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Imperial Officers Mafia - Day Three

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Frankly, Tarkin's response makes me think he's being honest. I wouldn't expect a traitor who's being lynched to just surrender like that. 

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Vote Count: 
Grand Moff Tarkin / LegoMonorailFan - 8 (mediumsnowman, KotZ, Khscarymovie4, Sandy, Peanuts, LegoRacer1, Tariq j, Rider Raider) 

With 13 players, 7 is required to lynch. The day will end 24 hours early if the vote remains the same. Otherwise, 41 hours remain in Day Three. 

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And I don't mean that as a slam on Tarkin - I appreciate his statement and his desire to keep the discussion alive. 

Lord Vader, Needs (khscarymovie) voted for Thrawn, not Tarkin. 

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11 minutes ago, mostlytechnic said:

And I don't mean that as a slam on Tarkin - I appreciate his statement and his desire to keep the discussion alive. 

Lord Vader, Needs (khscarymovie) voted for Thrawn, not Tarkin. 

:vader::blush:

Vote Count: 
Grand Moff Tarkin / LegoMonorailFan - 7 (mediumsnowman, KotZ, Sandy, Peanuts, LegoRacer1, Tariq j, Rider Raider) 
Grand Admiral Thrawn / mediumsnowman - 1 (Khscarymovie4)

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I've just realized I haven't voted. But frankly I'm unsure as to who to vote for.

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Not that it matters, but I'd hate to go out having not voted. Even if it's useless. So I'll vote for Piett for old times sake. :tongue:

Vote: Admiral Piett (Sandy)

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Upon review my biggest suspect has to be our so called esteemed Grand Admiral Thrawn. 

His actions have ranged from very middle of the road to fear mongering.

Yesterday he continually tried to derail the vote against Ozzel by claiming their was a band wagon despite there not being one. One vote, followed by votes written coincidentally  

Then he voted for Piett at the last minute, along with Jellico who we know now was scum. 

Sure it's possible he's innocent but he's been playing it so safe I'm wary.

Vote: Grand Admiral Thrawn (MediumSnowMan)

*Wow a lot has happened, sorry for the inactivity it's been a rough day. 

Thrawn's early-bird vote also caught me as suspect. If I was amongst the surviving mafia or the last remaining member I feel like I would definitely try to be amongst the first to vote. 

It's an easy way of claiming you started a discussion and shift attention from yourself.

 

And I will note I find it very strange how Thrawn has guided us so quickly into a final vote for Tarkin this soon in the daym

Where is his concern for band wagons now when it is by his design?

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28 minutes ago, Forresto said:

Upon review my biggest suspect has to be our so called esteemed Grand Admiral Thrawn. 

His actions have ranged from very middle of the road to fear mongering.

Yesterday he continually tried to derail the vote against Ozzel by claiming their was a band wagon despite there not being one. One vote, followed by votes written coincidentally  

Then he voted for Piett at the last minute, along with Jellico who we know now was scum. 

Sure it's possible he's innocent but he's been playing it so safe I'm wary.

Vote: Grand Admiral Thrawn (MediumSnowMan)

*Wow a lot has happened, sorry for the inactivity it's been a rough day. 

Thrawn's early-bird vote also caught me as suspect. If I was amongst the surviving mafia or the last remaining member I feel like I would definitely try to be amongst the first to vote. 

It's an easy way of claiming you started a discussion and shift attention from yourself.

 

And I will note I find it very strange how Thrawn has guided us so quickly into a final vote for Tarkin this soon in the daym

Where is his concern for band wagons now when it is by his design?

I feel like I’ve explained my thoughts on Ozzel and Jellico a million times. We got lucky with one and I had to make a snap decision on the other.

I voted first because Tarkin is our best suspect and I happened to be online when voting started.

I replied to Motti and admitted the quick votes under my lead was similar to what happened yesterday, and called out those that seemed particularly bandwagon-y.

Have you even read the thread? :facepalm:

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Just now, mediumsnowman said:

I feel like I’ve explained my thoughts on Ozzel and Jellico a million times. We got lucky with one and I had to make a snap decision on the other.

I voted first because Tarkin is our best suspect and I happened to be online when voting started.

I replied to Motti and admitted the quick votes under my lead was similar to what happened yesterday, and called out those that seemed particularly bandwagon-y.

