO Technic Theme

[Erik Leppen]

3 hours ago, Jim said:

As an AFOL we expect a big Technic set to be perfect. As a kid (or non AFOL adult) you are simply amazed by the sheer size and you f...ing love the big set, even though the suspension isn't on par or the gearbox has the incorrect sequence.

That said though… I can remember fondly my favorite studded set, 8460, the great mobile crane, and I had tons of fun playing with that, and I was really impressed by multiple things in that set:

• the tiny steering circle
• the fact that when the outriggers are extended, the wheels are not touching the ground
• the lifting capacity
• the large movement range of the boom

That set was perfect. As a bonus it had a really nice B model.

Granted, I was young at the time, and I have always been technically-minded (but isn't that who Technic is for? ), but I can't help but think children can definitely feel disappointed with a set like 42070 (whose color seems to indicate "this is for the kids"), that doesn't have the nice steering radius (does it even steer? That's hard to see ), that doesn't have outriggers that actually support the whole truck, and whose crane doesn't seem to be the strongest ever (I don't own the set, so I don't know). And it's not like I picked a cheap set. I know my MOCs don't have lifting capacity either, but that's three functions where 8460 achieved better than 42070, making it more playable for less money. Yes, it's not "BIG!!!", but it was a blast.

I think for kids, the best 2018 Technic sets are the First Responder and the upcoming forklift.

(Edit: and indeed, 8109 and 42008 are both great sets. Technic the way I like it.)

Edited June 20, 2018 by Erik Leppen

[Bublehead]

The last real Technic set that I just had to have was the 8258 Crane Truck. Since then, only the Cargo plane, Arocs, the formentioned 42008 Service Truck and the Wheeled Loader 42030 have been what I considered classic Technic sets. With the Heavy Lift Helicopter and Claas tractor rounding out the best of the lot.   The rest has been pretty much the same but different.  The Mack truck has been a bright spot, and the Extremem Adventure interesting but a little weird. The Air Race Jet is a fun build, but not very realistic from proportions standpoint. The BWE was a great parts pack, interesting build but it didn’t excite me. The Unimog was good, but was really eclipsed by the Arocs.  The 42070 was a disaster, but the build was neat, and I liked the gearing, if nothing else. The Logging Truck was an Air tech claw rig rehash in my mind, as was the 41999 a rehash of the crawler.  The Hovercraft was a good parts pack, but otherwise uninteresting. The ocean explorer was a neat boat on dry land model, and more interesting than the Racing yacht.  I gravitate to sets 1000+ pieces and up, the smaller sets only get bought as parts donors or time wasters waiting on bigger sets.  

I have built almost every flagship set from 1977 till now, and the Rough Terrain Crane looks like what I consider a flagship set and I am eagerly awaiting its arrival. The Chiron and the Porsche were nice display models, but I am still disappointed by the flaws in both sets. The new parts from 2018 are the stars of this year, the rotary catch and the 20z clutch gear being the major additions that will give us some nice engineering challenges to incorporate into MOCs. The new pneumatic valve will also be interesting as well.  The PU platform makes me nervous, since we have yet to see anything that equivocates PF flexibility and stackability. I hope they don’t just adopt the we-do brick with two built in motors and 2 external ports and call it good enough for Technic.

I would really like to see some advancement in PF technology that goes where 3rd party suppliers have gone, but I am not holding my breath.

So where is Technic heading? Hopefully they pull it back on Theme and make it more function than form. The UCS type display sets are fine, but hopefully not the growing trend in the Theme, but as @Jim pointed out, Porsche was in top 10 sales so if the Chiron does any where near as good, look for another supercar in 2020, if not 2019.

Edited June 20, 2018 by Bublehead

[Andy D]

I really like most of the Technic sets for the last several years. I do feel that the "Flagship" sets have gotten way, way too large. My Ideal Technic set is between 1200-2700 pieces (3000 tops).

One of my favorite Technic sets was the 8258 Crane Truck at 1877 parts and the 42009 MK II Mobil Crane at 2607 parts. They were both very fun to assemble and functions worked well. I like functions driven by a distribution gearbox as opposed to complete remote control with one function per motor. I like some of the pneumatic sets as well.

