Narrow gauge straights and cross track

[ritzcrackerman]

18 hours ago, Hod Carrier said:

That's an interesting little loco there. I'm assuming you're going to have a try at building this as a conventional adhesion loco rather than a cog driven loco as per the original. If I read the article correctly, driving this loco through the cog removed the need to modify the wheels as they were no longer needed to transmit the drive.

Yes, the drivetrain is very simple, but effective in a compact space.  I was never quite able to sort out how the builder ultimately executed the build, as regardless of whether you went conventional adhesion or cog-driven, you would need to alter the wheel (?)  At any rate - a cog-driven locomotive doesn't seem feasible on the small curved radius tracks and the technic gear racks.  It may for a larger layout using straights (?) 

At any rate, we will see how successful it ends up being!  I'm excited to try now with the printed train wheels.  Here's hoping it is successful with some trial + error.

[Lowa]

22 hours ago, Hod Carrier said:

As for traction tyres, don't worry about providing these. It's possible to buy rubber O-rings in just about any size. Once the diameter is known it will be possible to buy O-rings in an appropriate size. 

That's a good idea.  I'm just bought some.  Once I get them I will add the grove in the wheel and fine tune the tread diameter.

[Hod Carrier]

5 hours ago, ritzcrackerman said:

Yes, the drivetrain is very simple, but effective in a compact space.  I was never quite able to sort out how the builder ultimately executed the build, as regardless of whether you went conventional adhesion or cog-driven, you would need to alter the wheel (?)  At any rate - a cog-driven locomotive doesn't seem feasible on the small curved radius tracks and the technic gear racks.  It may for a larger layout using straights (?) 

At any rate, we will see how successful it ends up being!  I'm excited to try now with the printed train wheels.  Here's hoping it is successful with some trial + error.

Reading his article it seems he went for cog drive, although he doesn't use the official 4-wide curves but rather makes his own using 9V(?) track which presumably makes it a little easier to lay the rack. You can clearly see in the photos that the rack extends the whole way around his layout.

In the article he talks about making two illegal moves when building the loco, the first being to cut cross axle holes in the wheels and the second being to open out the teeth in the bevel gear wheel so that it engages with the rack. He admits that the second illegal move actuallly renders the first one redundant because the loco no longer needs to drive through the wheels as it now uses the cog instead.

I hope you will post up your progress with building this little gem as I am interested to see how it goes, especially if you take the adhesion-only route.

[Lowa]

16 hours ago, jkj1909 said:

 

Wow, Fast and Perfect work, I will look forward to buy some in your BL shop

The pic with the design from me, was just to give you an idea what I meant, your design is spot on what I wanted, and the Right (with transition) one looks better

Quote: Would you also want them for the narrow gauge ? Yes PLease

Quote Do you mean a half of the standard LEGO curve ? Yes, Half the length and number of degrees, so 2 pieces equals 1 Lego curve

Thank you!  

I started producing the half and quarter narrow gauge straights today, so you can mark that as done!

Concerning the 'half curves', just to make sure, you're talking about the narrow gauge right ?  This implies you would like to have a 22.5 degree turn narrow gauge track, right ?  That would be the narrow gauge equivalent of a standard gauge curve.

[jkj1909]

Yay, way to go !

do you have an estimated schedule for availability in your BL Shop ?

Edited December 9, 2016 by jkj1909

[Lowa]

On 12/9/2016 at 5:56 AM, jkj1909 said:

do you have an estimated schedule for availability in your BL Shop ?

If all goes well we'll have the first batch available in our bricklick store by the end of next week / beginning of the following week.

[Lowa]

On 12/8/2016 at 5:52 AM, jkj1909 said:

Quote Do you mean a half of the standard LEGO curve ? Yes, Half the length and number of degrees, so 2 pieces equals 1 Lego curve

I managed to make the half curve as well.  It was a bigger challenge than the straights but it done! 

[jkj1909]

Very Nice

[Elektrychka]

Will there be any switches for narrow gauge track?