Have you even read the thread? :facepalm:

I read this thread twice and it actually made me suspect you more.

Although I will give you credit for calling out band wagoners. 

~~

You keep dismissing Ozzel lynch as luck as if those like Yularen and myself didn't have reasons for voting for Ozzel.

He was acting totally scummy in every post yesterday. It wasn't luck, it was perception, and everything is telling me you're off.

It's as if you're doing everything you can to distance yourself from Ozzel.

Tarkin never struck me as off because he was so blatant and obvious in his defense of Ozzel whereas Thrawn was far more subtle.

Is Tarkin guilty? I don't know. I just suspect Thrawn more.

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3 hours ago, mostlytechnic said:

Frankly, Tarkin's response makes me think he's being honest. I wouldn't expect a traitor who's being lynched to just surrender like that. 

He could be trying to trick us. Also, I do not see your vote anywhere. Care to share why? There has to be someone you suspect, the only thing you have basically said is "not really sure Tarkin is a traditor" is different ways.

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Of course we might be wrong with Tarkin, and I personally haven't heard of an investigator confirming his or anyone else's allegiance.

But we as a town got lucky last night when Jellico was killed and none of us weren't. It might mean the scum got to convert instead of kill, but still there's room for error now.

Even if Tarkin turns out to be town, tomorrow we can lynch Thrawn or Needa, if nothing new comes up. 

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1 hour ago, Forresto said:

You keep dismissing Ozzel lynch as luck as if those like Yularen and myself didn't have reasons for voting for Ozzel.

He was acting totally scummy in every post yesterday. It wasn't luck, it was perception, and everything is telling me you're off.

We absolutely got lucky. We can’t go patting ourselves on the back for catching Ozzel when he was acting exactly as he always has. The case against him this time was weak at best, it just happened to work out. Scum tells for the majority of people are not necessarily tells for Ozzel, if that makes sense. 

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8 hours ago, mediumsnowman said:

Hmm. As others have said, thus seems to be the same thing that happened yesterday with a quick run of votes. Dellus, Fenton, and Daala all stand out as bandwagon-y to me. Doing damage control mode after losing two teammates in the last day? 

Kinda funny you should mention that, I find whenever you voted, you never gave much of a reason:

On 27.4.2018 at 6:44 PM, Peanuts said:

You stated why you voted for the Colonel, but your statement sounds to me like "I'm voting just because I have to, but if you want to kill Dellus, that's fine too" which is as non-commital as voting gets.

As for being aggressive? There are traitors amongst us and we have to find them. Would you rather ask nicely?

On 28.4.2018 at 2:06 AM, mediumsnowman said:

Not to explicity defend Captain Fenton, per se, as he's just as likely to be a traitor as any of the rest of us, but this statement seems rather unfounded and unwarranted. Would you rather people sit back to be herded onto a bandwagon like those weird cow things on Florrum? There's a difference between actively stimulating discussion on Day 1 and "being aggressive." This also seems like an attempt to deflect Fenton's observations made about your behavior by claiming he's done the same thing to many other officers, which is simply not a truthful statement.

To follow up on another of Fenton's "agrressions", Admiral Shelby, your vote also reads as if you don't particularly care who gets lynched. If you're loyal to our great Empire you should certainly care who gets lynched. Only traitors are this apathetic, as long as it's not one of your scumbuddies getting the axe. :hmpf_bad:

[Something to Motti, I accidentally deleted this]

Still, I don't find that as suspicious as Admiral Shelby's curious responses to Captain Fenton's legitimate grievances, and I am content for now to

Vote: Admiral Shelby (Forresto)

Yet, I'm still keeping my Chiss eyes on you, General Veers. 

You pretty much repeated exactly what I said before, just with more words.

On 2.5.2018 at 5:32 AM, mediumsnowman said:

I don't like how quickly this bandwagon is forming against Admiral Ozzel. This is definitely reaching into metagame territory, but our dear Admiral has always been somewhat... erratic in his behavior, and it's not necessarily a scum or town tell. But that's not the point - we already have 3 votes in less than an hour. That reeks, absolutely REEKS, of behind-the-scenes collusion. If Ozzel is town, at least one or two of these first few votes are traitors to our glorious Empire. 

