42056 - Porsche 911 GT3 RS - MODs and Improvements

[Didumos69]

For you and all of those who don't like to have a cog on the dash:

While I was driving (being a driver) An idea came up... It is an actulal modification of my HOG.

1. Instead of using 8L axle with stop, use a 6L axle

2. Secure the 6L axle inside the upper bracket with 3 pieces of half bushes

3. DO NOT use the pinhole with pin in the dashboard. (sothe last step in the video is not happening)

4. get 2L axle connector, a 2L axle and your desired HOG and push them together

The result is a removable HOG. When the model is on display and you don't have the HOG on and the upper end of 6L axle nicely hiding in the level of the dash. When you wana play it (sorry, demonstrate it ) you put on the Hog assembly (what we made in step 4.) and it is ready to go...

I'm still a digital stupid. If anyone shares the secret, how can I attach a 133 kb pic here you will see better what I meant.

Great idea! You mean something like this? Maybe the removable HoG can be stored under the hood together with the luggage bag (Sorry I used my HoG)

Edited June 7, 2016 by Didumos69

[Attika]

I am still trying to pinpoint what is causing these problems between them.. it is very strange having two models built exacty the same right in from of you and both behaving differently..

When I was building mine, I made a check after every and each step, that all the transmission parts are loose enough. At the end it was and it is quite smooth even in 2. gear considering the number of cogs in the system.

My point is: there isn't two identically working model. The building process defines the end result strongly here.

Great idea! You mean like this? (Sorry I used my HoG)

yep

Edited June 7, 2016 by Attika

[Meatman]

Because the 90 degree problem is u.a. Caused by backlash i strongly recommend applying Attikas mode for the Double engaging issue. See initial posting of this MOD thread...

And i can imagine that a geartrain with backlash shows different results in two builds even if identically built. Esoecially when some discrete positions are needed...

He did say that one model was rotating 90 degree perfectly though without the mod.

[Didumos69]

There is one more thing that I can't get out of my head. In the section where the drive axle crosses the gear selecter axle there is also a pin joiner placed. Not that I think pin joiners are generally bad after the Blakbird fix, but I thought it would be worth trying without. I don't think the pin joiner is needed for keeping the bevel gear with pin hole in place and it does cause some unnecessary friction. Did anybody try? This won't fix the backlash problem but maybe it reduces friction even further.

Edited June 7, 2016 by Didumos69

[Tommy Styrvoky]

I improved the suspension, and compacted it slightly. Now the shock absorbers can use their full travel length. It was rather easy to mount the steering rack behind the axle, and only required the addition of a couple new parts, I need to determine the correct length for the new steering arms, so it can have proper geometry.

I will try to keep parts color coded, for ease of assembling all of the mods into one file, so eventually this can be exported into ldraw format for a master set of instructions.

lego Porsche GT3 RS updated Macpherson suspension and behind the axle steering by Tommy Styrvoky, on Flickr

lego Porsche GT3 RS updated Macpherson suspension and behind the axle steering by Tommy Styrvoky, on Flickr

Edited June 7, 2016 by Tommy Styrvoky

[Kumbbl]

He did say that one model was rotating 90 degree perfectly though without the mod.

i know but that perfectly supports my thesis - the perfectly working 90 degree slots are there because the builder has accidentally build in exactly the perfect amount of friction/backlash etc... mechanic with backlash can not so precisely moved/driven that you can gurantee 1 degree precision without a additional mechanism which ensures that - and AFAIK these two change over catches are such a mechanism...

to make a long story short: the 100% working version of Pauls wife is pure coincidence - if she would build it again the result would probably be different without the MOD of Attika...

[technic_addict]

Great idea! You mean something like this? Maybe the removable HoG can be stored under the hood together with the luggage bag (Sorry I used my HoG)

I would add HOG if it was removable as shown!

[Appie]

Great idea and can hide the HOG top under the hood with the Porsche bag probably when it's not used. Maybe it fits in the bag even, in parts or as a whole, I don't know how hollow that thing is.

edit:

Made some adjustments to my version of MaxSupercars' gearlock. It works now, except for one little problem. In neutral there is a bit of slack in the system. Unlike MaxSupercars' version which only has slack from the gear selector, this has play from the gear selector which is amplified by the mechanism at the bottom to account for the D>N>R sticker. When the selector is in reverse or drive it has no play, so neither will the mechanism at the bottom. I tried to reduce the slack in neutral with a friction pin at the lower mechanism, but with a bit of force you could still gear down while in neutral (not sure if that's really a bad thing though), can't gear up. Otherwise it works just like Max' mod, can only engage reverse from 1st gear and drive is free to go whichever way.

