Those fantastically expensive 1:87 LEGO cars/trucks

[LEGO Historian]

I've wanted to put an extensive thread out here on Eurobricks on what is arguably the most expensive and least understood of all LEGO items... the 1955-70 LEGO 1:87 HO scale model cars and trucks.

These cars come as cheap as $10 for cars in bad condition with missing parts... all the way up to $5,000 for cars/trucks that have fewer than 10 examples known...

The display here is just a sample of what I have in my Unofficial Sets/Parts Collectors Guide, where there are approximately 100 pages (out of 2,800) devoted to these very expensive and collectible LEGO items... spread over several chapters... LEGO 1:87 Vehicles... LEGO Promotional Sets/Parts... LEGO Prototype Sets/Parts, and LEGO Counterfeit Sets/Parts.

I hope you will enjoy this little look into a true collectible....

The images shown here will be from my own image collection, my DVD/download collection, and those of my Dutch collector friend Jeroen, and German collector friend Lothar. Enjoy!

The first LEGO 1:87 trucks came out in 1955 with the first LEGO Town Plan accessories. The first cars were not introduced until 1956 (VW Bus), 1957 (VW Beetle), and 1961... miscellaneous LEGO cars.

Here are some of the 1961-66 LEGO 1:87 cars in plastic garages sealed with a banderole... and some 1965-67 LEGO 1:87 cars in cardboard boxes...

Here are some of the 1961-66 1:87 cars in garages... and their model types. These are numbered in the 261-268 range....

Here are the 1965-67 601-605 and 658-668 1:87 boxes... from the back... listing the different box types...

Here are some of the 1957-62 VW Beetle with Showroom Window Box - 260... which was a supplement

Here's a 307 VW Showroom Set that uses the showroom window (and VW) from the 260 parts pack...

Here's an entire Diorama of LEGO 1:87 Cars/Trucks and other Town Plan accessories showing the beautiful versatility of the Town Plan System... including the Town Plan board. This is from my Dutch friend Jeroen...

This is "just"... the first installment of the old 1:87 cars/trucks on this thread... much much more to follow... probably about $50,000 worth of LEGO in all...

Gary Istok

[Hey Joe]

Thanks, those individual 'garages' that they're packaged in are pretty cool as well.

It's interesting to see how the scale of Lego has grown over the years.

Joe

[LEGO Historian]

Thanks Joe!

I forgot to Show those garages in an image.... here is a copy of a 1963 German LEGO catalog showing the 261-268 1:87 Autos in their garages... (and also the 8 Bedford trucks that were sold loose by retailers)...

One interesting thing about the 1962-65 continental European catalogs... they always show the garages with a red door. It seems that early examples produced by TLG came with either red doors, black doors, dark gray doors... or the common gray doors... with gray being about 98% of all known examples.

Also the garage base came in either white, dark gray or gray... again with gray being about 98% of the time.

The red and black garage doors often came with a white base. And the dark gray doors often came with a dark gray base. But this was not always the case. In some instances you might find a gray or dark gray base to a red or black door.

And to make matters even more complicated... rare early examples with red doors sometimes came with a tinted trans-pink garage. and also rare dark gray or black door examples may have come with a trans-black garage.

As I said... this was a very complex issue... with many variables. But the rarest colors are red or black door with white base... and either trans-pink or trans-black garage.

Here is a red door/white base/trans-pink garage....

And here is a garage with red door/dark gray base/trans-black garage tint....

Here is a box of 5 garages with 1:87 vehicles. This is how LEGO Retailers bought them from TLG in Europe, in a plain brown cardboard box... (these are the common gray door/gray base/trans-clear garage tint...

So the irony is that 1962-65 continental European LEGO catalogs ALWAYS showed the garages with red doors... even though only early 1962 examples of these actually had the garages with anything other than gray doors/bases.... Just another LEGO anomaly that is so common among early LEGO catalogs. This is not unusual for early LEGO catalogs to show things that were NOT generally available to the public. There are many many examples of this. Like I tell folks about my 2800 page collectors guide.... if TLG actually produced items as they were described or shown in catalogs... then my DVD/download would only be about 500 pages long. It's all these little anomalies that make early LEGO so very complex. I often tell people that do NOT let the fact that early LEGO catalogs were only 2 sides of 1 page... fool you that early LEGO was somehow not complex... that couldn't be farther from the truth!! And in the case of these 1:87 garages... I've not even touched on the "colors available" yet for these vehicles. Some of these came in colors where fewer than a dozen examples are known!! $$$

Gary Istok

Edited May 9, 2013 by LEGO Historian

[Blondie-Wan]

Thanks for these images. I'll have to get your DVD sometime.

