Ghostbusters 2016 Reboot discussion

[PicnicBasketSam]

What I was getting at is that I'm sure there would be a number of people who haven't heard of the original, and would complain that "Hollywood is out of ideas, they're making samurai movies out of westerns," or worse, "How dare they remake a Western into a movie about Asian people! That's racist and horrible and this movie is an insult to my childhood..." if the reaction is anything like what happened to Ghostbusters.

[Littleworlds]

In the end it's looking like a 70 million plus loss for Sony, and the director said he'll never reboot another franchise, so, hey! Something good came out of this ugly trainwreck after all.

I don't feel sorry for sony for sure. Its just another tech/entertainment corporation, but I feel very sorry for the cast who had to go through an ugly trainwreck (to use this colourful phrase) of entitled fanboy shitstorm and for the women in the movie branche in general, since a successful reboot would have likely opened many doors for female-led casts and more equal payment.

Good film or not, ghostbusters or not, gender equality is something that simply needs to finally happen.

[HawkLord]

^^^ This x 100.

The reboot needed to be successful for the franchise and while I'm not suggesting people don't speak their minds, the constant trolling worked to hurt the trolls. Those that wanted an all-make sequel are now hosed.

I do feel bad for Paul Feig and the cast who did their best. This was gonna be a big movie break for some of them and it would have been nice if they got a fair chance right out of the gate.

[Actor Builder]

Good film or not, ghostbusters or not, gender equality is something that simply needs to finally happen.

I agree entirely. Perhaps it would have been a better decision to have a cast of 'busters with both genders involved, even if it leaned more heavily on the female characters.

[SodorBricks]

I agree they do need to sort out the gender gap, but a better use would have been 2 males and 2 female ghost busters but just dont bring a classic franchise into it as they dont seem to mix well.

Edited August 10, 2016 by SodorBricks

[Jbricks]

Holy... Paul Feig being absurdly childish, trying to get his Twitter followers to harass Bardock Obama. And then Twitter forced Bardock to delete a tweet, threatening to ban him... Just because he said he was happy that the sequel plans were squashed.

[Captain Nemo]

Holy... Paul Feig being absurdly childish, trying to get his Twitter followers to harass Bardock Obama. And then Twitter forced Bardock to delete a tweet, threatening to ban him... Just because he said he was happy that the sequel plans were squashed.

How does this contribute to a productive Ghostbusters film discussion at all, in any way?

Everyone:

I've been watching this thread for a while now, and it's really spiraling out of hand. If you like the movie great, rejoice, talk about it. If you don't like the movie, ok, talk about your dislike if you wish. But don't come here to tell people that they're wrong for liking the movie or worse yet, use this thread as means to incite anger because its supposedly besmirching a 'classic' through the use of actresses.

Thanks!

[NXS7]

Everyone:

I've been watching this thread for a while now, and it's really spiraling out of hand. If you like the movie great, rejoice, talk about it. If you don't like the movie, ok, talk about your dislike if you wish. But don't come here to tell people that they're wrong for liking the movie or worse yet, use this thread as means to incite anger because its supposedly besmirching a 'classic' through the use of actresses.

Thanks!

The Internet needs more moderators like you

[x105Black]

I read this entire thread, and it's an interesting discussion. Lots of people with very reasonable complaints (either before or after seeing the movie), and a few supporters (with one repetitive fanboy) with completely valid reviews of their own.

I was a fan of Ghostbusters, and equally of Ghostbusters 2. Not a huge fan, but I definitely enjoyed the films, cartoon, and action figures. When I first heard that they were finally making a new Ghostbusters movie, I figured I'd enjoy it. Unfortunately, everything I've heard since has convinced me not to see it.

I'm glad it has found an audience. I'm also glad that the audience it has found is small.

[Captain Pirate Man]

Well it's officially considered a box office flop. I am genuinely sad that this is HOW Ghostbusters will come to an end, I just don't see the potential in any more live action films.

[Forresto]

How is it a flop if its already made more then it's budget? If it made less on the domestic market but more on the international market isnt that still a big success?

[Captain Pirate Man]

How is it a flop if its already made more then it's budget? If it made less on the domestic market but more on the international market isnt that still a big success?

It hasn't made back it's budget though. The film cost 144 million to make, probably another 100 million or so in marketing. Also let's not forget that theaters take 30 to 40% or the cut. That is why reports have come out that it's a 70 million or so loss on it's budget,but again that's not even counting marketing.

Whether people like it or not, the film has officially flopped.

[Forresto]

According to wikipedia Ghostbusters has earned 182 million worldwide and cost 144 million to make. I guess adding everything else on then definitely I could see it not making the money back. However that's the studio and producer's fault not the film.

