I Made a Replica of Marshall Banana's 7500pc Lego Millennium Falcon (Instructions!)

[Brick Customs]

Last year I stumbled across Marshall Banana's massive, and exquisitely detailed Millennium Falcon MOC.  I was quite impressed by the model as it makes Lego's official UCS appear quite pitiful in comparison.  I had always felt Lego's UCS was a bit blocky looking (even for Lego) to begin with.  After discovering Marshall Banana's custom, my first thought was "I'm going to build this one day."  I tossed it into my browser's bookmark folder and didn't think about it for another four months or so.  It was then that I decided to open a new project in LDCad and "just mess around with it."  A couple of months and 200 hours later, I had a complete digital model.  60 hours after that, I had a complete real model.  Finally another 70 hours and I had a complete instruction manual.

Youtube | Ultimate Lego Millennium Falcon | Timelaps Build

My model, while a very near twin of Marshall Banana's masterpiece, also boasts a number of upgrades and improvements throughout.  I did succumb to using some "cheater" moves to avoid some techniques I didn't like.  Most notably, I didn't like the technique used for the rear engines that involved bending stacked 1x2 plates.  It put way too much tension on the bricks that would inevitably lead to cracking.  My solution was to use 1/8 brass hobby rod as a 3mm rigid hose alternative and arrange the greeble and engine details into clip-on sections.  This lead to another fix for the upper and lower edges of the engines.  MB seemed to achieve a slight angle by attaching the pieces unevenly on the studs (assuming I interpreted correctly from the pictures).  I really didn't like this, so I added another 1/8 rod at the correct height to allow the pieces to clip in and rest at the correct angle. 

I've made numerous other modifications including a number of shape adjustments to the shell plates to allow them to fit more evenly. 

View full Flickr album here.
 

 

Edited July 27, 2017 by Brick Customs

[Smitty500]

Welcome to the forums!  This looks awesome! I love the mostly SNOT design, Millennium Falcon looks a lot better without studs. and using the System scale cockpit helps bring it full circle. I like how the radar dish and other protrusions are neatly sculpted around with plates, just fits seamlessly. I feel the plates that go around the top need to slope a bit more rounded to give it that disk shape. but other than that the model is perfect. I would like to do a build like this someday. I don't feel your brass pieces are too far out of line from being a purist model, as long as they act the same a lego piece in it's place, though you did solder some together. Being a display only model, it's not like LEGO has never used metal in their displays for structure. Great work, Do you have a Flickr or something to visit?

[VaderFan2187]

Hey @Brick Customs! I saw your Slave I MOC on Youtube!

This looks amazing as well, just that the cockpit looks a little small...

[Azrielsc]

Holy smokes! I can't believe that you managed to reverse-engineer it and also made some improvements!

[masterX244]

just saw this... nice work :)  feeling like theres another rabbit hole waiting there for bricklinking... 

[Ellisss_2]

Hello, and welcome to Eurobricks!

This Falcon is flawless!

Congrats on making the instructions, it's the one thing I cannot do. I have to say though, I don't like how you have used brass rods, but the looks make up for it! Great improvements too! I agree with Smitty500 the SNOT and stud design looks beautiful and has a great contrast!

Kind regards, Ellis.

 

[kibosh]

I have to ask, but did you get Marshall's consent to use his name like this?  Something about this doesn't site quite right, and this question comes up all the time.  You admittedly reverse engineered another's MOC, and now you are trying to profit from their original work.  Are you giving him a cut of the action?

[Kristof]

^ Reverse engineering someones MOC jsut out of several pictures (as far as I know, there isnt a hige reference material or exceptional WIP build cocumentation from Marshal) of this size is achievement enough. A lot of actual designing must have went into other than just building certain outer details according to Marshal's build. Plus, making a quality instructions is even more laborious and tedious work and not many builders are willing to take that spend the time. I am a big believer in fair play and giving appropriate credits and i think this is just ok. Of course, it would be nice if direct permission from Marshal was granted - maybe it is, right? - but nonetheless this doesnt seem like exploit to me. Even with this higher pricepoint for instructions, I dont think the profit can go very high, given how many people would actually buy it. Most likely this makes for only small income to compensate for all the time that went into. No evil here for me :)

 

EDIT: Btw I like the build, though I still like Marshal's one better, It feels like some minor details are missing, which makes yous look a bit flat. Also I dont like this big gap between mandibles and front top hull plating, again this is smaller on Marshal's - perhaps has to do with some slightly illegal builds you mention? All in all, although Marshal excellent photography may contribute as well, his model would be the one I'd pick of these two :D

Edited February 20, 2017 by krisandkris12

[kibosh]

Believe me, I will be the first to admit this is a beautiful MOC, and reverse engineering it is an amazing feat.  And I totally understand that digitally documenting it would be an enormous task, but unless Marshall is included in some way, financially benefiting from his original work seems wrong.  Maybe he is benefiting.  Who knows.  That's why I asked.  And no, it's not any of my business.  I just hope Marshall is ok with this.

