Eurobricks Mafia Day One: Let the metagaming begin!

[Dannylonglegs]

Why can't you quote like a normal person? I think you've already answered your own concerns. Yes, I can now see how those things contradict each other and yes, I read your post too fast. And my thought process did spill out into that post as I was posting between tasks at work. Notice that signifies that I'm not afraid to let my thought process spill out onto the page. You know how I obsess over what I say when I have something to hide. Anyway, thanks for taking the time to explain yourself twice.

To clarify: Redblade would be a vig target, but I don't think that was the vig, based on the MO. The trap killer in The Forest II was gleeful because the ACME catalog made the traps sound like fun and he had an obligation to behave like the road runner. However, I would also assume that if there is a Scum killer, which we know there is, there is a serial killer, which also seems to have been confirmed, that it would be the most likely if any killer was to choose not to act, it would be the vig. It's possible a killer was blocked or a target protected last night as well.

See what all of this speculation has gotten us? We should've stopped talking about this a long time ago.

Sorry about the quote thing. I just copied it from my own quote because I did't want to go back and requote you. I could have just clicked the quote and gone back that way, but I've been really busy with housework recently (I've been taking down a rotting gazebo all day.), so I sort of forgot I could do that.

I still think the skelli-head's the scum killer, and the chandelier, the Psycho, but I agree, there's no point in more speculation such as this.

I've changed my mind anyway. I'd like to put the pieces we did have together to find out how many pieces there likely were. Wouldn't this be an easy game if we were all supposed to have one and the ones who said they didn't are just liars? We'd have busted all the Scum. It's worth a shot and a better use of my time than sitting around being a dick to everyone.

Yes, it would be much easier! Unfortunately it would be bizarrely stupid to lie about something so readily provable. Additionally, if the Scum were trying to conceal the puzzle pieces, why even lie? Just wait until you've solved the puzzle on your own and then post it, or post it the next day. Also, you know me, I don't like lying. I'm not sure how finally building the puzzle could be useful to the Town at this point, but I don't see the harm in it.

I'm not sure what Analysis to derive from behaviors in regards to the puzzle-pieces. I'm sure the scum wouldn't put forward all their pieces at once, maybe saving them until after they solved the puzzle (and I'm sure the scum solved it. They'd have to be off the ball not to have clinched it. Unlike the riddles and fun nonsense in Forest 2, the clues are in the hands of the few (well, technically a majority of individuals, but I digress.), and not immediately available to the many.) Moreover, revealing them at the exact same time (I'm assuming 3 or so Scum--enough to warrant the name team.) would be unlike the scum, who strive to always avoid associating. Plus, time-zone differences and whatnot. It's likely that at least one member of at least one of the scum teams did not receive a puzzle piece, so maybe we could look for today's lynch from within that net? What's that called? Rule of 5-6s? It's a long shot though. Also, the first few to post their pieces should not be ruled out as potential scum, because while the scum may have their own 2-3 pieces, we can be sure that they couldn't solve the puzzle with simply those. They probably did not receive connecting pieces, but it was probably randomly selected.

~Insectoid Aristocrat

[Tamamono]

Hinckley wants to use the pieces to the town's advantage to see who is lying or not.

Ah, okay, that makes sense.

Judging by the fact that nobody's claimed to be invincible (which would be to the town's advantage; especially if it's someone who's likely to be investigated), it's likely that a scummo got invincibility for tonight. I'd actually be suspicious of those just revealing their pieces now - if they're scum they realize that there's no reason not to reveal their pieces now that it's been solved (Adam and Alopex are the only ones, right?)

Adam's actually been 'pinging my scumdar' (to steal a phrase) a lot today. He's voiced his opinion on several matters enough (this post and this post) to avoid being seen as a generic sheep, but still not enough to actually make himself useful; basically putting him in the middle ground, which is where a lot of scum want to be. badboy's vote for him is weird too. I doubt a scum would vote for another scum for mayor out of the blue like that, but it really makes no sense at all. Maybe they have some sort of linked roles?

However, a lot of other people are in the middle ground as well at the moment; why not FoS them? In all honesty, I feel like a lot of this read is gut, and I've learned the hard way that that's not the way to lynch.

Danny and Scouty were both reading the thread as the pieces were coming in. Scouty didn't reveal his until the following day and only as part of a larger jpg. We haven't seen the actual shape of his original piece. TrumpetKing67 suggest we wait until Day One to solve it Why wait?

This is actually a really good point; while it's certain that there are a few non-piece-holders (like Danny claims), it's safe to assume that the scum don't/didn't really know what to do with their pieces (or lack thereof), so they're likely to sit around on writeboard talking about who will reveal what, etc.