[Lowa]

3 hours ago, Elektrychka said:

Will there be any switches for narrow gauge track?

Yes, I'm planning to make a range of specialty switches including narrow gauge switches but I first want to focus on the train automation...

[M_slug357]

14 hours ago, Lowa said:

*snip* but I first want to focus on the train automation...

You mean, like a narrow gauge train motor...?

If you could devise one that's around the size of a 2x6x2 "counterweight brick," with 2 axle ports... I would praise you! ... but I can't imagine a motor small enough to fit that size though...

http://brickset.com/sets/containing-part-6094053

[Lowa]

12 hours ago, M_slug357 said:

You mean, like a narrow gauge train motor...?

If you could devise one that's around the size of a 2x6x2 "counterweight brick," with 2 axle ports... I would praise you! ... but I can't imagine a motor small enough to fit that size though...

http://brickset.com/sets/containing-part-6094053

I was referring to this thread:

But there is no reason we couldn't look into a dedicated narrow gauge motor!  I don't immediately know of a motor what would fit into a 2x6x2.  But I do have a small geared DC motor that might fit into a 2x5x3 brick.  Would that work ?

 

[willhappy]

hello would this be compatible the roller coaster friends set?

will

 

[Lowa]

3 minutes ago, willhappy said:

hello would this be compatible the roller coaster friends set?

will

 

Yes, it is.  That roller coaster is using narrow gauge track, it's just the color that is different.

[willhappy]

hi lowa

thanks for the heads up

will

 

[M_slug357]

On 12/12/2016 at 1:00 PM, Lowa said:

*snip* ... but there is no reason we couldn't look into a dedicated narrow gauge motor!  I don't immediately know of a motor what would fit into a 2x6x2.  But I do have a small geared DC motor that might fit into a 2x5x3 brick.  Would that work ?

 

That may work! just as long as the motor isn't wider than 2 studs or taller than 4 studs, it should be fine.

i think more ppl may go for longer&lower versus shorter&higher...

What kind of motor(s) are you going to use btw?

[Lowa]

2 hours ago, M_slug357 said:

That may work! just as long as the motor isn't wider than 2 studs or taller than 4 studs, it should be fine.

i think more ppl may go for longer&lower versus shorter&higher...

What kind of motor(s) are you going to use btw?

My idea was to try a 'DC motor in a 9g servo housing'. '9g servos' have a standardized shape and now you can also find DC motors in the same housing. The size is roughly 32mm x 30mm x 12mm, so in theory it has to be possible to get it into a 2 stud wide brick (16mm). I don't know if they are powerful enough and spin at the right RPM for a narrow gauge train but it's worth to try and find out. They are 6V I think, so we would have to do some voltage conversion as well if you want to use the LEGO battery box.

[Lowa]

@ritzcrackerman, @Hod Carrier

This is the latest version of the 'medium sized' train wheels for the narrow gauge trains.  The pictures below show them in comparison to the LEGO train wheels.  Both wheels are the same, but the one on the left has a traction tire and the other one not.

 This is what I changed compared to the previous version:

• I printed them at maximal resolution, so the 'groves' on the flange are thinner and thus less visible.
• I added a groove for the traction tire
• I added a traction tire.  
• I tweaked the dimensions.  With the traction tire the tread diameter is now 13mm so slightly larger than the 12T bevel gear
• I printed them in black

What do you think ?

 

 

[M_slug357]

5 hours ago, Lowa said:

*snip* What do you think ?

((what about the backside?))    ((what size band did you use?))

These look great!!

I think something to consider also would be the addition of a regular size wheel that has a hole for a bar (or a pin) -- for narrow gauge steam engines!

[Hod Carrier]

I think it looks very promising indeed. I may have to acquire a set to evaluate them.

What's the clutch power like on a Technic axle through the cross hole? What material has been used for the traction tyre? The standard LEGO traction tyres on their train wheels are not that good and often get swapped for rubber O-rings which perform much better.