Another of my favorites was the 2017 Anniversary Chassis made from three other sets.  It does not have to be big with many parts to be great!

I have the 42055 BWE still in it's box I may assemble it someday, I am just not sure IF or WHEN (it has been sitting for a year so far).

These are just my personal opinions.

Andy D

[andythenorth]

9 hours ago, Erik Leppen said:

That said though… I can remember fondly my favorite studded set, 8460, the great mobile crane, and I had tons of fun playing with that, and I was really impressed by multiple things in that set.

That set raised the bar at the time.  I found it in the loft a few days ago.  It looks tiny now, but for functions, it's not far behind much much bigger flagships.  The functions are performant, and fun to play with   

8459 pneumatic front-end loader also nailed it.  https://brickset.com/sets/8459-1/Pneumatic-Front-End-Loader . Still got that assembled, kids love it.  The only missing function was a pendular axle, and it might have been less playable with that (wobbly when pressing the pump).

Nostalgia is kind of boring, I don't think these sets outclass anything we have now.  But they nailed playability, and they were affordable, and they don't take up much shelf space.

[Jim]

9 hours ago, Erik Leppen said:

Granted, I was young at the time, and I have always been technically-minded (but isn't that who Technic is for? ), but I can't help but think children can definitely feel disappointed with a set like 42070 (whose color seems to indicate "this is for the kids"), that doesn't have the nice steering radius (does it even steer?

Well, I can tell you that my nephews of 4 and 6 have been playing with the 42070 the entire day. Along with the 42069, which they liked better because of the little system built items, but nonetheless they absolutely love the 42070. The 4 year old even understood (with some trial and error) how to switch the functions. They didn't care about the turning radius....or lack thereof 

I have also read on numerous occasions that kids love the BWE and I reckon that's not because of the smooth working functions. They simple love the sheer size and the impressive build.
Edit: they do love putting bricks in the bucket and watch them go.

I do agree that the 8109 perfectly embodies what Technic is (or should be) al about. Medium sizes set with an impressive primary function and some nice secondary functions.

[rener]

I can confirm that my kids love playing with the BWE. Size must have something to do with it, but I think it’s mostly because of dropping bricks in buckets and watch them going all the way to the back, and then catching them with the mining truck. Had to buy a 42035 to keep them from fighting...;)

42070 was a favourite as well, but that would really have been a lot better if it was fully remote à la 8043. That would have justified the price tag better, too...

[Jim]

Just now, rener said:

I can confirm that my kids love playing with the BWE. Size must have something to do with it, but I think it’s mostly because of dropping bricks in buckets and watch them going all the way to the back, and then catching them with the mining truck. Had to buy a 42035 to keep them from fighting...;)

My nephews liked it as well, and indeed they loved putting the bricks in the buckets and watch them go. I guess the GBC element has something to do with it.

Just now, rener said:

42070 was a favourite as well, but that would really have been a lot better if it was fully remote à la 8043. That would have justified the price tag better, too...

True. I even started making the chassis for the full RC version. I never got around finishing it. I do have the partially finished chassis though.

[TeamThrifty]

There's one area i seem to differ from the comments here, and thats comparisons. When i look at the new flagship, i work off gut instinct - do i want it, does it gives me that same excitement i got when i was 10. It seems quite common to base your opinion of it, by comparing it... its worse than set X, or feature Y isn't as good. I view it on its own merits

Technic is a mature product now, so huge leaps become harder, if not impossible. Its more about incremental gains, like new gearbox parts.

Not saying that its wrong to compare, and i guess we all want to see technic move forward, but for me, i see 42082 and WANT IT!! (and if it has some new gearbox parts in it too, great. if it does something special with bearings in the ring gears, better still..) My primary reaction though is from the 10 yr old that still thrives inside me (i'm proud to say, at 46!).  

Basically i'm 10, but with a bigger budget! And as mentioned before, i'm a sucker for a big set.. i love a huge part count! Bring on 42082, it will stay built for 3 or 4 days. I've got plans for those parts, and its not as a display model!! (porsche last 2 days before it got 4wd and a central diff... and a mid mounted engine....)

 

 

[Jim]

1 minute ago, TeamThrifty said:

...

