Bregir

Brethren of the Brick Seas (BoBS) Intro Thread, Era II

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13 minutes ago, Roadmonkeytj said:

.. Is there a list of the GM members to contact reguarding npc nations somewhere for future reference?

There is a topic Somewhere with all the leaders, but I dont know if there is specified who is in court or doing npc or handeling t or a mcra.

I wouldnt even be able to tell you if (never mind who) there are any searats players in any of those groups. 

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1 hour ago, Roadmonkeytj said:

Because currently thats the only "black flag" ships in the SR fleets ..

As Genaro has explained, the SR ships that originally attacked Prio are marked black flag too, as they committed piracy and was very clearly caught in the act. (Sailing into the sake port as the rest of the fleet they attacked).

Ships caught in committing piratical attacks (without legitimate justification like war or a LoM) will be considered black flag ships going forward, unless something is actively done to remove it again.

So a ship can fly the black flag either as a choice by the player, or as a result of its actions.

In this case, the sea rat ships attacked by Prio were flying the black flag due to their actions.

I am not saying this system is perfect, and it is fairly new for us all, but that is how it works, to ensure that piracy can exist without reflecting on the faction, and that anti piracy can exist without attacking peaceful traders.

1 hour ago, Roadmonkeytj said:

Is there a list of the GM members to contact reguarding npc nations somewhere for future reference? 

You can send requests for contact to any of the members of the court, who will then forward it to the NPC Nation Committee. :)

The current committee is Captain Genaro (OL), Capt Wolf (ESL), dr_spock (SR), and myself.

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On 7/14/2018 at 3:20 AM, Bregir said:

 Ships caught in committing piratical attacks (without legitimate justification like war or a LoM) will be considered black flag ships going forward, unless something is actively done to remove it again.

What would be an example of something to remove it then?  So then would just the drunken monkey be black or the palmetto as well?

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34 minutes ago, Roadmonkeytj said:

What would be an example of something to remove it then?

In the current case of the Palmetto, it could have been an MRCA build explaining that the attack was the result of a misunderstanding, handing the Palmetto back, and add a pm or ooc note to say that there was an error and that you would like the black flag removed.

Anything that explains why the black flag is no longer applicable and which satisfies the afflicted parties. :)

37 minutes ago, Roadmonkeytj said:

So then would just the drunken monkey be black or the palmetto as well?

@Captain Genaro is the right one to answer this.

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So, for the Land Combat rules, will the cost of troops be changed at all?

Right now, it's a little prohibitive to get anything other than a Regiment.

Platoon: 30DB | 10 Men | Upkeep 6DB / Month
Company: 80DB | 30 Men | Upkeep 18DB / Month
Battalion: 220DB | 90 Men | Upkeep 54DB / Month
Regiment 600DB | 270 Men | Upkeep 162DB / Month
Division: 1700DB | 810 Men | Upkeep 486DB / Month
Army 4500DB | 2430 Men | Upkeep 1458DB / Month

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As in, would it be a poor investment to buy troops now?

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56 minutes ago, Mesabi said:

As in, would it be a poor investment to buy troops now?

Anything is possible, but I think it's likely that troop costs will remain the same. And if they do change, you wouldn't be the only person to have already purchased troops, so that will be something for leadership to consider.

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Another question about troops:

Is 1 Cargo Point still 10 men? Because to move an army then takes 243 cargo points, which would require at least 16 vessels with maxed cargo stats.

Thank you!

Edited by Mesabi

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4 hours ago, Mesabi said:

Another question about troops:

Is 1 Cargo Point still 10 men? Because to move an army then takes 243 cargo points, which would require at least 16 vessels with maxed cargo stats. 

Thank you!

Troop carrying capacity will be defined when the raiding rules are (re)released (which I believe we are aiming for before the next MRCA).

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On 7/13/2018 at 6:29 PM, Captain Genaro said:

There seems to be some confusion regarding the black flag rules. Let me clarify. 

