Bionicle 2015 Discussion

[Mandate]

What's wrong with three-year plot arcs? I'd say it's quite feasible for an arc of three years to be executed well. As long as there is a true progression of the story through the years, without too much filler, I see nothing wrong with not limiting a story to one year. The end of 2006 aside, none of the things you mention seem to indicate contrived prolongation. Am I missing something?

It gets stupid when you find out that they were planning a "Mask of Life + Revive" 3-year arc and another "Awaken Mata Nui" 3-year arc. When a story is paced properly, I'm all for it. We've only just left Stage 1 of the Marvel Cinematic Universe. But the problem is when it has a severe lack of pacing. They get the Mask of Life! Then it turns into a rocket and dumps itself in the bottom of the ocean. That's bad pacing. It turned the entire first year of the arc into a filler year. That's all it became. Do I even need to mention the plot holes with it being able to turn things into snakes, make a body for itself (TWICE), revamp an entire planet and do all sorts of crazy stuff?

Imagine if NINJAGO spaced out the quest for the Golden Weapons over three years. Could it be done right? Yes. Would it? Probably not. I'm not saying they should have condensed the Mahri+Phantoka/Mistika years in with Inika, just provided more variety than that. There was a severe lack of planning for how the story would go along after the "awaken" plot arc, anyway.

Edited October 14, 2014 by JayWalker

[Jacen Torq]

Like the three year plot-arcs? Let's hope they don't do that again.

"Oh yay! We defeated the Piraka and got the mask-*FWWWOOOOOOOOOOOSH*"

"Oh yay! We defeated the Barraki and- Matoro? MATOROOOOOO!"

"Oh yay! We defeated the Makuta and- NOT AGAIN!"

"Oh yay! We defeated the Makuta *AGAIN* and now Mata Nui is conveniently trapped inside the mask. Too bad there's no sand around here... *COUGH*"

THANK YOU.

That said... Hey, 2001-2003 was pretty nice.

[Mandate]

THANK YOU.

That said... Hey, 2001-2003 was pretty nice.

Indeed it was, but that's not what I would call a three year plot arc. Those were individual arcs, they didn't center around the same thing every year. First year was the Golden Masks and freeing the Rahi, second year was fighting off the Bohrok and getting upgraded to Toa Nuva. '03 was about the Rahkshi and revealing Metru Nui. While arguably you could call it the "Mata Nui Arc" it wasn't focused on one sole thing. Metru Nui... sorta was, but not entirely.

EDIT: WHOA, I just realized you own Pod 1! Congrats!

Edited October 14, 2014 by JayWalker

[Jacen Torq]

Hmm, true. The 2006-2008 story felt /seriously/ rushed, while seeming to drag out for way too long at the same time, if that makes any sense. I really loved how 2009 felt like a return to Bionicle's roots. I think that there was finally an exploration of the location's culture that we hadn't truly gotten since the Metru era that really brought it to life.

And yep, got it during the B.R.I.C.K. thing when I guessed LEGO Universe's tagline. :D I was never able to play it though, didn't have a good enough computer at the time. Shame it went out so quickly. The Creation Lab actually got taken down recently.

Edited October 14, 2014 by Jacen Torq

[Mandate]

Hmm, true. The 2006-2008 story felt /seriously/ rushed, while seeming to drag out for way too long at the same time, if that makes any sense. I really loved how 2009 felt like a return to Bionicle's roots. I think that there was finally an exploration of the location's culture that we hadn't truly gotten since the Metru era that really brought it to life.

And yep, got it during the B.R.I.C.K. thing when I guessed LEGO Universe's tagline. :D I was never able to play it though, didn't have a good enough computer at the time. Shame it went out so quickly. The Creation Lab actually got taken down recently.

Well, that means Pods 1, 4 and 7 are accounted for then.

Just had a thought. What if we're going to get Makuta and Ekimu as just Protector sets in the Summer wave? It would most certainly make sense, the Hammers seem to be made up of the Stud Shooters.

[Shakar]

This discussion on plots and story arcs got me wondering if some of the scrapped plot points of G1 are ever going to be reused in G2. I mean both stuff they wanted to do in 2001-2009 but that developed in different ways (like Makuta wanting to destroy everything after his defeat in MoL) AND what was planned for 2010 and beyond (Element Lords, dinosaurs, etc).

