21314 TRON: Legacy Revealed

[Blondie-Wan]

1 hour ago, Scarilian said:

This set is easily the worst in regards to Price to Parts ratio and i dont see the justification in that when other licensed Ideas themes are so cheap in comparison - the only set even remotely close in terms of price per piece ratio is the Hayabusa and that was back when it was Lego Cuusoo. I understand that multiple aspects affect pricing, but a set based on a movie released in 2010 that was not that popular at the time should not have a higher license than all the other active licenses here. I understand Tron is connected to more than just the movie license, but it's not priced well for what it offers.

Ideas sets;
Tron Legacy - Price per piece; 13.0p / 15.2c / 15.2c
Hayabusa - Price per piece; 12.2p / 13.5c / 13.5c
Big Bang - Price per piece; 10.3p / 12.4c / 12.4c
Beatles - Price per piece; 9.9p / 10.8c / 10.8c
Research Institute - Price per piece; 9.7p / 12.1c / 12.1c
Caterham Seven - Price per piece; 9.7p / 10.4c / 10.4c
Exo-Suit - Price per piece; 9.3p / 10.9c / 10.9c
Adventure Time - Price per piece; 9.1p / 10.1c / 10.1c
Ghostbusters Car - Price per piece; 8.9p / 9.8c / 9.8c
Women of Nasa - Price per piece; 8.7p / 10.8c / 10.8c
DeLorean Time Machine - Price per piece; 8.7p / 8.7c / 10.0c
Mars Rover - Price per piece; 8.5p / 10.2c / 10.2c
Doctor Who - Price per piece; 8.0p / 9.6c / 6.7c
Maze - Price per piece; 7.8p / 9.1c / 9.1c
Ship in a Bottle - Price per piece; 7.3p / 7.3c / 7.3c
Minecraft - Price per piece; 7.3p / 7.3c / 7.3c
Birds - Price per piece; 6.9p / 7.8c / 7.8c
Fishing Store - Price per piece; 6.8p / 7.3c / 7.3c
WALL-E - Price per piece; 5.9p / 8.9c / 7.4c
Saturn V - Price per piece; 5.6p / 6.1c / 6.1c

Several of those sets have no minifigures, and only three have a higher percentage of their parts given over to minifigures. And if I'm not mistaken, no Ideas sets have a higher percentage of their parts that are printed. It's also a small set, and small, figure-rich and print-rich sets are naturally going to tend to have higher prices per piece. Were this not the case, we could reasonably expect individual "CMFs" to cost a minute fraction of what they do - under a dollar, say. No other Ideas set has this particular set's precise combination of minifigure count, print count, and size, which makes direct comparisons difficult, but I believe it's fairly priced.

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I dont think you see the issue, here is the Lego version compared to a Tron Legacy version.

The main flaw of the design is that you can easily describe the Lego one as two circular wheels with a rectangle connecting them. It's blocky by design rather than limitations of Lego. The Tron Legacy version you cannot give that description due to the curved middle that raises it and makes the vehicle have a different overall feel. The Lego Tron Legacy version attempts to trick you with a curved inaccurate exterior piece and a random slanted piece on the back of the bike with no attempt being made to even remotely change the middle design from looking flat to being curved.

You're right; I don't see the issue. It very much looks like an attempt to do so to me, and a fairly successful one at that. Certainly the midsection of LEGO's model is more curvilinear than a mere rectangle, in part due to the same piece whose inclusion you decry. The inherent limitations of not just LEGO in general but the minifigure in particular are naturally going to drastically impact any attempt to recreate in minifigure scale an essentially human-sized vehicle whose look is so profoundly shaped by its rider. It is unfortunate you are disappointed, and you're entitled to your disappointment, but I think your comment about what was attempted is unwarranted, and I also think you're being unduly harsh. Certainly the model is instantly recognizable to anyone familiar with Tron as a Tron light cycle, as opposed to a real-world bike, an Akira one, or whatever.

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It has been documented for years, the most notable example can be comparing the 2016 AT-ST to the 2017 version in which the piece count dropped by 70 while the price increased.

In general it is a 10% increase among Star Wars sets. In 2017 they bumped up prices again and they are planning to do so again in 2018.

... while all other lines will experience price stagnation, one presumes.

Star Wars set pricing is skewed by the routine inclusion of much larger sets than most other lines can support, but at those price points at which other sets may be found, Star Wars sets in general - perhaps not in your solitary example, but in aggregate across all lines - offer what I think is comparable value.