Those garages are enticing; I wish I had some. I'm not sure what I'd use them for, but I'd doubtless think of something if I had them at my disposal.

[LEGO Historian]

Thanks Blondie-Wan!

Those garages are relatively inexpensive... in gray. The problem is as you say... in determining what you would use them for in this age of the Minifig!

Bricklink always has an assortment of these available at relatively decent prices... (for 50 year old items!)...

http://www.bricklink.com/catalogList.asp?catType=P&catString=79

Now getting to the topic of colors... this is an open book... There are so many colors available on some of these items... that it becomes mind numbing... Just the VW Beetle... which probably comes in more colors than any other 1:87 auto... comes in a vast number of variable colors.

Looris, the son of a deep pockets Swiss collector just recently posted this wonderful assortment of colors of the 1:87 LEGO VW Beetles on Flickr...

This is just 26 variations of colors (some metallic) of the LEGO 1:87 VW Beetle... there are at least another dozen more colors available. This collection shown here is valued at least at $5000!!

[LEGO Historian]

And speaking of rare colors....

This black 605 Fiat 1800 (1965-67)... is a very rare color... with fewer than a dozen known. LEGO 1:87 collectors usually have very deep pockets... as this one would attest to when it sold on EBAY for $3235 back in 2009!!!

But the real prize among the 1:87 Autos is the very rare 1957-58 prototype of a Opel Kapitän. There are only about 8 or 9 known of this very rare and collectible car. It is known in yellow (most common), red and orange. Here is a rare Norwegian example of this car, which doesn't have "glass"... although since it is a prototype... that really doesn't affect its' value... worth over $5000!!

The Opel Kapitän's existence was confirmed long ago with the box top of all 1958-60 LEGO basic sets (all had the same box top design)... Kids in Europe back in the late 1950s didn't realize that TLG was toying with them (no pun intended)... when they showed the box top with a LEGO car they could never own!! It is parked in front of the twin tower hotel building...

[LEGO Historian]

My LEGO friend Jeroen in the Netherlands has a large assortment of 1:87 cars and trucks. Here is a display stand he has of his 1:87 VW Buses, Vans and Pickup Trucks.... in an almost endless assortment of colors. The buses without windows date to 1956-61... the vans date to 1961-67, and the pickups date to 1962-67.

Among the valuable LEGO 1:87 items are promotional items... And the LEGO 1:87 VW Buses and Vans seem to be the most common promotionals. There are about a dozen different promotional variations known.

Here are 3 of them... an all white "KOLEVOGN", all green "KASTNER & OHLER", and blue and gray PHILIPS van. The Philips is worth about $200-$400, and the other 2 are worth well over $1000 each. These date to about 1962-65.

Another very rare promotional item is the 1967 MURYAR BISHARA VW Pickup Truck. This promotional item was for a 1967 Danish Boy Scout Jamboree, where a large number of Nigerian boys were invited (thanks to a Nigerian Christian Missionary TV Station nameed Muryar Bishara). The irony is that each of the Nigerian boys went back to Nigeria with one of these pickups on a plastic rope (similar to a keychain). These are worth about $1000+ each today. It boggles the mind on what valuable toys the boys in Nigeria had that they had no idea of its' value... and likely very few of these survived in Nigeria!!

Edited May 13, 2013 by LEGO Historian

[LEGO Historian]

Here is a link to a 4 page magazine article on the LEGO 1:87 vehicles.

A couple of things... the author of the article was not aware of the fact that early 1:87 cars/trucks were made of Cellulose Acetate... and therefore warped... the author thought that they had "impurities" that caused that.

And another thing that has still not gotten answered... where were the 1:87 vehicles made. At least the Bedford trucks and early cars were made in Billund... the cars in the garages carry a "MADE IN DENMARK" label on the bottom.

But the Mercedes trucks and later cars may have been made in Hohenwestedt Germany. The jury is still out on this one....

Here is the magazine article... very informative....

http://www.flickr.com/photos/istokg/5580883976/sizes/l/in/photostream/

http://www.flickr.com/photos/istokg/5580306705/sizes/l/in/photostream/

http://www.flickr.com/photos/istokg/5580306707/sizes/l/in/photostream/

http://www.flickr.com/photos/istokg/5584087545/sizes/l/in/photostream/

Gary Istok

[LEGO Guy Bri]

What would your friends whole collection be estimated at and how many 1:87 vehicles does it contain?

[LEGO Historian]

Actually these are from the collections of 5 different old time LEGO collectors... each of whom has 10s of thousands in LEGO 1:87s and other rare old LEGO items.