The 3 years that are planned don't seem to leave room for these concepts (since it's going to be all about the Mask Trio), and the story team for G2 is made of all new people (aside from Faber's and Greg's consultancy), but if they decide to extend the line maybe they're going to consider taking inspiration from those scrapped concepts? It could work not just from a story standpoint: I think dinosaurs and elemental gods would sell pretty well...

I don't mind the gold on Onua, it blends in quite well with his yellow eyes and the yellow lever on his back. Kopaka's is a lot more jarring, particularly because it's both Takanuva's colour scheme and the fact that gold stands out so much more next to white and trans-blue. I really wish all that gold was silver, but oh well. Can't win them all, I guess.

EDIT: On the subject of the yellow knob on the back, just be glad it's not red. Red is SO much more jarring than yellow, which seems to blend in really nicely with all the sets. I still hate that red button on Dragon Bolt's back.

I think that, by the time Takanuva shows up (I would be very surprised if he didn't,given how much they pushed Rocka), the Gold Masks plot point is going to be surpassed in favor of the obligatory yearly "must sell toys" upgrade, and so the Toa might not feature gold armour and Masks anymore (just like the Gold Masks in G1 were turned into Kanohi Nuva in normal colours).

Personally, I don't mind the gold on Kopaka. Blue (both the bones and the chest print) and gold do really look beautiful together IMO. It clashes with his element, yes, and silver armour would look great on him. I guess I'm more relaxed about his gold due to the major changes my head canon brings to the Toa elements. For the same head canon reasons, though, I rather have Onua wear fully silver armour even though gold doesn't look so bad.

And agreed, yellow is way better. Imagine if the Protectors' miniguns were red like the Cordak blasters...ugh.

Yeah, that would be rubbish. I'm fine with the story leaving things open for fans to decide, but the big story decisions should be written for narrative impact, not just to leave things open for different play scenarios.

Indeed, that is what matters. IMO adding or changing a few powers inside your head canon isn't going to to hurt the plot (a fight can go in a slightly different way but keep its outcome unchanged, ie the Toa defeats the villain or vice-versa).

Yup, AFAIC Lewa's still the Toa of Air (the confusing thing is, the Jungle Protector is described as fighting with a Air Element bow or something similar..) and the Toa wear masks with specific abilities.

And, way off topic and probably way old, but way too good to not post as well.

[Mandate]

Well, if Makuta wanted to destroy everything he certainly made the right move awakening the Bohrok.

Edited October 14, 2014 by JayWalker

[TheGreatSpirit]

Remember that the Toa consider each other, and call each other, brother and sister... so much for shipping them, eh?

[Aethersprite]

I think that, by the time Takanuva shows up (I would be very surprised if he didn't,given how much they pushed Rocka), the Gold Masks plot point is going to be surpassed in favor of the obligatory yearly "must sell toys" upgrade, and so the Toa might not feature gold armour and Masks anymore (just like the Gold Masks in G1 were turned into Kanohi Nuva in normal colours).

Personally, I don't mind the gold on Kopaka. Blue (both the bones and the chest print) and gold do really look beautiful together IMO. It clashes with his element, yes, and silver armour would look great on him. I guess I'm more relaxed about his gold due to the major changes my head canon brings to the Toa elements. For the same head canon reasons, though, I rather have Onua wear fully silver armour even though gold doesn't look so bad.

And agreed, yellow is way better. Imagine if the Protectors' miniguns were red like the Cordak blasters...ugh.

Indeed, that is what matters. IMO adding or changing a few powers inside your head canon isn't going to to hurt the plot (a fight can go in a slightly different way but keep its outcome unchanged, ie the Toa defeats the villain or vice-versa).

Yup, AFAIC Lewa's still the Toa of Air (the confusing thing is, the Jungle Protector is described as fighting with a Air Element bow or something similar..) and the Toa wear masks with specific abilities.

And, way off topic and probably way old, but way too good to not post as well.

Fair point. Kopaka's gold is growing on me slowly. In fact, I never hated the gold, I just vastly prefer silver. It's probably due to the fact that I'm so used to seeing silver/grey/gunmetal on him on his previous Nuva forms.

On the subject of Takanuva, I guess you're right! Gold seems to be Lego's favourite colour. Plus, given the larger colour palette we have now, they might choose to change up his colour scheme, pairing gold with Keetorange or trans yellow etc to differentiate him from Kopaka.

