Technic 2018 Set Discussion

[Aventador2004]

54 minutes ago, vectormatic said:

are we seriously counting a seat as a feature in a technic set now?

 

And doors.. a bunch of liftarms and a panel rotating on a pin.. unless there is some underlying more complex mechanism like in the enzo or 42039, i dont feel like they count as a function, not on a medium or larger sized technic set

Yes, they do.

They still are doors, and they move just like 42077.

Btw, if this seems snarky, I don't mean it as such. I just am putting my opinion out there.

[Saberwing40k]

6 hours ago, Jim said:

You are seriously comparing the 42077 with the 42037?! 

I get that some of you want it to be a supercar or something, but this is what it is. A cool looking rally car with basic functionality. That is, driving, steering, suspension, opening hood, trunk and that's about it. I fail to see why this is a problem.

This thing will probably sell like hot cakes! No need for more than these functions.

It's a problem because Technic is about looks AND functions, and Lego's ethos has ALWAYS been about doing more than the minimum. Plus, it would be easy to have a cool looking rally car with lots of technical functions, but no, we're doing another rehash of the same old suspension and steering, and direct engine drive.

This set has no technical innovation or merit, when it would have been easy to add. And, before you say anything about kids not caring, the kind of kids that buy Technic would.

[1gor]

7 hours ago, vectormatic said:

are we seriously counting a seat as a feature in a technic set now?

 

And doors.. a bunch of liftarms and a panel rotating on a pin.. unless there is some underlying more complex mechanism like in the enzo or 42039, i dont feel like they count as a function, not on a medium or larger sized technic set

We understand a point, but sometimes simple is also nice, specially when concept is working well like suspension 

[Jim]

8 hours ago, Saberwing40k said:

It's a problem because Technic is about looks AND functions, and Lego's ethos has ALWAYS been about doing more than the minimum. Plus, it would be easy to have a cool looking rally car with lots of technical functions, but no, we're doing another rehash of the same old suspension and steering, and direct engine drive.

This set has no technical innovation or merit, when it would have been easy to add. And, before you say anything about kids not caring, the kind of kids that buy Technic would.

For us it might seem as a rehash, for most kids this is new. They will get one or two cars during their active Technic period. So the functions in this car are adequate. When you want more functionality, get an Excavator or Crane Truck or something. Even the Sailing Yacht has some cool functions. 

I really don't think that kids wanting this car will be disappointed by the lack of functions. They just want this cool looking rally car. And that's just what this is.

Looking at Technic cars over time, they didn't have a lot more functions than the current (non-flagship) cars. Mostly suspension and steering. Occasionally there's a winch or something, but that's about it.

[Jim]

However....don't get me wrong....I would have loved the rally car to have an extra feature. But I can easily accept the fact that this is just a rally car.

[jorgeopesi]

I agree with Jim, I am the first disappointed but my level of demand is not fair, every year brings new children without idea about Technic so Lego doesn't need to improve itself every year.

[Jim]

Just now, jorgeopesi said:

I agree with Jim, I am the first disappointed but my level of demand is not fair, every year brings new children without idea about Technic so Lego doesn't need to improve itself every year.

Exactly. A Technic car needs to stand out in stores, so bright vibrant colors with flashy stickers. Grannie, mom or dad won't know this car doesn't have extra functions. They will buy it, because kids love cars and this car looks cool. And when the kid looks at the model in stores he will definitely not say "I like this car, but it doesn't have a lot of functions, so I will skip this one". This car has the functions a kid would expect this car to have. No more...no less. Admittedly, I am looking at it from a business point of view, instead of an AFOL point of view.

I was disappointed that the 300 euro Porsche didn't have flexible drive height or rear wheel steering. On a 300 euro model, you expect some extra features. 

[Saberwing40k]

I still am not convinced, especially at this price point. Furthermore, I think you're wrong about how kids think about this. For kids, more features are better, and I can speak from personal experience, working at a toy store, that a lot of grandparents put more thought into a toy, like what it does, and other things, so the kids don't get bored. And, real talk, I think Lego needs to do more, in Technic and elsewhere, to compete with video games and the like. Lastly, I don't think the opinions of children are relevant on this forum. I see this as being a forum for us older fans, and their opinions, and I can't help but think you're disparaging that with the "It's for kids" excuse. It's good to keep perspective, as to why Lego does things, but that doesn't mean we have to like it. 

Man did we get sidetracked. How about we just agree to disagree on this issue of what kids like? It's not like we can prove the argument one way or the other. All this discussion does is sidetrack the thread, an work people up over nothing.