Edited June 7, 2016 by Appie

[MaxSupercars]

Tommy thanx for suspension. Looks interesting... :)

Max

Edited June 7, 2016 by MaxSupercars

[Attika]

Appie, you should clean that screen But th main subject is great

[Appie]

Thanks and yeah, you're right about the screen

[pilsbury1440]

seeing all the excellent mods i can't help wondering if lego have been incredibly devious......

why leave a 1L hole in the dashboard... if not to tempt people to add a HOG

why leave a hole just the right size for an XL PF motor underneath

why "deliberately" create an unusual (wrong!) gear shift sequence?

why put the changeover catches in the paddle shift the wrong way round? accidentally on purpose?

surely the friciton issue blackbird pointed out in stage 6 is so glaringly obvious lego wouldn't have built it that way without reason

could it all be to drum up interest and controversy and excitement to sell a lot of sets at a high price...?

would be quite brilliant if they did turn round and reveal a hidden contest to identify all the "deliberate" mistakes and win a real GT3 RS*

are you sure there is nothing in the special content to reveal a competition.

Why create individual lazer etched pieces to only get a few posters and a cheap certificate, if its not a limited edition...Is it a secret code?

...i doubt anything is so sneaky but this set certainly is ultimate in the amount of hype and interest, ultimate marketing and parting people from their money - it seems popular whatever its limitations

Me i never thought id spend £250 on a set.... but sadly porsche was out of stock when i visited the lego shop in stratford to try and get it...

*hope its not the case as it may mean people stop sharing all their finds!

[Tommy Styrvoky]

Here's a couple interesting thoughts for modifications. I think it would be possible to mount functional brake and accelerator pedals. I think there could be technic rubber parts used to apply pressure on thr rims of the tires, and be toggled by either string or linkages.For the accelerator, I think it would be possible to mount a 7v Lipo battery box in the front trunk, and connect the adjustment knob to a linkage to the pedal. Then connect a L motor to the engine. Though before this can be done, thr paddle shifter has to be compacted, I do have a couple different solutions to solve that problem.

Edited June 7, 2016 by Tommy Styrvoky

[Attika]

seeing all the excellent mods i can't help wondering if lego have been incredibly devious......

why leave a 1L hole in the dashboard... if not to tempt people to add a HOG

why leave a hole just the right size for an XL PF motor underneath

why "deliberately" create an unusual (wrong!) gear shift sequence?

why put the changeover catches in the paddle shift the wrong way round? accidentally on purpose?

surely the friciton issue blackbird pointed out in stage 6 is so glaringly obvious lego wouldn't have built it that way without reason

could it all be to drum up interest and controversy and excitement to sell a lot of sets at a high price...?

would be quite brilliant if they did turn round and reveal a hidden contest to identify all the "deliberate" mistakes and win a real GT3 RS*

are you sure there is nothing in the special content to reveal a competition.

Why create individual lazer etched pieces to only get a few posters and a cheap certificate, if its not a limited edition...Is it a secret code?

...i doubt anything is so sneaky but this set certainly is ultimate in the amount of hype and interest, ultimate marketing and parting people from their money - it seems popular whatever its limitations

Me i never thought id spend £250 on a set.... but sadly porsche was out of stock when i visited the lego shop in stratford to try and get it...

*hope its not the case as it may mean people stop sharing all their finds!

I won't stop sharing, since I don't care about money. It messed up the world already. All these people on this blog could spend their time by making money, but they don't. They build and share, So I don't think I'm alone with this.

Bottom line is: Stay tuned, more amazing things will come up....

A real porsche? God, that is an unpractical car... We couldn't afford to change the braekepads.... And it's orange too...

Here's a couple interesting thoughts for modifications. I think it would be possible to mount functional brake and accelerator pedals. I think there could be technic rubber parts used to apply pressure on thr rims of the tires, and be toggled by either string or linkages.For the accelerator, I think it would be possible to mount a 7v Lipo battery box in the front trunk, and connect the adjustment knob to a linkage to the pedal. Then connect a L motor to the engine. Though before this can be done, thr paddle shifter has to be compacted, I do have a couple different solutions to solve that problem.

Interesting idea with the accelerator pedal. I like it. But the brake system should be disk brake, just to be authentic. Sheepo could manage in his porsche. That is about the same scale anyway. Still I never attempted any kind of brake to model, so I should stay quiet

Edited June 7, 2016 by Attika

[Appie]

After testing my version of MaxSupercars' mod some more, I decided it was crap. I don't like the crap it does in neutral, so it has to go. Clean slate. This time I basically worked on the rough version from Max' video into LDD and hid the lock behind both panels, because that was what I wanted to do in the first place. I think this solution actual looks better than my previous crap.

