Gate of a fortress

[Tordenskjold]

Im making maps and plans for a new fortress now. and have started the building. the fort will be on 6 48x48 plates and builddt so that each plate can be separatet from the other ones( for transportation etc)

imnow wondering how to build the gate and the doors. made two versions

where there is two doors on the outside of the wall and two on the inside and this

where the gatedoors is placed more or lessin the middle of the wall. and opening inwards.

i cant agree with my selves on whats the best solution

Thunder

[Fender Bender]

Strategically it would be best if the doors swung outwards, because then attackers will have a harder time breaking in and defenders can more easily break out. It's how they've done it since the middle ages. You can even see the concept in most public places today where the doors swing outwards for fire security reasons.

Another tactical disadvantage with the inwards door is that you give attackers close to the doors shelter from gunfire, which I assume is highly unwanted since you appear to have built the walls so that your men can shoot at whoever is at the door.

In terms of aestethics I think it looks a wee bit cooler with the door swinging inwards, but for a fortress i would choose the tactical solution over the better looking solution any day :-)

This is for your decatio island?

[Doctor Sinister]

The second one looks better - I'm not sure if it will wholly negate the ability for defenders to shoot at attackers from the flanks, I reckon that'll be OK. In addition, anyone caught in there at the door could perhaps be subjected to some lovely burning oil from above - were you so inclined to build in such a feature.

Dr. S.

[Tordenskjold]

Yes this is for Decastio. this fortress will replace the big black fort on Battle island.

Will be sort of a diamond shaped fort with six bastions and about 35 cannons.

The reason that i think about letting the door open inwards is that if we imagine an enemyattacking the fort and reach all the way to the door in before retreating a bit they can do lots of damage to the doors like setting fire or it or just place huge amounts of rubble outside so the gates cant be opened. if the doors then open inward they could open the gates a bit and put out a fire or remove rubble so they can use the gate again. and if i set the gate inside the wall or in the middle i can make fire down from above in small holes in the wall or fro the side like the germans used in their ww2 fortress'

[Col. Whipstick]

I can see your confusion and I'm going to vote for option 2 with the doors being inside and further back. Ultimately with most fortresses you could have a grill gate that runs down at the front facing outside which would be infront of your doors. I don't see how you could implement this however without heavily altering the design.

That sounds like a really big fortess. What's the reason for such a bastion? Has Napolean got you scared with all those troops? X-D

[Mister Phes]

I think you need bigger gates... X-D

Like the gate we see here:

[iamded]

I think you need bigger gates... X-D

Like the gate we see here:

<snip>

I have that Castle! :-D

Anywho, I think both methods have their pros and cons, personally I think 2 gates are better than one for keeping out attackers, but that makes it harder to escape. Maybe have a secret escape way, and keep 2 sets of doors?

~Peace

[Mister Phes]

I think Mr Tordenskjold could make the entrance a bit more grandiose by creating an arched gateway to accommodate those large doors seen in the above picture.

[Fender Bender]

ya. A secret escape route is highly recommended.

'nless you really want to escape through the front door during a siege X-D

But seriously, I agree with Mr. Phes that the main entrance should be bigger and more elaborate, but I still think you should stick with the two door solution.

You know what I eagerly await on your island? A large dock! So that I can come visiting in the Triton's Vengeance!

Skip ohoi :-)

Edited November 11, 2007 by Fender Bender

[Tordenskjold]

this is how its going to be.

the doors should not be big and beutiful but smaller and stronger. i looked at the gate doors fro the 6090 set but they look too big for me. at least at the moment. as the doors now are facing inwards they also have the hinges on the inside. so the enemy cant destroy them from the outside. there is also a better way for the defender to block of the entire gate from the inside now.

If you look closely you can see a little hole in the wall just outside the door. from within the wall (will make an opening later defenders can shoot out those holes, while they are too small to dromt grenades into.

This is how it will look with door s open.

a secret way out?? hmm wont tell YOU that :-D :-D

[Tordenskjold]

By the way. here is a glimt of how it will be( i hope)

this is two sections put together. number 2 and 3. in real life i buildt most of section 6 but have no pic of that yet. the battery with four cannons is The Prince' battery .

And Col Whipstick, i do not fear anyone, but better be prepared for everything . but Bonaparte is a H*ll of a enemy . ;-)

[Lt. Col. Thok]

Very nice. It reminds of one of the descriptions I read about the French forts in the Spanish city of Salamanca during the Peninsular War.

[Captain Green Hair]

By the way. here is a glimt of how it will be( i hope)

this is two sections put together. number 2 and 3. in real life i buildt most of section 6 but have no pic of that yet. the battery with four cannons is The Prince' battery .

And Col Whipstick, i do not fear anyone, but better be prepared for everything . but Bonaparte is a H*ll of a enemy . ;-)

This looks very promising Tjordenskold!

But why not build in a different color like grey or white?

[woody64]

Maybe I've missed it but what have you used for drawing and how long did you spend for the picture.

Does it give you a better(faster?) possibility to try it?

