JopieK

Powered Up - A tear down...

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12 hours ago, Mr Hobbles said:

I don't recall seeing any differences in the Control+ L and XL motors? There are RPM and power draw differences as Philo documented, but unless my memory is failing me I think the modes, capabilities and version revisions are identical. The same for the SPIKE Prime motors.
...

Let me explain my observations of differences between Motors 0x2E & 0x2F

I took UART records of initialisation phase from Philos Page and get this results :

Sensor Type

UART

 

Sensor ID

0x2E

46d

Baudrate

 

2.400 Bd

at Initialization

115.200 Bd

after Initialization

Modes

0x00 .. 0x05

 

Views

0x00 .. 0x03

and DataLogs

Firmware Version

0.0.00.0004

 

Hardware Version

1.0.00.0000

 

ComboMode Flags

0x000E

0000.0000.0000.1110b

Capability Bits

Byte
String

Byte

0x00 0x98 0x00 0x2C 0x04
G834061

0x00 0x00 0x00 0x00

Info Msg 0x09

Byte

Byte

0x88 0x13 0x00 0x00 0xFA 0x00 0x00 0x00
0x10 0x27 0x00 0x00 0xBE 0x05 0x00 0x00

Info Msg 0x0A

Byte

Byte

0x98 0x3A 0x00 0x00 0x96 0x00 0x00 0x00

0x98 0x3A 0x00 0x00 0x00 0x00 0x00 0x00

Info Msg 0x0B

Byte

0x00 0x00 0x00 0x00 0x00 0x00 0x00 0x00

Info Msg 0x0C

Byte

0x00 0x00 0x00 0x00

Mode Info

6 Byte Flags

Mode 0 : 0x30 0x00 0x00 0x00 0x05 0x04
Mode 1 : 0x21 0x00 0x00 0x00 0x05 0x04
Mode 2 : 0x24 0x00 0x00 0x00 0x05 0x04
Mode 3 : 0x22 0x00 0x00 0x00 0x05 0x04
Mode 4 : 0x22 0x40 0x00 0x00 0x05 0x04
Mode 5 : 0x00 0x00 0x00 0x00 0x05 0x04

and

Sensor Type

UART

 

Sensor ID

0x2F

47d

Baudrate

 

2.400 Bd

at Initialization

115.200 Bd

after Initialization

Modes

0x00 .. 0x05

Input

Output

Modes

Modes

0000.0000.0001.1110b

0000.0000.0001.1111b

Views

0x00 .. 0x03

and DataLogs

Firmware Version

0.0.00.0004

maybe 0.0.00.1000

Hardware Version

1.0.00.0000

maybe 0.0.00.1000

ComboMode Flags

0x000E

0000.0000.0000.1110b

Capability Bits

Byte
String

Byte

0x00 0x49 0x00 0x2F 0x03
G836660

0x00 0x00 0x00 0x00

Info Msg 0x09

Byte

Byte

0x28 0x23 0x00 0x00 0xFA 0x00 0x00 0x00
0x28 0x23 0x00 0x00 0xF5 0x05 0x00 0x00

Info Msg 0x0A

Byte

Byte

0xF8 0x2A 0x00 0x00 0x78 0x00 0x00 0x00

0xC8 0xAF 0x00 0x00 0x00 0x00 0x00 0x00

Info Msg 0x0B

Byte

0x00 0x00 0x00 0x00 0x00 0x00 0x00 0x00

Info Msg 0x0C

Byte

0x00 0x00 0x00 0x00

Mode Info

6 Byte Flags

Mode 0 : 0x30 0x00 0x00 0x00 0x05 0x04
Mode 1 : 0x21 0x00 0x00 0x00 0x05 0x04
Mode 2 : 0x24 0x00 0x00 0x00 0x05 0x04
Mode 3 : 0x22 0x00 0x00 0x00 0x05 0x04
Mode 4 : 0x22 0x40 0x00 0x00 0x05 0x04
Mode 5 : 0x00 0x00 0x00 0x00 0x05 0x04

The Differences are marked blue
But what this differences are causing is still mysterious for me

The Mode-Depending Data are identical.

Mode

Name

Raw

%

SI

Unit

Mapping

Data

Format

Fig

Dec

Out

In

0x00

POWER

-100,0 .. 100,0

-100,0 .. 100,0

-100,0 .. 100,0

PCT

0x00

0x50

1

Byte

4 1?

