Blk69

How should I rebuild my bogies for bearings?

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So I made a spontaneous decision to purchase 50 of the small bearing for my Lego trains.  They should be coming in a week or so. Today, I looked at my stock bogies and there is no place to put a bearing in there.  They just pinch the axel in the middle.  Anyone have a guide on how to rebuild stock  bogies?   Hoping someone smarter that me has already figured this out.  I found these examples on the net.

This is what I have stock.  

Image result for lego train bogie

This one uses a technic brick per side.  Looks fairly straight forward, bearing should fit in the holes.  I don't have any spare outer pieces to hold the wheels in place.  

Image result for lego train bogie

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Without the bearings it will be a little difficult to think along of course, so maybe you can also share them? And possibly more people here would be interested in sharing the details on the bearings!

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I tried for you and I found that lego train wheels do not need bearings, by puting the bearings inside the wheel holder It rolled less than without. 

I also tried the motor-shaped bogie, the wheel were barely kept in place by the flanges. It rolled better than with a cross axle through the technic brick but not as well as standart lego train wheel (I tried with the 2878c02).

Unless you want to avoid using the train wheel holder to make more detailled  bogies, I would recomend you let them how they are.

 

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If you're looking to rebuild the stock bearings then the second image is probably your best bet, unless you want to build your own sideframes. Like you said, just fit the bearing into the axle hole, stick the axle through the bearings, and add the wheels. Sometimes a drop of glue is needed to keep the wheels from falling off. There's more details in this thread, which you probably already saw. 

On 1/19/2018 at 9:11 AM, Tbx Nicolas said:

Unless you want to avoid using the train wheel holder to make more detailled  bogies, I would recomend you let them how they are.

What sort of setup did you use with the bearings when you tested? I ask because the bearings perform better than everything I try, especially the standard Lego wheel holders. The friction is so little that my heavy 8x60+ stud passenger cars start to roll on what I thought was a flat surface! Practically everyone I talk to finds the same benefits.

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^ Agree and concur with Matt. Ball bearings have been far superior for any of my train cars, especially the larger and heavier cars. I too have had cars roll towards the edge of tables due to lack of friction.

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Has anyone explored the possibility of ball bearings that would fit a tecnic axle? I could see it being a pain to try to mount them in lego, but it would solve a lot of problems where the use of technic axles cannot be avoided.

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7 hours ago, zephyr1934 said:

Has anyone explored the possibility of ball bearings that would fit a tecnic axle? I could see it being a pain to try to mount them in lego, but it would solve a lot of problems where the use of technic axles cannot be avoided.

Yup:

156zz ball bearings

By legoman666 on flickr (Andy). The custom technic brick is 3D printed to house a 156zz bearing. I'm told it also works quite well.

 

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3 hours ago, Glenn Holland said:

Yup:

156zz ball bearings

By legoman666 on flickr (Andy). The custom technic brick is 3D printed to house a 156zz bearing. I'm told it also works quite well.

 

DUBs-T-F! I can give roller bearings to my EN!? Wow! This is super cool!

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11 hours ago, Glenn Holland said:

Yup:

 

By legoman666 on flickr (Andy). The custom technic brick is 3D printed to house a 156zz bearing. I'm told it also works quite well.

 

Cool. Can it be done by drilling or milling a real LEGO brick to hold the 156zz bearing?   Gotta get some 156zz bearings to try out.

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1 hour ago, dr_spock said:

Cool. Can it be done by drilling or milling a real LEGO brick to hold the 156zz bearing?   Gotta get some 156zz bearings to try out.

With a sharp drill bit, probably. A lathe with a 4 jaw chuck or a mill would work best I'd think. 

I used a few 156zz's in my BNSF SD70ACe. Runs good :)

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@Blk69 Usually ball bearings are not inserted into the wheel holder, instead they are inserted into the holes of technic bricks, e.g. into a 1x2 technic brick with 1 or 2 holes.

 

Your original question made me wonder, if it is possibe to put ball bearings into the LEGO wheel holder (part 2878). I came up with a solution that works very well but unfortunately requires a small irreversible modification to the wheel holder:

1. Cut the two clips that prevent the axle to fall out of the holder. A sharp knife can be used (see below).

2. Push the complete axle assembly with two ball bearings and wheels into the holder.

3. Make sure the ball bearings are correctly aligned on top of the plastic support (see red arrows).

25210157997_34bfcd5a81_b.jpg

 

This Video shows how well the ball bearings perform compared with the standard wheel holder.

As I already mentioned, the disadvantage is that you need to cut the two clips of the wheel holder. Afterwards, you cannot use the wheel holder anymore without ball bearings, else the axle would fall out of the holder each time you lift it from the tracks.

I wonder if it is possible to come up with a different solution that allows to insert the ball bearings without cutting the clips. This requires to push the ball bearings a little bit deeper into the wheel holder. However, this does not work if you place the ball bearings on top of the plastic supports (see picture 2). 

Best regards

Arnold

 

 

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On 2/4/2018 at 1:36 PM, Legopold said:

@Blk69 Usually ball bearings are not inserted into the wheel holder, instead they are inserted into the holes of technic bricks, e.g. into a 1x2 technic brick with 1 or 2 holes.

