Party Lines Mafia - Day Two: Veto

[mostlytechnic]

What I find odd is that the scum didn't target Siegfried. If he isn't scum, then why wouldn't the scum target him? The only reasons I can see are these:

1. Siegfried is scum himself.

2. The scum are worried that the town would catch on to the photographer of Siegfried by looking at those who accused him on day one.

This is an interesting new topic that hadn't been brought up yet... even without being Speaker I could see him being a likely scum kill target for the first night. Unless, as you said, he IS scum. Or alternately... don't forget that we presumably have night abilities that they would be concerned about. A protector could likely protect him, expecting him to be a night 1 target. Or we could have some sort of watcher / spy / tracker role, who could watch the speaker to see who targeted him. That would give away the scum (well, not necessarily, I suppose they'd just see that he was targeted by a certain person, but still not know if the photographer was scum or the vig).

Basically, for the speaker, I see 2 possibilities. He's either scum, or he's a vanilla loyal like he claims. He wouldn't have jumped at the role of speaker if he had any night abilities, since the speaker is very likely to get caught by a photo soon. As simple as him being Octan would make things (explaining things I mean), I can totally buy the scum NOT taking him out night 1 simply because he's TOO obvious of a target and they'd be worried about getting caught.

[Scaevola]

This is an interesting new topic that hadn't been brought up yet... even without being Speaker I could see him being a likely scum kill target for the first night. Unless, as you said, he IS scum. Or alternately... don't forget that we presumably have night abilities that they would be concerned about. A protector could likely protect him, expecting him to be a night 1 target. Or we could have some sort of watcher / spy / tracker role, who could watch the speaker to see who targeted him. That would give away the scum (well, not necessarily, I suppose they'd just see that he was targeted by a certain person, but still not know if the photographer was scum or the vig).

Basically, for the speaker, I see 2 possibilities. He's either scum, or he's a vanilla loyal like he claims. He wouldn't have jumped at the role of speaker if he had any night abilities, since the speaker is very likely to get caught by a photo soon. As simple as him being Octan would make things (explaining things I mean), I can totally buy the scum NOT taking him out night 1 simply because he's TOO obvious of a target and they'd be worried about getting caught.

I concur with Maurice that the most likely reason for the Octan not targeting Speaker Dixon is due to it being too obvious. Without many people to trust on Night 1, the protector ought to have chosen the speaker. Thereby, it would be liable to have been a wasted attempt. I'd not entirely discount the possibly he is scum, but given the odds it seems less likely. Siegfried has not yet done anything major to make himself look scummy, whereas a protector is a nearly confirmed issue the scum have to deal with.

[Tamamono]

Voting is now open. With 15 representatives, it takes 8 to impeach.

[Bob]

I am not twisting your words around. But you are sure trying to keep attention of yourself. Any reason for that?

I'm keeping attention off of myself? How? I've been the most vocal today.

For a plethora of reasons, I Vote: Addie Tremain (adventurer1).

[def]

Well, overall, I'd say Leroy was more likely a scum "photograph" than Winnifred, as he was mentioned much less, and made for a more "undercover" kill.

(Keep in mind that even if a member of the scum were to accuse a town player that didn't get lynched by the end of the day, it would be a pretty terrible decision for them to also photograph that person during the night.)

Assuming this is the case, the reasons for a vigilante pic of Winnifred are somewhat unsubstantial, so there are still questions to be asked there.

What I find odd is that the scum didn't target Siegfried. If he isn't scum, then why wouldn't the scum target him? The only reasons I can see are these:

1. Siegfried is scum himself.

2. The scum are worried that the town would catch on to the photographer of Siegfried by looking at those who accused him on day one.

Scum won't target someone putting themselves out there on day one, mainly because they are worried about a protector targeting me (wasting their kill) or a watcher (seeing who kills me). So, yeah, part of the reason I use so much bluster on day one is to see me live to day two, I dare scum to kill me, and they've never killed me once. It won't work night two, due to WIFOM politics, it's much less likely that I'll be protected or watched night two.

One thing that will keep me from getting killed (by the scum at least) is accusing me in thread. The more that town claim I'm scum, even only because they're meta-gaming, the less reason for scum to kill me: they'll just support you in lynching me.

Sadly, I have only had two PMs, one with Winifred, and one with another. I sent out two last night, but they were about Winifred, and were my mistake. I might hazard a thought that the two I sent warnings about Winifred are likely town, since scum would be disinclined to kill the person I thought was scum, but there's no way to tell which faction killed Winifred.