[Lowa]

On 12/15/2016 at 9:29 AM, Hod Carrier said:

What's the clutch power like on a Technic axle through the cross hole?

I tweaked the hole to get the right clutch power.  I did however discover than the 'modern' axles are slightly narrower than the 'old' axles (old = from the end of the 80s beginning 90s); there's a difference of about 0.1mm.  I designed the wheel for the modern axles and for them the clutch power is just right, at least that's my feeling...  It works with the old axles too, but it's tight and rather tough to get the wheel off the axle.

On 12/15/2016 at 9:29 AM, Hod Carrier said:

What material has been used for the traction tyre?

I'm not really sure as there is not much information on the package, it just says "non latex rubber bands".

On 12/15/2016 at 9:29 AM, Hod Carrier said:

The standard LEGO traction tyres on their train wheels are not that good and often get swapped for rubber O-rings which perform much better.

The rubber bands are wider than the LEGO traction tires, they are also flat so there is a larger contact surface.  When block the wheels and rub them over over the tracks, I have the feeling that the rubber bands give better resistance than the LEGO traction tires.  With the LEGO wheels I have more of a sliding feeling while with the rubber bands I have more of a rubbing feeling.  So I think we're good...

[Lowa]

On 12/15/2016 at 2:48 AM, M_slug357 said:

These look great!!

Thank you!

what about the backside?

The back side is 'solid'... 

what size band did you use?

 

The bands are 8mm (5/16") in diameter and stretched to a 12mm (15/32") diameter when put on the wheel.  They are about 1.4mm (~3/64") wide.

I think something to consider also would be the addition of a regular size wheel that has a hole for a bar (or a pin) -- for narrow gauge steam engines!

What do you mean with 'bar' ?  Do you mean a technic peg ?

[M_slug357]

54 minutes ago, Lowa said:

What do you mean with 'bar' ?  Do you mean a technic peg ?

For bars, I meant the lightsaber element: http://brickset.com/parts/design-30374

Although a technic peg (pin) hole would be more accessible, i think the diameter of one would clash with the existing axle hole?

Hence the bar as an alternative

[Hod Carrier]

3 hours ago, Lowa said:

I tweaked the hole to get the right clutch power.  I did however discover than the 'modern' axles are slightly narrower than the 'old' axles (old = from the end of the 80s beginning 90s); there's a difference of about 0.1mm.  I designed the wheel for the modern axles and for them the clutch power is just right, at least that's my feeling...  It works with the old axles too, but it's tight and rather tough to get the wheel off the axle.

That sounds good. I'm looking forward to trying some of these for myself. Do you have a release date in mind for these?

3 hours ago, Lowa said:

The rubber bands are wider than the LEGO traction tires, they are also flat so there is a larger contact surface.  When block the wheels and rub them over over the tracks, I have the feeling that the rubber bands give better resistance than the LEGO traction tires.  With the LEGO wheels I have more of a sliding feeling while with the rubber bands I have more of a rubbing feeling.  So I think we're good...

I wasn't meaning rubber bands, but rubber O-rings like those used as seals in hydraulic or pneumatic systems. These have a round rather than flat cross-section, come in black and seem to work very nicely indeed at improving traction.

[coaster]

30 minutes ago, M_slug357 said:

For bars, I meant the lightsaber element: http://brickset.com/parts/design-30374

Although a technic peg (pin) hole would be more accessible, i think the diameter of one would clash with the existing axle hole?

Hence the bar as an alternative

For that scale, you might almost be better off skipping the second hole altogether and use an element that gives you a small offset, perhaps like the Technic crank:http://brickset.com/parts/4119475

 

2 minutes ago, Hod Carrier said:

I wasn't meaning rubber bands, but rubber O-rings like those used as seals in hydraulic or pneumatic systems. These have a round rather than flat cross-section, come in black and seem to work very nicely indeed at improving traction.

Not to be pedantic, but o-rings do come in a square profile as well.  It'd be interesting to see which would actually provide better traction.