0

0x01

SPEED

-100,0 .. 100,0

-100,0 .. 100,0

-100,0 .. 100,0

PCT

0x30

0x70

1

Byte

4

0

0x02

POS

-360,0 .. 360,0

-100 .. 100

-360,0 .. 360,0

DEG

0x28

0x68

1

Long

11 4?

0

0x03

APOS

-180,0 .. 179,0

-360,0 .. 360,0

-200 .. 200

-180,0 .. 179,0

-360,0 .. 360,0

DEG

0x32

0x32

1

Word

3

0

0x04

CALIB

LOAD

0,0 .. 3600,0
0.0 .. 127.0

0,0 .. 100,0

0,0 .. 3600,0

0.0 .. 127.0

CAL

PCT

0x00

0x00

2

1

Word

Byte

5

1

0

0x05

STATS
CALIB

0,0 .. 65536,0

0.0 .. 512.0

0,0 .. 100,0

0,0 .. 65536,0

0.0 .. 512.0

MIN

RAW

0x00

0x00

14

3

Word

5

0

I've no Idea what UART Info-Messages 0x08 to 0x0C are used for.

Also unclear what the 6-Bytes coded in Mode-Names are used for.
Maybe additional capabillity-Bits ? But why 48 Bits ?
And whats their meaning ?

The red marking at Modes, in Mode-Table, HW- & Firmware- Versions I've taken from your Feedback

 

So Documentation from Lego is highly expected

 

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1 hour ago, Tcm0 said:

I haven't seen that you made a library for that

No, no library.
Only "raw" code to understand the UART Protocol.
ASAP I put all my experiments on GitHub

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On 6/27/2020 at 12:24 PM, GianCann said:

No, no library.
Only "raw" code to understand the UART Protocol.
ASAP I put all my experiments on GitHub

Would be nice to see ;-)

 

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Does anyone know the technical specs of the step down voltage regulator used in the Power Up Hub (No. 4)?

I'm interested in creating a rechargeable pack for the hub and wondering if it can handle 7.2-7.4v or 10.8-11.1v packs. From the PUP Motor Specs it looks like it somewhat different to the Power Functions train motor which used a 7.2v rechargeable pack, but the efficiency was much better for that motor at 7.2v vs the new PUP motor, so i'm wondering if LEGO intends to use a 3S pack for the new PUP motors.

The PUP hubs also have stepper motor drivers included, are any of the PUP motors actually steppers?

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21 minutes ago, unreality said:

Does anyone know the technical specs of the step down voltage regulator used in the Power Up Hub (No. 4)?

Read this:

https://www.philohome.com/pupbat/pupbat.htm

21 minutes ago, unreality said:

The PUP hubs also have stepper motor drivers included, are any of the PUP motors actually steppers?

No, no any motor is a stepper.

There is only a tacho-meter sensor in all motors, except in the train motor.

All motors are PWM driven.

Edited by GianCann

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15 minutes ago, GianCann said:

There is only a tacho-meter sensor in all motors, excpet in train motor.

The WeDo/Batmobile motor is also a "dumb" motor; as far as I know, it's a PF M motor with different connection points and a PUp plug.

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Just now, AVCampos said:

he WeDo/Batmobile motor is also a "dumb" motor

Yes, Right.... I forgot about this motor ;)

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Shinichiro Oba, on Facebook, has published this info about the new LEGO Mario set:

Just got my set of LEGO Super Mario 71360 in Japan!

It seems that the LEGO Mario is a new device of Powered Up Platform because it supports LEGO Wireless Protocol.

https://lego.github.io/lego-ble-wireless-protocol-docs/

System Type and Device Number: 0x43

Internal IOs:

Port 0: Unknown IO Type (0x47)

Port 1: Color and Barcode Sensor? (0x49)

Port 2: Unknown IO Type (0x4a)

Port 3: Unknown IO Type (0x46)

Port 6: Voltage Sensor (0x14)

Yoshihito Isogawa has published this video:

 

 

Edited by GianCann

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6 hours ago, GianCann said:

Shinichiro Oba, on Facebook, has published this info about the new LEGO Mario set:

...

System Type and Device Number: 0x43

Internal IOs:

Port 0: Unknown IO Type (0x47)

Port 1: Color and Barcode Sensor? (0x49)

Port 2: Unknown IO Type (0x4a)

Port 3: Unknown IO Type (0x46)

Port 6: Voltage Sensor (0x14)

Looks great!