We also need to take into account that when you were 10 years old, you had one or maybe two flagships. Now you are basically waiting for the next year's flagship to buy it. So most of us have like 10, 15 or 20+ flagships. We do have so much material to compare. When you were 10 you didn't know any better.

[agrof]

39 minutes ago, Jim said:

Well, I can tell you that my nephews of 4 and 6 have been playing with the 42070 the entire day. Along with the 42069, which they liked better because of the little system built items, but nonetheless they absolutely love the 42070. The 4 year old even understood (with some trial and error) how to switch the functions. They didn't care about the turning radius....or lack thereof 

On big sets like this are usual above 11, for UCS it is 16+ (which basically means adults, especially considering the price). So your nephews are not licensed to understand and to play with those! 

Seriously, it is cute and many times admirable if a small child can operate, build and enjoy a set like these, but to be fair the expectations of a 4 year old and a 16 year old are pretty different. And as the target group is 11-16 (set by LEGO itself), than steering radius can be an issue. Just to compare apple to apple.

[Jim]

Just now, agrof said:

And as the target group is 11-16 (set by LEGO itself), than steering radius can be an issue. Just to compare apple to apple.

Valid point 

[TeamThrifty]

Thats true, but i still 

6 minutes ago, Jim said:

We do have so much material to compare. When you were 10 you didn't know any better.

That is absolutely true, and there's a great truth hidden in that sentence - we have so much material! So many great sets. And for me thats such a positive! The occasional sketchy function is incidental to me.. but i know its not for everyone.

I guess its whether you view Technic as Cattle or a Pet. When cattle goes wrong you shoot it and get a different one. But a pet, you stick with and take it to the vets. Or if it pees on the carpet you forgive it, cos its your pet. Lego for me is a pet, so i can live with the occasional wet patch on the carpet or ruined curtains!!! 

[sirslayer]

I like fire trucks and cop cars and im still excited with 42068 even though its a simple model , my soon to be release update on the 42068 will be towards to the fire fighting crowd and technic lovers hopefully will accepts it.  if any complaints themes like SUV's cop cars and Forest rangers trucks or even a complete ambulance that uses Pneumatics in a technic world to measure your blood pressure would be easy to implement  (i know cause I repair medical machines for a living!)) and the arm cuffs are cheap today!!! My issues with technics are seem to be the same thing but just an upgrade..  not enough variances in models/technics and it was the fire truck that got me back into Technic!! it took them how many years to do a fire truck and they didnt do it right!!!! well almost!! 

    

Edited June 21, 2018 by sirslayer
grammar

[aol000xw]

Yellow cylinders made sense back then... when all that we got was yellow machinery. Nowadays the gray used in LAs is a more sensible approach. Really surprised they kept the new cylinders in yellow. Also never understood by what logic the air tank wasn't yellow, not that I'd like it to be it.

In the end there are so many different interests, preferences and expectations that the only truth is that we want more. But for god's sake, make it work properly.

 

edit: I lost the quote and the the thing about cylinders doesn't make sense without it...oh well.

Edited June 21, 2018 by aol000xw

[allanp]

I think they kept them yellow because by quickly glancing at the model you can see it has pneumatics, or it could be cheaper to only have to make them in one colour. But still it would be great to have them match the colour of the vehicle/machine they are connected to like in the real world. If not, then having them in black would be good for when yellow doesn't work. 

[Maaboo the Witch]

1 hour ago, allanp said:

I think they kept them yellow because by quickly glancing at the model you can see it has pneumatics, or it could be cheaper to only have to make them in one colour.

The second thing. Although it would be good to see black cylinders.

[TeamThrifty]

On a slight tangent (apologies).. spoke to customer services today about my order for the spiral gearbox selector and new 20 tooth clutch gears.. and the lady i spoke to was the most helpful person in the world. A real credit to TLG.

[LennyRhys]

21 hours ago, aol000xw said:

Yellow cylinders made sense back then... when all that we got was yellow machinery.

 

You may be surprised to find that this is not true on either count - when TLG released the first pneumatic system it came with both yellow and red cylinders and pump.  For whatever reason, they dropped the other colours and have stuck with yellow (except for the random transparent ones).  There were many pneumatic models not yellow, such as 8851, 8854, 8044, 8042, 8462 etc.