I would be much more comfortable delivering Admirals Shelby or Motti to Lord Vader today, both of whom I raised suspicions against yesterday. 

As I said yesterday in response to this post by Admiral Motti: (My apologies for the odd formatting - I haven't been able to quote from old topics since the forum rollover - if anyone can show me how to in PM that would be great, since my old method doesn't work anymore!)

 

"So far we have 10 votes, spread among 9 people. Not uncommon at the start of these quests. 

I'm going to further that, with a 

Vote: Komec (jluck)

because he hasn't voted yet either, and while not the quietest among the group, he's been quieter than I remember him in the past. So this vote is partially a prod and partially legitimately suspicious."

 

My response:

 

"Why would you further that? A vote for Komec does just about nothing at this point, with less than 24 hours left in the day. (Right?) It seems spreading out votes late in the day like this is a deliberate attempt to sow confusion and give yourself plausible deniability for any bandwagons that might form in these waning hours.

Yet, I'm still keeping my Chiss eyes on you, General Veers."

 

It has since come to my attention I referred to General Veers when I meant to refer to Admiral Motti (the grey uniforms all look the same!), but the point still stands, and I still find his blatant vote spreading odd, especially at the end of the day. I would be much more comfortable lynching Motti than Ozzel today.

Vote: Admiral Motti (mostlytechnic)

 

You vote for Admiral Motti simply for "spreading votes" on Day One, when it was fairly obvious there wouldn't be a lynch anyway.

On 3.5.2018 at 4:26 AM, mediumsnowman said:

Assuming Jellico’s vote count is correct and we have less than 24 hours left, in the interest of securing a lynch and not repeating Day 1, I’ll

Unvote: Admiral Motti (MT)

Vote: Admira Daala (Rider Raider)

in the hope that we’ll have something to go off of tomorrow, and I find the case against Daala more compelling than the case against Ozzel.

Is this bandwagoning? Maybe. I don’t feel strongly about Daala, but spinning our wheels for the second day in a row would give the traitors a huge advantage and put us in a very bad position goin forward.

"I don't feel strongly about Daala, maybe because I know she is town, but I'd like to kill her anyway"

On 3.5.2018 at 6:48 PM, mediumsnowman said:

I’m pressed for time at the moment and likely won’t be able to come online again before the end of the day. I think Daala would be the best and I don’t like the Ozzel train. If it would help I’d rather go for Piett than Jellico

unvote Rider Raider

vote: Sandy (Piett)

please accept my hurried vote I’m trying to walk out the door 

Admittedly, you said you are in a hurrry, which I can understand well (especially right now, I really should leave for work other imperial duties :grin:). Still, you never followed up today why you found Admiral Piett a better option than Ozzel, since you didn't even feel strongly about Daala, did you have an opinion on Piett at all?

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Okay, so my thoughts on Thrawn. Thrawn has pointed out many times now that we got lucky by lynching Ozzel since Ozzel's behavior is often like this.

7 hours ago, mediumsnowman said:

We absolutely got lucky. We can’t go patting ourselves on the back for catching Ozzel when he was acting exactly as he always has. The case against him this time was weak at best, it just happened to work out. Scum tells for the majority of people are not necessarily tells for Ozzel, if that makes sense. 

In other words, Thrawn is catching a lot of flack for saying the same thing I am. Personally, I think he's innocent for now.

 

9 hours ago, Forresto said:

Sure it's possible he's innocent but he's been playing it so safe I'm wary.

Vote: Grand Admiral Thrawn (MediumSnowMan)

People who play it safe can likely be two things.

1: Traitors.

2: Third party players.

Keep the latter in mind tomorrow if he's to be considered as a potential lynch.

9 hours ago, Forresto said:

Thrawn's early-bird vote also caught me as suspect. If I was amongst the surviving mafia or the last remaining member I feel like I would definitely try to be amongst the first to vote. 

It's an easy way of claiming you started a discussion and shift attention from yourself.

That's a fair suspicion, but the following is rather off.

9 hours ago, Forresto said:

And I will note I find it very strange how Thrawn has guided us so quickly into a final vote for Tarkin this soon in the day.

Where is his concern for band wagons now when it is by his design?

