MOC: Border Gate

[Peppermint_M]

Here stands the gateway between Dragon Lands and the DMZ before the Lion border. Some travelers have their credentials checked by a guard before being let through.

Well, where do I start? I am not happy with this at all, I have never been much of a building MOCer, things that go are more my cup of tea. It started off as a pair of towers I built and then I felt like linking them together. So far so terrible. I have no clue where to start improving, as I was trying to go with a more grounded castle, living in South Wales I am more familiar with real castles than the fantasy creations or even those on the continent.

Raglan Castle, Chepstow Castle and Caerphilly Castle featured greatly in my childhood and bank holidays recently. Their structure and construction influence my building in the variety of parts and shades used.

But, well the resulting build is not the best. Can anyone make practical suggestions I can use to improve?

I adore making vehicles but just once I would like to have a castle to my name...

[AwesomeStar]

Well, I've never built a castle either (I much prefer other medieval scenes) but I have admired my fair share and picked up plenty of tips and ideas, so I'll offer my bit.

My advice to you would be consistency. From what I can see, the gate uses a whole host of different types of pieces, different ornaments, etc. When you take a way all the decorative aspects of castles, they are extremely uniform, as are most buildings in general. So I would start by building in one colour - for the Dragon Knights depicted in your photo, I would suggest Dark Bley - and then swapping in and out different colours for added realism later on.

Castles are also, for the most part, symmetrical (I believe this is true of those lovely castles you added links too. Wales is, by the way, one of my favourite places to visit, largely because of the castles ). So I would say that at first, make everything symmetrical, and then start building outwards in terms of design, such as adding a flagpost to the right side, or a stairway to the left, etc.

Lastly, practicality. Now, this is just a personal preference on my part, but I like it when castle builders take the time to make sure that everything is designed practically. This means adding crenelations to the bridge, making higher walls, lookout posts and such.

Sorry for the long post but I just thought you might get something out of it. I always enjoy your other work, Peppermint, so I look forward to seeing this completed!

-A.S.

[Dr.Cogg]

Maybe add some plants on the outer wall and on the ground add some rocks, hang flags on the front of the towers and add a roof above the enterance ,then widen the path way. p.s. castles don't always have to be symmetrical and for some ideas look at the castle moc index.

Edited July 25, 2011 by Dr.Cogg

[lightningtiger]

Nice one 'Peppermint', a stone structure that in parts has seen better days.....excellent work the queen of clones, queen of action, oh and queen of eh, er, anything else on EB !

Great work and Brick On !

[TheLegoDr]

Interesting concept. I don't have a lot of familiarity with MOCs, but I think this has some good bones. I agree with maybe more landscaping, but almost all MOCs can use more landscaping (including my own). Overall, I think it has some good texture/colors.

[Tazmaniac]

Don't lose hope Pep I rate castles as one of the hardest subjects to MOC.

To start of I'd avoid using larger bricks for the walls, the colour deviation is good but to bold IMO.

Try to stick to 1x2 bricks and use 1x1 round plates mixed with 1x1 and 1x2 plates to get some texture.

Depth is another great thing to add to you castle so instead of leaving you windows flush with the rest of the wall/tower give them some trim whether it's a protruding surround or embedding the window itself it will help avoid the flat look.

I see you built a "foot" on th left tower (the angled brick at the bottom) I'd try this along the whole wall, every 4 or 6 studs and see how that looked, if it looks wrong I'd at least give the other tower the same treatment.

I hope something in that rant will help you, though there are much better castle builders around here that could point you in the right direction.

[Peppermint_M]

Thanks for all the tips guys! I was thinking of taking it all down and starting with a new purpose build, not a border gateway but some kind of tower or keep.

To begin with, my idea was to use tan and dark tan for the Dragon Knights, but the price is prohibitive... It would look yummy though wouldn't it?

[Hoboman]

First let me say I do not think this is as bad as you might feel. I think most designers are their own worst critics.