[Fugazi]

Here is a link to a 4 page magazine article on the LEGO 1:87 vehicles.

Thanks for the interesting read! For some reason I thought that HO scale (1:87) was an American thing and I couldn't figure out why LEGO would invest themselves in that scale, but after a quick visit to Wikipedia I know better! Turns out that HO was actually developed in Germany, so the market for 1:87 cars must have already been good there in the 1950s.

[caperberry]

I almost bought my first vehicle + garage on eBay just the other day, a Merc 220 that looked in great condition but I guess the CA accounts for how good these look. Didn't bid very high though... still feels like a slippery slope for me to get into HO! It went for £21, probably a great deal.

[Captain Green Hair]

Actually these are from the collections of 5 different old time LEGO collectors... each of whom has 10s of thousands in LEGO 1:87s and other rare old LEGO items.

Why the puking face? In all collections there are items that are just that rare and wanted, it's just what you are willing to pay for it as collector I guess.

I love your educational posts about the history of Lego, but the use of this particular smiley doesn't come off as really professional, nor objective.

Just a friendly suggestion.

[LEGO Historian]

Why the puking face? In all collections there are items that are just that rare and wanted, it's just what you are willing to pay for it as collector I guess.

I love your educational posts about the history of Lego, but the use of this particular smiley doesn't come off as really professional, nor objective.

Just a friendly suggestion.

... and here all this time I thought that was a "green with envy" face... will have to get my smiley faces in order... but "puking" was the last thing from my mind... these 1:87s are the "crown jewels" of old LEGO collectibles....

[caperberry]

Haha! Brilliant misunderstanding.

Puking with envy?

[LEGO Historian]

And speaking of ENVY......

(And now that I've got some "Copying Flickr for Dummies Training on Forum Community..... ).... I can post more images...

Here's some very rare 1:87 LEGO trucks.... this is a #652 Mercedes Truck/Trailer... but with the extremely rare Nivea (skin lotion company) decals. These may have been just prototypes never put into production, since this is the only known pair... value... too hard to determine... but in the thousands.... $$$$$$

Here's a very rare pair of vehicles.... the "Leche Danny Leite" #257 Bedford Delivery Truck (circa 1963) is a TLG promotional truck that was sold a few years ago from the LEGO Collections... and is a prototype worth many thousands. On the other side of this truck is the English/French caption "Mik DANNY Lait". Danny was a continental European dairy company, and this prototype delivery truck was never actually produced for sale, but only as a prototype.

The #258 VW Van also dates to circa 1963... and SPAR is a European grocery company. However, this van was not found in the company archives... but in used condition. This may have been a protoytpe as well, since no other specimens are known... one that got out of the factory and into circulation. Again a very valuable item... worth $$$ in good condition.

The number of these rare vans and truck varieties numbers over 2 dozen. If you had a collection of all of them... it would likely be worth at least $50K.

Now where's my green with envy Emoticon??

Thanks to collectors from all around the world, I am able to show all of these very rare and highly desireable cars/trucks in my Unnoficial LEGO Sets/Parts Collectors Guide. I always enjoy showning the folks at the LEGO Archives/Collections cars/trucks that they have no record of....

Edited May 26, 2013 by LEGO Historian

[quiquinho]

Dear LEGO Friends,

Just a short note about the amazing BLACK color ref. 605 Fiat 1800.

As far as my poor knowledge goes, in 1965 all LEGO H0 models were sold without the Garage clear box.

But the picture above showns this extremely rare black version...

...inside a garage, and with a LEGO leaflet!

Am I saying something silly?

I don't know, and perhaps someone could elucidate me about this matter.

Warmest regards!

Armando

Edited April 1, 2014 by quiquinho

[LEGO Historian]

Hello again Armando....

Yes you are correct... the 605 Fiat was NOT sold in a plastic LEGO garage. The 605 was introduced in a cardboard box in 1965. 1965 was a year in which all the older 261-268 1:87 LEGO cars were renumbered to 661-668 (no 663 however)... and the way they were sold was no longer in a plastic garage... but in a cardboard box.

Here is an example... the 267 VW 1500 Limousine (1962-65) in a garage with a banderole around it... was re-issued in a cardboard box under the 667 number (1965-67)...

So... 1965 is the year when the switch from plastic to cardboard, and using new set numbers happened.

In addition to the 261-268, the 258 (VW Van), 259 (VW Bus), 603 (Citroen DS19), 605 (Fiat 1800) and 607 (VW Samba Bus) were introduced in a cardboard box... with the 601 (Morris Marina) coming out in 1966.