:wacko: Being the first to vote on something doesn't mean you "guided a vote". Most of the votes for me consist of a few people who have actual suspicions of me, and then a whole lot of bandwagoners. 

Right now your pretty high on my scum radar. Can't recall if I voiced the concerns, but these suspicions I have of you go back to day one. So I'm going to change my vote so when people look back on today, they'll have a concrete documentation to remind them of my suspicions.

Unvote: Admiral Piett (Sandy)

Vote: Admiral Shelby (Forresto)

 

Another thing I'm concerned about is those who might voice concern saying that they think I might be innocent. That way when I flip town, they can say "see?! I knew he was town".

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So are we all fine with the Lynch being early? I find it very odd that everyone is just ok with the lynch today. If scum are as wounded as I think they are I feel like they would be putting up more of a fight if we were lynching a scum. Motti, Veers, Kormac, any of you going to vote? Kormac has stuck me as incredible odd, he is usually very talkative, here I keep forgetting he's here.

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20 hours ago, Rider Raider said:

I would also like to offer an apology. I am extremely busy right now, but I have some thoughts that may be useful that I will type later.

 

And what were these useful thoughts? Apart from jumping on the bandwagon for Tarkin you haven’t said much. 

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As I noted earlier, weekends are bad for me. But it's over and you'll see what you saw on day 2, I'm fully engaged. There's a lot for me to digest, but I'm going to get out a few thought from my first read through:

13 hours ago, mostlytechnic said:

Frankly, Tarkin's response makes me think he's being honest. I wouldn't expect a traitor who's being lynched to just surrender like that. 

Egh, depends. The wagon formed so fast that it can be overwhelming, especially cuz several players voted and went radio silent. Hard to defend yourself to people who aren't listening.

24 minutes ago, Khscarymovie4 said:

So are we all fine with the Lynch being early? I find it very odd that everyone is just ok with the lynch today. If scum are as wounded as I think they are I feel like they would be putting up more of a fight if we were lynching a scum. Motti, Veers, Kormac, any of you going to vote? Kormac has stuck me as incredible odd, he is usually very talkative, here I keep forgetting he's here.

I do think we settled a little early. However, if the crowd is right on the lynch, whata you think the scum could do? At this moment any defense or attempt to change the vote will just make the player look suspicious tomorrow (this is if Tarkin is truly scum).

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Captain Needa, I think you're right, personally. I expect Tarkin to flip town, as I've stated. Both his reaction to the voting and the lack of any other push make me convinced of that. However, I doubt at this point things will change, and at least he's confirmed he doesn't have a PR that we'll be losing. 

So given that, I have to assume all the scum are on his vote and the non-voters (Veers, Komec, and myself) are likely town. Which is funny, because both Veers and Komec have been pinging me as scummy all game, but it's just a feeling, not anything I can point to. 

I am trying to look through some votes and pick someone to vote for today. I have some other duties to attend to, but I will be back when I have more analysis to discuss. 

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On 5/3/2018 at 3:59 PM, Actor Builder said:

Ozzel am Town

Look guys, I'm the town vigilante again. I can only kill on alternate nights. 

I'm hopeful someone will remove their vote from me and keep me alive to see another day.

Love you.

 

On 5/3/2018 at 4:12 PM, Peanuts said:

Huh, this was unexpected.

I'm not a huge fan of vigilantes, they tend to srew with the town more than they do with the scum in my experience. But it's unusual for scum to claim vigilante, just because of how easy it is to check up and how you paint a big target on your back if someone else is the real vigilante. And I don't want to lynch the vigilante. I guess it's too late for another lynch now, but I will still try

Unvote: Ozzel (Actor Builder)

Vote: Jellico(Lady K)

 

On 5/3/2018 at 4:16 PM, LegoMonorailFan said:

What the heck is that supposed to mean?! Is that how a loyal town member would act?

@Peanuts changed his vote.

I was surprised when I read the day that there wasn't more of a discussion regarding this exchange. Peanuts vote change alone isn't my main concern, but more the timing. The claim, the vote change, and LegoMonorailFan's quickly pointing it out to Bob all happened within 17 minutes. It felt very coordinated, like they were trying to blindside the town. Also, Peanuts changed the vote to Jellico, now a known scum. I'm just not comfortable how it all played out.

