Is anyone else fearing that Nexo Knights is meaning NO new castle them

[thetang22]

2 hours ago, Aanchir said:

I have no problem with the idea of having a poll here in this forum, even knowing that it would be biased. The ridiculous thing is to create a poll seeking answers only from one specific perspective. It's basically engineering the poll to get an answer you agree with by willfully shutting out perspectives you don't expect to agree with you. If you engineer the poll to get the outcome you want, then the outcome is meaningless. It neither proves anything, teaches anyone anything, nor convinces anyone of anything. It would be like if the poll in the Action Themes forum read "Do you like Nexo Knights? (Only answer if you're an action themes fan)".

Plus, as I said, it raises the question of what a "traditional castle perspective" even is.

The intention of the poll was something that obviously doesn't apply to you, so just move on.  You don't always have to argue with every point that's brought up.  Good grief man....it's exhausting.

[RetroInferno]

Ideally the poll would target the whole eurobricks community, not set in a specific sub-forum with two simple questions.

A. What were your initial impressions of Nexo Knight back at it's beginning? Answers varying from Most impressed to Sorely dissapointed. 

B. What are your feelings towards Nexo Knight after it's first completed year? Answers varying from Most impressed to Sorely dissapointed. 

Personally I think we would have a good gap from A to B, the theme grew old extremly fast for some people initially liking the idea and color scheme. Others old a bias agaisn't it for replacing Castle, which is also a fair point. 

 

Would anything looking somewhat like this be feasible?

[x105Black]

Those questions would tell how many people liked it up front, and how many like it now.  I'd be curious to get further details, like the following:

Has your opinion of Nexo Knights improved since the beginning?
Has your opinion of Nexo Knights diminished since the beginning?
Has your opinion of Nexo Knights stayed the same since the beginning?

It might be worth waiting until the new winter wave for 2017 has officially been announced before doing the poll.

Another good question could be about the idea that LEGO sees Nexo Knights as a Castle theme (despite the opposing perception of much of the fan base).  Like this:

Does Nexo Knights make a good Castle theme?
Or
Does Nexo Knights satisfy the expectations and desires of Castle fans?
Or
Is Nexo Knights satisfactory as a Castle theme?

Something along those lines.

[Lord Sith Lego]

I love the bad guys from Nexo Knights but still want regular castle to comeback. Mostly want a castle to build and the Disney castle out now is too expensive even if it looks good.

[Giantorange]

On 10/6/2016 at 4:40 AM, RetroInferno said:

Ideally the poll would target the whole eurobricks community, not set in a specific sub-forum with two simple questions.

A. What were your initial impressions of Nexo Knight back at it's beginning? Answers varying from Most impressed to Sorely dissapointed. 

B. What are your feelings towards Nexo Knight after it's first completed year? Answers varying from Most impressed to Sorely dissapointed. 

Personally I think we would have a good gap from A to B, the theme grew old extremly fast for some people initially liking the idea and color scheme. Others old a bias agaisn't it for replacing Castle, which is also a fair point. 

 

Would anything looking somewhat like this be feasible?

I don't think you are asking the right questions.  

 

As a classic castle builder, I had no expectations that Nexo would fulfill my needs, and therefore I'm not Sorely dissappointed.  

 

I have bought a few of the smaller sets, mainly for some of the figs, and trans pieces.  But I could say the same for some technic or town sets.  I have got them to cover a specific need to some parts.  Not because they are in themselves what I want from a castle set.  If there was a wave along the lines of Vikings, with a strong historical side, or Fantasy (trolls v dwarves), or any medieval theme largely based on structures rather than wheeled machines and catapults.  I would probably buy most if not all of it.  

[The_Cook]

Unless you place the poll on the EB frontpage and allow everyone on EB to vote you're not going to get a sensible answer; instead all that will happen is that you'll confirm the assumption that people that frequent the "Historic" forums generally don't like Nexo because it's not a Historic/Fantasy theme.