In my own meta-game, I'm inclined to consider Leroy as killed by someone from this. He was slippery here, and I can imagine some lingering distrust.

Again, I'm just a vanilla, so I can only go on the given info, and the few PMs I've had.

[mostlytechnic]

Scum won't target someone putting themselves out there on day one, mainly because they are worried about a protector targeting me (wasting their kill) or a watcher (seeing who kills me). So, yeah, part of the reason I use so much bluster on day one is to see me live to day two, I dare scum to kill me, and they've never killed me once. It won't work night two, due to WIFOM politics, it's much less likely that I'll be protected or watched night two.

One thing that will keep me from getting killed (by the scum at least) is accusing me in thread. The more that town claim I'm scum, even only because they're meta-gaming, the less reason for scum to kill me: they'll just support you in lynching me.

Well, as much as that is logical and a pretty good method of playing, it still doesn't at all mean that you didn't survive because you're scum.

[def]

Well, as much as that is logical and a pretty good method of playing, it still doesn't at all mean that you didn't survive because you're scum.

Okay, so surviving means I'm scum. Push it if you like. Either I'll be lynched, then you'll be lynched when I come up town, or you'll be lynched for pushing a weak lynch.

As always, punishing experienced players for being experienced is a quick road to a scum win. Investigate, deduce, do whatever, but just saying that the veteran is scum because they're alive is simply weak play. On day five, if I am still alive, sure, that's fair (call it Rick's Law) Day two? That's weak.

*if I'm alive and haven't proven any use to town

[Scaevola]

I for one am not satisfied with Representative Jacob Palacios justifications. A refusal to tender his vote, especially as one of the crucial later votes strongly testifies that he was aiming for a no-lynch which would entirely benefit the Octan. Furthermore, he attempted to justify his action by stating it would make himself look scummy, which is very self-serving and suggests a paranoid inclination to maintain his reputation (though paradoxical considering his vote), which also incriminates him as scum. Therefore, I'll be voting for Jacob.

Vote: Jacob Palacios (JackJonespaw)

[Lady K]

I'm keeping attention off of myself? How? I've been the most vocal today.

For a plethora of reasons, I Vote: Addie Tremain (adventurer1).

Interesting. You have been the most vocal by one more post than me. With this post I will now have the same number as you. Voting for me for a plethora of reasons? I could retaliate with a vote for you because you are now high up on my suspicious list, but at this point that would just be revenge voting. There are others to consider that are also high up on my scum list.

I agree that Jacob, for reasons already stated is very suspicious. Gerald is also on that list for his response to Winnifred's poke at him, overly defensive and initial revenge vote. And Bryant Laughlin still hasn't responded.

I have also just noted that Molly Callaghan hasn't even posted once today. Molly, care to share any thoughts with us?

[def]

I have also just noted that Molly Callaghan hasn't even posted once today. Molly, care to share any thoughts with us?

In the interest of not causing confusion and dissent, I will admit now:

There is a second ability of the speaker, and it is stealing the vote of one player who didn't vote, and muting them for 24 hours. So, today, I have two votes, and Molly none, and she couldn't vote for the first chunk of the day.

I haven't thought about how to use this vote yet, but Molly isn't on my suss-list yet, so I think it's prudent to reveal this now, rather than start us on a witch hunt.

Officially, those are all my secrets revealed to the public.

Only Molly and Carol were listed at the end of day one, so that is why Molly was chosen.

[Brickelodeon]

Hmph. I fall asleep for a few minutes and three loyal people bite the dust. I will hopefully be fully rested by the end of this next impeachment. I'm sorry about my lack of assistance, it's my new Californian medication.

I am sorry for this if I am completely off target here, I haven't been listening to anything, but I am a bit suspicious of our estimable speaker as it turns out that he has been hiding a few things. Even though I voted him into his position, I will vote for him. It might be noted that he was also key in impeaching a loyal representative.

Vote: Speedy (Siegfrieid Dixon)

[Adam]

I for one am not satisfied with Representative Jacob Palacios justifications. A refusal to tender his vote, especially as one of the crucial later votes strongly testifies that he was aiming for a no-lynch which would entirely benefit the Octan. Furthermore, he attempted to justify his action by stating it would make himself look scummy, which is very self-serving and suggests a paranoid inclination to maintain his reputation (though paradoxical considering his vote), which also incriminates him as scum. Therefore, I'll be voting for Jacob.