Edited March 23, 2018 by Blondie-Wan

[julesvincent]

Well, here is an interview with a Star Wars Designer: https://www.promobricks.de/promobricks-im-gespraech-mit-dem-chef-designer-der-lego-star-wars-linie/55540

Especially the last part ("Worst Lego Star Wars set of all time") it says:

For many fans, the FO AT-ST is the worst Lego SW set of all times. Of course, the designers disagreed. But they agreed on one thing: the price of the set is too high. But Lego does not have the last word considering the price. Holders of IP's have a big voice when considering prices, which led to the discrepancy here.

Now guess who holds the Star Wars AND the Tron IP? I think Disney made the price here!

[Mac Daddy]

Easy buy for me as an Ideas and Tron fan. Love it!

[Scarilian]

12 hours ago, Blondie-Wan said:

No other Ideas set has this particular set's precise combination of minifigure count, print count, and size, which makes direct comparisons difficult, but I believe it's fairly priced.

Getting incredibly specific here. If you want to compare specific features, then take a look at Women Of Nasa with four figures, tons of unique figure printing and unique printed pieces, some dual molded legs, 231 pieces and priced at $10/£10/€10 cheaper than the Tron set. To me, the Tron Cycle should not have been priced more than that set. Its that $10/£10/€10 addition that people are having trouble justifying. If you like the set that is fine, i'm not trying to change your viewpoints merely explaining my own - to me the set disappoints in regards to the bikes, but excels in regards to the printing of Flynn and Qoura - Rinzler could have used his arm print though and the printed mask is not accurate (They printed the reflection of the mask onto the mask and it looks weird)

12 hours ago, Blondie-Wan said:

Certainly the midsection of LEGO's model is more curvilinear than a mere rectangle, in part due to the same piece whose inclusion you decry. The inherent limitations of not just LEGO in general but the minifigure in particular are naturally going to drastically impact any attempt to recreate in minifigure scale an essentially human-sized vehicle whose look is so profoundly shaped by its rider.

Adding stuff to the upper sides does not fix the bottom of the build - the bottom is flat. This is clearly not a limitation of the building system given it has been tackled by a variety of fan versions including the originally submitted Ideas version.Here are some examples; 2011 Tron Cycle MOC, 2015 Ideas Tron Cycle, 2016 Tron Cycle Chase, 2017 Tron Legacy Light Cycle and more...

12 hours ago, Blondie-Wan said:

It is unfortunate you are disappointed, and you're entitled to your disappointment, but I think your comment about what was attempted is unwarranted, and I also think you're being unduly harsh. Certainly the model is instantly recognizable to anyone familiar with Tron as a Tron light cycle, as opposed to a real-world bike, an Akira one, or whatever.

My comment is not remotely unwarranted or harsh and is echo'd on a majority of Lego sites - if they make a product that people do not like then people are going to criticize it. Tron fans realized shortly after the movie that the exterior wheels along with the rest of the body are a shell - they do not move. Lego has either ignored this or thought that the set needed moving wheels and decided to have the exterior shell move - in a similar sense they either attempted something with the flat main segment and gave up or they did not attempt something with the flat main segment - either way, they left the flat main segment.

The model is recognizable due to the layout of the bike and the colour scheme - the core idea is still there regardless of the execution. This is recognizably a Tron Light Cycle also - it does not change the fact that the build for the official set is lacking. I've seen people dismiss the bikes, which should be the main reason to buy the set, in favor of the figures.

Edited March 23, 2018 by Scarilian

[Blondie-Wan]

2 hours ago, Scarilian said:

Getting incredibly specific here. If you want to compare specific features, then take a look at Women Of Nasa with four figures, tons of unique figure printing and unique printed pieces, some dual molded legs, 231 pieces and priced at $10/£10/€10 cheaper than the Tron set. To me, the Tron Cycle should not have been priced more than that set. Its that $10/£10/€10 addition that people are having trouble justifying. If you like the set that is fine, i'm not trying to change your viewpoints merely explaining my own - to me the set disappoints in regards to the bikes, but excels in regards to the printing of Flynn and Qoura - Rinzler could have used his arm print though and the printed mask is not accurate (They printed the reflection of the mask onto the mask and it looks weird)

Women of NASA is great, but it is a less substantial build than the TRON: Legacy set or nearly any other Ideas set, and was criticized as such. It has one piece more, but a less substantial build overall. And while it does have an excellent assortment of prints, it does still have fewer prints than this one.

2 hours ago, Scarilian said:

 

 

Adding stuff to the upper sides does not fix the bottom of the build - the bottom is flat. This is clearly not a limitation of the building system given it has been tackled by a variety of fan versions including the originally submitted Ideas version.Here are some examples; 2011 Tron Cycle MOC, 2015 Ideas Tron Cycle, 2016 Tron Cycle Chase, 2017 Tron Legacy Light Cycle and more...