 

I can't face trawling through the old posts but the original "rumour" went something along the lines of "It's castle, a bit like fantasy era" which got everyone in the history forums all excited; if only that person had said "it's sci-fi with medieval influences" then the world would be a very different place with significantly less shattered dreams. Expectation management is everything; TLG need to get better at phrasing the rumours that escape so that the correct expectations are set.

[RetroInferno]

Yes expectations can be really deceiving, especially if one followed the rumors and discussion threads. Although the fact remains that Lego considers this their new ''Castle'' theme, I think it's only fair to ask the community about how they feel about the ''replacement'', even though the 2013 line was meh. 

 

[x105Black]

3 hours ago, The_Cook said:

I can't face trawling through the old posts but the original "rumour" went something along the lines of "It's castle, a bit like fantasy era" which got everyone in the history forums all excited; if only that person had said "it's sci-fi with medieval influences" then the world would be a very different place with significantly less shattered dreams. Expectation management is everything; TLG need to get better at phrasing the rumours that escape so that the correct expectations are set.

I agree, it wouldn't have been so disappointing if the true nature of the theme was known up front.  The Nexo Knights 2016 thread was originally in the Historic forum, and originally had a title that indicated a new Castle theme.  If it had been placed in the Sci-Fi forum, it may not have generated as much hate.  The expectations are the primary cause of the disillusionment.

1 hour ago, RetroInferno said:

Yes expectations can be really deceiving, especially if one followed the rumors and discussion threads. Although the fact remains that Lego considers this their new ''Castle'' theme, I think it's only fair to ask the community about how they feel about the ''replacement'', even though the 2013 line was meh. 

I completely agree.  Since LEGO considers this their Castle theme, it is worth asking people's opinions of it in that light.  I personally feel it fails as a Castle theme, despite any successes it may have otherwise.

[Aanchir]

10 minutes ago, x105Black said:

I agree, it wouldn't have been so disappointing if the true nature of the theme was known up front.  The Nexo Knights 2016 thread was originally in the Historic forum, and originally had a title that indicated a new Castle theme.  If it had been placed in the Sci-Fi forum, it may not have generated as much hate.  The expectations are the primary cause of the disillusionment.

I absolutely agree with this. However, the LEGO Group generally doesn't have a say in those kinds of "initial rumors" because they generally try not to publicly reveal anything until the theme is properly announced, and certainly not a full year in advance like with the earliest Nexo Knights rumors. This also wasn't the first time that early rumors led to a misconception about a theme's concept. The first rumors about LEGO Ninjago had people expecting a new traditional ninja theme. When the name Legends of Chima first surfaced, some people thought it might have to do with a South American Indian tribe. When a trademark was registered for the term "Speedorz", some people expected a new theme similar to Racers. When rumors came out about LEGO Elves, people automatically assumed it to be yellow-skinned minifigure elves like the CMF one. And let's not forget this rumor which ultimately just resulted in all kinds of confusion. Most recently the rumors of the Nexo Knights "Action" sets had some people in the constraction community expecting CCBS Nexo Knights, when the final sets ended up being System power-suits.

I don't think anybody can fully prevent rumors like that from getting out of control and resulting in misplaced expectations.

[The lego fan]

Possibly. But I think nexo knights has to end eventually though, with so many similar sets coming in. I realy love classic castle themes and hope to see more, but I don't mind nexo knights either.

 

[Artanis I]

15 hours ago, Aanchir said:

I absolutely agree with this. However, the LEGO Group generally doesn't have a say in those kinds of "initial rumors" because they generally try not to publicly reveal anything until the theme is properly announced, and certainly not a full year in advance like with the earliest Nexo Knights rumors. This also wasn't the first time that early rumors led to a misconception about a theme's concept. The first rumors about LEGO Ninjago had people expecting a new traditional ninja theme. When the name Legends of Chima first surfaced, some people thought it might have to do with a South American Indian tribe. When a trademark was registered for the term "Speedorz", some people expected a new theme similar to Racers. When rumors came out about LEGO Elves, people automatically assumed it to be yellow-skinned minifigure elves like the CMF one. And let's not forget this rumor which ultimately just resulted in all kinds of confusion. Most recently the rumors of the Nexo Knights "Action" sets had some people in the constraction community expecting CCBS Nexo Knights, when the final sets ended up being System power-suits.