I agree.

Vote: Jacob (JackJonespaw)

[badboytje88]

Lloyd and Maurice I have to say that your reasons to suspect our speaker are weak at best. Though I do agree that we should be cautious, I think Siegfrieds arguments are satisfactionary.

Molly where are you?

I will join:

Vote: Jacob Palacios (JackJonespaw)

For abstaining a lynch never is the answer.

[Tamamono]

Vote Tally

Jacob Palacios (JackJonespaw) - 2 (Scaevola, Adam)

Addie Tremain (adventurer1) - 1 (Bob)

Siegfried Dixon (Speedy) - 1 (Brickelodeon)

40 hours remain. With 15 representative, it takes 8 to impeach.

[Mencot]

Now I am here, sorry for my low activity yesterday. Lots of booze, I need to stop drinking, I have joined AA because of my problem.

But the people of Brickstein are so proud of me and I am so happy to be here

And the real thing why I was so quiet and didn´t vote was, yes I know it is a lame excuse but my playing or should I say commenting from the my mobile didn´t work well.

But as for today, Mr Dixon is at least speaking the truth in the matter about:

In the interest of not causing confusion and dissent, I will admit now:

There is a second ability of the speaker, and it is stealing the vote of one player who didn't vote, and muting them for 24 hours. So, today, I have two votes, and Molly none, and she couldn't vote for the first chunk of the day.

I haven't thought about how to use this vote yet, but Molly isn't on my suss-list yet, so I think it's prudent to reveal this now, rather than start us on a witch hunt.

Officially, those are all my secrets revealed to the public.

Only Molly and Carol were listed at the end of day one, so that is why Molly was chosen.

So that is why I haven´t said anything today.

I am sorry for this if I am completely off target here, I haven't been listening to anything, but I am a bit suspicious of our estimable speaker as it turns out that he has been hiding a few things. Even though I voted him into his position, I will vote for him. It might be noted that he was also key in impeaching a loyal representative.

Vote: Speedy (Siegfrieid Dixon)

Don´t you think hiding those things wouldn´t been the best thing to do, ofcourse this doesn´t mean he couldn´t be scum, the scum would do the same thing to hid the abilities from the public on day 1.

But I don´t feel good about not having the vote ability but that doesn´t mean i can´t say whom I would vote for.

Yesterday I would had vote for Bryant or Carol.

Right now I feel Dixon is in a place that can be dangrous for town, if he would turn out to be scum. 2 votes to had!

And I think he is enjoying that spot where he is, aren´t you Mr Dixon, in the center of all things, pulling strings just as you like it

What the hell I can just vote for him, there is plenty of time to change the vote.

Vote: Speedy (Siegfrieid Dixon)

* had should be add, in the sentence about Dixon´s 2 votes.

[def]

he has been hiding a few things. Even though I voted him into his position, I will vote for him.

Hiding things in mafia? Oh my! Maybe the whole town should blab their roles. That sounds like a plan

It might be noted that he was also key in impeaching a loyal representative.

Yup. Day one lynch was my fault.

Sorry, but this sort of logic is not going to help us out. Pushing this sort of logic is just going to make you a lynch candidate.

And I think he is enjoying that spot where he is, aren´t you Mr Dixon, in the center of all things, pulling strings just as you like it

What the hell I can just vote for him, there is plenty of time to change the vote.

Vote: Speedy (Siegfrieid Dixon)

* had should be add, in the sentence about Dixon´s 2 votes.

1) you can't vote for me because you have no vote. I already told you that. The host will confirm it next vote tally.

and

2) if I were scum.... that is dumb logic. I am not scum, and if you lynch me, the town will need a new speaker, and they very well might be scum. Far better to track/watch/confirm me than to lynch me.

But, as is always the case, dealing with people in this game is not a matter of explaining logic. The gut rules.

[StickFig]

Molly where are you?

I'm fairly sure that our esteemed speaker answered that question hours before you asked it... in the interest of making things interesting, I think I'll poke uou

you*

Vote: Bjorn Borchard (badboytje88)

[Mencot]

Hiding things in mafia? Oh my! Maybe the whole town should blab their roles. That sounds like a plan

Yup. Day one lynch was my fault.

