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Excalibur 2.0: Day Seven


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#26 Shadows

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Posted 07 August 2012 - 09:02 AM

View PostDragonator, on 07 August 2012 - 08:58 AM, said:

George yawns.

*snip*

Vote: Lieutenant Michelle Wheeler (Inconspicuous)
Inserts. :wink:

Rule of 3s and all that.

Vote: Lieutenant Michelle Wheeler (Inconspicuous)

Just as a side note, nope, I've got nothing. Carry on.

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#27 Capt.JohnPaul

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Posted 07 August 2012 - 09:29 AM


Vote: Lieutenant Michelle Wheeler (Inconspicuous)


I have nothing better to do with my life. :hmpf_bad:

#28 swils

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Posted 07 August 2012 - 10:14 AM

/votes-for-Wheeler
/gets-accused-of-bandwagoning
/cries-in-corner

#29 Fugazi

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Posted 07 August 2012 - 11:15 AM

View Postfhomess, on 06 August 2012 - 10:21 PM, said:

I went with my own read on one of the remaining players who wasn't among my list of folks I trusted.
So can you confirm that no one knew you would be targeting Lt Daly?

View PostInconspicuous, on 06 August 2012 - 10:46 PM, said:

I really hope you're not voting me out simply because the blocker was killed the night he was going to block me. What kind of reasoning is that? If you have other, legitimate reasons to vote me out, present them to me and I'll defend. There's no way I can address your vote if you don't even present a case against me.
The case against you is that, if Lt Wilder can confirm it, we haven't been able to rule out that scum have had access to insider information after Gordon was lynched. And we can't figure out why scum have chosen to kill Lt McAndrews instead of a more dangerous role such as the investigator or the vigilante. Remember that by then scum apparently knew about those PRs already. So connecting the dots we have that scum killed McAndrews because they somehow suspected that he would block you. Therefore there would have been no scum kill that night, automatically condemning you to be lynched the next day.

View PostShadows, on 07 August 2012 - 09:02 AM, said:

Rule of 3s and all that.
Huh?

View Postswils, on 07 August 2012 - 10:14 AM, said:

/votes-for-Wheeler
/gets-accused-of-bandwagoning
/cries-in-corner
Would you rather be accused of being useless?
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#30 Shadows

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Posted 07 August 2012 - 12:30 PM

View PostFugazi, on 07 August 2012 - 11:15 AM, said:

Huh?
Old mafia folklore that holds surprisingly true sometimes. It relates to the lack of randomness in a random set of sets. Kind of hard to explain and even harder to use.

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#31 Fugazi

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Posted 07 August 2012 - 12:57 PM

View PostShadows, on 07 August 2012 - 12:30 PM, said:

Old mafia folklore that holds surprisingly true sometimes. It relates to the lack of randomness in a random set of sets. Kind of hard to explain and even harder to use.
Oh... I have looked it up in the ship's computer and I must admit that I'm none the wiser! :blush: Carry on!
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#32 Bob

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Posted 07 August 2012 - 01:46 PM

Lieutenant Wheeler / Inconspicous: 4 (fhomess, Dragonator, Shadows, Capt.JohnPaul)

6 votes are needed for a lynch today.

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#33 Waterbrick Down

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Posted 07 August 2012 - 03:09 PM

Well after going through the past day records, my net is as empty as everyone elses and it looks like we're having to vote someone not necessarily due to their scuminess but because they're one of the few that aren't part of the group we're somewhat convinced are part of the town (due to investigations, blocks, PM's, role-claims). :def_shrug:

Vote: Lieutenant Wheeler (Inconspicuous)

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#34 Masked Builder

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Posted 07 August 2012 - 03:15 PM

Vote: Lieutenant Wheeler (Inconspicuous)  I'm really not sure who else to vote for at all.
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#35 Waterbrick Down

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Posted 07 August 2012 - 03:58 PM

This is as bad as a day 1. I'm fine with voting Wheeler in the end if we can't find anything else, but seriously there has to be something out there and I don't think trying to bring this day to a quick end just so we can get back to the night phase and depend upon our night action is utilizing our time wisely. Each of us true townies has a responsibility to take everything that has been said into account and not just go with the flow, letting PR's take the helm though I am grateful that they have done so in order to lead us to victories over the scum thus far.

