Shipwrights Guild Hall (WIPs, feedback, and advice)

[Legostone]

I've recently been buying a couple of prefabs, mostly because I stumbled over them while buying other stuff. 

While I'm not planning on using all of them (don't worry, I'm not throwing the others away or anything, they already have new owners), I already started the build of a ship on one of them.

Yes, I'm using the Shtandart as inspiration here - round gunports, yellow/green colourscheme, quite some tumblehome for such a small vessel etc. It's still quite early in the development, but I think I'll get there. Not sure where I'll store this one though... Running out of space and black plates now. I suppose I'll need to order a couple of parts get the other side to the state of this one.

Quite happy with the upper headrails, the lower ones are very much temporary right now. I still need to get a good idea how to properly mount them. I'm also not quite sure if I should try to add the second yellow line below the gundeck - it would be a cool detail, but it would most likely cause a bunch of issues with the bow and stern. What do you think? As well as that - any criticism  is welcome, I want this ship to be one of my better ones.

[Bregir]

It's looking great sofar, LS. Are we supposed to know of the Shtandart, or is it some obscure dutch ship? ;)

Comparing her to the drawing, I think your mizzen is almost one gunport to far forward, but otherwise, it's looking very nice. I think I would forego the yellow line, or at least make it at least two plates thick.

I have been contemplating investing in more prefabs myself too. Does speed up the process of shipbuilding considerable! :)

[Legostone]

12 minutes ago, Bregir said:

It's looking great sofar, LS. Are we supposed to know of the Shtandart, or is it some obscure dutch ship? ;)

Comparing her to the drawing, I think your mizzen is almost one gunport to far forward, but otherwise, it's looking very nice. I think I would forego the yellow line, or at least make it at least two plates thick.

I have been contemplating investing in more prefabs myself too. Does speed up the process of shipbuilding considerable! :)

 

 

 

 

The Shtandart was a Russian ship and actually has a replica sailing

so not the most obscure ship possible :D

Mast placement is very temporary at this point, so that's an easy fix, once I actually get to that point in the build I'll take care of that (before that I'll see about building the bow and forecastle - I think there are still some small issues that I'll have to fix there). But don't count on the gunports for other details - the ship has 11 on each broadside, which I can seem to manage with this spacing and these ports, given that they require a 3 stud wide area to be placed. For the yellow line - I don't think I'll be placing it, but if I would I would most likely replace the cheeseslopes below the hinged part with them - 2 birds with one stone basically.

[Jacob Nion]

@Legostone looking great! Especiallay the use of the lifebelts is a beautiful touch. I think we haven't seen that often yet. 

And I see you changed the tops of the white hull pieces with those from the dark greay ones. Makes for a great colour combo. 

[Legostone]

4 minutes ago, Jacob Nion said:

@Legostone looking great! Especiallay the use of the lifebelts is a beautiful touch. I think we haven't seen that often yet. 

And I see you changed the tops of the white hull pieces with those from the dark greay ones. Makes for a great colour combo. 

Thanks! I can't remember anyone using the lifebelts on a sailing ship before, but I would like to be proven wrong there. What other options are there anyways for round gunports?

Yeah, I ordered 3 sets of the dark grey hulls a couple weeks back - they are quite cheap. You can also see it on the brown hull (which gives you a full dark grey hull - I'm sure someone has already found a good use for those. Sepearating the bowpieces is a nightmare though, good luck to anyone trying it. 

[Jacob Nion]

4 hours ago, Legostone said:

Thanks! I can't remember anyone using the lifebelts on a sailing ship before, but I would like to be proven wrong there. What other options are there anyways for round gunports?

Yeah, I ordered 3 sets of the dark grey hulls a couple weeks back - they are quite cheap. You can also see it on the brown hull (which gives you a full dark grey hull - I'm sure someone has already found a good use for those. Sepearating the bowpieces is a nightmare though, good luck to anyone trying it. 

Only thing I can think of are the 4x4 round plates with 2x2 cutout. 