Not quite sure what to make of Trumpet saying we should wait until Day 1 to solve the puzzle. He's felt a bit forced this game, but I'm wary of misreading him because of how he played in Heartlake.

We're not trying to find what the puzzle said

Yes, sorry, I was still getting caught up when I posted that.

[Hinckley]

What homicidal 1977 new wave hit ____ed the _____ ti_____

It's like def said, it's psycho killer. We're wasting our time.

He already told us what it said. We're just seeing who has the pieces and if they were trying to hide them from us and why...

[Hinckley]

A ridiculously long shot, and you left out yourself from that list, as you would also be best able to read a lot of people's town and scum tells from that game. You even appraised us about it afterwards. Such a long shot that you mention that list (without yourself) twice.

Fine, I'm on the list then.

It's almost as if you're trying to preempt an accusation against Hinck, and you seem to be trying to say that Cornelius wants to be mayor because of his ego? This whole post reads scummy to me. Especially after:

Where you don't actually say where or when you saw Hinck being accused, and why you think these accusations have been cleared up.

Couple that with a bunch of people just 'deciding' to vote for you as mayor, and it all smells rather fishy.

It's time to vote, right? Well maybe we should get the ball rolling.

I vote: Flare (but not for mayor.) I think we can live without you, and it'll give us some insight into the other people who were happy for you to become the EB mafia tool mayor. I'm sure this will give us something to talk about.

Although Flare turning up Scum would heavily incriminate me, I have to agree with your logic here. I find it interesting that two votes for Flare followed mine. Everyone seems to have had reasons, but as I've stated, I found other behaviors DarkDragon exhibited weird, although you defended her, and Zepher is being typically nonsensical, but I thought his reasoning was a little weaker (it's a tool to get the sheep more involved). The weirdest thing that Flare has done was his first post after seeing I voted for him. He asked if I was trying to get on his good side. As I said to someone in private (as I have a disturbing number of them going for being Day One. Don't worry, nobody has claimed to me. Most people want to know why I'm being such a dick.) he's either an inexperienced player unfamiliar with my gameplay or a Scum not sure how to respond to being voted for and getting advice from fellow team members to seem suspicious of my vote. I would like to see Flare's allegiance, even if I end up getting lynched tomorrow for being the first to vote for him for mayor.

Adam's actually been 'pinging my scumdar' (to steal a phrase) a lot today. He's voiced his opinion on several matters enough (this post and this post) to avoid being seen as a generic sheep,

Who started this trend? Can't you just quote the actual posts instead of linking to them? I know we can't multiquote from a closed topic now, but can't you copy the text and put it between quote tags?

[def]

Vote Tally:

Flare 1 (Pandora)

[Darkdragon]

I agree with you Hinckley that Flare's response to your vote was really strange, having not seen any previous behavior from him in these situations it's hard to say if that's normal for him or not though. When I voted him for mayor it was because he was on the short list of what I'd consider new players and the fact that I know him from Heroica, so I know he does pay attention to the games and read things...and he didn't do anything crazy in Heartlake like some people on that list. Anyway, I hadn't even seen your vote for him when I wrote mine.

I've been busy catching up on today's discussion and have to agree that these games of chance are very dangerous for town to play. Yes we all want to have fun, but we shouldn't just throw our votes away to the winds of chance. Come on, think a little folks. With so many votes already lost, perhaps the mayor will be a more powerful position than we first thought.

I agree with some of Pandora's reasoning behind voting Flare, I think it would be good to clear that alliance question up, but I'm really not ready to vote him yet. There's so little to go on yet, but the day is still relatively young. We have more than normal with that whole night zero discussions to go through. Right now, I just don't have a strong feeling on anyone.

[CorneliusMurdock]

I've found the whole thing with Flare as something worth exploring as well. It seems odd that he became a strong candidate for mayor by doing almost nothing. A lot of the reasoning given for voting for him didn't seem to amount to anything.

I'd like to hear from him a little more to see why he feels people voted for him.

For now, I'll Vote: Flare.

[Shadows]

Here's my piece.

To be honest, I saw posting our pieces as more helpful to the scum than the town, since one would assume that multiple scum on a team would have multiple pieces, thus giving them a faster shot at solving it, especially if we helped by posting ours. Obviously it doesn't matter now.

I also agree that Flare seems suspicious, but I can't really base that on past history. That's exactly why I voted for Corny, at least I think I will be able to tell if anything changes there.