Thus I am going to unvote: Lieutenant Wheeler (Inconspicuous), until I have made sure there is nothing else we are missing.

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#36 Fugazi

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Posted 07 August 2012 - 03:59 PM

View PostWaterbrick Down, on 07 August 2012 - 03:55 PM, said:

I'm fine with voting Wheeler in the end if we can't find anything else, but seriously there has to be something out there and I don't think trying to bring this day to a quick end just so we can get back to the night phase and depend upon our night action is utilizing our time wisely.
Very true, but every day is the same length regardless of our voting. I wish Lt Wheeler came back and fought a bit harder for his life. :sceptic:
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#37 Waterbrick Down

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Posted 07 August 2012 - 04:03 PM

View PostFugazi, on 07 August 2012 - 03:59 PM, said:

Very true, but every day is the same length regardless of our voting. I wish Lt Wheeler came back and fought a bit harder for his life. :sceptic:
Yes, but if we all bandwagon early that kills discussion and no-one is willing to bring forth new ideas because they think the lynch canadite has been selected and they don't want to stick their neck out on the line for fear of being silenced by the scum. Realistically if Wheeler was scum I would have expected more of a fight instead of a bandwagon. We are getting down to the final days upon this ship and the scum know how close the numbers are and what it would mean to lose one of their own due to a lynch and potentially a vig kill tonight.

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#38 Fugazi

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Posted 07 August 2012 - 04:21 PM

View PostWaterbrick Down, on 07 August 2012 - 04:03 PM, said:

Realistically if Wheeler was scum I would have expected more of a fight instead of a bandwagon. We are getting down to the final days upon this ship and the scum know how close the numbers are and what it would mean to lose one of their own due to a lynch and potentially a vig kill tonight.
You unvoting him achieves exactly that, not reaching the required majority. One could argue that it could be a form of defence under disguise. Or you could be truly concerned about the risk of taking out another townie. In any case, Lt Wheeler is the one who should defend himself and giving up is no more a townie attitude than a scum one.
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#39 Waterbrick Down

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Posted 07 August 2012 - 04:30 PM

View PostFugazi, on 07 August 2012 - 04:21 PM, said:

You unvoting him achieves exactly that, not reaching the required majority. One could argue that it could be a form of defence under disguise. Or you could be truly concerned about the risk of taking out another townie. In any case, Lt Wheeler is the one who should defend himself and giving up is no more a townie attitude than a scum one.
Giving up becomes more of a townie tell however as time goes on and the scum are whittled down. They know how many of them are left and how important it is that they keep their numbers up for the final few days, I don't think one would just give up and die like that. Like you said the day has a set length and I'd rather promote discussion than stifle it with a bandwagon, Wheeler can defend himself when shows up and then I'll decide whether he's worth pursuing or not, until then I'm focusing my effort on making sure we've covered all our bases. If you'd like to help that would be great. :classic:

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#40 AwesomeStar

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Posted 07 August 2012 - 05:23 PM

Well, you aren't prepared to get on with this then I shall step up the plate. We need to get somewhere, even if it is just anywhere.

Vote: Lt Wheeler (Inconspicuous)

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#41 Fugazi

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Posted 07 August 2012 - 06:06 PM

View PostWaterbrick Down, on 07 August 2012 - 04:30 PM, said:

If you'd like to help that would be great. :classic:
That's precisely what I'm doing. Do you think I'm poking at you just for kicks? :classic:

Besides, Lt Wheeler's voting record is dodgy at best. She has managed to avoid voting when it mattered most -- Days 3 and 6, when there wasn't a clear bandwagon and her opinion would have been welcome. I don't know, I don't feel much sympathy for Lt Wheeler. :sceptic:

Vote: Lt Wheeler (Inconspicuous)
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#42 Inconspicuous

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Posted 07 August 2012 - 06:32 PM

View PostFugazi, on 07 August 2012 - 03:59 PM, said:

I wish Lt Wheeler came back and fought a bit harder for his life. :sceptic:

View PostWaterbrick Down, on 07 August 2012 - 04:03 PM, said:

Realistically if Wheeler was scum I would have expected more of a fight instead of a bandwagon.