I don't think anybody can fully prevent rumors like that from getting out of control and resulting in misplaced expectations.

"...a bigger, better Death Star"

[Klaus-Dieter]

That's a very interesting topic, Itaria No Shintaku!

 

Like the majority I voted for NO, regrettably not.

Nexo Knights is like Knight's Kingdoms 2 and Fantasy Area a dispraise of the Castle theme. Nothing in there has to do anything with middle age and knights. It's pure, senseless, brainless and horrible action stuff. But at the moment that seems to be hip at many kids because they do the same games on their computers, smartphones etc.

I wouldn't say that there never will be again that a glorious Castle theme like Kingdoms (2010-2011/12). Since it was released after the Fantasy Area, too. But we for sure have to wait minium til 2018/2019 when consumers will be tired of Nexo Knights and when TLG will run of profitable ideas for that theme.

 

Klaus-Dieter

[MAB]

16 hours ago, Klaus-Dieter said:

Nexo Knights is like Knight's Kingdoms 2 and Fantasy Area a dispraise of the Castle theme. Nothing in there has to do anything with middle age and knights. It's pure, senseless, brainless and horrible action stuff.
 

I'm not sure what the adjective pure is referring to in this sentence. The theme it self is not pure, and that seems to be the problem many people have with it. It is impure in that it derives from two distinct themes; castle (historical) and space (future). Senseless? Not really, it has a perfectly good purpose like other themes. Brainless? It seems to have a well defined storyline, way better than other kids' TV series and this is thus projected onto the sets. Horrible? Only in the eye of the beholder. Action, I agree.

 

So "It's action stuff".

 

[blackie]

2 hours ago, MAB said:

I'm not sure what the adjective pure is referring to in this sentence. The theme it self is not pure, and that seems to be the problem many people have with it. It is impure in that it derives from two distinct themes; castle (historical) and space (future). Senseless? Not really, it has a perfectly good purpose like other themes. Brainless? It seems to have a well defined storyline, way better than other kids' TV series and this is thus projected onto the sets. Horrible? Only in the eye of the beholder. Action, I agree.

 

So "It's action stuff".

 

Since he is German, I bet he means "it's nothing but senseless, brainless and horrible action stuff". And I totally agree to that, btw. In German, the word "pure" sounds like a German word, with a different meaning.

[Aanchir]

8 hours ago, MAB said:

Brainless? It seems to have a well defined storyline, way better than other kids' TV series and this is thus projected onto the sets.

While I agree that Nexo Knights is anything but brainless, I wouldn't call its storyline "way better than other kids' TV series", because from my experience, there are a LOT of good cartoons out there these days. The standards for kids' entertainment are a lot higher than they were in the 80s when the earliest merchandise-driven shows were first hitting the airwaves, most of them characterized by weak storytelling and meager production values. I saw a clip of the He-Man & She-Ra Christmas special just yesterday, and it was laughable just how BAD it was by today's standards.

Zany mashup themes like Ninjago or Nexo Knights may not be to everybody's liking, but I'm bothered when people use that as an excuse to disparage today's youth for having poor taste. A big part of why there is so much great kids' entertainment today (including movies, cartoons, video games, and LEGO sets) is that the people making it have learned to respect their audience's intelligence and take their tastes seriously. To assume kids are dumb, tasteless saps who will lap up anything that's put in front of them is to revert to a kind of decades-old ignorance that toy and media companies have learned they can no longer afford in today's market.

Edited October 18, 2016 by Aanchir

[Artanis I]

17 hours ago, MAB said:

I'm not sure what the adjective pure is referring to in this sentence.

The comma is not supposed to be there. It should read "pure senseless, brainless and horrible action stuff"

Sometimes the word pure is used as a synonym for complete, entire etc.

