Haddock51

Lego Train 9V Extreme - ready!

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This is plain awesome! Had so much fun watching that video. Even though I'm on a low bandwith connection.... couldn't even make out how many motors your Swiss ore train had.

And BTW: your moustache rocks! :thumbup:

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On ‎2017‎-‎11‎-‎28 at 10:10 PM, Capparezza said:

This is plain awesome! Had so much fun watching that video. Even though I'm on a low bandwith connection.... couldn't even make out how many motors your Swiss ore train had.

And BTW: your moustache rocks! :thumbup:

The Swedish Iron Ore Train consists of 24  fully loaded wagons and a Dm3 locomotive. The train is equipped with 13 (!) 9V engines, has a total length of approx. 6,4 meters and a total weight of approx. 11 kg (!).

I think this is how far you can stretch it w.r.t. "extreme".  This train has been - and still is - a borderline project all the way. To operate it on this layout - particularly uphill - is very tricky.

Edited by Haddock51

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Whoaaaaah. Yepp, if you look up "Extreme" in the Dictionary, your train will definitely be No.2 or even No.1 on the list. Incredible. Are those all fed by the 4 speed regulators?

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Truly stunning. Excellent videography as well, well done. It all seems to run like clockwork!

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I'm at a loss for words.....

 

A great video idea would be to (securely) put your camera in a single freight car and let it roll down the track!

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On ‎2017‎-‎11‎-‎28 at 11:37 PM, Capparezza said:

Whoaaaaah. Yepp, if you look up "Extreme" in the Dictionary, your train will definitely be No.2 or even No.1 on the list. Incredible. Are those all fed by the 4 speed regulators?

As I mentionned under "Technical data and details" on the first page, all speed regulators are modified. Each regulator is used for a specific segment of the track which makes it possible to run four trains simultaneously and independant of each other.

So this train with its 13 engines is operated by one regulator in each segment. As you can see in the video, I sometimes use two regulators (B and C) in synch in order to provide a smooth transition between the segments. This also provides additional power which is necessary uphill.

On ‎2017‎-‎11‎-‎29 at 3:34 AM, brickmasterben11 said:

I'm at a loss for words.....

 

A great video idea would be to (securely) put your camera in a single freight car and let it roll down the track!

I am not sure if this is such a great idea.

Before I added the super magnets to all train couplings, I experienced several spontaneous decouplings in the ramps. With gradients of 8 percent, the wagons accelerate very quickly and in most cases don't make it through the first 180 degree curve - even without a mounted camera ...

Edited by Haddock51

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On ‎2017‎-‎11‎-‎29 at 12:23 AM, ColletArrow said:

Truly stunning. Excellent videography as well, well done. It all seems to run like clockwork!

Thanks.

Some comments about the filmproject. This has been a fantastic teamwork with two guys who had never heard about Lego trains before. Both are physicians and colleagues to our younger daughter.

When they saw pictures from my 9V Extreme project, they both became fire and flames and promised to participate in the film project. One of them made a special music arrangement just for this film!

The equipment used was a Canon 7D Mark II (mainly for pictures), two GoPro Hero 4k cameras and a DJI Mavic Pro drone with 4k camera (the drone could not be used in flying mode because of severe turbulence under the ceiling)

And yes, there will be more pictures and more films ....

37401701854_493b8080c1_c.jpg

Edited by Haddock51

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12 hours ago, Haddock51 said:

So this train with its 13 engines is operated by one regulator in each segment.

Okay. 13 engines on one (1!) controller. Even with a modified one, that is an enormous feat. You did explain the modifications already, thinking about doing the same...

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1 hour ago, Capparezza said:

Okay. 13 engines on one (1!) controller. Even with a modified one, that is an enormous feat. You did explain the modifications already, thinking about doing the same...

The LM350T regulator provides 3A at most, at least according to specification (compared to approx. 0.9A for a standard LM317 regulator). In practice, it's a little more.

The 9V engine requires approx. 350 mA at maximum speed. To run 13 engines at medium speed requires approx. 2.6 - 3.5 A.

Keep in mind that you must upgrade your speed regulator with a feasable heatsink (I have chosen heatsinks with a thermal resistance of 1.9 K/W) and you must replace the four diodes to 3A diodes. I would also recommend to install a mini-fan in order to prevent/control high temperatures inside the box.