As soon as a ship attacks neutral shipping (i.e. shipping, be it player or NPC, that your faction is not openly at war with), your ship, and any other ship it is sailing with, will be black flagged. They will be pirates. When a black flagged ship sails, any ship sailing with it will be treated as if it is flying a black flag. 

Any attack against black flagged vessels or any vessel sailing with a black flagged ship is permissible, and the game mechanics do not have any penalties for doing so. You are attacking a pirate. There may be IC consequences, but that is strictly between players.

If you are at a state of war, you may freely attack enemy ships without the black flag rules applying. That is not piracy, that is legitimate warfare. If you have a Letter of Marque, granted by a faction that is at war, you may legitimately attack enemy shipping. 

But where was this stated before now? Clearly the entire SR team, leadership included, did not realize this was how the rule worked. The form allows a person to raise or lower the black flag. This led me to believe the status was changeable only by the player, not GM decisions. 

On 7/13/2018 at 6:48 PM, Bregir said:

We have done what we can to make Prio react reasonably, like a player controlled nation might have done in the same situation, based on the information available to us.

What my team is trying to tell you is that it doesn't seem reasonable to treat an NPC with more favor and grace than a player run team.

On 7/13/2018 at 6:29 PM, Captain Genaro said:

The SR vessels Dark Narwhal, The Drunken Monkey, and Misfortune’s Wrath attacked Prio's traders. At this point, these three attackers gained black flag status. In the subsequent MCRA, the Dark Narwhal and Misfortune's Wrath were attacked by Prio. Under the black flag rules, this attack was not against legitimate shipping. This was an attack against black-flagged pirates and was justified. Prio's actions were anti-piracy, not piracy. As such, Prio's ships are not black flagged.

Why were these ships never notified of their status change? Nowhere can one see what status their ship has.

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2 hours ago, MKJoshA said:

But where was this stated before now? Clearly the entire SR team, leadership included, did not realize this was how the rule worked. The form allows a person to raise or lower the black flag. This led me to believe the status was changeable only by the player, not GM decisions. 

What my team is trying to tell you is that it doesn't seem reasonable to treat an NPC with more favor and grace than a player run team.

Why were these ships never notified of their status change? Nowhere can one see what status their ship has.

I share these concerns ... I can see in the summary where joshes ships are black flag ... However he selected this status on the form ... I would have just kept sailing not know this about my own ships

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I agree that there should be some quick and easy way to see if a ship is black flag or not. I assume this could be done via the MCRA result tables in the KPA?

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11 hours ago, MKJoshA said:

Why were these ships never notified of their status change? Nowhere can one see what status their ship has.

In the monthly account summary there is a tab for all licensed ships. Black flagged ships have a black flag and skull and crossbones next to their name. 

11 hours ago, MKJoshA said:

But where was this stated before now? Clearly the entire SR team, leadership included, did not realize this was how the rule worked. The form allows a person to raise or lower the black flag. This led me to believe the status was changeable only by the player, not GM decisions. 

Capt. Wolf posted this when the rules were announced in the February MCRA. 

Quote

Once a ship has been registered as a “black flag” pirate AND committed an act of piracy, it retains its “black flag” status until some external event (capture, trial, pardon, etc.) wipes its slate clean.

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11 minutes ago, Captain Genaro said:

In the monthly account summary there is a tab for all licensed ships. Black flagged ships have a black flag and skull and crossbones next to their name. 

I think the whole point was that @Roadmonkeytj his ships didn't had this sign there, but where seen as black flag anyway. 

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3 minutes ago, Bart said:

I think the whole point was that @Roadmonkeytj his ships didn't had this sign there, but where seen as black flag anyway. 

It looks like leadership needs to do a better job of both updating the account summary and posting black flag status each month. I'll take some of the heat for that.

And I trust now that we all have a better understanding of how the black flag rules are supposed to work. Does anybody still have a question about how it is supposed to work?

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---

From a quick look at the account summary, I see four black-flagged ships: Calamity Strikes (which was sunk this month), Komodo Dragon (also sunk), Morning Fog, and Viper. If sisterships of Calamity Strikes and Komodo Dragon are commissioned, they will begin as un-black-flagged (they are new ships).