[Adam]

Adam's actually been 'pinging my scumdar' (to steal a phrase) a lot today. He's voiced his opinion on several matters enough (this post and this post) to avoid being seen as a generic sheep, but still not enough to actually make himself useful; basically putting him in the middle ground, which is where a lot of scum want to be. badboy's vote for him is weird too. I doubt a scum would vote for another scum for mayor out of the blue like that, but it really makes no sense at all. Maybe they have some sort of linked roles?

I try to post when I can and when I have something to contribute. I can't metagame wildly like the rest of you, and I think that posting long-winded and repetitive crap is unproductive and ultimately impedes the search for scum.

As for badboy's vote, your guess is as good as mine. I would definitely like to hear if he has a reason for suggesting me for mayor other than the smexiness of my hat.

Finally, as for my puzzle piece, I echo Shadows:

To be honest, I saw posting our pieces as more helpful to the scum than the town, since one would assume that multiple scum on a team would have multiple pieces, thus giving them a faster shot at solving it, especially if we helped by posting ours. Obviously it doesn't matter now.

Also, I quite frankly wasn't awake when the puzzle pieces were posted in Night Zero.

The bandwagon mayor vote for Flare is certainly weird, but I can't who voted for him based off of flawed reasoning or evil intent. Below is the comment from PirateDave which supposedly incited the vote for Flare:

On to the mayor business; I propose that we elect someone which is not one of our usual town leaders (Hinck, Shadows, Etc.. we all know who they are) and instead opt to elect a player like Alopex, Flare, Darthpotatoe or someone of the likes.

Thoughts?

It's definitely possible that people agreed with PirateDave and decided to vote for Flare as such, following the lead of one of the more experienced and vocal mafia-players, Hinckley. What worries me is how quickly this bandwagon formed and how little discussion went into the initial vote for Flare, especially seeing as you cannot unvote for mayor. Why would anyone so readily relinquish his or her mayor vote?

There's always the chance that some scum voted for Flare because he is a scum or because they planned to recruit him, but this is merely conjecture based on less than a day of behavior. The people who voted for him after Hinckley are as follows: Darkdragon, Zepher, Big Cam, CallMePie, TrumpetKing67, Flare, TinyPiesRUs. Do you seven have anything to add to the discussion? I will also repeat my inquiry into badboy: is it merely my fabulous bowler that caught your eye?

[DarthPotato]

I will also repeat my inquiry into badboy: is it merely my fabulous bowler that caught your eye?

If it is then that's not a good reason to vote for someone as mayor. I also hope he has a good reason for voting for you.

[CMP]

My reasoning for voting Flare was simply that there's no reason not to. It's Day One, everyone's on even footing trust-wise. The only thing that could've influenced my decision came up later in the day, where I brought up the mayor could probably be converted, and others brought up that it'd be easier to tell if CM had been converted than Flare. I'm not speaking for anyone else, and I'm not going to pass off either group as decidedly scummy or townie.

Anyway, since voting's apparently mandatory, I'm going to go and Vote: Big Cam. I don't know whether you're just screwing around or if you've been hit with a roleplaying action, but neither should prevent you from saying a single thing that's relevant. Not even any casual discussion on anything. Except for where you excused yourself for not posting your puzzle piece. You've been posting pointlessly all day, it's not inactivity. You're reading the discussions, you agreed with some people about some stuff that you didn't even bother to add anything to.

Here's all he's said so far.

Mommy, mommy, I need to make poo poo.

I saweded this by the poop monster last night but I felleded asleep before I could show my mommy.

I tolded you I felleded asleep before I could show it. I really had to potty.

I wanteded evewyone to know I has a piece, but I have to poo now. Mommy!

Poop stuck, poop stuck.!

Mayor: Flare

I likes the ideas of not normal man being boss.

Maybe he's a baddy who wants to be bad and knows he cans bes bad in charge, also poop.

Or maybe he was good guy , but I tink he's doing that (what you think), I need to toilet now.

Isn't that the same poopin thing? I need to wake up my mommy so I can go potty.

I asked my.mommy where the potty is and she said I should agree with you. Let's see those pieces, I like puzzles, uh oh. I need pee pee now!

I showed my piece lates because I went night night while pottying. I still needs to potty.

[DarthPotato]

Anyway, since voting's apparently mandatory, I'm going to go and Vote: Big Cam. I don't know whether you're just screwing around or if you've been hit with a roleplaying action, but neither should prevent you from saying a single thing that's relevant. Not even any casual discussion on anything. Except for where you excused yourself for not posting your puzzle piece. You've been posting pointlessly all day, it's not inactivity. You're reading the discussions, you agreed with some people about some stuff that you didn't even bother to add anything to.

Here's all he's said so far.