I was looking up the small hull pieces because I was hoping to combine the green/black hull of the 6250 cross bone clipper with those black top pieces.

But it's only available in America. Does anyone know if this set was USA exclusive? Would be odd.

[Legostone]

17 hours ago, Jacob Nion said:

Only thing I can think of are the 4x4 round plates with 2x2 cutout. 

I was looking up the small hull pieces because I was hoping to combine the green/black hull of the 6250 cross bone clipper with those black top pieces.

But it's only available in America. Does anyone know if this set was USA exclusive? Would be odd.

 

 

 

 

Yeah, those are certainly an option, but adding details to those while keeping the round shape could prove difficult.

I think the Cross bone clipper was actually only available in America, I remember a friend of mine who has been collecting all Lego ships is also missing it because it isn't and wasn't available in Europe at all. If you really really want it I suggest messaging a couple of American and Canadian Sellers asking for the shipping for the specific parts, given how impractical they are in shape. Given how rare the hulls are they are surprisingly cheap in the US. 
For separating the small hull pieces I'll warn you right away - it is almost impossible to separate the bow without some damage. After the first few and asking around I was finally given a good hint by Captain Green Hair who told me to put the upper part of the hull on some supports and then mess with the connectors inside (knife or screwdriver, sorry poor part), and eventually. they will slide apart. 

Oh, and @Bregir - if you are considering buying prefabs, try getting a red one. Midsections are affordable, and you can get a full red stern or bow by combining the Red Beard Runner's parts with the Skull's Eye Schooner's ones. And red hulls are rarely seen :P White large hulls are also an option, but they are becoming more and more expensive now (well, you can't get a 6 midsection hull including end pieces for 10€ anymore), old brown has very expensive midsections, reddish brown is comparable to white, dark brown oddly enough has unfindable upper bow/sternparts - a whopping 3 available in Europe now, starting at 11€ a piece, and black - well, expect to pay much for that.

Edited May 29, 2017 by Legostone

[kurigan]

On 5/28/2017 at 1:27 PM, Legostone said:

Thanks! I can't remember anyone using the lifebelts on a sailing ship before, but I would like to be proven wrong there. What other options are there anyways for round gunports?

Yeah, I ordered 3 sets of the dark grey hulls a couple weeks back - they are quite cheap. You can also see it on the brown hull (which gives you a full dark grey hull - I'm sure someone has already found a good use for those. Sepearating the bowpieces is a nightmare though, good luck to anyone trying it. 

um... 

Spoiler

Now, that being said; I love her. It's no secret that I'm no fan of prefabs, but I think you picked a good ship to model on them. Shtandart, the replica, is an incredibly small ship so, well suited to the size and scale limitations, IMHO. I too am a fan of her color scheme and find it pops pretty well in Lego. One thing though; you do know that the ports and flaps are actually square? The rings are just wreaths around the openings. I went and took a look at some photos of the replica again and find that the wreaths seem to have always been finished wood, but I wouldn't think it completely inappropriate to interpret them as gold or green. If you're sticking with the yellow, which really doesn't seem to stand out much, I might suggest another hull color. Though she appears in some of the images be painted with a bright lemon yellow color, other's, perhaps from a different time, look like an ocher yellow instead. So, there seems to be some room for creative license there. I've always thought that Bright Light Orange would be a close approximation to ocher. 

 

[Bodi]

Hello! Here are two ships I'm building now:

The first one is a sort of pocket battleship, I draw inspiration from KB's Tuna Spirit, I thought it will be fun if I could build it in real brick. I'm not sure if I'll be allowed to license a ship like this. If not, I can always raze the upper deck and transform it into a brig, maybe.

The second is more conventional, a small two-decker on 5 midsections, 50-gun once completed.

I have some questions for this one: where should I place the wheel, in the front or behind the mizzen mast, on some ships, the wheel is in the front of the mizzen mast and on others, it's behind the mast.

Also, should I cover the poop area, i.e. build a poop deck, or leave it like this, décapotable (sorry, I don't know the correct english term),because I've seen both on ship models, some with fully covered poop deck, and some with open poop, like a frigate.