BUT... and this is a big BUT.... for some odd reason... this was not the case in your home country of Portugal, Armando... the 1965 Portuguese LEGO catalog shows all the new numbers... but all the cars still in the plastic garages!! And instead of 603 Citroen and 605 Fiat in cardboard boxes... the 1965 Portuguese catalog shows these 2 with the 602/604 number... again in plastic garages...

So although that black Fiat 1800 (as a 605 number) shows an incorrect box type from this Ebay auction.... that's not to say that this wasn't originally a 604 Portuguese Fiat 1800 box. Unfortunately... when the outer banderole is missing... it would make this impossible to prove!

However, that being said... I have yet to find any of these rare Portugal (only) cars in their plastic garages and banderole.

That's where the collectors in Portugal need to help find these!!

Any of these 1965-66 Portuguese 661-668 MISB (with banderole) boxes would likely be worth over 1000 Euros each to old time LEGO collectors. And the 602 Citroen/604 Fiat... would likely be worth twice that, if not more, under those rare set numbers.

And of course... a very rare black Fiat in a 604 plastic garage with banderole sealing it... would easily be worth 5000 Euros!!

Portuguese collectors.... you are on notice!!

Edited April 1, 2014 by LEGO Historian

[LEGO Historian]

Just got a wonderful Email from my Norwegian collector friend Arild! Earlier in this thread I posted some images from my Dutch collector friend Richard, who purchased a red Opel Kapitän (from 1957) from a Norwegian LEGO collector. There were 7 known of these, until my friend Arild found an 8th one in yellow.

Now Arild was so very fortunate enough to find the 9th known example of this very rare Opel... but in green... a new color for this rarity. Although his model is missing the roof (so far 2 of 9 are missing this)... these are so rare that it really doesn't affect the value all that significanty...

Here it is... another $5000 LEGO car!

[quiquinho]

And speaking of rare colors....

This black 605 Fiat 1800 (1965-67)... is a very rare color... with fewer than a dozen known. LEGO 1:87 collectors usually have very deep pockets... as this one would attest to when it sold on EBAY for $3235 back in 2009!!!

But the real prize among the 1:87 Autos is the very rare 1957-58 prototype of a Opel Kapitän. There are only about 8 or 9 known of this very rare and collectible car. It is known in yellow (most common), red and orange. Here is a rare Norwegian example of this car, which doesn't have "glass"... although since it is a prototype... that really doesn't affect its' value... worth over $5000!!

The Opel Kapitän's existence was confirmed long ago with the box top of all 1958-60 LEGO basic sets (all had the same box top design)... Kids in Europe back in the late 1950s didn't realize that TLG was toying with them (no pun intended)... when they showed the box top with a LEGO car they could never own!! It is parked in front of the twin tower hotel building...

Hello from Portugal, Dear Friends!

Just some short notes about the extremely rare BLACK color variation of the Fiat 1800:

TLG adopted very early a philosophy to reference their H0 models with three digits for Central European countries - including Portugal in 1957! - beeing the first digit 2 or 6.

The 2xx references were sold with the plastic garage, the 6xx references were sold with the rare paper «presentation» box (with very few pre-59 exceptions, like the early Bedford truck series).

The Fiat 1800 was available from 1965 until 1967, with the ref. 605...

This means all Fiat models were never sold with a garage box, adversely as seen in the picture above.

I strongly suspect that the seller of this auction «added» (on purpose?) the garage.

FINAL NOTE:

In 1955, when the “Lego System of Play” was created (as well as the always fascinating "TOWN PLAN" system), TLG sold their first H0 models with a FOUR digits (125x) reference for a short time.

From 1955-58, only Denmark, Norway and Sweden used a 4 digit number that started with 12xx (for parts packs):

1250 - Bedford ESSO Tanker

1251 - Bedford Open Delivery ESSO Truck

1252 - Trailer ESSO

1253 - Bedford Flatbed Truck

1254 - Flatbed Trailer

1255 - Bedford Fire Ladder Truck

1256 - Bedford Tow Truck

1257 - Bedford LEGO Transport Truck

All 125x Bedford series above were sold in closed card boxes.

Tha-tha-tha-that's all, folks!

Very warm and friendly regards from your portuguese friend,

Armando Fernandes

[quiquinho]

Hello again Armando....

Yes you are correct... the 605 Fiat was NOT sold in a plastic LEGO garage. The 605 was introduced in a cardboard box in 1965. 1965 was a year in which all the older 261-268 1:87 LEGO cars were renumbered to 661-668 (no 663 however)... and the way they were sold was no longer in a plastic garage... but in a cardboard box.