As for Lewa, he still retains some of his air elemental powers according to his official description. He's also definitely still the Toa of Air for me.

Remember that the Toa consider each other, and call each other, brother and sister... so much for shipping them, eh?

I'm quite neutral on the whole subject of shipping, but that's a good point you've raised! I really like the affectionate way the Toa address each other as brother and sister. I hope they keep this in the official animations and books.

Edited October 14, 2014 by Lockon Stratos

[Mandate]

Remember that the Toa consider each other, and call each other, brother and sister... so much for shipping them, eh?

Not in Germany

http://www.telegraph...ittee-says.html

Sigh... now I'm stuck in that awkward position where people want all sorts of relationships happening and I'm against them for reasons that if I explained would get blasted into the next century.

Edited October 14, 2014 by JayWalker

[Shakar]

Fair point. Kopaka's gold is growing on me slowly. In fact, I never hated the gold, I just vastly prefer silver. It's probably due to the fact that I'm so used to seeing silver/grey/gunmetal on him on his previous Nuva forms.

On the subject of Takanuva, I guess you're right! Gold seems to be Lego's favourite colour. Plus, given the larger colour palette we have now, they might choose to change up his colour scheme, pairing gold with Keetorange or trans yellow etc to differentiate him from Kopaka.

As for Lewa, he still retains some of his air elemental powers according to his official description. He's also definitely still the Toa of Air for me.

I'm quite neutral on the whole subject of shipping, but that's a good point you've raised! I really like the affectionate way the Toa address each other as brother and sister. I hope they keep this in the official animations and books.

Yeah, silver does suit him very well. I guess that I'm ok with both- since the printed torso is gold, I said to myself getting used to it was the best thing to do and so I started to work the gold into my head canon (which is G1 with a lot of stuff changed, I might take something from G2 too if I like it).

As for Taka, I really wouldn't like keetorange on him (mostly because I think it looks awful when coupled with white), tr. yellow seems like the best choice for a secondary colour but I get the idea Lego hates that colour. Tr. clear would be cool too but it's probably not very eye catching for marketing purposes.

A serious question:

will Europoors have their Bionicles before christmas?

Has that ever happened? Winter waves always come out after Xmas holidays in Italy (around January 9th), they show up on S@H around December 26th but they arrive more than a week later, making the preorder moot. Not sure how it goes in other countries.

Not in Germany

http://www.telegraph...ittee-says.html

whatthef***mansloth.png Edited October 14, 2014 by Shakar

[wghost]

I'm not too fond of the new animation style - it's really nice, but gives off a vastly different vibe than previous Bionicle promo vids. And am I the only one who thinks it has - with minor exagerration - nothing to do with MNOG? MNOG was mostly set-accurate, only in 2D with contours. Comparing this new style to MNOG is like comparing it to Godzilla TAS or Duck Tales, 'cause hey, it's drawn! (Though I have to admit, the backgrounds/sceneries are kinda similar in stylization.)

I'm gonna miss the ghost-rendered promo animations. Those were just marvelous.

Edited October 14, 2014 by wghost

[Gatanui]

Has that ever happened? Winter waves always come out after Xmas holidays in Italy (around January 9th), they show up on S@H around December 26th but they arrive more than a week later, making the preorder moot. Not sure how it goes in other countries.

Where I live I've been able to get the winter wave a few days before Christmas for the last few years.

-Gata

[Mandate]

I'm not too fond of the new animation style - it's really nice, but gives off a vastly different vibe than previous Bionicle promo vids. And am I the only one who thinks it has - with minor exagerration - _nothing_ to do with MNOG? MNOG was always set-accurate, only in 2D with contours. Comparing this new style to MNOG is like comparing it to Godzilla TAS or Duck Tales, 'cause hey, it's drawn! (Though I have to admit, the backgrounds/sceneries are kinda similar in stylization.)

I'm gonna miss the ghost-rendered promo animations. Those were just marvelous.

We could still get them, they just won't have a big focus

>implying they ever had a big focus in the later years

[wghost]

We could still get them [...]

As there were no indication in the presentation at the NYCC, it is highly doubtful, I fear.

Edited October 14, 2014 by wghost

[Mandate]

As there were no indication in the presentation at the NYCC, it is highly doubtful, I fear.