[Brick Customs]

Thanks guys!  

 

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EDIT: Btw I like the build, though I still like Marshal's one better, It feels like some minor details are missing, which makes yous look a bit flat. Also I dont like this big gap between mandibles and front top hull plating, again this is smaller on Marshal's - perhaps has to do with some slightly illegal builds you mention? All in all, although Marshal excellent photography may contribute as well, his model would be the one I'd pick of these two :D

Agreed on the details part.  I left of some of the 3mm rigid hose details and forgot a couple of front detail pieces in my excitement to get it done and take pictures.   Most of these details are easily added (will be adding them to mine eventually).  I approached my build with a slightly different design philosophy.  There are a few areas were I opted to keep the strength of the assembly rather than added extra details and sacrifice strength.  Most notably, I left out some of the 1x1 rounds around the gun turret because the assembly was already a bit fragile.  

If you see Marshall's model from the right angle there is indeed quite a gap.  There is not much of a way to avoid this.  The panel must be two plates thick.  You must also consider that the plate is hinged off of the front "hood" so the gap is unavoidably going to increase as it meets the hood.  The deciding factors on the gap are the appropriate hood placement, and where the far corners of the panels touch.  I'm pretty sure I got it right.

Yeah, Marshall's photography kills mine.  

 

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Believe me, I will be the first to admit this is a beautiful MOC, and reverse engineering it is an amazing feat.  And I totally understand that digitally documenting it would be an enormous task, but unless Marshall is included in some way, financially benefiting from his original work seems wrong.  Maybe he is benefiting.  Who knows.  That's why I asked.  And no, it's not any of my business.  I just hope Marshall is ok with this.

It is a grey area for sure.  For the record, even Marshall Banana didn't entirely originate the design.  His model is based on Mike Psaki's incomplete MOC (below).

 

 Frankly, I wouldn't be putting the instructions out there if there wasn't some incentive to do it.  I only amassed enough motivation to finish the instructions because people kept asking about it.  

I believe even the Cavegod AT-AT instructions are sold by an individual other than Cavegod (although admittedly with Cavegod's permission).  Cavegod made the LDD file available in the first place, so all the instruction designer did was import into LDraw, step the model, and organize the pages in LPub (still a sizable amount of work, to be sure).

Anyway, if Marshall says something, I'll worry about it then.  It's better to ask forgiveness than permission.   :P 

 

[Kristof]

@kibosh Regardless of what I believe, you were in fact the first who only raised a question about potential fraud without commenting on the creation at all ;) Anyway, don't get me wrong, I don't want to be anyones judge or lawyer - I also wish that Shawn has Marshal's blessing as it would be for the best. I would just suggest not casting an unwarranted shadow on still impressive work.

Also think about how different model would it have to be for you to acknowledge it as original already. Hard question for me, I must say. Also Marshal took some parts from Psiaki's amazing draft, which was (as Shawn points out in his video) probably the first one to use such outline for cockpit area, side structures and the paneling... should he also be included in some way? I know, I'm nitpicking right now. Just trying to point out that 'original' is also relative. That being said, every conscious lego fan who is in SW models does recognise MB's model as outstanding and in a way revolutionary. And I see Shawns recreation as more of a tribute than a scam, really :) Assuming good intentions is the way out anyway ;)

10 minutes ago, Brick Customs said:

forgot a couple of front detail pieces in my excitement to get it done and take pictures.

Haha :) these two knobs certainly add a lot of character and break down the gap line so it's less obvious. But still it is pretty obvious and if I had to name a flaw of MBs design, this would be the one.

11 minutes ago, Brick Customs said:

You must also consider that the plate is hinged off of the front "hood" so the gap is unavoidably going to increase as it meets the hood.  The deciding factors on the gap are the appropriate hood placement, and where the far corners of the panels touch.  I'm pretty sure I got it right.

 

You are probably right and you got it right just like MB. Are you 100% positive its unavoitable though? Perhaps this is the right place to improve on that otherwise flawles skin :) In the end, this is the angle MF is usually viewed from, very significant feature. I don't have that much insight though, but I would try letting the panel float a bit more, probably trying to use small balljoints and hoping to find a proper placement for at least three point fixture while being slightly more tilted to reduce the gap. But hey, maybe it's really quite impossible :)

[NorvernRob]

Looks great, I've admired MB's model for some time. However, I think you've made the same mistake with the mandible LED's as I have on my EP7 UCS Falcon - they're supposed to be red as far as I can make out, and there are white floodlights inside the centre cargo docking area.