Hmm, this is a good point. No one's really accused him for it yet either, so this is interesting. The only thing that I don't understand would be why is he making himself noticed so much. I mean, if he was scum, it'd probably be better to not role play like that on the first day. I think his scum buddies would tell him to quit making himself be so obvious out in the day thread. I don't know, but I do think he should add a little more to the discussions.

[Hinckley]

I agree with some of Pandora's reasoning behind voting Flare, I think it would be good to clear that alliance question up, but I'm really not ready to vote him yet. There's so little to go on yet, but the day is still relatively young. We have more than normal with that whole night zero discussions to go through. Right now, I just don't have a strong feeling on anyone.

Reading that word "alliance" makes me think the idea that the Scum would spill themselves on Day One by trying to get one of their own elected Mayor (a role whose importance still seems dubious, although less so considering many of us have gambled our votes away. ) is ridiculous. Really, that would have to be incredibly stupid.

[CMP]

I'm not accusing him for what's probably a roleplaying action, I'm accusing him for being totally useless despite being reasonably active.

[DarthPotato]

I'm not accusing him for what's probably a roleplaying action, I'm accusing him for being totally useless despite being reasonably active.

Yeah, but what I'm saying is that if he was scum it wouldn't make sense for him to role play like that. Unless it's a role play action like you said, but I've never heard of those before.

But I can understand where you're coming from saying he's mindlessly agreeing with everyone and being unhelpful.

[CMP]

A roleplaying action (I haven't read any particular ones in detail, but they've come up here before) pretty much gives you a bit of roleplaying that you have to do in every single you post you make during the day. I think you get a penalty if you forget, but I believe that's as much as it can really effect. Unless def's put in a 'cannot make any contributions whatsoever' clause to the role, it has little to do with my vote for him.

[Hinckley]

[Darkdragon]

Reading that word "alliance" makes me think the idea that the Scum would spill themselves on Day One by trying to get one of their own elected Mayor (a role whose importance still seems dubious, although less so considering many of us have gambled our votes away. ) is ridiculous. Really, that would have to be incredibly stupid.

I meant what side he is on...allegiance? What the hell is the word. No, that would be pretty dumb of a scum team to try and get the Mayor elected and to let Flare post that strange reply to you. I don't think there was a team behind that.

So, this Big Cam thing...well it's quite true he hasn't been posting anything of substance. If he was some sort of target of a roleplay action, I wouldn't expect it to make him be useless, it seems to just make him have to talk about pooping all the time. I think even with that, he should be able to make a decent post with some kind of info in it. I think we should wait to see what he has to say first, hopefully it's something that isn't just all about poop.

I'm a bit troubled by people throwing a vote out already and saying "because it's mandatory to vote", i mean there's over 24 hours left (i think around 36?) in the day and yet they feel like they HAVE to vote now without a whole lot to go on. I just don't feel comfortable with that, it's like they want to hurry up and get voted before any bandwagons form so they can say they weren't on one...maybe?

[Hinckley]

Puzzle Pieces:

Shadows - Sixteenth person to reveal his puzzle piece.

CallMePie - Third to reveal his puzzle piece.

Zepher - ?

Dannylonglegs - claims not to have a puzzle piece.

DarkDragon - ?

Adam - Fourteenth person to reveal his puzzle piece.

Tamamono - Fourth to reveal his puzzle piece.

JimButcher - claims to not have a puzzle piece.

Hinckley - Second to reveal his puzzle piece.

Cornelius Murdock - First to reveal his puzzle piece.

Scouty - Tenth to "reveal" his puzzle piece.

PirateDave84 - Eleventh to reveal his puzzle piece.

Nightshroud99 - Ninth to reveal his puzzle piece.

Trumpetking67 - Sixth to reveal his puzzle piece.

badboytje88 - claims to not have a puzzle piece.

Cecilie - claims a piece but won't reveal it, but now dead.

iamded - Fifth to reveal his puzzle piece.

DarthPotato - Eighth to reveal his puzzle piece.

Flare - ?

Alopex - Fifteenth person to reveal his puzzle piece.

Pandora - Thirteenth to reveal her puzzle piece.

Big Cam - Twelfth to reveal his puzzle piece.

Capt. Redblade - we'll never know

Rick - claims to not have a puzzle piece.

TinyPiesRUs - claims to not have a puzzle piece.

Dragonator - ?

People whose claims are in bright red or bright green claimed after the puzzle was solved. Didn't someone else claim not to have a piece since the last time I posted this list? I thought I remembered someone claiming that but I don't see it now.

[Darkdragon]

I really don't see the point in this. The puzzle is solved, and it hurts my eyes.