[Blondie-Wan]

Holy... Paul Feig being absurdly childish, trying to get his Twitter followers to harass Bardock Obama. And then Twitter forced Bardock to delete a tweet, threatening to ban him... Just because he said he was happy that the sequel plans were squashed.

First of all, Bardock's tweet celebrating the movie's failure was churlish and childish; no one who wanted a sequel would have to have it, but actively campaigning to keep others from getting it? How gauche.

And secondly, Feig didn't do or say anything; he merely retweeted Bardock Obama, by way of showing what kind of BS he's still having to deal with, but without actually commenting on it or advising a course of action. Merely retweeting a tweet is hardly childish.

It hasn't made back it's budget though. The film cost 144 million to make, probably another 100 million or so in marketing. Also let's not forget that theaters take 30 to 40% or the cut. That is why reports have come out that it's a 70 million or so loss on it's budget,but again that's not even counting marketing.

Whether people like it or not, the film has officially flopped.

Unfortunately, that's probably the case. Meanwhile, Suicide Squad and Batman v Superman: Dawn of Justice, while performing below expectations, still rake it in at the box office, as have all the live-action Transformers movies. Oh, well. Unfortunately, I think misogynists have killed the franchise, or at least put it into a coma.

[Littleworlds]

Unfortunately, that's probably the case. Meanwhile, Suicide Squad and Batman v Superman: Dawn of Justice, while performing below expectations, still rake it in at the box office, as have all the live-action Transformers movies. Oh, well. Unfortunately, I think misogynists have killed the franchise, or at least put it into a coma.

I completely agree, even if they were merely hiding it with "factual" comments on the movies' quality, despite not having watched it

[Blondie-Wan]

I completely agree, even if they were merely hiding it with "factual" comments on the movies' quality, despite not having watched it

Indeed:

On Thursday, the movie had an IMDB average of 5.1 out of 10, which was surprisingly low, given the film’s relatively high critical reviews. A closer look revealed men rated the film, on average, a 3.6 out of 10. Women, on the other hand, rated it 7.7 out of 10.

Additionally, nearly five times as many men had rated the movie — 7,547 men as opposed to 1,564 women.

Many armchair number crunchers have attempted to determine if a film’s average IMDB rating has any effect on its actual ticket sales, but the jury remains out on any causation. That said, a curated list on the site of the highest grossing films of all time only includes one movie with a rating under a 6 out of 10.

Also impossible to discern is whether men are intentionally rating the film low as a means of “trolling” those who enjoy it, but it should be noted that when Hickey crunched those 12,000 votes, the movie hadn’t been officially released in the United States.

(source)

[Space Police XVIII]

Yup, the misogynists have won. It was misogynists all along.

So.... where's the hate for Suicide Squad?

Where's the hate for The Phantom Menace?

There's a Wonder Woman movie coming out. This is unconfirmed, but I heard the title character is a woman. There should be a massive hate campaign against that, right? where is it?

edit: aw crap I meant the Force Awakens

Edited August 13, 2016 by Space Police XVIII

[Blondie-Wan]

Yup, the misogynists have won. It was misogynists all along.

Not entirely; no one's saying that. Certainly the trailers didn't help. And plenty of people hated that it rebooted a beloved franchise at all, with or without women. But there was indeed a deeply entrenched misogyny directed against this movie.

So.... where's the hate for Suicide Squad?

Well, yeah - exactly. That movie has much worse reviews than Ghostbusters, yet one doesn't see the venomous posts about that one does for the other. And what negative posts and tweets there are aren't filled with gendered insults and such, the way a great many - not, not all, but a lot - of the Ghostbusters ones were.

Where's the hate for The Phantom Menace?

Well, all over the place, actually...

There's a Wonder Woman movie coming out. This is unconfirmed, but I heard the title character is a woman. There should be a massive hate campaign against that, right? where is it?

Totally different thing, since that's based on a female superhero who's been around 75 years, and is also the sole female headliner in what's ofherwise an overwhelmingly male-dominated franchise.

Edited August 13, 2016 by Blondie-Wan

[Captain Pirate Man]

@Blondie-wan,

Seriously, that's the story you are going with? Mysogynists killed the movie huh? You seriously need to go and watch the Nostolgia Critics video on this film. Everybody that doesn't like this film is not a misogynist, and stereo typing them all as such is really short sighted.Is there a percentage that are perhaps indeed sexists? Yes I'm sure. But to claim they are the sole reason why the film failed is just plain not true. Could it be that the film itself is just not all that good?

[x105Black]

So.... where's the hate for Suicide Squad?

Right here!

Where's the hate for The Phantom Menace?

Right here!

[Space Police XVIII]

Right here!

Right here!

why do you hate women

But there was indeed a deeply entrenched misogyny directed against this movie.