I'm now hoping someone can show me there are white lights on the mandibles too, as it will save me some work changing them over!

[ScottishDave]

I'm very glad to see the best part of the design still being used. For the record: you are forgiven for that part at least. Hey, I put it out for free in the first place, so I'm not about to turn around and get shirty now!

Seriously - well done. Copying something accurately, and making improvements on it, is a skill in itself.

One note - my own Falcon, built with "stressed brick" engines, is a few years old now, and the engine bricks don't appear to have cracked - so I reckon that you could have gotten away with it. The brass rods definitely look cool, however.

 

[SpiderJazz]

Not really a fan of SW but this is dope! Wonder if someone can do that on Superhero themed vehicle, very detailed and awesome! 

[Brick Customs]

6 hours ago, ScottishDave said:

I'm very glad to see the best part of the design still being used. For the record: you are forgiven for that part at least. Hey, I put it out for free in the first place, so I'm not about to turn around and get shirty now!

Seriously - well done. Copying something accurately, and making improvements on it, is a skill in itself.

One note - my own Falcon, built with "stressed brick" engines, is a few years old now, and the engine bricks don't appear to have cracked - so I reckon that you could have gotten away with it. The brass rods definitely look cool, however.

 

Haha, yeah, your radar design is brilliant!  When I ordered the parts for Falcon, I "fixed" the 6L bar mold variation on my final parts list to avoid using the old short stopper version.  I assumed I had just accidentally inserted an old version somewhere when I was building.  When I finally got to the radar, I was like "oohhhh." 

Good to hear about your Falcon (love your interior, btw).  I was just super nervous about using that technique.

Also, for the record, you are credited in the descriptions of all my Falcon Flickr photos (I may have forgotten in a couple other places though).  ;)

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You are probably right and you got it right just like MB. Are you 100% positive its unavoitable though? Perhaps this is the right place to improve on that otherwise flawles skin :) In the end, this is the angle MF is usually viewed from, very significant feature. I don't have that much insight though, but I would try letting the panel float a bit more, probably trying to use small balljoints and hoping to find a proper placement for at least three point fixture while being slightly more tilted to reduce the gap. But hey, maybe it's really quite impossible :)

I'll have to look into it more.  I don't have the model with me now but here's a look under the digital version's hood.  You can see that the hood is about as far down as you would want it to go.

I could - as I understand your suggestion - change the angle of the plate separate from the hood, but that seems like it would negatively affect the nice lines between the hood and plate.  :\

 

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Looks great, I've admired MB's model for some time. However, I think you've made the same mistake with the mandible LED's as I have on my EP7 UCS Falcon - they're supposed to be red as far as I can make out, and there are white floodlights inside the centre cargo docking area.

I'm now hoping someone can show me there are white lights on the mandibles too, as it will save me some work changing them over!

 

A New Hope Falcon didn't seem to have any lights.  This is from Empire Strikes Back.  Seems that one red and one white is "correct."  Although, these lights only appear in this landed scene.  Perhaps they were just landing markers or something?  

 

Edited February 21, 2017 by Brick Customs

[brobert]

7 hours ago, Brick Customs said:

A New Hope Falcon didn't seem to have any lights.  This is from Empire Strikes Back.  Seems that one red and one white is "correct."  Although, these lights only appear in this landed scene.  Perhaps they were just landing markers or something?  

First of all: wow. This is an amazing MOC.

About the lights, I wouldn't get too bogged down on this, the light were not present in ANH probably because of budgetary reasons.

I remembered that they are shown being turned on when they fly into the space slug's belly, an indeed I found it:

In "parking mode" the right side light is red in every scene. So yours is still correct, since the engines are lit too, it has the flight lights on. 

(and let's face it, the movie version of the lighting doesn't make much sense, if those are positional lights, why would they only be on when landed but eh, it's a movie )

 

[Brick Customs]

4 minutes ago, brobert said:

First of all: wow. This is an amazing MOC.

About the lights, I wouldn't get too bogged down on this, the light were not present in ANH probably because of budgetary reasons.

I remembered that they are shown being turned on when they fly into the space slug's belly, an indeed I found it:

In "parking mode" the right side light is red in every scene. So yours is still correct, since the engines are lit too, it has the flight lights on. 

(and let's face it, the movie version of the lighting doesn't make much sense, if those are positional lights, why would they only be on when landed but eh, it's a movie )

 

Good find!  Yeah, I've noticed that the movie doesn't take consistency or accuracy (never-mind logic) nearly as seriously as the fans tend to.  It's sometimes hard to tell which "official" version of the Falcon to reference. lol  Still, cool to see that the "headlights" are actually a thing.