In the case of the Iron Ore train, temperatures measured on the outside heatsink peaked at approx. 45 degrees and inside the box at approx. 30 degrees Celsius.

In addition, you need a more powerful power supply unit.

If you plan to operate your engines/train on a flat level, there should be no problem. Operating a very heavy train on a track with gradients may require more power, maybe 4A. That's why I synch two speed regulators when operating the Iron Ore train uphill.

In my track - considering the gradients - the distance between power connections to the rails is approx. 2.5 - 3.5 meters.

Edited by Haddock51

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Wow, that layout is incredible. I missed this thread over the summer but have been watching your earlier posts as things progressed over the years. Do you have a schematic of the layout? Or I guess the thing I don't see, once up at the top, are there two loops that go all the way around the room, or is it a single long loop that with a turn-back to give the double track in front of the mountains? Are there any passing sidings on the spiral? That could make for some interesting train operations to run trains up and down the spiral following some sort of train order scheme. In any event, truly stunning and I am looking forward to seeing more videos.

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You see so many great MOCs and MODs on this site that you almost think there's nothing more to be done.

 

Then you come across a project like this where the usual boundaries are pushed (to use your word) "to the extreme" showing what can be achieved with a particular theme/sub genre (the 9V train system in this case)

 

I am slowly accumulating the 9V hardware needed to attempt my own dream layout in the next few years and will definitely be coming back to this thread regularly for inspiration and technical guidance. A few (possibly noob) questions:

1-what sort of cabling are you using to provide track power? The old 9v cables are notorious for decaying with age

2-where did you get your 9v double crossover track from?

3-which specific magnets did you use and how did you incorporate them (custom buffers?)

 

Looking forward to seeing more videos of your amazing layout.

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I do have a recommendation, if I may... put some tape on top of the camera's red blinking led :laugh:

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On ‎2017‎-‎11‎-‎29 at 11:55 PM, ElectroDiva said:

You see so many great MOCs and MODs on this site that you almost think there's nothing more to be done.

 

Then you come across a project like this where the usual boundaries are pushed (to use your word) "to the extreme" showing what can be achieved with a particular theme/sub genre (the 9V train system in this case)

 

I am slowly accumulating the 9V hardware needed to attempt my own dream layout in the next few years and will definitely be coming back to this thread regularly for inspiration and technical guidance. A few (possibly noob) questions:

1-what sort of cabling are you using to provide track power? The old 9v cables are notorious for decaying with age

2-where did you get your 9v double crossover track from?

3-which specific magnets did you use and how did you incorporate them (custom buffers?)

 

Looking forward to seeing more videos of your amazing layout.

1.    I had many discussions re cabling to provide track power. My initial plan was to solder cables directly to the rails but was strongly dissuaded from that approach. Even though I have also experienced  decaying of 9V cables, I finally decided to go with the 10078 power connections. To be honest, it was not easy to find 52 of these items...

The 9V cables are then connected to the RK cables 1.5 sqmm (using Märklin pins and sleeves) all the way to the cable terminal. The longest distance is approx. 23 m without any loss in voltage.

23917519047_435c1e4f46_c.jpg

2.   The 9V single crossover tracks are track modifications I made myself. There is an excellent modification instruction by Ondrew J. Hartigan that should be helpful (don't get deterred, it's actually not that difficult):

3.    Some years ago, I found round super magnets (10x1 mm) on the internet. They fit perfectly on train buffers with sealed magnets and are indeed very strong. No more spontaneous decouplings.

338741695681_d6938e160c_c.jpg

 

The super magnets are actually so strong that I initially experienced some difficulties to decouple in a controlled way. Therefore I made this "decoupling scissor" which works perfectly!

26974637429_a46c152d7b_c.jpg

 

Please feel free to come back if you need further help/advise.

And don't forget to keep us posted on the progress of your own dream layout!

PS:  Cool to hear from somebody who is determined to invest longterm into the  9V system. There ain't so many more 9V freaks around in the country where I live, at least not to my knowledge.