This requires that an army of internet misogynists materialized out of nowhere, hated on Ghostbusters, then dissipated into thin air. That makes no sense.

Nothing else got this same kind and intensity of backlash. Meanwhile a great many movies, with leading actresses, did quite well. What happened around this steaming pile is unique.

Remember what happened with Leslie Jones? She got trolled hard. She responded to every one of those trolls. Then she got trolled harder.

Now, those misogynistic comments on youtube and the like..what do you think will happen when one of those guys notices, now he can get quoted in an article showcasing misogyny, now he can get retweeted by the director? The actual amount of misogynistic commets, compared to the total, is stupidly tiny, but they made for a wonderful bogeyman. Oh of course it was misogyny, and a great unprovable blob of internet haters, the alternative is that a crappy movie with horrible marketing failed as badly as it deserved. Paint it as misogyny and fragile egos are salved, shareholders appeased and all is well. Feig, the cast and Sony's marketing team didn't just feed the trolls, they served up a ten course buffet and set up megaphones. You are not seeing a massive misogynistic hate campaign. You're seeing marketing.

I hate that sort of underhanded manipulative crap, and I hate it when people fall for it. This thread's depressing. At least the box office shows it mostly didn't work... anyway, JBricks mentioned a good video on the last page, it's worth watching,

, I'm out, cheers.

edited because English difficult,eh

Edited August 13, 2016 by Space Police XVIII

[Forresto]

Guys be careful, let's not let this thread go the way of the Pokemon Go thread.

[Blondie-Wan]

@Blondie-wan,

Seriously, that's the story you are going with? Mysogynists killed the movie huh? You seriously need to go and watch the Nostolgia Critics video on this film. Everybody that doesn't like this film is not a misogynist, and stereo typing them all as such is really short sighted.Is there a percentage that are perhaps indeed sexists? Yes I'm sure. But to claim they are the sole reason why the film failed is just plain not true. Could it be that the film itself is just not all that good?

I didn't say they did it all by themselves; I said they were a major factor, and they are, along with the horrible advertising. I never said everyone who didn't like it was a misogynist; that's you misunderstanding me, and extrapolating things I didn't say (and don't mean) from things I did say.

I am fully aware that plenty of people just plain don't like the movie. However comma there are also many people who ripped into it on sexist grounds, with a fervor one never sees for remakes and reboots with male casting, and attacked using gendered insults and slurs like the c-word, etc., leaving no room for doubt.

Could the film just be not good? Sure; that's true for anything. However comma again the critics' response was and is still nothing like the what the haters are saying. You have a video from Nostalgia Critic? Peachy. Allow me to direct you to Rotten Tomatoes or Metacritic, where you can find not just one or two but many reviews for the movie, from over a hundred critics. See what they say. Yes, negative reviews do exist, but they're outliers. They're not representative of the whole. The closest thing we have to a general consensus on this is that the movie is somewhere from okay to really good.

And even if they were, it would do nothing to change the fact so much of the response was so vile and beyond any reasonable standard of criticism for even a terrible movie.

As for whether it actually is a terrible movie or not, aside from the critics' word, all I can say is that I personally enjoyed it immensely, as did every other person I personally know who's seen it and whose opinion I know (of whom there are nine). If you like, I could let you know if and when that changes, but for now, having seen it twice so far, I'm comfortable with my own informed opinion of the movie's worth, thanks.

One last thing, with regards to the article I quoted earlier that you guys probably didn't bother to read, and one of the other pieces it cites, which I'll quote here directly:

But this “Ghostbusters” thing? It lays bare so, so much of what we’re investigating when it comes to the provenance and reliability of internet ratings.1 Namely, they’re inconsistent, easily manipulated and probably not worth half the stock we put in them.2 Here are a few stats I collected early Thursday for the new “Ghostbusters” movie:

IMDb average user rating: 4.1 out of 10, of 12,921 reviewers

IMDb average user rating among men: 3.6 out of 10, of 7,547 reviewers

IMDb average user rating among women: 7.7 out of 10, of 1,564 reviewers

The movie isn’t even out in theaters as I’m writing this, but over 12,000 people have made their judgment. Male reviewers outnumber female reviewers nearly 5 to 1 and rate “Ghostbusters” 4 points lower, on average.

(emphasis added) Edited August 13, 2016 by Blondie-Wan

[Actor Builder]

...However comma there are also...

...However comma again the...

Well! Isn't that a fun quirk?

When Blondie-Wan gets upset, he spells out his punctuation!

Fascinating!

[Blondie-Wan]

Well! Isn't that a fun quirk?

When Blondie-Wan gets upset, he spells out his punctuation!

Fascinating!

If I can fascinate Actor Builder, my life shall not have been lived in vain.