I'm with lynching Tarkin but that lynch is sealed, so for discussion I'm thinking

Vote:Captain Fenton ( Peanuts)

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1 hour ago, LegoMonorailFan said:

Okay, so my thoughts on Thrawn. Thrawn has pointed out many times now that we got lucky by lynching Ozzel since Ozzel's behavior is often like this.

In other words, Thrawn is catching a lot of flack for saying the same thing I am. Personally, I think he's innocent for now.

 

People who play it safe can likely be two things.

1: Traitors.

2: Third party players.

Keep the latter in mind tomorrow if he's to be considered as a potential lynch.

That's a fair suspicion, but the following is rather off.

:wacko: Being the first to vote on something doesn't mean you "guided a vote". Most of the votes for me consist of a few people who have actual suspicions of me, and then a whole lot of bandwagoners. 

Right now your pretty high on my scum radar. Can't recall if I voiced the concerns, but these suspicions I have of you go back to day one. So I'm going to change my vote so when people look back on today, they'll have a concrete documentation to remind them of my suspicions.

Unvote: Admiral Piett (Sandy)

Vote: Admiral Shelby (Forresto)

Another thing I'm concerned about is those who might voice concern saying that they think I might be innocent. That way when I flip town, they can say "see?! I knew he was town".

WOW, cheers!

I could've easily voted for you to dissapear into that crowd if I was scum. Why would I take a risk and not do that? It's because I suspect Thrawn more then you.

We clashed all of yesterday because I was leading the charge against Ozzel, I was pushing abd advocating at hour zero for those last votes to get him lynched while you were amongst the opposition.

You don't seem particularly scummy to me but if you are lynched today, hopefully I'm wrong.

How does saying Thrawn guided the vote against you make me scummy? He did by virture voting so quickly off the bat (I'd give him benefit of coincidence of timing irl but he won't even concede that with Yularen and my votes on Ozzel).

So please elaborate, you've said you've felt off about me since day one? 

I helped start the vote for Ozzel, I kept it relevant to the discussion the whole day, and I made sure he was lynched in the end.

Tell me what winning strategy is starting a vote against a scum member at the begining of the day, keep bringing it up constantly through the day when attention moves elsewhere, and to make sure we get the last votes to get him lynched?

Because Ozzel wouldn't have been lynched if I hadn't been the annoying thorn pushing for it.

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I've been looking through the voting. I've found a couple people I raised my rating of (meaning I'm leaning loyal on them) so far. That's worth discussion as much as who's scummy. 

1. Daala. I know she's been popular to vote for. However, look at day 2's votes. The two traitors voted for Daala as the 2nd and 3rd votes on her. Seems logical, if you're looking for a way to take the heat off of Ozzel. It'd be worth doing even if Daala was on the scum team, since it'd be something to point to later. But Jellico didn't just vote, she built a significant sized case on Daala. Enough so that I'm now leaning town on Daala. 

2. Adm. Piett. Another popular vote target. But look at the end of day 2. Piett was around and commented AFTER the vig claim, but didn't unvote. It would have been a perfect opportunity for Piett to have unvoted (like someone else tried to do...) without being suspicious and have saved the traitor from lynch. But Piett didn't. So again, that's making me lean strongly town. Additionally, later in the day Jellico threw a vote on Piett, bringing the count to 3 there as well, trying to distract from the votes building on her. 

 

So who's pinging me as scummy? Still working on that. 

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Other notes on people:

Veers was the hammer vote on Ozzel. So either he's town, or it was part of a mis-timed plan to hammer, Ozzel claim vig, and Ozzel be saved. Seems risky and prone to all the issues already discussed about Fenton early in the day.

Dellus didn't vote yesterday. That's not usually something traitors would do - but in this event, why not? It seems like a vanilla town move ("I was busy, sorry everyone") and not something scum would risk, but since the penalty votes apply on the day of the non-voting, NOT THE NEXT DAY like is normal for hunts I've been on, he knew they would be meaningless in this case. Day 1 he was solidly middle of the pack on posting (right in my scummo sweet spot). Day 2 basically gone. Day 3, no comment on why he was gone yesterday. 1 comment on mechanics (how many scum?), a weak, middle of the pack vote for Tarkin, and then 1 more post questioning why I hadn't voted yet. 