I'm interested in experiences you made with that kind of preparation.

I was not sure concerning the arguments for opening the doors. When I remember some visits I think they swung inwards.

Here's a picture of Hochosterwitz:

one of the most important castles against enemies from the east.

It has 14 doors. When fleeding back I think closing a door from the outside against a pressing enemy is hardly to do. But not sure at all ...

Andreas

Edited November 11, 2007 by woody64

[Tordenskjold]

Ho woody64 :) nice gate ..

i use mlcad to make this models. and how musch time? hmm long time. i could sit a whole evening and get no way . this is why i separatet the fort into 6 parts. so every part can be buildt separate.

reason for using so much black is that i have ALOT of black bricks :-D

Im not sure what you ment with

"Does it give you a better(faster?) possibility to try it?

I'm interested in experiences you made with that kind of preparation."

Thunder

[woody64]

Im not sure what you ment with

"Does it give you a better(faster?) possibility to try it?

I'm interested in experiences you made with that kind of preparation."

My consideration was that using mlcad it may be easier (or maybe faster) to exchange parts, positions or maybe to reuse something from a former doing?

Andreas

Edited November 11, 2007 by woody64

[Fender Bender]

When fleeding back I think closing a door from the outside against a pressing enemy is hardly to do. But not sure at all ...

Andreas

Come to think of it, that DOES make sense!

However, it depends on who's in charge of the defences. :-)

I've always built my castle gates swinging outwards, 'cause I'm the kind of commander who digs in behind the walls and take a beating, then open the doors wide and charge out. I'm straying off topic now...

Mr. Tordenskjold, the two cannons facing each other on each side of the gate, wouldn't it be safer to use a slightly smaller calibre? Right now it looks like they'll just blast holes in your own wall if fired...

The overall layout is nice *y*

[Tordenskjold]

Come to think of it, that DOES make sense!

However, it depends on who's in charge of the defences. :-)

I've always built my castle gates swinging outwards, 'cause I'm the kind of commander who digs in behind the walls and take a beating, then open the doors wide and charge out. I'm straying off topic now...

Mr. Tordenskjold, the two cannons facing each other on each side of the gate, wouldn't it be safer to use a slightly smaller calibre? Right now it looks like they'll just blast holes in your own wall if fired...

The overall layout is nice *y*

hehe the two cannons are loaded with grapeshots and when pointed down they will clear the area between them . thay can also be diverted to fire out on the harbour longside the other guns. but they will be replaced by others later.

Btw. how are you going to be able to swing the doors open and charge out if there is something blocking them from outside? like parts of the wall or a wagon filled with stone or something like that. then i can asily open my doors inwards and just jump over that :-P

Now i see your point Woody64. thats the main reason for me to use mlcad. i can make one model and then use it as many times as i want, or i can buildt in any color i have. or replace parts. its very fast and cheap compared to real life.

Catpain green hair talked about the color. i like the dark color. in my mind it make the fort look more hard to get . and also the white thing. i cant say i've seen a picture of a white fort yet. know there was some dark ones but havent seen a fort buildt in white.

[Mister Phes]

Now the fortress has brown the entrance looks more like a side door... It really needs some beefing up...

I'm not a big fan of the black either so I'd recommend a shade of grey.

[ZeekyBoogeyDoog]

This will be very impressive when finished! *y*

[Tordenskjold]

This will be very impressive when finished! *y*

I hope so *sweet* but its a long way to go . With the mlcad model its more easy to see what i need to buy and what i have. but still a long way to go.

workname for this is Diamond Fortress. and when i get pictures i will make post them out here on pirate forum. Perhaps this weekend if i got time to build at home

Thunder

[Col. Whipstick]

For shame on you all...

The guy asked which version of gate to use and you all want him to build the Taj Mahal! X-D

[Tordenskjold]

For shame on you all...

The guy asked which version of gate to use and you all want him to build the Taj Mahal! X-D

He he he- You know how to say it :) some of the ideas was a bit far from what i had in mind. of the fortificatyions i've been in noone have a very great entrance. they rely more on strength than beauty :-D

But several of the other here had ideas and hints that i have in mind when making other things. so it was not a complete miss to want me to build Taj Mahal hehe -

[Col. Whipstick]

He he he- You know how to say it :) some of the ideas was a bit far from what i had in mind. of the fortificatyions i've been in noone have a very great entrance. they rely more on strength than beauty :-D

But several of the other here had ideas and hints that i have in mind when making other things. so it was not a complete miss to want me to build Taj Mahal hehe -

In the end of the day a fortress is as you say always something Spartan rather than Athenian. So Northern Norway, is your fortess protecting Trondheim then? That used to be the old Viking capital if I remember. Or is this to be an unknown Norweigan base in the Caribbean? You should tell your Danish neighbours that colonizing Iceland and Greenland won't get them any coconuts and rum. X-D

[Tordenskjold]

It will be somewere in Carribean. on the big island Decastio

And i want them to be British :) maybe i make something from our homeland later.

we have a lot of history from these pirate times from Norway :-D