I couldn't figure out why the model has a 3x5 liftarm on the side, besides it adding support for the structure above it. The pinholes aren't used by the body that goes on top from what I can see. So I switched it with a 2x4 liftarm since I needed the space. I tested this mechanism on my mock up and it works.

And this how it should look on the model:

Thanks Max for the great idea!

Edited June 7, 2016 by Appie

[MaxSupercars]

Tommy,

I have tried your last MOD of front suspension. The top part is whole moving. What do I wrong? :/

Max

Edited June 7, 2016 by MaxSupercars

[Appie]

By the looks of it, in Tommy's image the spring is 1 stud closer to the towball pin than it is on your model, maybe that's the difference.

[do2]

This is a just a non-functional micro mod for the rear calipers, but if the official version is a little bit too blocky for your taste - just replace the 2 yellow plates pus tile at steps 249-251 with:

http://www.brickshelf.com/cgi-bin/gallery.cgi?i=6404007

This mod has slightly more height than the 2 plates with tile, but there is no problem with the Porsche wheels ;)

You can find the lxf file here:

http://www.brickshelf.com/cgi-bin/gallery.cgi?f=564665

[Didumos69]

I am still trying to pinpoint what is causing these problems between them.. it is very strange having two models built exacty the same right in from of you and both behaving differently..

I think someone mentioned it before, but there is something strange with step 121 and step 173 of the BI, which might cause differences. In step 121 one of the CV-joints is inserted in a 2L axle connector. However the CV-joint is oriented perfectly horizontally, while the 2L axle connector is rotated by 45 degrees, just like the knob gear attached to it at the other end. In fact step 121 shows something impossible. Most of us will leave the knob gear in 45 degree position and will end up having the CV-joint in rotated position too. However you can rotate the CV-joint clockwise or counterclockwise. This is where the first difference might occur. Further on in step 173 the CV-joint coming out of the paddle selecter - which is oriented perfectly vertically - is connected to the CV-joint that was put in place in step 121. Step 173 shows how the vertically oriented CV-joint is connected to the horizontally oriented CV-joint. In practice this might turn out differently, because of the first CV-joint being rotated by 45 degrees.

So you could end up with the CV-joints having the same orientation or different orientation. I've been playing with CV-joints and when they are angled more that 11 degrees they start grinding. So I don't trust them and therefore I wouldn't be surprised when their relative orientation matters in the whole gear selection setup. So I'm very curious whether the CV-joints in your builds have the same orientation or different orientation.

EDIT: Now that I'm looking into this I'm wondering, how can tthe whole gear selection mechanism operate properly if somewhere down the road a 90 degree oriented axle connects to a 45 degree oriented axle? Where have these 45 degrees gone? What am I missing? Or is this 45 degree difference what's needed to avoid backlash? But then the above possibilities might make the difference between adding backlash and reducing backlash. Could somebody clarify?

Remarkable side note; Step 173 is the last step showing the CV-joints. In the remaining 683 steps you don't see them again...

Edited June 13, 2016 by Didumos69

[MaxSupercars]

By the looks of it, in Tommy's image the spring is 1 stud closer to the towball pin than it is on your model, maybe that's the difference.

Hmm OK, thank you,

I corrected it, but there is still movement of top part. Smaller but still there. What is the purpose of upper 1x2 half beams? Hmm...

Max

Edited June 7, 2016 by MaxSupercars

[Tommy Styrvoky]

Hmm OK, thank you,

I corrected it, but there is still movement of top part. Smaller but still there. What is the purpose of upper 1x2 half beams? Hmm...

Max

it's missing a part, a pin/axle cross block with a 1/2 stud long technic pin. This eliminates the movement you speak of, and the spring should be moved to the next axle over(the purpose of these parts is to sandwich the springs in place). I forgot to mention the 8z gear that goes on the 2 stud long pink axle, that eliminates a lot of play in the suspension. That's why I color coded it and the gear pink.

I will just post the ldd file later tonight,I want to change the upper mount structure, as it interferes with the bodywork.

Edited June 7, 2016 by Tommy Styrvoky

[tomek9210]

Why don't you make the upper mounting for the strut like in Sheepo's mps? It is way simpler.

[Tommy Styrvoky]

Interesting idea with the accelerator pedal. I like it. But the brake system should be disk brake, just to be authentic. Sheepo could manage in his porsche. That is about the same scale anyway. Still I never attempted any kind of brake to model, so I should stay quiet

I don't think disc brakes will be possible for the front axle,but the back would work, because of the wheel hubs.

