Virtual Pivot Point Steering system with Suspension Question

[Myers Lego Technic]

 Hello all, 

I have recently come up with what I believe is the first Lego virtual pivot steering system with an independent double wishbone style suspension. Before I release it and brand it as such, I would like to ask you if any of you have seen that sort of thing before, so that I wont celebrate a premature victory  . 

I took @Sariel's  challenge from his virtual pivot point steering topic, and have added suspension to something that is "Very hard to add suspension to". 

 

Edited May 15, 2017 by Myers Lego Technic

[Leonardo da Bricki]

Would be nice if you could offer proof. I have seen live axle with virtual pivots, but not independent.

[Alex Ilea]

Sry bro , not the first :

https://youtu.be/uTAq_MCyprs

[Didumos69]

@tomek9210 did a double wisbone front axles with virtual pivot point: 

@nicjasno too:

But I'm still curious what you have come up with.

Edited May 15, 2017 by Didumos69

[PorkyMonster]

It'll be GREAT if someone can create a DRIVEN front axle with virtual pivot point and independent suspension.

[tomek9210]

Driven front axle with virtual pivot point can be made, but the kingpin axle would be too far from the wheel's axis with 42000 rims. 8484 wheels would be a bit better here.

PS.

Didumos69 - I am still working on my red sedan :) I will post details later today.

[Didumos69]

51 minutes ago, PorkyMonster said:

It'll be GREAT if someone can create a DRIVEN front axle with virtual pivot point and independent suspension.

That would be a nice quest!

18 minutes ago, tomek9210 said:

I am still working on my red sedan :) I will post details later today.

You're making me curious!

[BrickbyBrickTechnic]

 

6 hours ago, Myers Lego Technic said:

 Hello all, 

I have recently come up with what I believe is the first Lego virtual pivot steering system with an independent double wishbone style suspension. Before I release it and brand it as such, I would like to ask you if any of you have seen that sort of thing before, so that I wont celebrate a premature victory  . 

I took @Sariel's  challenge from his virtual pivot point steering topic, and have added suspension to something that is "Very hard to add suspension to". 

 

I think we're all a little late. Samolot made this:

 

[jorgeopesi]

Wow awesome idea  .

[Didumos69]

44 minutes ago, BrickbyBrickTechnic said:

I think we're all a little late. Samolot made this:

Nice idea, but the virtual pivot is not better than the pivot of a usual double suspension-arm setup. The shot from above shows the pivot point is still at the inner side of the wheel, whereas the purpose of virtual pivot steering is to move the virtual steering axis towards, or even beyond, the center of the wheel.

Edited May 15, 2017 by Didumos69

[Samolot]

2 hours ago, Didumos69 said:

Nice idea, but the virtual pivot is not better than the pivot of a usual double suspension-arm setup. The shot from above shows the pivot point is still at the inner side of the wheel, whereas the purpose of virtual pivot steering is to move the virtual steering axis towards, or even beyond, the center of the wheel.

You are right in this example the pivot point is still at the inner side of the wheel , but this suspension is easy to modify it is enough if you will replace liftarms in the swingarm for shorter ones. And pivot point will move closer to the center. I am thinking about RC motors or PF L motor in vertical position. All is simple if you do not need front wheels to be driven. Whole system is very strong and there is no looseness.

[Myers Lego Technic]

Interesting, I still think my idea is simpler and more efficient than Samolot's, and more stable than IA's discovery. 

It is under 7 studs tall with the shocks and is very true to Sariels original design. 

I will post picks of it implemented in my upcoming Toyota 86 860 Special Edition. 

Until then, Happy building! 

[Aventador2004]

8 minutes ago, Myers Lego Technic said:

Interesting, I still think my idea is simpler and more efficient than Samolot's, and more stable than IA's discovery. 

It is under 7 studs tall with the shocks and is very true to Sariels original design. 

I will post picks of it implemented in my upcoming Toyota 86 860 Special Edition. 

Until then, Happy building! 

this is something i should try, and the 86 sounds like a fun build.

[Myers Lego Technic]

It is turning out to be so. 

REAR axle- 

 

[Myers Lego Technic]

Not yet. Soon. 

 

 

[Didumos69]

1 hour ago, Samolot said:

You are right in this example the pivot point is still at the inner side of the wheel , but this suspension is easy to modify it is enough if you will replace liftarms in the swingarm for shorter ones. And pivot point will move closer to the center. I am thinking about RC motors or PF L motor in vertical position. All is simple if you do not need front wheels to be driven. Whole system is very strong and there is no looseness.

Aha, I understand. Interesting concept.

[TheMindGarage]

I don't think I used exactly the same setup as Sariel's, but I have made a virtual pivot with suspension:

Here you can see the two extreme positions of the suspension overlaid. The grey link connects to the longitudinally-mounted shock absorbers. A steering rack is connected to the suspension arms - as the rack moves, the suspension arms rotate, steering the wheel.

[nicjasno]

 

[romashkaman]

@nicjasno That's amazing! I'm looking forward to rolling prototype!)

[tomek9210]

Now make some audi car around it :)

What is the rim piece? What is the scale more or less?

[1gor]

On 5/15/2017 at 8:05 AM, tomek9210 said:

Driven front axle with virtual pivot point can be made, but the kingpin axle would be too far from the wheel's axis with 42000 rims. 8484 wheels would be a bit better here.

PS.

Didumos69 - I am still working on my red sedan :) I will post details later today.

You probably mean 8448 wheels - they are too loose with 42000, 8466 and 42054/56 hubs, so in that case you'll have to ise otdinary axles...but wheels are great. If you're looking for wheel with positive offset then Porsche wheel is the solution, but without drive; above mentioned hubs have bad steering angle.

Edited June 27, 2017 by I_Igor

[nicjasno]

On 27/06/2017 at 9:57 PM, tomek9210 said:

Now make some audi car around it :)

What is the rim piece? What is the scale more or less?

The rim is from standard 1:8 r/c wheels.