Two ships, Warped Wood and Killer Frog, do not yet show the black flag on the account sheet, but that needs to be changed because they sailed with the Komodo Dragon this month.

@Captain Genaro, who is supposed to update the black flag status on the account sheets?

And if any ships currently not flying the black flag sail with Morning Fog, Viper, Warped Wood, or Killer Frog this coming month, they will automatically become black-flag ships.

 

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1 hour ago, Captain Genaro said:

Capt. Wolf posted this when the rules were announced in the February MCRA. 

Quote

Once a ship has been registered as a “black flag” pirate AND committed an act of piracy, it retains its “black flag” status until some external event (capture, trial, pardon, etc.) wipes its slate clean.

The rules are starting to make sense, but the part you quoted is not what is happening. The ships in question, Sea Rat and Prio, were never registered as Black Flag. According to the rule you quoted it doesn't say who does the registering so it comes across that the ship owner has to do the registering because according to the rules the Black Flag form is the only way to register it as a Black Flag. Both sets of ships committed piracy, but they didn't commit piracy and were registered as Black Flag.

If an act during the MCRA gives a ship Black Flag status, I think it's only fair for the owner of the ship to be notified of the status change. You can't assume they know because sometimes errors are made on the form. Telling a player they can find the information on the 2nd page of a webform, when it's updated correctly reminds me of a quote from Douglas Adams:

“But the plans were on display…”
“On display? I eventually had to go down to the cellar to find them.”
“That’s the display department.”
“With a flashlight.”
“Ah, well, the lights had probably gone.”
“So had the stairs.”
“But look, you found the notice, didn’t you?”
“Yes,” said Arthur, “yes I did. It was on display in the bottom of a locked filing cabinet stuck in a disused lavatory with a sign on the door saying ‘Beware of the Leopard.”

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4 minutes ago, MKJoshA said:

Telling a player they can find the information on the 2nd page of a webform, when it's updated correctly reminds me of a quote from Douglas Adams:

Good quote, and a fair point. I'll look into seeing how we can make it easier for players.

35 minutes ago, Capt Wolf said:

@Captain Genaro, who is supposed to update the black flag status on the account sheets?

That might be Legostone, but I can't say for certain.

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Ships that unknowingly sailed with Black Flag ships that committed no act of piracy should have the status removed.

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Quick question - will anyone be mad if I add the Black Flag Status to the faction summaries? This could make some stuff easier to keep track off.

Also, I have no idea who was responsible for setting black flag beyond the form. 

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Just now, Legostone said:

Quick question - will anyone be mad if I add the Black Flag Status to the faction summaries? This could make some stuff easier to keep track off.

I think it should be flagged everywhere possible, including in the KPA. Not whether the order was given, but when it is actually activated.

 A private note would be a good thing, but perhaps showing it in the KPA (with a tagged name) would be sufficient?

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Just now, Bregir said:

I think it should be flagged everywhere possible, including in the KPA. Not whether the order was given, but when it is actually activated.

 A private note would be a good thing, but perhaps showing it in the KPA (with a tagged name) would be sufficient?

Once something happened is already implemented in the account summaries (if it is up to date is another question... ). I'm just asking given that I've recieved multiple requests asking if the Black Flag was already raised for some ships, and making it public to the faction could solve that part.

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40 minutes ago, Legostone said:

Quick question - will anyone be mad if I add the Black Flag Status to the faction summaries? This could make some stuff easier to keep track off.

Not mad, but that would mean I for one can't see it. the link to the searat page is lost in the depths of countless posts in various pm threads,
I really wonder how other fractions do that, information only for their members...

Edited by Bart

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On the question of whether the rules were clear or not, I'll just add that I always interpreted them as leadership has explained above, i.e. if you attack a non-pirate vessel your ships will become black-flagged by the game.

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6 minutes ago, Bart said:

I really wonder how other fractions do that, information only for their members... 

Our fleet list is, very secretly, in one of the first posts in our general faction topic. ;)

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