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1x2 Brick Built Cylinders


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#1 LEGO Guy Bri

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Posted 12 April 2012 - 05:39 AM

Greetings,

My question is in regards to building a large cylinder out of 1x2 bricks. A quick brief: I want to build a large fuel storage tank strictly out of 1x2 bricks. I am wanting to know if anyone has experiences with this, what the flex is of the bricks, what circumferential stress they can handle, and what the minimum footprint it will use. I know about adding 1x1 round bricks for a smaller footprint, but I don't want that look. Currently I am amassing the bricks needed, so I am not very far.

I have pictures of how far I am below. At 25 bricks wide and light bending tension, it is looking to take up a lot of space. However, I have seen a storage tank built purely out of 1x2's, that's circumference fit within a 32x32 baseplate. Before I try to bend these that tight I'd like to know a bit more and if there are any damaging effects or modifications.

Thanks for any help   Posted Image

Posted Image

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#2 Lego Otaku

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Posted 12 April 2012 - 06:55 AM

Good luck :/  Regular bricks aren't meant to be bent at all and you'll have a hard time fitting an all 1x2's into a single baseplate.

Have you tried hinged bricks? http://www.bricklink...m.asp?P=3830c01 would probably look less ugly than click hinge but they don't lock into any position and you may have some difficulty in making a perfect round building.

You can always suck it up and use 1x1 round with either 1x2 or 1x3 and make round building.

#3 Christoph

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Posted 12 April 2012 - 08:04 AM

While I do not know how large the smallest possible cylinder made out of 1x2 bricks would be, I am sure it will not fit onto a 32x32 base plate. You probably saw another technique? For a similar look but smaller diameters I recommend John Boozers technique for round towers. I try this out right now and it looks very nice... :pir-wub:
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#4 pinioncorp

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Posted 12 April 2012 - 08:06 AM

The curvature of purely 1×2s is pretty bad. You might be better off using either these or these. Using the 2 stud length side you can get a fairly smooth curve going and they get closer together.

Posted Image


#5 LEGO Guy Bri

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Posted 12 April 2012 - 10:04 AM

View PostLego, on 12 April 2012 - 06:55 AM, said:

Have you tried hinged bricks?


View PostChristoph, on 12 April 2012 - 08:04 AM, said:

While I do not know how large the smallest possible cylinder made out of 1x2 bricks would be, I am sure it will not fit onto a 32x32 base plate. You probably saw another technique? For a similar look but smaller diameters I recommend John Boozers technique for round towers. I try this out right now and it looks very nice...

View Postpinioncorp, on 12 April 2012 - 08:06 AM, said:

The curvature of purely 1×2s is pretty bad. You might be better off using either these or these. Using the 2 stud length side you can get a fairly smooth curve going and they get closer together.


Thanks for the ideas & suggestions Lego Otaku, Christoph, and pinioncorp. I am though, trying to keep this as cheap as possible due to it's planned size. I looked into hinge bricks, but alas, they do not come in green and I need green. 1x1 round tile may be the easiest option. JB's looks a little complex and to require many pieces.

I have, however, found a reference picture to what I want to build. As you can see HERE, someone, somehow, managed it with staggered 1x2's. I hope this can add a little to my dilemma. I reckon, trial and error is another way to go   Posted Image
-I don't tell you how to tell me what to do, so don't you tell me how to do what you told me to do... I know when to use finesse

#6 Lego Otaku

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Posted 12 April 2012 - 10:37 AM

View PostLego Guy Bri, on 12 April 2012 - 10:04 AM, said:


I have, however, found a reference picture to what I want to build. As you can see HERE, someone, somehow, managed it with staggered 1x2's. I hope this can add a little to my dilemma. I reckon, trial and error is another way to go   Posted Image

2x2 tiles on 1/2 pins fastened to thick lift arm, which is then connected with 3/4 pins to tread link with 2 holes

I can only remember it being more difficult and unfortunately it'll get expensive compared to using 1x2 brick and 1x1 round brick.

#7 SNIPE

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Posted 12 April 2012 - 05:45 PM

Lego make ramps from the sports theme, for the minifig skateboard, I think you could put a double ended brick where there is a clutch for studs to go into on both sides which means you can put the ramps top to top to make a semicircle, so this again but complete the other half of the circle

if they is no double sided clutch use a technic lift-arm (not the thin type, the 1L type which is about as thick as a lego 3005 brick and put the studs in the holes, it locks tight so it will be strong.

on the roof of the MOC (not mine by the way) you can see two white ramps, it is those.

Posted Image

Edited by SNIPE, 12 April 2012 - 05:48 PM.


#8 davee123

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Posted 12 April 2012 - 09:59 PM

Technically? They can get pretty tight. The tightest curve I ever saw built with 1x2 bricks is roughly a 12-15 studs radius.

BUT!

1) That was done by a LEGO Master Builder. And as we all know, LEGO Master Builders have no regard for being "nice" to their bricks. I'm pretty sure if you try and do that, you'll warp your bricks. But Master Builders don't have to worry about that, because their bricks just stay built in a static display.