But this detailed Info was not included in the Video

How did you find it out ?

Internals sensors usually have an Offset of 50dez in Port-Number
So Mario has only internal Ports like the Duplo Train.
Are you sure about Port 0x00 to 0x06 ?
What is with Port 4 & 5 ? any idea ?

Internal Voltage is in LWP3.0.0 usually specified at Port 0x3B (Handheld Remote seems to be an exception)

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12 minutes ago, BrickTronic said:

How did you find it out ?

Shinichiro has wrote a post on LEGO PoweredUp Community.

12 minutes ago, BrickTronic said:

What is with Port 4 & 5 ? any idea ?

Tilt sensor? Mario has a tilt sensor inside.

We waiting for other info at soon...

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New info from Shinichiro:

Current status..
Port 0: 0x47 Accelerometer & Gyro?
- Mode 0: Accelerometer (XYZ) - 3 bytes
- Mode 1: Gyro? - 4 bytes

Port 1: 0x49 Color & Barcode Sensor
- Mode 0: Barcode & Color Index - 4 bytes
- Mode 1: RGB Color - 3 bytes

Port 2: 0x4a Costume Sensor
- Mode 0: Costume - 6 bit

Port 3: 0x46 Game Information?
- Mode 0: ??
- Mode 1: ??
- Mode 2: Game start, Goal, Coin, Sleep, and more - 4 bytes

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Hi, my name is Walter and I´m new in this fantastic forum!

I´ve landed here because of the Powered Hub from the Set 10874, hoping to find a solution to my problem.

As described by many people across web, this Hub shows two common issues. 1, the color sensor problem; and 2- a sound problem, which is my situation.

I´ve 2 item (1 10874 purchased set and 1 received as replacement from Lego) and they both show the same problem. The sound comes and goes without logical reason.

Did anyone here gets the same sound problem? and, because people here were able to hack the hub, did any of you find any reason/solution of this No Sound situation? a code issue? an electronic issue?

Thanks in advance for any support, Walter.

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14 minutes ago, WalterPavicic said:

The sound comes and goes without logical reason

The "action bricks" works well?

When the train goes over the action brick, the train react to these?

Only the sound is the problem?

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1 hour ago, GianCann said:

The "action bricks" works well?

When the train goes over the action brick, the train react to these?

Only the sound is the problem?

Hi! Thank you so much for your reply!

Regarding your questions (both trains that we have, has show the same behaviour):

1- the train react/recognize all five action brick (of course, the yellow/sound action can be checked only when sound i working)

2- actually, now I recall that sometimes (now not sure if this happens with sound working or not), action brick green and blue are not recognized and train goes over without any action done, but this is not very frequent; may be room light? dust?;

3- beyond point 2, the only clear problem is the sound! showing a behavior of: not working for weeks / months; then it comes back and works for a few minutes / hours and then it goes again.

Thanks for your time and support!

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I would like to point you towards another dirction: Why not building our own technical base for control system that is at least compatible with LEGO APPS.

Have a look here: 

Because it is a branch of the ongoing discussion here, i have created own topic.

As i mentioned there: Even interesting for the "Phybricks initiative" because Microphyton ist still avsailable for a number of controllers.

Marc

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I' am a litlle bit confused about the angular motors.

There are two types, "middle" and "large"

And three sets  / colors:
Spike (blue)
42114 (gray)
mindstorms (green)

Are they all mechanical identical?
And electrical ( is at least the ID different)?

Is the following correct:
Spike on PoweredUp App: motors turns, but no feedback of the angle
42114 on PoweredUp App: nothing at all, no move, no angle?

If so it is not very useful that LEGO calls them both
"Technic Large Angular Motor".

Any ideas?

Edited by Lok24

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The different variants seem to have identical internals, at least what I could test with the Spike Prime and the Technic Large versions. The ID is different for these two. 

About the name, it is indeed confusing. The Spike Prime variant is called "Technic Large Angular Motor", but the one in 42114 is called "large angular position motor" on the product page and on the box as well. Bricks & Pieces calls it "MOTOR, NO. 15". 

Your observation about the current Powered Up app compatibility is correct. The Technic variant is not recognized at the moment, the Spike Prime variant has no feedback on position, but it can run and it can be also turned by x degrees, and it can be also turned to y relative position (although you won't have a feedback about it).

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