I think any discussion about colours of Lego Technic parts is moot because TLG clearly threw the colour design manual out the window when they started giving their pins and axles bright primary colours (yellow, red and blue).  I'll admit I didn't like it at first, but I think it really works with the new approach to Technic construction - it helps to quickly locate parts and makes building a lot easier than if everything was black or gray, and it gives the completed models unique character.

Edited June 22, 2018 by LennyRhys2

[MangaNOID]

Well I just tried building 8851 b model for the first time in 30+ years and oh what a joy to have to carefully look at instructions and work things out a bit for yourself. 

Everything these days is just layed out on a plate for us comparatively. Colour coding and  too easy instructions make everything a little ho hum.

out of 4 sets I bought, I only finished 1, which was the first set I bought since 1985. I never finished 8110, 42039, and 42054 cause I got bored as it was too easy.

This is where I think LEGO have gone wrong. 

Not the designs, not the lack of decent b model and not even all those stupid panels...oh wait, maybe the panels are a bit over the top.

 

[pleegwat]

5 hours ago, LennyRhys2 said:

it helps to quickly locate parts

I've got 5L in yellow grey and black, and 9L and 11L in grey and yellow. I know I've gotten new 10Ls in black after they started using red for it and I think that goes for 6L too.

I think they're usually consistent in a set though, and once you start mixing sets you've probably got them sorted on length anyway.

[Bublehead]

I love panels, flat 3x11 or 5x11 because they allow large flat constructions (without studs) without having to stack a gagillion beams together.  The “figure it out” angle of instructions, however, not missing that as much.  I get where you are coming from, but the “Where Waldo?” aspect of finding where they just stuck a single element in a step gets frustrating.

[Erik Leppen]

I actually dislike the large flat panels. That's partly because of those silly out-of-style stripes on them, but also because they're often too large, have holes in the surface and leave ugly gaps because of their rounded edges. I often find large Surfaces consisting of 5x11 or 3x11 panels to look very messy because of all there different shapes involved. In some cases I prefer stacked beams if done well. Or else, there's always tiles you can use to cover the holes :)

I much prefer the asymmetric panels (the numbered ones that come in left and right variants), because they can be put in many different ways because of their asymmetry. Every angle has a different effect on a build. Especially the smallest 1x2x5 variant, which I think if my favorite panel.

Anyhow, to prevent this from becoming a new Technic pub topic, let's return to opinions on Technic theme… I think what we're seeing is that flagship sets are becoming borderline too large, but the mid-size models are very often really nice sets (for their target audience). There are a lot of good mid-size sets lately, and I think the new parts, colors, building techniques, colored axles, new pins etc. contributed to that.

[BrickbyBrickTechnic]

10 hours ago, MangaNOID said:

and 42054

You should really finish it if you can. The end result is beautiful IMO, so lots of reward for little work 

Aside, I don't see a problem with the simplicity of build processes. It's clear that in the age of 8851, Technic had a mainly adult demographic, and so clarity was not as needed. However, with recent years, Technic must have seen a big increase in children taking interest, so making a big-scale-function-packed model easy to build is a necessity if anything. Just take a look at the recent commercials. Children are without doubt the stars.

Edited June 22, 2018 by BrickbyBrickTechnic

[zoo]

17 hours ago, BrickbyBrickTechnic said:

Aside, I don't see a problem with the simplicity of build processes. It's clear that in the age of 8851, Technic had a mainly adult demographic, and so clarity was not as needed. However, with recent years, Technic must have seen a big increase in children taking interest, so making a big-scale-function-packed model easy to build is a necessity if anything. Just take a look at the recent commercials. Children are without doubt the stars.

At the age of 9 I was building my 8868 Claw Rig and a year or so before I had built both the 8849 Tractor and 8862 Backhoe Grader. Sure, I could see the studless building techniques have added some difficulty but I still think the abilites of children of the Technic demographic are often underestimated.

[Erik Leppen]

1 hour ago, zoo said:

I still think the abilites of children of the Technic demographic are often underestimated.

This is probably because overestimation results in much more dissatisfaction and frustration, and less sales, than underestimation.

You gotta remember, for a commercial organization there is, in the end, only one measurement that counts: the profit. Whatever they do; ultimately, the goal is to increase profits.