Edited October 19, 2016 by Artanis I

[ProvenceTristram]

Admittedly, I'm a Star Wars and town aficionado first and foremost. But I do own a lot of Castle dating back to the late 1980s, and as I stood in my local Walmart tonight, staring down the massive display - front and center - of Nexo Knights, I have to admit, I could think of nothing else than what a waste the whole thing was. Let's set aside the fact that, in this particular store, the line didn't seem to be selling (at all); let's set aside my own personal bias against Lego genre blending - what a sad thing that in a year with no pirates and no real castle, this is what was dumped into our collective laps. Of all the dozens of historical time periods - previously visited or otherwise - that Lego could have invested in developing a line for, we get space squires. Space jesters. Space skeleton guys.

I mean... really? Really? Why not just purchase the license to He-Man and be done with it, Lego? Or, goodness, why not at least ape something cool like Warhammer 40k and do space knights that way? You know, space-paladins and such? 

I know there are people buying Nexo Knights - I know that, somewhere out there, there are folks who think this is the best release of all time. But I cannot for the life of me conceive of them as even approaching a majority. The castle/pirates crowd has to be larger, if not individually, then certainly from a cumulative perspective. Are the majority of them really spending their hard-earned cash on tank-castles? I doubt it. 

Edited November 4, 2016 by ProvenceTristram

[zoth33]

Its a toy for kids man.  It seems like some people forget that.  Obviously it tested well enough with Lego and their focus groups to make the theme.  I like the theme its not the greatest theme ever but it does have some nice builds and fun play functions.  My 6yr old loves it and that's all that matters really.  Plus the evil characters are really excellent.  That's just my 2 cents.

[Littleworlds]

6 minutes ago, zoth33 said:

Its a toy for kids man.  It seems like some people forget that.  Obviously it tested well enough with Lego and their focus groups to make the theme.  I like the theme its not the greatest theme ever but it does have some nice builds and fun play functions.  My 6yr old loves it and that's all that matters really.  Plus the evil characters are really excellent.  That's just my 2 cents.

I heartfully agree. As much many of us (me included) would like having a "proper" castle theme again - its simply not about us. We are not the target audience. And the villains offer great material for fantasy-themes. I don't like the builds either, but I got quite a number of their small sets now, mainly for the minifigures, so for me its alright. It could be better, of course. But much, much worse too 

[x105Black]

To answer the question in the title, yes.  It is well known around these parts that I really don't like Nexo Knights, and it irks me greatly that this is what is on the shelves in lieu of other great themes like Castle and Pirates.  I also haven't witnessed it selling well in my area.

A licensed He-Man theme would have been much better, but also very different.  I would love to see it, though.  Warhammer might be closer to what they were aiming for, though.  They missed the mark by a wide margin.

[Lordofdragonss]

1. I always wanted space-tech-knights myself.
2. The Lava monsters are great for fantasy building (RED ORCS!)
3. Lego original licences > Other licences. <3

[Nick Wolfe]

I didn't like Nexo Knights at first but it has started to grow on me since I started getting into Voltron, just because the aesthetics are similar. I think that the over the top weapon shaped vehicles are pretty cool and I absolutely agree that the red orcs are a great addition to parts collection. I love classic castle and even though there are plenty of new placed that LEGO could go with it I would rather have something creative like this than another boring castle rehash like Kingdoms.

[Blakstone]

While I don't like Nexo Knights and it does bother me that it may be preventing a castle theme that I would enjoy, I do NOT find it a betrayal. Betrayal makes it sound like LEGO owed us a specific type of theme and they forsook their oath.

I believe LEGO thinks that most AFOLs move on to Modulars, Ideas, UCS, and Dimension sets and targets kids for their smaller sets. And if they maintain the design aesthetic for these smaller themes, it becomes a self fulfilling prophecy.

Frankly there is not a must buy theme for me anymore but I can find a bit to like in quite a few themes.

I LOVED Castle as a kid, but the simplistic designs of the minifigures do not pair well with modern ones. I want a Castle theme back that continues the level of detail of Kingdoms, Lord of the Rings, and the CMF series. If Castle 2020 looks on par with Castle 2013, I will probably pick up only a few and wait for clearance. If Castle 2020 looks like Kingdoms, I will horde the sets when they are first released.