Gee, you make it sound like CGI animations that have pretty much well never had a big story focus would actually be mentioned.

In all honesty, why would they mention them? What purpose would they serve at Comic Con? The Ghost animations were used almost exclusively as promotionals, or as brief story run-downs (eg, Mahri movie). The first few years saw them as nothing more than character advertisements, with the story being told though - you guessed it - comics and cartoony looking character in MNOG and the MNOG-style Bohrok series. Guess what else we didn't see at NYCC? We didn't see the books, they haven't even selected authors yet! There's a fair while between now and release, and there's a full year after that to make animations. Will they most certainly be made? No. Is there a chance? Yes.

[Still Raindrop]

I'm not too fond of the new animation style - it's really nice, but gives off a vastly different vibe than previous Bionicle promo vids. And am I the only one who thinks it has - with minor exagerration - nothing to do with MNOG? MNOG was mostly set-accurate, only in 2D with contours.

I think the new animations are only slightly less set-accurate than the MNOG. People think that the MNOG was super set accurate, but it took a lot of design liberties, too (look at the Ruru/Pakari, or the Matoran arms, for example). So I agree that the animation style isn't the same, but they're both stylized 2d animations.

[Timeline15]

Something worth mentioning is that in an interview about the animated shorts, the person from the production team said how much he liked when the characters meet each other for the first time. That makes it sound like these toa don't know each other, does it not? Whether this is due to memory loss, or that they were just never created as a team in this continuity, I don't know, but I thought it was an interesting point on some of the *ahem* discussions over the last few pages.

EDIT: Pohatu's signature move is apparently called the Kaboom-erang. Lego, stahp XD

Edited October 14, 2014 by Timeline15

[Still Raindrop]

As silly as "kaboom-erang" is, I'm glad we're getting specific attacks. I mean, I liked the way they did it in G1, as well, when the powers were more vague--and I think there's still room for vagueness. But having a couple signature moves that each Toa is known for is a good idea, too. It gives something solid to work with other than "can control element."

[InfurnallDragon]

The Facebook cover photo got changed. Someone noted that it looks very similar to the Slizer's image with all the characters on it, surrounding a circle.

Edited October 14, 2014 by InfurnallDragon

[Aanchir]

I'm not too fond of the new animation style - it's really nice, but gives off a vastly different vibe than previous Bionicle promo vids. And am I the only one who thinks it has - with minor exagerration - nothing to do with MNOG? MNOG was mostly set-accurate, only in 2D with contours. Comparing this new style to MNOG is like comparing it to Godzilla TAS or Duck Tales, 'cause hey, it's drawn! (Though I have to admit, the backgrounds/sceneries are kinda similar in stylization.)

I'm gonna miss the ghost-rendered promo animations. Those were just marvelous.

The similarities to MNOG are less about the level of set accuracy and more about the bright, flat colors and simple shading. And also, perhaps, the length of the episodes.

It might not be the spitting image of the MNOG, but it's a lot closer to that than to the other animation styles used in the old BIONICLE. As the presentation showed, the MNOG was just one of many influences on the new animation style.

[DuckBricks]

But. Boomerangs, man.

Boomerangs.

... Don't forget Jeterangs and Kaboomerangs and Stormarangs

All from the updated bios on Lego.com...

[TheDesuComplex]

The Facebook cover photo got changed. Someone noted that it looks very similar to the Slizer's image with all the characters on it, surrounding a circle.

That was my first thought when we first saw that image a few days ago. It seems that they are throwing in some little ideas from Slizers, which is a good thing.

[Agent Fusion]

I need me a pair of Jeterangs. What could go wrong?

[SuperGeniusCreator]

Not in Germany

http://www.telegraph...ittee-says.html

Sigh... now I'm stuck in that awkward position where people want all sorts of relationships happening and I'm against them for reasons that if I explained would get blasted into the next century.

I know how you feel... it's awkward discussions like these that make the official Lego Message Boards seem so safe and secure.

And, way off topic and probably way old, but way too good to not post as well.

I'm guessing that's what happens when you try to put Pohatu Mata in an Exo-Toa?

That was my first thought when we first saw that image a few days ago. It seems that they are throwing in some little ideas from Slizers, which is a good thing.

The way the island is divided by sharp borders is also a lot like Slizers. (Which makes it easier for me to understand where everyone lives, though some might consider this a bad thing.)