Yes, I had a piece and didn't post it. I didn't think it was a good idea to post it on night zero for all the reasons already stated by many others.

Guess I'm number 17 and in eyestabbing lime text too.

[Hinckley]

I'm a bit troubled by people throwing a vote out already and saying "because it's mandatory to vote", i mean there's over 24 hours left (i think around 36?) in the day and yet they feel like they HAVE to vote now without a whole lot to go on. I just don't feel comfortable with that, it's like they want to hurry up and get voted before any bandwagons form so they can say they weren't on one...maybe?

Well, there has been a lot of activity today to base a vote off of. And everyone who has voted has presented a case. Not very many votes have been cast yet anyway.

[TrumpetKing]

The reason i had voted for Flare partly came from Piratedave's post, but also because I had misinterpreted the rules. I had thought that we would be electing a different mayor each day. A stupid move on my part, so I'm actually quite happy with Cornelius being our mayor. I agree that Flare's reactions and such have been suspicious, and as strange as it sounds, I'm willing to vote for him, due to my misinterpretation. There are two people that I'd like to hear a bit more from before I vote, though.

Big Cam: What the hell are you talking about????

PirateDave84: Why haven't you responded well to any of the questions asked to you, if you responded at all? (I'll check if you did shortly.)

[Hinckley]

Yes, I had a piece and didn't post it. I didn't think it was a good idea to post it on night zero for all the reasons already stated by many others.

It could be very telling later to find out who kept theirs to themselves until after it was solved.

I understand people thought it would benefit the Scum to get the question and be able to solve it, but if the idea was to stop the Scum from getting it, then people would have to suggest that and therefore suggest that the Town not get the question either, and therefore not get the benefit and nobody suggested that, except for Cecilie. Again, there are all sorts of reverse psychology tactics to be had with this puzzle. For example, if I were Scum, I could've shared my piece early to encourage others to show theirs and therefore gain the advantage, having two or three pieces my Scum buddies and I never planned to share.

However, If there are 26 players and 20 pieces to the puzzle and we think that the Scum have two teams of three...

Hmmm...everything is a viable theory until it is tested and proven one way or another. The two lynch candidates so far are Flare and Big Cam. Flare hasn't produced a puzzle piece, nor has he claimed to have been given one or not, so I think we could test a couple of things by lynching him:

1. Does the distribution of puzzle pieces have anything to do with allegiance? (I doubt it would be setup this way. If a Scum team had no puzzle pieces among them, I doubt anyone would be admitting so quickly to not having any...)

2. Does the reluctance to share or talk about puzzle pieces have anything to do with allegiance? (Did either Scum team decide not to reveal their pieces? Is that a way they could be finding each other right now?)

3. Are the people who voted for Flare the dumbest Scum team ever? (Or did random selection of a previously unknown player lead them all to their lynches because he turns out to be Scum? )

I can't vote, and I'd probably still have mine on TrumpetKing67, but I'd advocate for a Flare lynch at this point. Yes, even though I voted for him for mayor. My reasons for voting him mayor were based on my lack of knowledge of him. Since placing my vote and hearing his responses, the knowledge I've gained is not comforting. His responses are somewhat confounding. Couple that with the fact that many people voted along quickly and some with no reason, it would be most interesting to see where his allegiance lies. If he's Scum, I'm in trouble, but I'd rather get myself in trouble and find a Scum than stay safe and not solve anything. That's a pretty long list of people who voted for him, and several of them after the tactic of voting for a lesser-known player was already loudly in question. It's almost like a lynch voting pattern. If Flare is Scum, we'd have a lot to analyze there.

[TrumpetKing]

There are for sure some liars. I think there are more than 20 pieces, but somewhere close. Maybe 23 or 24. Those spaces are way too big. If you assume Redblade had a piece, then there were 18 pieces confirmed, leaving an estimated 2-6 pieces left. There are 3 people that haven't confirmed, and if each of them has a piece, then there are some liars. If only one of them has a piece, then there are some guaranteed liars. We just have to choose wisely and pay attention to their behavior.

[Hinckley]

There are for sure some liars. I think there are more than 20 pieces, but somewhere close. Maybe 23 or 24. Those spaces are way too big. If you assume Redblade had a piece, then there were 18 pieces confirmed, leaving an estimated 2-6 pieces left. There are 3 people that haven't confirmed, and if each of them has a piece, then there are some liars. If only one of them has a piece, then there are some guaranteed liars. We just have to choose wisely and pay attention to their behavior.

No, I wouldn't assume Redblade had one. Cecilie had one. That, I believe. You're analyzing the info I've compiled more than I am. Perhaps I should take a closer look myself...