So given that, I will

Vote: Dellus (LegoRacer1)

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Vote Count: 
Grand Moff Tarkin / LegoMonorailFan - 7 (mediumsnowman, KotZ, Sandy, Peanuts, LegoRacer1, Tariq j, Rider Raider) 
Grand Admiral Thrawn / mediumsnowman - 2 (Khscarymovie4, Forresto)
Admiral Shelby / Forresto - 1 (LegoMonorailFan)
Captain Fenton / Peanuts - 1 (jluck)
Colonel Dellus / LegoRacer1 - 1 (mostlytechnic)

The day will continue. 24 hours remain in the day. 

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I am back from some of my extra duties and have some catching up to do in terms of what's happened today, also in light of the previous days as well.  I think we do ourselves a disservice if we narrow the field too much.  I will say that I agree the combined efforts of Ozzel and Jellico to lynch Daala have Daala firmly in the clear, IMO.

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3 hours ago, LegoMonorailFan said:

Okay, so my thoughts on Thrawn. Thrawn has pointed out many times now that we got lucky by lynching Ozzel since Ozzel's behavior is often like this.

In other words, Thrawn is catching a lot of flack for saying the same thing I am. Personally, I think he's innocent for now.

I wouldn't say you two are catching flack for the same thing. Thrawn, the way I see it, has consistently been steering clear of any scum, neither really accusing nor defending them. All he said about Ozzel was "Ozzel is Ozzel, Daala is the same, let's kill Daala" and "I'd rather kill Piett than Jellico" (slightly paraphrased). You actively defended scum members. I think the former is more scummy, because it is what I usually did when I was going on undercover operations, early in my career in the Imperial Navy. But both is scummy, and we can lynch Thrawn tomorrow.

3 hours ago, LegoMonorailFan said:

People who play it safe can likely be two things.

1: Traitors.

2: Third party players.

Keep the latter in mind tomorrow if he's to be considered as a potential lynch.

Are you suggesting Thrawn may be a third party? Why?

3 hours ago, LegoMonorailFan said:

That's a fair suspicion, but the following is rather off.

:wacko: Being the first to vote on something doesn't mean you "guided a vote". Most of the votes for me consist of a few people who have actual suspicions of me, and then a whole lot of bandwagoners. 

Right now your pretty high on my scum radar. Can't recall if I voiced the concerns, but these suspicions I have of you go back to day one. So I'm going to change my vote so when people look back on today, they'll have a concrete documentation to remind them of my suspicions.

Unvote: Admiral Piett (Sandy)

Vote: Admiral Shelby (Forresto)

 

Another thing I'm concerned about is those who might voice concern saying that they think I might be innocent. That way when I flip town, they can say "see?! I knew he was town".

I feel you contradict yourself a bit there. If you are the first to vote and the others are just bandwagoners, it's fair to say you guided the vote. If the other people have suspicions of their own, in an ideal world your vote should have had no influence on them. I was a bit worried about Thrawn casting the first vote, but honestly, what else would he do? Tarkin and Thrawn were the two big suspects today, and he'd need a damn convincing case to get someone else lynched. If he's scum, being the first to vote for Tarkin is the right move, no matter if Tarkin is town or scum. If he's town, being the first to move if also the right move. So I feel Thrawn's vote doesn't say anything about the validity of Tarkin as a lynch target.

2 hours ago, jluck said:

I was surprised when I read the day that there wasn't more of a discussion regarding this exchange. Peanuts vote change alone isn't my main concern, but more the timing. The claim, the vote change, and LegoMonorailFan's quickly pointing it out to Bob all happened within 17 minutes. It felt very coordinated, like they were trying to blindside the town. Also, Peanuts changed the vote to Jellico, now a known scum. I'm just not comfortable how it all played out.

I'm with lynching Tarkin but that lynch is sealed, so for discussion I'm thinking

Vote:Captain Fenton ( Peanuts)

About the timing, it was random, at least on my part. It's 10pm, which is a good time to be active for me. No idea about Tarkin, maybe the scum were just waiting for someone to unvote, or maybe they were waiting for one of their own to unvote and I surprised them, or maybe it was uncoordinated. Here's a question, though: Assuming this was all a coordinated scum plot, why not execute it before the time runs out? If Vader had sent us all to sleep on time, none of it would have happened to begin with.

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