Edited February 21, 2017 by Brick Customs

[brobert]

Just now, Brick Customs said:

Good find!  Yeah, I've noticed that the movie doesn't take consistency or accuracy (never-mind logic) nearly as seriously as the fans tend to.  It's sometimes hard to tell which "official" version of the Falcon to reference. lol  Still, cool to see that the "headlights" are actually a thing.

We fans are probably taking a lot of thing more seriously than the healthy amount  That's why ol' papa George used to say: "It's just a movie"

Btw, I just got curious about the TFA version, since yours has the new dish, I guess that should be the reference.

Here it looks like there is a reflector next to the cockpit, and the lights on the nose are red most of the time and smaller...so..yours is still correct..from a certain point of view :D

But the main thing is it looks great so don't even worry about being "accurate" 

 

[NorvernRob]

8 hours ago, brobert said:

First of all: wow. This is an amazing MOC.

About the lights, I wouldn't get too bogged down on this, the light were not present in ANH probably because of budgetary reasons.

I remembered that they are shown being turned on when they fly into the space slug's belly, an indeed I found it:

In "parking mode" the right side light is red in every scene. So yours is still correct, since the engines are lit too, it has the flight lights on. 

(and let's face it, the movie version of the lighting doesn't make much sense, if those are positional lights, why would they only be on when landed but eh, it's a movie )

 

Ah I missed that - thank you, that's saved me switching out the LED's! 

[sandtrooper]

My UCS Falcon build was primarily inspired by the ESB version.  I included both red and white LEDs on the mandibles because they are both shown in the movie.  If I could have figured it out, the white would have been switchable independent of the red ones.

Anyway great job reverse engineering this version of the Falcon.

[teos]

On 2/20/2017 at 11:05 AM, kibosh said:

Something about this doesn't site quite right, and this question comes up all the time.  You admittedly reverse engineered another's MOC, and now you are trying to profit from their original work.  Are you giving him a cut of the action?

It is not the other person's original work.  At what point do you draw the line in giving credit or asking permission?  The original designer of the Millennium Falcon?  The designer of Lego's UCS version, which gave many people inspiration to create their own?  The organization that holds the IP (or maybe something further since the Falcon is such an iconic ship)? 

When you consider the above, then you'll realize that all Lego MOC builders that design something based on someone else's work have made the decision to draw the line at their choosing.  The OP in question decided to give credit to the person that inspired them to create their version. 

[kibosh]

58 minutes ago, teos said:

It is not the other person's original work.  At what point do you draw the line in giving credit or asking permission?  The original designer of the Millennium Falcon?  The designer of Lego's UCS version, which gave many people inspiration to create their own?  The organization that holds the IP (or maybe something further since the Falcon is such an iconic ship)? 

When you consider the above, then you'll realize that all Lego MOC builders that design something based on someone else's work have made the decision to draw the line at their choosing.  The OP in question decided to give credit to the person that inspired them to create their version. 

Ok.  Let's take your premise one step further then.  Where do you "draw the line"?  If you post a model that gets rave reviews from the LEGO community, and I successfully reverse engineer it, can I sell copies of the instructions I made without your consent?  Should you share in the profits if I copied your design 100% as long as I clearly state it is based off your efforts?  What if I changed 1 brick of 1000?  What if I changed 10 bricks out of a thousand?  Where do you want me to "draw the line"?  This is a slippery slope in my opinion.  Based on this thread, it sounds like the general population has no problem with someone reverse engineering a model and selling their own instructions of said model.

[teos]

6 hours ago, kibosh said:

Ok.  Let's take your premise one step further then.  Where do you "draw the line"?  If you post a model that gets rave reviews from the LEGO community, and I successfully reverse engineer it, can I sell copies of the instructions I made without your consent?  Should you share in the profits if I copied your design 100% as long as I clearly state it is based off your efforts?  What if I changed 1 brick of 1000?  What if I changed 10 bricks out of a thousand?  Where do you want me to "draw the line"?  This is a slippery slope in my opinion.  Based on this thread, it sounds like the general population has no problem with someone reverse engineering a model and selling their own instructions of said model.

There's no slippery slope in this instance.  You cannot sell instructions for the Millennium Falcon.  Making money off of someone's IP could lead to a lawsuit (probably not very likely in this instance).  However, I believe Disney is less forgiving than Lucas was.

[Choops]

nice model.  I like this scale for a Falcon.  I have the last version of the Falcon and always thought it should be a little bigger.

Steve

[kibosh]

14 hours ago, teos said:

There's no slippery slope in this instance.  You cannot sell instructions for the Millennium Falcon.  Making money off of someone's IP could lead to a lawsuit (probably not very likely in this instance).  However, I believe Disney is less forgiving than Lucas was.

But he IS selling instructions for his Millenium Falcon.  What exactly do you think I was talking about?