View PostFugazi, on 07 August 2012 - 04:21 PM, said:

In any case, Lt Wheeler is the one who should defend himself and giving up is no more a townie attitude than a scum one.

Jeez, so I stay up late at night, waiting for a case against me, and I wake up in the morning practically lynched? There's plenty of time left in the day, you could have at least waited a bit.

View PostFugazi, on 07 August 2012 - 11:15 AM, said:

Remember that by then scum apparently knew about those PRs already. So connecting the dots we have that scum killed McAndrews because they somehow suspected that he would block you. Therefore there would have been no scum kill that night, automatically condemning you to be lynched the next day.

There's the hole in your argument. You assume that the scum knew McAndrews was blocking me. What's more likely here? That the scum somehow guessed his intended action or that I'm not the killer?

What really bothers me about the bandwagon is that barely anyone gave a legitimate reason for the vote. The reason the vote against me was even started was the flimsy point about a block that I just countered.

View PostFugazi, on 07 August 2012 - 06:06 PM, said:

Besides, Lt Wheeler's voting record is dodgy at best. She has managed to avoid voting when it mattered most -- Days 3 and 6, when there wasn't a clear bandwagon and her opinion would have been welcome. I don't know, I don't feel much sympathy for Lt Wheeler. :sceptic:

Thank you for being the first person to actually present a reasonable case. Yes, I admit that my voting pattern hasn't been particularly strong. On Day 3, I didn't like the fact that the case against Burbank was opened as a result of a crazy simulation-based theory that could have been turned against me just as easily. Obviously, votes were cast against him for his subsequent arguing, but something didn't seem right at first, so I didn't jump on the bandwagon later. On Day 6, none of the candidates seemed particularly scummy. My brief case against Hornby earlier today was rightfully shot down because it was weak to begin with, and was really just a crazy theory.

Maybe you guys should stop blindly following the vigilante, who seems to have done more harm than help the last few days.

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#43 fhomess

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Posted 07 August 2012 - 10:58 PM

View PostFugazi, on 07 August 2012 - 11:15 AM, said:

So can you confirm that no one knew you would be targeting Lt Daly?
Anyone who knew it would essentially be cleared at this point, as had they been scum, they would've shared it with their scummy teammates and chosen a different night kill target.

Unvote: Lt Wheeler (Inconspicuous)

I must say, that Lieutenant Wheeler points out that I've not led us anywhere good, and yet several people are bandwagoning on my very weak suggestion.  I'm flabbergasted at the number of people who've proposed names other than Wheeler's to me in private, yet refuse to propose those same names in public.  Are you all just trying to get me to vig kill those players instead of putting your own neck on the line with a lynch candidate?

That said, Vanderbilt's vote pattern is decidedly fishy today.  Why did you vote only once the vote made it beyond 6, yet you were involved in the conversation well before then without voting.  Not much appears to have changed between your non-voting contributions and your vote.  Certainly no comment from Wheeler.

#44 Inconspicuous

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Posted 08 August 2012 - 03:03 AM

View Postfhomess, on 07 August 2012 - 10:58 PM, said:

That said, Vanderbilt's vote pattern is decidedly fishy today.  Why did you vote only once the vote made it beyond 6, yet you were involved in the conversation well before then without voting.  Not much appears to have changed between your non-voting contributions and your vote.  Certainly no comment from Wheeler.