Why don't you make the upper mounting for the strut like in Sheepo's mps? It is way simpler.

it wasn't centered over the shock absorber, and I wanted to make my own design. I also noticed play when the upper mount when it isn't supported. Edited June 7, 2016 by Tommy Styrvoky

[Attika]

I think someone mentioned it before, but there is something strange with step 121 and step 173 of the BI, which might cause differences. In step 121 one of the CV-joints is inserted in a 2L axle connector. However the CV-joint is oriented perfectly horizontally, while the 2L axle connector is rotated by 45 degrees, just like the knob gear attached to it on the other side. In fact step 121 shows something impossible. Most of us will leave the knob gear in 45 degree position and will end up having the CV-joint in rotated position too. However you can rotate the CV-joint clockwise or counterclockwise. This is where the first difference might occur. Further on in step 173 the CV-joint coming out of the paddle selecter - which is oriented perfectly vertically - is connected to the CV-joint that was put in place in step 121. Step 173 shows how the vertically oriented CV-joint is connected to the horizontally oriented CV-joint. In practice this might turn out differently, because of the first CV-joint being rotated by 45 degrees.

So you could end up with the CV-joints having the same orientation or different orientation. I've been playing with CV-joints and when they are angled more that 11 degrees they start grinding. So I don't trust them and therefore I wouldn't be surprised when their relative orientation matters in the whole gear selection setup. So I'm very curious whether the CV-joints in your builds have the same orientation or different orientation.

EDIT: Now that I'm looking into this I'm wondering, how can tthe whole gear selection mechanism operate properly if somewhere down the road a 90 degree oriented axle connects to a 45 degree oriented axle? Where have these 45 degrees gone? What am I missing? Or is this 45 degree difference what's needed to avoid backlash? But then the above possibilities might make the difference between adding backlash and reducing backlash. I don't get it.

Nice finding. I've been straight jumping into my porsche to find something. There isn't anything, or at least it has no effect on the outcome. The paddle shifter mechanism operates only with knob wheels right down to the actual rotating shifting axle. So follow it on its way:

1. Due to the nature of the paddle shifter the knobwheel in it (the upper middle on the vertical axle) should be always + (+ means pointing in the "noble" directions, ahead, backward and the two sides 0,90,180,270)

2. So the next knobwheel what connected to it (on the horizontal axle at the bottom of the paddleshifter) is always x (x means the 45,135, 225,315 pointing) (I hope you get what I mean)

3. Here comes the two cv-joint going backward keepeing the x position.

4. That gives us that the knobwheel behind the 8 tooth gear is also in x position

5. What makes the last knobwheel on the actual shifting axle being always in + position. Just as it is desired by the design.

So my conclusion is: On the picture the knobwheels are ok. And it is a 3d modeling mistake the the cv is in an impossible position, BUT when you physically build it, you can't go wrong as the whole system conains only elements what can only be turned only by 90 degrees (knobwheel, and cv)

I'm surprised to say this, but this time the designers did well, and whoever made the pic for the instruction messed up the picture. But it can't make anyone to go wrong at the building procedure.

Did it make sense to you what I wrote?

edit: when I say "always" that means the resting system in any gear

Edited June 7, 2016 by Attika

[Tommy Styrvoky]

More progress on the front suspension, and Ackerman Geometry.

The front suspension is nearly complete, I know there will have to be modifications to the trunk interior, in order to mount the bodywork on the model, but it isn't included in the LDD file. I have made a mockup of a strut, and the suspension seems to work fine with soft and hard springs, though for hard springs It may need more reinforcement.

Don't forget to mount the 8z gears on the 2L axles, otherwise the suspension will have lots of slack. These parts are in dark purple.

A small test of the geometry( it's close, but maybe off by half a stud.)

I think the smaller steering rack will decrease the turning radius, but it should be similar to the original kit's, as Jim mentioned in his review that the 24 hour car had the approximately the same wheel radius. If only lego produced an 11 stud wide rack, a custom brick built rack would work better, but I have to mess around with that in real life.

Also the mounts for the brake calipers need to be reaffixed to the new suspension struts.

updated file http://www.bricksafe...son strut 2.lxf

Color coding

-Green= Behind axle steering/Ackerman geometry

- Bright purple= Macpherson strut suspension

- Bright reddish violet= parts need to be mounted together.

42056_Ackerman Geometry by Tommy Styrvoky, on Flickr

42056_macpherson strut by Tommy Styrvoky, on Flickr

42056_macpherson strut by Tommy Styrvoky, on Flickr

Next to work on the shifting drum, I am almost questioning if someone should start on replacing the awfully designed gearbox with a better functioning one.

as that seems to be one of the major drawbacks of the model. I think it could work with a six speed transmission, and a six position shifting drum, though I will attempt to make solutions for both.

Edited June 8, 2016 by Tommy Styrvoky