[ratjag]

I almost never comment, but feel this is pretty important.  Like so many, I grew up with classic castle, inheriting the first sets from an older sibling and taking over with forestmen and the black knights era.  My "dark ages" took me through the end of the 90s and it took Vikings to bring me out of it.  

What seems missing in these discussions, and what Lego seems to no longer value, is that imagination is more than just throwing bricks together and blowing things up. Sometimes, it means connecting to new subject matter through play. For me, Lego was the catalyst for my love of history, and the hours I spent building castles and western forts and pirate ships genuinely fed a passion that has endured into my adulthood and informed my approach to the world and the work that I do.  I really do owe so much of that to little plastic bricks. 

Which makes all of this distressing.  Nexo Knights aren't, in themselves, some grand evil, but they are another symptom of a broader disease -- Lego has clearly shifted away from being a medium through which children can explore ideas that connect to the real world.  Creativity, for all of Lego's marketing to the contrary, sometimes does require context, even at the risk of not appealing to a particular region or target market.  Like so many of you, I am a father myself now, and it's particularly tough knowing just what my young daughter is missing.  It's a bit sad to think of what Lego COULD do given the molds and colors available today, not just for castle, but for long-dreamed-of themes like Romans, etc. how easy could it be to develop a time travelers theme and hit so many incredible areas... 

[BearHeart]

3 hours ago, ratjag said:

I almost never comment, but feel this is pretty important.  Like so many, I grew up with classic castle, inheriting the first sets from an older sibling and taking over with forestmen and the black knights era.  My "dark ages" took me through the end of the 90s and it took Vikings to bring me out of it.  

What seems missing in these discussions, and what Lego seems to no longer value, is that imagination is more than just throwing bricks together and blowing things up. Sometimes, it means connecting to new subject matter through play. For me, Lego was the catalyst for my love of history, and the hours I spent building castles and western forts and pirate ships genuinely fed a passion that has endured into my adulthood and informed my approach to the world and the work that I do.  I really do owe so much of that to little plastic bricks. 

Which makes all of this distressing.  Nexo Knights aren't, in themselves, some grand evil, but they are another symptom of a broader disease -- Lego has clearly shifted away from being a medium through which children can explore ideas that connect to the real world.  Creativity, for all of Lego's marketing to the contrary, sometimes does require context, even at the risk of not appealing to a particular region or target market.  Like so many of you, I am a father myself now, and it's particularly tough knowing just what my young daughter is missing.  It's a bit sad to think of what Lego COULD do given the molds and colors available today, not just for castle, but for long-dreamed-of themes like Romans, etc. how easy could it be to develop a time travelers theme and hit so many incredible areas... 

Wow, excellent post! I completely agree with you about everything.

I am a history buff myself and the LEGO castle and pirate themes of my childhood played a large role in my initial interest in history. I was also in a dark age and it was the Vikings theme that eventually brought me back to LEGO as an adult.

In regards to the Nexo Knights theme, I was originally apprehensive when I heard/saw it at first but I thought it would eventually grow on me. It hasn't. In fact, as time passes and more sets come out I find them less and less interesting... I don't even bother looking at the newly released sets at all anymore.

To me, Nexo Knights, Ninjago and Chima might as well be one big theme because all these themes seem to be just a group of good guys going up against a bunch of baddies with a bunch of crazy, over the top colorful vehicles. At least with Ninjago and Chima there was a few sets here and there that I would cherry pick because they'd fit in with my other castle/pirates stuff.  I don't find this with Nexo Knights at all, I bought a few of the 'ultimate (insert name here)" sets but none of the bigger sets appealed to me at all.

My biggest fear is that Nexo Knight will just go on and on and on like Ninjago seems to be doing (didn't that theme start in 2011 or something?) which will make a classic castle theme most likely impossible. Instead, I'm just hoping to ride it out and maybe in a year or two a different, more historic or fantasy oriented castle theme will return.