My comment is not remotely unwarranted or harsh and is echo'd on a majority of Lego sites - if they make a product that people do not like then people are going to criticize it. Tron fans realized shortly after the movie that the exterior wheels along with the rest of the body are a shell - they do not move. Lego has either ignored this or thought that the set needed moving wheels and decided to have the exterior shell move - in a similar sense they either attempted something with the flat main segment and gave up or they did not attempt something with the flat main segment - either way, they left the flat main segment.

I think the important thing isn't the appearance of movement in the wheels, but the fact they mean the bike can actually go. Would you prefer that the bike be static?

 

2 hours ago, Scarilian said:

This is recognizably a Tron Light Cycle also - it does not change the fact that the build for the official set is lacking. 

But that's a subjective assessment, not a fact.

[Scarilian]

6 hours ago, Blondie-Wan said:

Women of NASA is great, but it is a less substantial build than the TRON: Legacy set or nearly any other Ideas set, and was criticized as such. It has one piece more, but a less substantial build overall. And while it does have an excellent assortment of prints, it does still have fewer prints than this one.

I think the important thing isn't the appearance of movement in the wheels, but the fact they mean the bike can actually go. Would you prefer that the bike be static?

I'll grant you that the Tron Legacy set includes some larger pieces than the Women of NASA ('WoN') set - though the 'WoN' set had three main builds including a rocket and all has a thicker base. I cannot really compare the two, as i do not own the Tron Legacy set - but i'd be interested to see a comparison when people inevitably end up getting the set. It looks like the bike may be roughly the same size as the rocket in the 'WoN' set.

The original bike was static and received 10,000 supporters for that design and the base plate is intended for static display also. I doubt people as such expected wheel movement, and while it has it's benefits that i do understand, it's not something that particularly motivates me to go and get the set anymore than if the wheels were static. I'd still end up displaying or depicting the vehicles racing regardless of if the wheels are static or not.

6 hours ago, Blondie-Wan said:

But that's a subjective assessment, not a fact.

If how recognizable something is, is subjective - then your point about the official model being recognizable is also subjective. I can use the same criteria and it applies to almost every Tron Cycle MOC. This is probably a Tron Legacy Cycle at its most core level. You need very little to make a set recognizable other than specific aspects of it's design.

Edited March 24, 2018 by Scarilian

[Venefic]

 

To be honest I don't see a wow factor in this set and I'm especially put off by the ppp ratio. It doesn't really reflect what the IDEAS branches purpose is. I'd like to see more ideas that are not based on licensed themes. 

[x105Black]

35 minutes ago, Scarilian said:

The original bike was static and received 10,000 supporters for that design and the base plate is intended for static display also. I doubt people as such expected wheel movement, and while it has it's benefits that i do understand, it's not something that particularly motivates me to go and get the set anymore than if the wheels were static. I'd still end up displaying or depicting the vehicles racing regardless of if the wheels are static or not.

I expected it to roll, and would have been disappointed if it did not, despite the original submission lacking that feature.  Ideas is not always about replicating the submitted project.  Largely, people are voting on the idea behind the set more than they are voting on that specific build.  Despite the changes here, it still looks relatively faithful to the original project anyways.  Definitely more than the Ship in a Bottle set did, and I even thought the changes made there made some sense.

[MAB]

5 hours ago, Venefic said:

 It doesn't really reflect what the IDEAS branches purpose is. 

Yes it does. People voted for it. There was a business case for it. LEGO made it. They improved the design to increase the size and hence the price, as I imagine just one bike and figure wouldn't have sold as well and would probably have a cost of more than half of this set.

[Digger of Bricks]

The Brothers Brick - Enter the grid with LEGO Ideas 21314 Tron: Legacy [Review]

[Digger of Bricks]

The New Elementary blog has their own review of the set, though this one is focused primarily on its parts:

New Elementary - LEGO® 21314 TRON: LEGACY

Also, the official designer video:

 

[Cinderbike]

Yeah I'll be buying this day one.

[dforce]

Another comparison I thought of today as I read those reviews. 

"Rhino Face-Off at the Mine" is a new 2018 set that has 223 pieces (just shy of the 230 of TRON) and retails for $19.99 US and 19.99 UK.  It has many large and unique pieces like the legs of the Lugabeast and the two sections of rollercoaster track.  It also comes with 3 unique minifigures that have some superb printing.  Compare that to TRON and you can see the huge difference in price, even when they are both DISNEY properties! 

I'm sure there are some people who can justify the price, but I have to hope it goes on sale.

[x105Black]

Ideas sets tend to have additional money put into the packaging, including the box and booklet.  I don't believe that the Rhino Face-Off set has the number of printed parts included in the TRON set, either.  Both of those are surely factors.

[BrickSantorum]

2 hours ago, dforce said:

Another comparison I thought of today as I read those reviews. 