Edited by Haddock51

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On ‎2017‎-‎11‎-‎29 at 9:36 PM, zephyr1934 said:

Wow, that layout is incredible. I missed this thread over the summer but have been watching your earlier posts as things progressed over the years. Do you have a schematic of the layout? Or I guess the thing I don't see, once up at the top, are there two loops that go all the way around the room, or is it a single long loop that with a turn-back to give the double track in front of the mountains? Are there any passing sidings on the spiral? That could make for some interesting train operations to run trains up and down the spiral following some sort of train order scheme. In any event, truly stunning and I am looking forward to seeing more videos.

 

There are some 20 schemes and more than 100 versions...

This scheme shows level 195, the climbing spirals and the high speed tracks on level 216:

38026698624_6f0f81ff83_c.jpg

As you can see, there are two loops - including the climbing spirals -  that go all the way around the room. There are passing sidings on level 195 and on level 175  (where the post train is parked in the video). That makes it possible to operate four trains simultaneously and independent of each other:  One on each loop on levels 195/216, one from the train station level up the vertical climb to the siding on level 175 (back and forth) and one between rail yard level and train station level (back and forth). This however requires more hands...

The possibility to operate four trains simultaneously has been one of the key requirements for this project from the very beginning.

PS:  I really love your rods on the Dm3 and the two ENs!

Edited by Haddock51

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Ah, okay, I see it now, you actually have three spirals. In addition to the main vertical climb, the mainline requires a pair of spirals to clear the low side of the ceiling. Simply amazing! Oh, and I must say, although the layout is one of a kind, the trains are quite interesting too (great TEE)

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"Decoupling Scissor" ... Man... I just can't cope with the amount of love and dedication you've put into that project. If I would be somehow religious in any way, I would worship you! :laugh:

Are those super magnets just snapped on? I can't quite judge it by that picture, but it looks to be the case.

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11 minutes ago, Capparezza said:

Are those super magnets just snapped on? I can't quite judge it by that picture, but it looks to be the case.

Yes, they are just snapped on.

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What is the basis for the swedish ore train? I can't remember if I saw something like that on Trainz: A New Era....also, Jackshafts... ¡ME GUSTA MUCHO!

 

Image result for me gusta mucho

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19 hours ago, Steamdemon said:

What is the basis for the swedish ore train?

 

The Dm3 - legendary Queen of the Swedish Iron Ore Train. Picture taken at Narvik station in Norway.

37883333455_4a8fbf8bf3_c.jpg

 

Iron ore train passing Norddals Bridge on its way from Kiruna to Narvik.

38739478472_77828cc36d_c.jpg

Edited by Haddock51

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20 hours ago, Haddock51 said:

Please feel free to come back if you need further help/advise.

And don't forget to keep us posted on the progress of your own dream layout!

PS:  Cool to hear from somebody who is determined to invest longterm into the  9V system. There ain't so many more 9V freaks around in the country where I live, at least not to my knowledge.

Thanks for the tips and the offer of future help - I will definitely be taking you up on that :)

 

I did debate for quite a long time whether I should invest in the 9v system as I had no sets from the original era and both the sets and parts are now pretty eye wateringly expensive. For me it boiled down to three factors:

1-The versatility of the old 9V system (the fact you can run trains with either on track power or PF)

2-The size advantages of using the 9V motors (i.e. much cleaner to use for small trains like the Winter Holiday Train without messing about with battery boxes and cables)

3-It just looks a lot better (proper metal tracks rather than all plastic)

 

I picked up the Metroliner and Cargo Railway sets earlier this year to start me off and have since been adding track, motors and other parts as I can. It's a long term project which won't come to full fruition until I move house and can dedicate a reasonable sized room to it.

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1 hour ago, ElectroDiva said:

1-The versatility of the old 9V system (the fact you can run trains with either on track power or PF)

2-The size advantages of using the 9V motors (i.e. much cleaner to use for small trains like the Winter Holiday Train without messing about with battery boxes and cables)

3-It just looks a lot better (proper metal tracks rather than all plastic)

 

I think you made absolutely the right decision to go for the 9V system (I might be somewhat biased ...)

Even though Lego has discontinued to sell this system, you can still find quite a lot of sets, parts etc. on the internet, not only through BrickLink.

 

Good luck with your project!

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Very Nice video!

Any derailings while making it?

Looks like a huge Lego room!

 

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