[Vectormatic]

Just now, Jim said:

Exactly. A Technic car needs to stand out in stores, so bright vibrant colors with flashy stickers. Grannie, mom or dad won't know this car doesn't have extra functions. They will buy it, because kids love cars and this car looks cool. And when the kid looks at the model in stores he will definitely not say "I like this car, but it doesn't have a lot of functions, so I will skip this one". This car has the functions a kid would expect this car to have. No more...no less. Admittedly, I am looking at it from a business point of view, instead of an AFOL point of view.

I was disappointed that the 300 euro Porsche didn't have flexible drive height or rear wheel steering. On a 300 euro model, you expect some extra features. 

Ill agree that the car is "good enough" to sell a whole bunch to kids, but is that really all we get to expect from lego? From what we know currently, 42077 is a regression coming from 42000 and 42039, which are the obvious comparisons to make, given subject matter and size/price bracket. How much more effort would it have been to put a front diff in there and link front and back axles with a simple driveshaft? (hell, you dont even need a diff in that one, as it wont inhibit function, and having an open diff in the middle would make it pointless as a rally car)

Ill agree 100% on the porsche by the way, there the "good enough to sell to kids" doesnt fly, and technically speaking, the only thing seperating it from a $99 set like this is the 4 speed flappy padle gearbox, which doesnt run smooth, has an error in the instructions, and it hugely unrealistic compared to the real thing in terms of how it operates. And all the community mods clearly show that better solutions, using lego-legal techniques exist.

4 minutes ago, jorgeopesi said:

I agree with Jim, I am the first disappointed but my level of demand is not fair, every year brings new children without idea about Technic so Lego doesn't need to improve itself every year.

As i said to Jim, is "good enough to sell to kids" really the standard we hold lego to on a big set? And function wise i dont really see this car as a lack of improvement, but a regression compared to previous race cars

[valenciaeric]

The trend seems to be towards more panels covering less tech on the sub 1300 part sets. You have to go to the flagship models to get anything more sophisticated.

[1gor]

1 hour ago, Jim said:

I was disappointed that the 300 euro Porsche didn't have flexible drive height or rear wheel steering. On a 300 euro model, you expect some extra features. 

I was disappointed about price (her in Croatia it was almost 400€ and my incomes are some 850€ and I'm a Professor), so rally car is IMHO best compromise and I'm looking forward to it 

[Jim]

2 hours ago, Saberwing40k said:

Man did we get sidetracked. How about we just agree to disagree on this issue of what kids like? It's not like we can prove the argument one way or the other. All this discussion does is sidetrack the thread, an work people up over nothing.

Hehe, nothing wrong with a good discussion. As long as we stay nice to each other. We're cool no worries.

[Jurss]

2 hours ago, Jim said:

On a 300 euro model, you expect some extra features. 

Anyway it sells good, I suppose. I also bought one, but for 250. 

So will also that rally car sell good. I'm also planning to buy it as only model in 2018 maybe. Who knows what 2H will bring ...

[1gor]

48 minutes ago, Jurss said:

Who knows what 2H will bring ...

So far 1H  is very interesting (specially rally car), so I hope at lease some new parts on set i 2H, remember that LEGO has CLAAS license and it will be almost 2 looooooooooooong years between Xerion and summer 2018

[tgrbailey]

So @Jim and @Sariel are you expecting an delivery soon to do some reviews???

[Jim]

Actually, I expected the review offer already, but I haven't seen it yet.

Sidenote; I am really pressed for time at the moment, so if we get the sets, @Milan will most likely be the one to review them.

[tgrbailey]

Good stuff, it will be good to have something to keep our interest :-) and hopefully will sort out some of the doubts!

Edited November 27, 2017 by tgrbailey

[AOW]

5 hours ago, Jim said:

Looking at Technic cars over time, they didn't have a lot more functions than the current (non-flagship) cars. Mostly suspension and steering. Occasionally there's a winch or something, but that's about it.

I have taken a look at the Technicopedia in order to recall myself all the cars from the past and it is hard for me to classify it. Blakbird has done segregation by:
Super Car / Race Car / Go Cars  / Dune Buggies / 4x4 
Now the 42077 in my opinion should go under the Race Cars category and there would need to face sets as: 8209, 8213, 8216, 8247, 8386, 8440, 8445, 8461, 8674, 8808, 8880(B), 42000, 42039, 42050 

Then in reality we could compare it only to: 42000/39/50 due to the quite similar suspension, engine transition, functions - and how does it looks like ? I think the only one that is quite equal is the 42050 -but this one has 2 nice wheels at the back, V8 and small LA ... but is did not had suspension. So we look at the 42039, which I believe was the H1 flag, was it? What it does better then 42077? It looks to be bigger, has V8, LA for cover engine opening (which can be motorized by adding PF) - still it has the same suspension (well almost) which has seen ages of 8865 (in theoretical point of view nothing in LEGO has changed since) RWD and no more functions. 