2) The build in question was REALLY difficult to do, even for him. He built it two or three times before deciding that he would have to use *GLUE* in order to prevent it from literally EXPLODING from the strain. And even then, small bits of it would explode now and again, making it take a long time to assemble (in addition to gluing, which takes a long time already!)

As for where? The LEGO Millyard, in Manchester, NH, USA-- built around... late 2004 or early 2005 I think? I forget which "phase" build that was done in.  I think I drummed up a picture of it once for this very topic some time ago, but I don't know which picture I found. It's probably out there somewhere.

<Edit>Ahh yes, here's the thread. And here's the image!

Doing some extra checking, I'd guess it's a 14-stud radius. That building's "Building #3 (SEE)" in this image, which measured the footprint of each building. I'm pretty sure that the radius on that corner starts 10 studs in from the jut-out of the main building, which would make it 14 studs. And calculating pixels in the image, I get about 13.79 studs, which is a pretty good match.

Also, in re-reading the old thread, I recall why there are those "stripes" of old brown mixed with new brown bricks-- The plates would hold together without exploding better than the bricks, so after a few rows of bricks, he'd put on a row that was 3 stacked plates to keep integrity while the glue dried.</Edit>

DaveE

Edited by davee123, 12 April 2012 - 10:30 PM.


#9 Xyver

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Posted 12 April 2012 - 10:40 PM

I've played with bending the 1x2s a bit lately and a circle can quite easily be done with 80 bricks per row. I don't know if this causes any damage to the bricks as I haven't had a look at them, but I don't think so as the stress isn't too much. It also works with the 1x2 plates so you can add a thin line around it too. It does look quite nice, but scale wise it would be too big for a display.

With a little patience, you would be able to get the number of bricks per row down a bit, but I doubt you'd get it to fit onto a 32x32 baseplate without damage and the risk of it exploding.

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#10 Legoman

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Posted 12 April 2012 - 10:58 PM

I've done a bit of work with this and I believe you can probably get it into 25x25cm (32x32Studs). The main thing you have to decide is how much this model is worth to you. When getting that tight, the bricks do warp and the only thing they'll be useful for afterward is filler bricks (Which isn't all bad, but it depends on weather this MOC will be long term for you). 1x2 bricks are pretty cheap in the primary colors, so hopefully money shouldn't be too much of an issue (I assume, Given that you're building such a large MOC). If you need some bricks for this, let me know, I've got ~12,000 primary colour bricks (Red White Blue and Yellow) that I'm not using.

As for strength, it depends on both how tight the circumference of the circle is, and how many layers of bricks you're having. Also make sure you keep it out of UV light, as that will weaken the bricks.

Hope this helped!

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#11 LEGO Guy Bri

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Posted 13 April 2012 - 12:39 AM

My brick order has arrived much sooner than anticipated. I immediately started further assembly on the structure. It is currently at 130 studs long and 8 high and completes a full circle.
Thank you for your contributions, Lego Otaku, SNIPE, davee123, Xyver, and Legoman.


@Lego Otaku, I did some pricing on 1x1 round bricks and hit a wall when it came to green. Of the estimated 150+ needed, pricing starts at $0.05/pc from single sellers with over 100, in US. If I do go that route, it won't be until May, that I can start orders   Posted Image

@SNIPE, Those slope pieces would be great if the smooth ramp was convex rather than concave. I'm not familiar with them to determine how I would attach the green and red stripe. However, I do like the degree of their curvature   Posted Image

@davee123 and Xyver, Thank you for the useful info and pics regarding full 1x2 circles. 12-15 circumference is very tight for these bricks. There is no doubt in my mind I would not be able to do that at all, let alone without glue. My first pic above was at 50 studs and barely 1/4 turn. That said I am not sure I will be ruling glue out anyways, as this will be a permanent structure. I had just finished my cylinder base before checking this. Looking at the multicolor example, it looks identical. Even at 130L , it is under moderate stress. If it doesn't have an even stud height all the way around, it buckles due to uneven tension  Posted Image

@Legoman, Thank you for sharing your experience on the matter. This model will just be what it is, a permanent structure. I am not too worried about stress and warping and don't plan to reuse these pieces. At most I would consider the whites, but as most are a little discolored, I see no further use. AS for the money, you are absolutely correct, they are cheap.  I think I've spent just over $50 and have only received 1/3 of amount ordered. I'll keep you in mind regarding the white ones. As this project is an OCTAN related build, I can't use yellow or blue.

I am trying to keep the stress, at most, moderate. At 130L I'm on the limit. I don't think I can get much shorter, especially with a projected height of 24. I my even have to make it a bit longer to make it easier to connect once I have it built up. And no worries on light. None of my Lego has seen light in 15 years... I'm very adamant about that   Posted ImagePosted Image

Here are pictures of the structure in it's current standing. As you can see it is quite a large scale:
Length 130 Studs
Posted Image


Projected Height 24 Studs
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Full Circle @ 130L
Posted Image



Many thanks to all the help and ideas presented so far  Posted Image
-I don't tell you how to tell me what to do, so don't you tell me how to do what you told me to do... I know when to use finesse



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