"Rhino Face-Off at the Mine" is a new 2018 set that has 223 pieces (just shy of the 230 of TRON) and retails for $19.99 US and 19.99 UK.  It has many large and unique pieces like the legs of the Lugabeast and the two sections of rollercoaster track.  It also comes with 3 unique minifigures that have some superb printing.  Compare that to TRON and you can see the huge difference in price, even when they are both DISNEY properties! 

I'm sure there are some people who can justify the price, but I have to hope it goes on sale.

That Black Panther set has probably already sold 10x what the Tron set will ever sell. The break-even points for each set are wildly different. 

[ToaDraco]

It's now available on S@H! I got mine ordered, I can't wait to build it when it arrives!

Edited March 31, 2018 by ToaDraco

[jonwil]

Bought this today from the Dreamworld LEGO store and its awesome, even at the price I paid for it (Although I am a HUGE TRON fan and this was always "shut up and take my money" territory ever since I first saw that it was greenlit for production)

 

 

[sed6]

On 3/22/2018 at 9:22 PM, Johnny1360 said:

Edit; it's like this should be $19.99, okay it is an Ideas set $24.99, and licensed okay $29.99, what $34.99 no thanks. 

So $5.00 makes the difference? Most of us waste that each day on fast food, coffee, etc...

Just bought mine tonight! Love it! Several pieces included that I don't yet have. While it's smaller than  I thought it's still worth the price. I paid just $16 because I had VIP points, a great PPP value!

[Johnny1360]

Yes that last $5 was the straw that broke the camels back, for me anyway. I just have to say no at some point. 

I am glad others like it though, I enjoy seeing the Ideas theme do well. 

[NeutralNoodle]

15 hours ago, Johnny1360 said:

Yes that last $5 was the straw that broke the camels back, for me anyway. I just have to say no at some point. 

I am glad others like it though, I enjoy seeing the Ideas theme do well. 

Agreed, lucky for me though I had a $5 credit from VIP points so I got it anyways. 

[manglegrat]

Pricing merits aside, this was sold out when I popped in to the Calgary Lego Store earlier today. Gah.

Probably just the result of the keeners emptying out the first shipment, though. Another shipment is due shortly. Can't see there being a longterm shortage, but it kinda ticked me off since I only went down there for that! Should've checked, I guess. 

[rodiziorobs]

I saw this set at my local Lego Store yesterday (on display in the window, not for sale--they were sold out) and thought to myself, "hmmm. That is a pretty good looking set. I take it back, it's totally worth the $20 price tag." It wasn't until I got back to my car I remembered it was $30, and not until posting this now I realized it is actually $35.

It is a very slick set, I'll give them that. The display base is a nice touch and supports the prestige pricing, somewhat. I can see how someone invested in the source material might be willing to pay that much, but I for one would only consider it at half the asking price.

Good luck to those trying to track this one down! Hopefully they mistakenly overproduce them so the rest of us can find them marked down, Exo-suit style.

[ToaDraco]

7 hours ago, rodiziorobs said:

I saw this set at my local Lego Store yesterday (on display in the window, not for sale--they were sold out) and thought to myself, "hmmm. That is a pretty good looking set. I take it back, it's totally worth the $20 price tag." It wasn't until I got back to my car I remembered it was $30, and not until posting this now I realized it is actually $35.

It is a very slick set, I'll give them that. The display base is a nice touch and supports the prestige pricing, somewhat. I can see how someone invested in the source material might be willing to pay that much, but I for one would only consider it at half the asking price.

Good luck to those trying to track this one down! Hopefully they mistakenly overproduce them so the rest of us can find them marked down, Exo-suit style.

I am definitely one of those fans who had no problem forking over the money for the set. In addition to LEGO I also collect Transformers(official and 3rd party), video game memorabilia and I'm starting to get into Gunpla(Gundam model kit building) so compared to those other hobbies the markup price for this is much easier to swallow. Having $10 in VIP also helped. Mine should be here in the mail tomorrow but I do hope they made enough copies of this set to ensure everyone who wants it can get it. I'm still kicking myself for not getting the Exo-suit...

[eldiano]

Honestly I thought the 34 dollars for this set was not bad at all, certainly cheap from the high end sets i've been buying. I love Tron and i'm one of those rare ones who liked Legacy so this set hits a nail in the head, my lego store had like 15 of the sets and I must have gotten the first one but overall I LOVE IT, I love it even more that on the Lego Ideas Blog entry they stated they plan to release Clu also which was mind blogging to me as to my we got rinzler instead, but the minifigs are detailed, the lightcycles are fun to build my only gripe is the handles should be black rather than grey, it's a clever build, although you get used to the design but overall not bad at all!

[x105Black]

I don't know if they have outright stated that they plan to release Clu.  I saw that they made a cryptic comment that used Clu's name as a pun, but I'm not sure they ever said anything more about it.