 

Lets see yours (all of you) opinions now :) 

 

[iv-tecman]

1 hour ago, I_Igor said:

So far 1H  is very interesting (specially rally car), so I hope at lease some new parts on set i 2H, remember that LEGO has CLAAS license and it will be almost 2 looooooooooooong years between Xerion and summer 2018

 

We can only hope for more farm machinery to go with the CLAAS tractor and Combine Harvester. I find some of the Lego Tractors to be come of the most engaging builds, heck I just like Lego Technic period but the 2016 CLAAS tractor was in a class  of its own , I've never built a Technic model quite like it since in terms of just making me go wow - it was such a sturdy and well designed Technic model. 

I'd have to say the Extreme Adventure in 2017 came close, as that had some really interesting build techniques - the Bucket wheel in 2016 was brilliant, but the CLAAS tractor was brilliant and also solid and fun to take pictures with and play with - even at my age. 

The first half 2018 Technic sets are looking promising. 

[Ivan_M]

6 hours ago, Jim said:

For us it might seem as a rehash, for most kids this is new. They will get one or two cars during their active Technic period. So the functions in this car are adequate.

I disagree. I don't think such Technic models are impulse-buy or bought without study in advance. Target audiance of technic are kids old enough to look for review videos on youtube or to look for the reviews on brickset etc. And if such reviews are full of "seen-before", "nothing new" or "lack of features" I think that it will have some impact. Imagine there would be gearbox - it would be mentioned in every review that is is long time since we got that and how cool is that, that TLG is going to its roots, true succeesor to (insert reviewers favourite lego car set name)...

\\edit, how I would approach rally car:

1) make it smaller, use 43mm wheels, this saves a lot of panels

2) put saved plastic from 1) into 3+R gearbox, if you are still short of budget drop more panels

The current set is big, but empty. The emptyness is hidden by panels

Edited November 27, 2017 by Ivan_M

[AOW]

41 minutes ago, Ivan_M said:

The current set is big, but empty. The emptyness is hidden by panels

+1 !!!! to the point !!!!

[Sariel]

1 hour ago, tgrbailey said:

So @Jim and @Sariel are you expecting an delivery soon to do some reviews???

Not a single word from the Lego company yet. Remember that they had just let some people go and they're generally cutting their expenses.

Edited November 27, 2017 by Sariel

[1gor]

1 hour ago, Ivan_M said:

I disagree. I don't think such Technic models are impulse-buy or bought without study in advance. Target audiance of technic are kids old enough to look for review videos on youtube or to look for the reviews on brickset etc. And if such reviews are full of "seen-before", "nothing new" or "lack of features" I think that it will have some impact. Imagine there would be gearbox - it would be mentioned in every review that is is long time since we got that and how cool is that, that TLG is going to its roots, true succeesor to (insert reviewers favourite lego car set name)...

\\edit, how I would approach rally car:

1) make it smaller, use 43mm wheels, this saves a lot of panels

2) put saved plastic from 1) into 3+R gearbox, if you are still short of budget drop more panels

The current set is big, but empty. The emptyness is hidden by panels

But 3 + R transmission is highly unrealistic, so IMHO this way is much better. For 43mm tire size we need smaller differential because current differential would be few milimeters over ground...

[tgrbailey]

34 minutes ago, Sariel said:

Not a single word from the Lego company yet. Remember that they had just let some people go and they're generally cutting their expenses.

This is true!

Do you usually know they are coming or do they just land on your doorstep?

[1gor]

1 hour ago, iv-tecman said:

 

We can only hope for more farm machinery to go with the CLAAS tractor and Combine Harvester. I find some of the Lego Tractors to be come of the most engaging builds, heck I just like Lego Technic period but the 2016 CLAAS tractor was in a class  of its own , I've never built a Technic model quite like it since in terms of just making me go wow - it was such a sturdy and well designed Technic model. 

I'd have to say the Extreme Adventure in 2017 came close, as that had some really interesting build techniques - the Bucket wheel in 2016 was brilliant, but the CLAAS tractor was brilliant and also solid and fun to take pictures with and play with - even at my age. 

The first half 2018 Technic sets are looking promising. 

Agree