Sorry, but this sort of logic is not going to help us out. Pushing this sort of logic is just going to make you a lynch candidate.

1) you can't vote for me because you have no vote. I already told you that. The host will confirm it next vote tally.

and

2) if I were scum.... that is dumb logic. I am not scum, and if you lynch me, the town will need a new speaker, and they very well might be scum. Far better to track/watch/confirm me than to lynch me.

But, as is always the case, dealing with people in this game is not a matter of explaining logic. The gut rules.

I know I can´t vote I said it also, wink wink you should try your own tips, read

I just wanted to say i would vote poke you, ofcourse it wouldn´t count but I will be watching you and it is totally useless to send me PM about me being pissed at you about some past things, don´t even know what your talking about there

Somebody have or will probably be watching you, tracking you and try to confirm you but until that Mr Nixon you are as possible to be Octan than the rest of us

I'm fairly sure that our esteemed speaker answered that question hours before you asked it... in the interest of making things interesting, I think I'll poke uou

you*

Vote: Bjorn Borchard (badboytje88)

I don´t think he had paid attention or noticed that or something

[badboytje88]

I'm fairly sure that our esteemed speaker answered that question hours before you asked it... in the interest of making things interesting, I think I'll poke uou

you*

Vote: Bjorn Borchard (badboytje88)

Completely missed that she was muted for the rest of the day, thought she only wasn't allowed to vote. Any other reasons for voting for me?

[Mencot]

Completely missed that she was muted for the rest of the day, thought she only wasn't allowed to vote. Any other reasons for voting for me?

I was just muted for 24 h

[badboytje88]

I was just muted for 24 h

Thanks for clarifying and standing up for me. By the way my vote didn't get counted. I guess because I posted almost ag the same time as our host.

[def]

Somebody have or will probably be watching you, tracking you and try to confirm you but until that Mr Nixon you are as possible to be Octan than the rest of us

Next time somebody starts pointing the finger at you, I won't go out of my way to dig you out. My fault for being nice to you.

Help Molly. Molly would then vote for you.

It's a stupid lesson to learn, but I've learned it.

[Mencot]

Next time somebody starts pointing the finger at you, I won't go out of my way to dig you out. My fault for being nice to you.

Help Molly. Molly would then vote for you.

It's a stupid lesson to learn, but I've learned it.

and I would do it again

As said before everyone is an Octan until found innocent... also you Mr Dixon.

[Yzalirk]

Way to stick it to him, Molly! As to what you said about him basically saying "guilty until proven innocent", I fee I should respond to this:

1) you can't vote for me because you have no vote. I already told you that. The host will confirm it next vote tally.

and

2) if I were scum.... that is dumb logic. I am not scum, and if you lynch me, the town will need a new speaker, and they very well might be scum. Far better to track/watch/confirm me than to lynch me.

How do we know for a %100 facto-mundo that you are a Loyalist that you claim to be? How do we know you're already not an Octan Speaker? Like you said yourself, by your logic, no one is considered a Loyalist until lynched and found to be one. By that logic, it seems like we might as well play Russian Roulette. And it does seem quite scummy to play the woe-is-me game when you essentially have one vote that counts against you.

So, for now, I'll do this.

Vote: Speedy (Siegfrieid Dixon)

Until you sell the idea that you are truly a Loyalist like you claim to be, I think I'll keep my vote.

[def]

It's not woe-is-me to point out bad strategy.

I can't wrap my head around the stupidity of thinking there is any safety to lynching me. I am the speaker for now. I can be verified. If you lynch me, you'll be down a townie, and then the next person who is speaker (because there will be one) will also need to be verified.

Of course, should I be lynched, those who pushed for it will be at the top of the list day three.

I understand that some townies will make dumb votes for no reason, but it's the ones that try to pick up steam that are really dangerous. Gerald wants me to sell the idea that I'm a Loyalist? Would you like me to do a screen grab of my role PM? No, that's not going to happen. There will be no proof of my Loyalist status unless I was investigated, or I'm dead. Which every single one of us should know. His vote is lazy, without reason, and it's an attempt to get a bandwagon going on somebody the scum want out.

Vote: Goliath (Gerald Hatley)

This is not a revenge vote, otherwise Laughlin or Molly would have got it. No, Hatley is playing a dangerous game, and even if he is town, the sooner we get this polluted thinking out of the legislature, the better.

I can change my vote if others have a more pressing argument.