Here is an example... the 267 VW 1500 Limousine (1962-65) in a garage with a banderole around it... was re-issued in a cardboard box under the 667 number (1965-67)...

So... 1965 is the year when the switch from plastic to cardboard, and using new set numbers happened.

In addition to the 261-268, the 258 (VW Van), 259 (VW Bus), 603 (Citroen DS19), 605 (Fiat 1800) and 607 (VW Samba Bus) were introduced in a cardboard box... with the 601 (Morris Marina) coming out in 1966.

BUT... and this is a big BUT.... for some odd reason... this was not the case in your home country of Portugal, Armando... the 1965 Portuguese LEGO catalog shows all the new numbers... but all the cars still in the plastic garages!! And instead of 603 Citroen and 605 Fiat in cardboard boxes... the 1965 Portuguese catalog shows these 2 with the 602/604 number... again in plastic garages...

So although that black Fiat 1800 (as a 605 number) shows an incorrect box type from this Ebay auction.... that's not to say that this wasn't originally a 604 Portuguese Fiat 1800 box. Unfortunately... when the outer banderole is missing... it would make this impossible to prove!

However, that being said... I have yet to find any of these rare Portugal (only) cars in their plastic garages and banderole.

That's where the collectors in Portugal need to help find these!!

Any of these 1965-66 Portuguese 661-668 MISB (with banderole) boxes would likely be worth over 1000 Euros each to old time LEGO collectors. And the 602 Citroen/604 Fiat... would likely be worth twice that, if not more, under those rare set numbers.

And of course... a very rare black Fiat in a 604 plastic garage with banderole sealing it... would easily be worth 5000 Euros!!

Portuguese collectors.... you are on notice!!

Many, many thanks for your most kind answer to my question!

I have just posted another note about LEGO H0 models, and somehow, I had not noticed your wonderful and so COMPLETE informations about the portuguese H0 models.

So, I must apologize if I have unnecessary placed my today's comments...

It was just wonderful to see your old portuguese LEGO catalogue!!!

Can you imagine that the superb LEGO H0 models had the same price in Portugal as the much more rude and common Matchbox models???

After all, the LEGO models were not that expensive, in the 60's...

Anyway, it has been for me a great pleasure to contribute to EUROBRICKS, a GREAT site for all LEGO fans!

Thank you, LEGO Historian!

Armando

[LEGO Historian]

From 1955-58, only Denmark, Norway and Sweden used a 4 digit number that started with 12xx (for parts packs):

1250 - Bedford ESSO Tanker

1251 - Bedford Open Delivery ESSO Truck

1252 - Trailer ESSO

1253 - Bedford Flatbed Truck

1254 - Flatbed Trailer

1255 - Bedford Fire Ladder Truck

1256 - Bedford Tow Truck

1257 - Bedford LEGO Transport Truck

And here are all the 4 digit spare parts pack sets, including the 8 Bedford Trucks...

[LEGO Historian]

My Swiss LEGO friend Pascal is another collector of the 1:87 LEGO cars and trucks. He is especially partial to the Volkswagen Beetles, Vans, Buses and Pickups.

1:87 VW Beetle, introduced in later 1957, came in at least 30 different colors. Some of the nicer LEGO 1:87 car colors are the metallic ones. There is a metallic blue color that is known in at least 1/2 dozen of the different 1:87 cars. But the nicest assortment of metallic colors is the VW Beetle, which is known in Metallic Blue, Metallic Silver, Metallic Light Gold, Metallic Gold, and Metallic Bronze.... these are going into my next update to my collectors guide...

The Karmann Ghia sedan (under the 265 number from 1962-65, and 665 number from 1965-67)... came in a large number of colors as well. Here are 10 of the colors that it is known in. Missing from this group is Metallic Blue, Metallic Green and Brown...

[pbaptist]

I have two question for the car/truck collectors

1) On the inside of the chassis of my Lego Karmann Ghia models there is a number I have seen the numbers 1,2,3 and 4 on my different models. What does this number mean?

2) I have three shades of grey. How are they called? It seems that only light grey and dark grey exist?

Regards

Patrick

For picture of my models see: www.karmann-ghia.nl/collectibles/index.php?action=view_user_image&image_id=167

Edited April 26, 2014 by pbaptist

[LEGO Historian]

Thanks for the nice images pbaptist!! The colors of the 1:87 cars do not correspond to specific official LEGO colors. In some instances they differ due to die lots, such as the 3 shades of gray that you mentioned. But your image certainly adds to the list of known colors... which I love when it increases!! Thanks for sharing!!