I was so busy writing my response to all the votes that I didn't even notice that discrepancy! Vanderbilt, what do you have to say for yourself? You acted like you were waiting for me to defend myself, then suddenly change your mind once six votes are gathered. Seems awfully suspicious to me.  :thumbdown:

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#45 Bob

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Posted 08 August 2012 - 03:11 AM

A phaser blast rang out in the main recroom. Lieutenant Suzanne Vanderbilt / Fugazi's body was charred in the corner after being sent back a few feet.

She was a member of the League of Purists.

Lieutenant Wheeler / Inconspicous: 4 (Dragonator, Shadows, Capt.JohnPaul, Masked Builder, AwesomeStar)

6 votes are needed for a lynch today.

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#46 Inconspicuous

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Posted 08 August 2012 - 04:01 AM

View PostBob, on 08 August 2012 - 03:11 AM, said:

A phaser blast rang out in the main recroom. Lieutenant Suzanne Vanderbilt / Fugazi's body was charred in the corner after being sent back a few feet.

She was a member of the League of Purists.

*huh*  Errr.... Woo hoo! :grin:

Does anyone know what just happened? Last time I checked, my accusations couldn't kill people.  :laugh:

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#47 Shadows

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Posted 08 August 2012 - 04:07 AM

View PostBob, on 08 August 2012 - 03:11 AM, said:

A phaser blast rang out in the main recroom. Lieutenant Suzanne Vanderbilt / Fugazi's body was charred in the corner after being sent back a few feet.

She was a member of the League of Purists.
About god damned time. :sweet:

Hey Walters, just how many days have I been trying to get you to do that? Now... who the hell did it? :laugh:

I'll give you one thing, Wheeler, you put up a hell of a defense, I hope this doesn't end up being the ultimate meat-shield. :laugh:

Unvote: Lt Wheeler (Inconspicuous)

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#48 Shadows

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Posted 08 August 2012 - 05:02 AM

View PostShadows, on 08 August 2012 - 04:07 AM, said:

Hey Walters, just how many days have I been trying to get you to do that? Now... who the hell did it? :laugh:
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#49 swils

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Posted 08 August 2012 - 05:32 AM

...Very interesting kill.  That's our first Purist killed without a lynch, isn't it?  Way to go, you're doing better than our vig!  :tongue:

View PostFugazi, on 07 August 2012 - 11:15 AM, said:

Would you rather be accused of being useless?
Not that I really need to reply to this anymore but yes, I think I would.  I'd rather sit out another vote than jump on yet another of Wilder's stupid wagons.

Speaking of rickety, set-up wagons, Wilder, perhaps you could go one day without trying to bait people with that?  Try throwing out a name with some actual support behind it, rather than a weak argument just to see who hops on (hint: it doesnt' seem to have worked yet).  You said it yourself, you want to see people bring up their suspicions in public rather than coming to you in private, so why the hypocrisy?  It seems obvious to me that you are using someone you mildly suspect (if at all, I sometimes wonder) in the hopes that you can bait someone who you suspect more heavily to jump on the bandwagon.  Why not just voice your concern over the heavier suspicion in the first place?  If you're right, isn't there a good chance that others will have seen similar signs?  You'll (hopefully) get solid reasons for votes because other people also strongly suspect whomever.  Throwing a bait-and-switch target out there early has only really proven to stifle conversation as folks vote for that person, but only have your own reasons to go off of.  I can't really blame you for the silence today, but it certainly isn't helping anything.

View PostWaterbrick Down, on 07 August 2012 - 04:03 PM, said:

Yes, but if we all bandwagon early that kills discussion and no-one is willing to bring forth new ideas because they think the lynch canadite has been selected

Of course, the alternative would be for the rest of you (well, not all of you) to stop falling for it and giving Wilder an excuse to set you up as a target due to obvious bandwagoning.  Or at least give a half-decent reason for your vote.. *cough*

View PostShadows, on 07 August 2012 - 09:02 AM, said:

Just as a side note, nope, I've got nothing. Carry on.