 

Your original question made me wonder, if it is possibe to put ball bearings into the LEGO wheel holder (part 2878). I came up with a solution that works very well but unfortunately requires a small irreversible modification to the wheel holder:

1. Cut the two clips that prevent the axle to fall out of the holder. A sharp knife can be used (see below).

2. Push the complete axle assembly with two ball bearings and wheels into the holder.

3. Make sure the ball bearings are correctly aligned on top of the plastic support (see red arrows).

25210157997_34bfcd5a81_b.jpg

 

This Video shows how well the ball bearings perform compared with the standard wheel holder.

As I already mentioned, the disadvantage is that you need to cut the two clips of the wheel holder. Afterwards, you cannot use the wheel holder anymore without ball bearings, else the axle would fall out of the holder each time you lift it from the tracks.

I wonder if it is possible to come up with a different solution that allows to insert the ball bearings without cutting the clips. This requires to push the ball bearings a little bit deeper into the wheel holder. However, this does not work if you place the ball bearings on top of the plastic supports (see picture 2). 

Best regards

Arnold

 

 

You are a genius.  This solution is much better than what I came up with.  I was planning on cutting the ends of the holders and use a 1 X 2 brick with two holes (need the double hole brick as hole need to be right at the stud, technic bricks are off set from the studs).  Holder has enough clutch to secure this 1 x 2, like you idea better.  Is it ok if I use your method? 

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3 hours ago, Blk69 said:

You are a genius.  This solution is much better than what I came up with.  I was planning on cutting the ends of the holders and use a 1 X 2 brick with two holes (need the double hole brick as hole need to be right at the stud, technic bricks are off set from the studs).  Holder has enough clutch to secure this 1 x 2, like you idea better.  Is it ok if I use your method? 

Sure! I am pleased that my answer was helpful to you.

I also recommend this thread, which gives some ideas how to create beautiful train bogies with ball bearing without using the wheel holder at all.

While I like using the wheel holder for two-axle cars, I prefer to use train bogies without the wheel holder for four-axle cars.For those, I create my bogies similar to the ones shown in the aformentioned thread.

 

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Legopold, I tried modifying my stock axle holders as you suggested above.  Results were not great.  Was able to to get rid of the squeaking, but wheels do not want to turn freely in the bearings.  I did not cut out the two build in clips (in the middle of the holder, didn't seam to be interfering with operation).  Believe what is happening is the bearings are slipping to deep in the axle holder and the axle is rubbing on the bottom.  I tried some tests using multiple axle holders and results varied greatly (some actually worked quire well while others didn't...they all look similar).  I got some after market axles that are slightly smaller diameter than Lego.  I tried using these and results were much better.  Believe they are just spinning inside the bearing (reduced friction and no squeak).  Would perfer to keep my Lego axles but might have to change them out.

Definitely the axles are rubbing on something causing me problems.  Thinking about it now, maybe the clips in the middle of the axle holder are binding things up.  Didn't seam to when I looked at them thou.  Will look into this further.

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3 hours ago, Blk69 said:

Believe what is happening is the bearings are slipping to deep in the axle holder and the axle is rubbing on the bottom.

This happens when you do not place the bearings exactly on the right position. They need to be placed right on the plastic support indicated by the red arrows in the picture above. If you do not put them there, they will slip too deep into the wheel holder and cause the problems you described. If you put them at the right position, they will have contact to the plastic clips and that's the reason why you need to cut those (as described above).

 

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8 hours ago, Blk69 said:

Legopold, I tried modifying my stock axle holders as you suggested above.  Results were not great.  Was able to to get rid of the squeaking, but wheels do not want to turn freely in the bearings.  I did not cut out the two build in clips (in the middle of the holder, didn't seam to be interfering with operation).  Believe what is happening is the bearings are slipping to deep in the axle holder and the axle is rubbing on the bottom.  I tried some tests using multiple axle holders and results varied greatly (some actually worked quire well while others didn't...they all look similar).  I got some after market axles that are slightly smaller diameter than Lego.  I tried using these and results were much better.  Believe they are just spinning inside the bearing (reduced friction and no squeak).  Would perfer to keep my Lego axles but might have to change them out.

Definitely the axles are rubbing on something causing me problems.  Thinking about it now, maybe the clips in the middle of the axle holder are binding things up.  Didn't seam to when I looked at them thou.  Will look into this further.

What size after-market axles did you get? 

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I don' t know the exact size.  Seller just said would work with Lego axle carries and wheels.  Know they are slightly smaller in dia thou as the bearing slide right thru these, the Lego ones need a little tap with the hammer.

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Did some more experiments this morning.  Cut out the axle holder clips on one piece.  Had no effect on performance.  Got my flashlight and out and really checked things out.  Have multiple issues.

The main one is the wheels themselves want to bind in the decorative side piece

https://www.bricklink.com/v2/catalog/catalogitem.page?P=2871b&idColor=11#T=S&C=11&O={"color":11,"iconly":0}

Because the bearings are a press fit on my Lego axles, the wheel get stuck rubbing against this side piece.  I can push it out of the way, but seams like keeps getting suck here again.  On my O scale model railroad,  the points on the wheels are supposed to ride in the side piece (that is its bearing...believe that is what it is called even thou its not a true bearing just a hole in the plasic for the wheel point (center) to ride in.  Lego wheels appear not designed to ride in them. My wheels have some slack in the holders, they move a bit. Not sure how I'm going to remedy this

 

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