 

Edited June 14, 2017 by Bodi

[Jacob Nion]

Ahoy @Bodi ! First of all, I think nobody will ever forbid you to licence a vessel, ragardless of how realistic or unrealistic it is. Only question will be what class it will fit.

I would place the wheel in  front of the mizzen. And I think it is completely up to you whether to cover tge poop or not. But as far as I can see you started to build a cabin so covering it would be better I guess. But if the poop deck looks too high in the end I would skip that cabin and leave it on the same height as the main deck. 

[kurigan]

Well, mate, the trouble is that that's not a poop deck. It's the quarter deck and yes on a 4th rate it should be covered up to, and some bit past, the mizzen mast. That deck, which functions as the roof of the great cabin will then be the poop deck . On most of the SotLs I can conjure up the wheel is ahead of the mizzen and covered by or is just beyond the cover of the poop. I'd advise mocking up some portion of the poop deck and seeing how well a helm (wheel) fits below it. If its a good, fit, go for it. if not cut the poop short.

 

I can't comment on the first one there, but I really think you've got a good thing going on your 50 gunner here. 

[Bodi]

7 hours ago, Jacob Nion said:

Ahoy @Bodi ! First of all, I think nobody will ever forbid you to licence a vessel, ragardless of how realistic or unrealistic it is. Only question will be what class it will fit.

I would place the wheel in  front of the mizzen. And I think it is completely up to you whether to cover tge poop or not. But as far as I can see you started to build a cabin so covering it would be better I guess. But if the poop deck looks too high in the end I would skip that cabin and leave it on the same height as the main deck. 

Than you Jacob! Good to hear your answer, I'll place the wheel in the front then, that means I should move the grilling forward or shorten it. The height of the cabin is a concern to me too, a lower cabin should look better I think. 

For the pocket ship, I'll place 30 guns on it and rate it a 5HA, just kidding.

 

6 hours ago, kurigan said:

Well, mate, the trouble is that that's not a poop deck. It's the quarter deck and yes on a 4th rate it should be covered up to, and some bit past, the mizzen mast. That deck, which functions as the roof of the great cabin will then be the poop deck . On most of the SotLs I can conjure up the wheel is ahead of the mizzen and covered by or is just beyond the cover of the poop. I'd advise mocking up some portion of the poop deck and seeing how well a helm (wheel) fits below it. If its a good, fit, go for it. if not cut the poop short.

 

I can't comment on the first one there, but I really think you've got a good thing going on your 50 gunner here. 

Ok, not a poop deck, that's alarming! That means a lot of work to do. But in the right way, awesome. Thank you for your professional advices, master Kurigan, I appreciate that very much.

[Umbra-Manis]

I'm back, although it's different then the last hull I posted, which has been modified some, but I'll be posting that after it starts looking like a ship.

Today I've got a ship of rather large size (for me anyway). I just added the deck today and I'm pretty happy with it (for now) but the bow area is giving me a headache.

I'm also not entirely pleased with the inside of the stern so far. I like the outside detailing, though.

[Bregir]

Impressive, UM! That vessel is looking quite imposing! Are you working from a specific source of inspiration? 

I personally think both bow and stern looks rather promising. I would build the upper deck forward another 6 to 8 studs and then end it there and let the current height of the foremost bow remain open as now. Then you add a few headrails, and it will end up nice, I think. Can I ask why you have two gunports together lover than the rest? 

Also, I would suggest keeping the cabin low to avoid the typical Lego box-on-boat cabin style. :) 

[Bregir]

My old Sphinx is getting a big brother:

I am quite happy with the colour scheme and general shape, but I am a bit stumped on how to continue with the bow, particularly the beakhead. Any suggestions?

[blackdeathgr]

@Bregir Hello! Can you take a top down photo of the hull as well? Right now the grey bricks protruding from the bow seem to start further from the "beak" and seem awkward. I think that is not the case because I know your ship-building capabilities, still it would give us a better view in order to generate some ideas for you . Also I am curious as to why you have used those hinges that can be moved outwards instead of "inner-wards. Uncle Breg knows something???  