I do agree with the comment that the color shifts on some places are too harsh and too large. But I do believe you are heading in the right direction with the colors. If a wal is too monotone it takes away from it in my opinion.

To begin with, my idea was to use tan and dark tan for the Dragon Knights, but the price is prohibitive... It would look yummy though wouldn't it?

Yes, Tan and Dark Tan would look great for the Dragon Knights. But unless you had a lot of HP or PoP sets you could rob from, I tagree those colors are harder to us.

But my parting comment is this: Be kind to yourself. This is a WIP and as such you can and should play around with different ideas without feeling bad if some do not work out the way you would have liked.

[frogstudio]

Hi Pepermint!!! First of all I must say I love the whole idea behind it. Concerning the execution, I mostly agree with waht was posted by AwesomeStar. Yet, I would add another couple of things which are strongly related: proportions and real construction technics. I'm basically speaking of the width of the gate itself, related to its height. If you look carefully, most castle opening have a more rectangular proportion (with the longest side in vertical position). This is basically because, since they were built of stone, they needed to be able to materialize an arch which prevents the opening from falling down. When they wanted to make proportions similar to the one you are using, they would usualy buid with timber in a bridge-like manner or create a larger opening by adding more than one arch. I think that if you make this little adjustment and, while mocing, ask yourself "how is this constructed in reality?", you'll get better results. I would suggest either making the arch smaller, dividing it into smaller archs or to replace the stony upper part of the arch with a timbered guard house... Just my two cents. Keep bricking!!!! :)

[Skipper]

It's not as bad as you think Peppermint_M

However I agree with a lot of the suggestions above, especially the timbered house. A lot of the dragon sets have some wood element, so this would fit with the theme and be realistic (hoardings). I think it would look better if you made the walkway on the walls one brick lower, because the guard on the left side looks like he's standing on top, which isn't very realistic. Finally you said you were going for a realistic castle, so I would suggest making a gate of some kind as opposed to just an arch, which would make it IMO more solid looking.

Good luck!

[TheLegoDr]

Hi Pepermint!!! First of all I must say I love the whole idea behind it. Concerning the execution, I mostly agree with waht was posted by AwesomeStar. Yet, I would add another couple of things which are strongly related: proportions and real construction technics. I'm basically speaking of the width of the gate itself, related to its height. If you look carefully, most castle opening have a more rectangular proportion (with the longest side in vertical position). This is basically because, since they were built of stone, they needed to be able to materialize an arch which prevents the opening from falling down. When they wanted to make proportions similar to the one you are using, they would usualy buid with timber in a bridge-like manner or create a larger opening by adding more than one arch. I think that if you make this little adjustment and, while mocing, ask yourself "how is this constructed in reality?", you'll get better results. I would suggest either making the arch smaller, dividing it into smaller archs or to replace the stony upper part of the arch with a timbered guard house... Just my two cents. Keep bricking!!!! :)

I don't know about anyone else, but this is good information that will help with my future builds. I learn so much from this forum!

[Peppermint_M]

Thanks for these sterling tips. I have taken down the old MOC and I have begun building a new one. With a new and nicer pathway laid out, I am working on a little outline first, then some nice simple tower.

A quick question, is it an absolute no-no to use the angled pre-fab "tower" parts with the arrow slit cut out? I ask simply because I do like the shape they provide in an otherwise flat faced tower.

[AwesomeStar]

Thanks for these sterling tips. I have taken down the old MOC and I have begun building a new one. With a new and nicer pathway laid out, I am working on a little outline first, then some nice simple tower.

A quick question, is it an absolute no-no to use the angled pre-fab "tower" parts with the arrow slit cut out? I ask simply because I do like the shape they provide in an otherwise flat faced tower.

Hey, it's Lego. Do whatever the heck you feel like, you know that!

Pre-fab pieces can be extremely useful at times, especially in castles. They save money and pieces, and often look cleaner. So long as they are used appropriately (something Lego isn't so good at, if I'm honest), they'll look great.

-A.S.