View PostCapt.JohnPaul, on 07 August 2012 - 09:29 AM, said:

I have nothing better to do with my life. :hmpf_bad:

View PostMasked Builder, on 07 August 2012 - 03:15 PM, said:

Vote: Lieutenant Wheeler (Inconspicuous)  I'm really not sure who else to vote for at all.

View PostAwesomeStar, on 07 August 2012 - 05:23 PM, said:

Well, you aren't prepared to get on with this then I shall step up the plate. We need to get somewhere, even if it is just anywhere.



View Postfhomess, on 07 August 2012 - 10:58 PM, said:

I'm flabbergasted at the number of people who've proposed names other than Wheeler's to me in private, yet refuse to propose those same names in public.  Are you all just trying to get me to vig kill those players instead of putting your own neck on the line with a lynch candidate?

:hmpf:  Or maybe they just came to you because yes, you are the vig and they wanted you to consider a kill-target without raising awareness in public.  Assuming that any one of these names brought to you was correctly suspected as a purist, unless we got the lynch (which, okay, there's a pretty good chance that'd happen), then we'd have only managed to alert the purists to the fact that we were onto one of them who likely wasn't in danger previously.  Additionally, you're (supposed to be) one of the trusted/trustable loyalists, is it so unreasonable for them to want to bounce a suspicion off of you before going public with it?


View Postfhomess, on 07 August 2012 - 10:58 PM, said:

That said, Vanderbilt's vote pattern is decidedly fishy today.  Why did you vote only once the vote made it beyond 6, yet you were involved in the conversation well before then without voting.  Not much appears to have changed between your non-voting contributions and your vote.  Certainly no comment from Wheeler.

It's something of a moot point now but as I saw it before she got blasted, Vanderbilt was engaged in a back-and-forth with Holloway which drove Vanderbilt to elaborate on her suspicions and vote.  If she hadn't turned out to be a Purist, I'd have believed that it was the exchange with Holloway that prompted her vote before hearing a defense from Wheeler.

If you want to talk about fishy voting patterns, then how did Holloway's go unnoticed?  Less than an hour passed before he decided that he did not, in fact, want to participate in the bandwagon that he had just recently contributed to.  There was no defense from Wheeler in that period of time either (in fact, even less happened between his vote and unvote than between Vanderbilt's first suspicions and her vote), but he's allowed to have a change of heart without obvious cause, while you called out Vanderbilt for the same?


View PostShadows, on 08 August 2012 - 04:07 AM, said:

I'll give you one thing, Wheeler, you put up a hell of a defense, I hope this doesn't end up being the ultimate meat-shield. :laugh:

The initial argument against Wheeler was a weak one at best, as was admitted by Wilder himself.  I'll grant that he did give a pretty reasonable response to the points raised by Vanderbilt, but even those (stretch-theory and the voting pattern) weren't particularly strong supports for accusation either.  But a hell of a defense?  I dare say, you doth bestow upon him too much credit! :laugh:

#50 Shadows

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Posted 08 August 2012 - 05:51 AM

View Postswils, on 08 August 2012 - 05:32 AM, said:

The initial argument against Wheeler was a weak one at best, as was admitted by Wilder himself.  I'll grant that he did give a pretty reasonable response to the points raised by Vanderbilt, but even those (stretch-theory and the voting pattern) weren't particularly strong supports for accusation either.  But a hell of a defense?  I dare say, you doth bestow upon him too much credit! :laugh:
Yeah, it was more a confirmation that at least for now, my suspicion of Wheeler is reduced and a bit of playful joking at Vanderbilt's death. I've certainly waited long enough to see it happen.

Since you brought up the whole thing, I can confirm that I've been one of those voices going to the vig privately in an attempt to get someone killed, I think it's fairly obvious that it was Vanderbilt, who was on my list of suspects since day 2, along with what's-his-name-who-called-me-rude (has anyone noticed that I'm bad with names?). Now I don't have to ask again, since the job has been done. :wink:

It's a shame it took this long to deal with the most obvious members of the scum, now is where things are going to get interesting.

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