[Bregir]

Like so? :)

[blackdeathgr]

Yeap, thanks! Now I can see clearly the use of those hinges. I am not an expert by any means but I would like those gray hinged to be placed closer to each other so as to form a smaller beak. I think it would look more natural. Well, I must seriously find time to build a medium sized vessel myself... 

[kurigan]

Humm... well let's see. For starters, the dorsal view does help. Some visual aid of your concept would help too. To save time I'll assume this is going to be a Xebec or other similar Mediterranean style boat. With that in mind I went to a quick Google search for Xebecs to take a refresher course in their shapes, particularly at the bow. Honestly, I think you're over thinking it; reinventing the wheel, so to speak. I think I get what you're about with plates, tiles and hinges, but I don't know if it's going to really create the shape you're looking for. IMHO what's been done in the past with flex tube and hydraulic hose has been pretty effective and closer in scale. None of the rail constructions I saw recreated on models seemed all that substantial, made of rather thin stock. Some don't even have them at all, so maybe that's an option. 

 

On another note, do I perceive a bit of brick bending? 

 

The way your bow is constructed is very bluff for such a ship, if my assumptions are correct. If you used a method more like I've used on my later bent hulls, I think you'd not only like the overall look better, but also find it easier to blend in the rails in question. Take or leave it, but if you're interested and want more on how, hit me up or just take a peek at my catalog. I'll not tie up the thread any more with "what I did..." 

[Lord Buckethead]

Hello people who are far better ship builders than I will ever be, in the past few days I'e been attempting my first ship, to be honest at first I had no idea what she was going to be I just started building a ship based on my knowledge of what they look like. From what I have researched it looks like she will be a two-decker 44-gun fifth rate, so far I haven't sought out help as I'm not really trying to build anything too accurate however I believe I have reached an impasse, the bow.

It's not that I can't build up from here anymore, I'm just not too sure how high the bow should be. If anyone can offer me some help it would be much appreciated.

-Thanks

[Bregir]

Interesting, sir - an alternative way to build the bow that I shall look forward to seeing the result of!

I would suggest you take a look at some ship plans to get an idea about how the bow would be built on real ships. Here is a small set of plans, and there are plenty more out there to find, but you can probably find what you need here.

http://www.ctbasses.com/misc/BruceTrinque/aubrey4.html

Even when not building to specific plans, taking a look at a real ship is often a good way to find inspiration, I find. :)

[Bregir]

An update on the Grand Sphinx:

Reworked headrails and an 18-pounder on a swivel in the centerline. The hoses are custom (and a little bit thicker in external diameter, as can be seen on how they are a bit flat in the holders)

Waiting for more pieces for the lateen yards.

C&C is, as always, welcome! :)

[Kolonialbeamter]

@Bregir Looking Grand and good, new headrails are fitting better than the old brick built ones Question: how rigid/flexible are those custom hoses compared to Lego originals (of about the same length), do they tend to keep their shape like Lego's, or do they just flex back and forth more or less rigidly?

Also, better replace your captain, as he seems to have lost his head before he even took command

[Bodi]

That's a good looking ship caravel xebec, Bregir. Can I have closer shot of the swivel platform? It looks really interesting.

[Bregir]

8 hours ago, Kolonialbeamter said:

Question: how rigid/flexible are those custom hoses compared to Lego originals (of about the same length), do they tend to keep their shape like Lego's, or do they just flex back and forth more or less rigidly?

I'd say they are fairly similar, but of course they will tend to give into pressure and find a sort of resting state with no tension.

8 hours ago, Kolonialbeamter said:

Also, better replace your captain, as he seems to have lost his head before he even took command

Ibn al'Sayeed had to lend his head to another character for a moment, but a replacement has arrived ;)

5 hours ago, Bodi said:

Can I have closer shot of the swivel platform? It looks really interesting.

Not the best picture, but it really is just a slide on a swivel. :)