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Did Bionicle 2008 Fail?


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#1 matanui911

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Posted 14 December 2008 - 09:34 PM

Did you like the story, and Characters of Bionicle 2008?  Did 2008 add to , or destroy Bionicle?  Were the characters designed good?  Was it a good idea to bring back the Toa Nuva?  Was the end result of Bionicle 2008 of your liking?

This is the topic where you can express your positive or negative veiws on Bionicle 2008.  Personally, I loved it, but I have heard a lot of people who dont.

Edited by matanui911, 14 December 2008 - 09:43 PM.


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#2 Faramir

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Posted 14 December 2008 - 10:15 PM

I kind of feel like it did. We'd been waiting how long for the Nuva to come back and save everything? And they came back, and DIDN'T?? We spent 5 years waiting for them to FAIL?  :pir_bawling:

It should have just ended this year.
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#3 The Dor

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Posted 15 December 2008 - 12:40 AM

Story wise, this year was really good, especially the end (obviously), and set wise, they weren't bad in my opinion, but they certainly weren't great. I loved a few of them (Kopaka, Pohatu, Onua), and there were a few I didn't love (Tahu).

Overall, it was no where near failing. It was not the best year, but it was better than many.

#4 Gunnar

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Posted 15 December 2008 - 01:00 AM

It varies, but overall I'd say it was a pretty good year.

Some sets were awesome (All vehicle sets, a good deal of Makuta, some Nuva), but other sets were tragically bad (Oh, Gali). The story was universally pretty good, though a bit less sci-fi in Dark Mirror would've been appreciated, and I think Greg handled the return of the Nuva pretty well. There were lots of fascinating parts that brought a legendary feel back to BIONICLE (Which was conspicuously absent through most of 2007), such as the Codrex, Tren Krom, and the infinitely-awesome Journey of Takanuva.

Not to mention the ending, which was incredible- What with Mata Nui awakening and Makuta appearing in the stars (That was certainly a part of the legendary feel) and Makuta destroying all the other BoM members. Plus the Ignika went from being a threatening, frightening presence to being a fairly likable character. And a lot of the Makuta characters were pretty cool, though I was glad to see them die and forfeit their title to the original.

Unfortunately most of the canister sets reused old designs without even 2009's excuse of creative use of pieces. This was a very big disappointment, and the simplistic small sets made it even worse... Still, though, many of the sets were decent in their own right (Onua and Lewa were pretty cool, for example), and the Phantkuta were all good, what with the new torsos and all. And the vehicles are awesome, but overall I'd say the sets haven't been 2008's strong suit.

Storywise, though, a definite improvement over the monotony of 2007, most of 2006 (The first half of that year was good, but then it faltered), and the sheer nonsense of 2005.

#5 Kakihara Smile

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Posted 15 December 2008 - 01:03 AM

Yeah, I think this year did fail. I also couldn't stand the story. The only part even worth paying attention too has been the online serial with mazeka. The nuva were useless in the story (they couldn't fight very well and ended up failing) and in the end, the makuta were both stupid and pathetic (they were outsmarted by teridax, a weak villain who has been beaten almost a dozen times already). Seriously, a villain like teridax does not do bionicle justice, not anymore anyway. He just ended up be as lame a disappointment as he was in 04. I dunno, I still like the sets but the story has lost the magic from 06. I hope next year is better.
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#6 Zarkan

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Posted 15 December 2008 - 02:42 AM

Well, some of you probably know right now that I've been one of the more positive members concerning the state of Bionicle as a whole, and also with all the different years. 2005 is the only year I've generally disliked, and I have found merit in every single year.

That said, I must say that 2008 has been one of Bionicle's best years since 2001, and definitely the best since 2004. The biggest reason for this is the story, which I usually enjoy, and found especially excellent this year. The "final battle" may have not been so final, but it was spectacular, shocking, and had several awesome points. First, it showed the maturity of the Nuva as a whole, which I hoped would be the case now that they haved worked with each other for a while, and especially showed new sides of Takanuva which we needed to see after such a long break from his character. Second, it reintroduced the mysticism and mythology elements of earlier years to some degree, which had been largely missing from 2006 and 2007. Things like the Codrex, the keystones, the "Shattering," Tren Krom, and especially the Nuva flashbacks really helped to liven the year up. Thirdly, the year helped establish many interesting villain personalities in the form of the new Makuta, but in the end put the original Makuta back on top where he should be. Teridax, AKA The Makuta is now the universe, and he has become my favorite villian ever.

Another great thing about 2008 was the serials. 2007 introduced the concept, but 2008 fleshed it out and improved it substantially. Instead of a fairly uneventful Nuva Blog and two long and drawn out battles, we got far more interesting stories about the Brotherhood's past, Takanuva's journey into several bizzare dimensions, the establishing and deepening of two of the best Matoran characters in years, and other great tales. They are just as interesting as the main storyline, if not more, and played far greater a part in 2008 then in 2007.

Finally, the sets. Yes, they were certainly not perfect, but they did have some bright spots. Wile the Nuva were not all great, the Toa Phantoka and Takanuva were excellent, and looked so much like the characters they were meant to be. The Makuta were also superb, and all boaster new forms or torsos. The titans were the biggest surprise, however. For some time, rumors were floating around that we would be getting giant handheld guns made of technic pieces - and in a sense, we did. But fortunately, they came in the form of vehicles with bionicle pilots, and turned out to be some of the best builds and models in years. Sure, there were a few blemishes, most notably the Toa Mistika, Vultraz, and the simpleness of the Av-Matoran, but the sets to me were great overall.

So, in conclusion, I was a huge fan of Bionicle 2008, and I can't wait to see what the new year will bring.  :pir-classic:

Quote

Yeah, I think this year did fail. I also couldn't stand the story. The only part even worth paying attention too has been the online serial with mazeka. The nuva were useless in the story (they couldn't fight very well and ended up failing) and in the end, the makuta were both stupid and pathetic (they were outsmarted by teridax, a weak villain who has been beaten almost a dozen times already). Seriously, a villain like teridax does not do bionicle justice, not anymore anyway. He just ended up be as lame a disappointment as he was in 04. I dunno, I still like the sets but the story has lost the magic from 06. I hope next year is better.

Seriously, did you just call Teridax weak? The only times he's been defeated in the storyline were in 2003 against Takanuva and 2004 against Vakama. And those were both due to the movie portrayals, which are not true to the character and were not written by Greg. The books and serials have always protrayed The Makuta as an extremely powerful and inteligent villian, fully achieving his potential. Also, the Nuva put up an excellent fight this year, considering that they were up against beings far more powerful than themselves. Yes, they lost, but it wasn't for nothing - Mata Nui is awake, and we can be sure that he will return.

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#7 Ikki o' Moopyville

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Posted 15 December 2008 - 03:17 AM

Sets

Pros:
-- orange and yellow
-- Tridax pods
-- Krika and Takanuva
-- spiky visors
-- superlarge sets
-- Toa Phantoka resembling ol' Nuva
-- Makuta looking like true Makuta
-- innovative Mistikuta designs
-- Swamp Strider
-- Ignika in plastic
-- plenty new masks

Cons:
-- grey and silver
-- clones and rehashed designs all over
-- floppy necks and limbs
-- low-quality plastic
-- boring vehicle designs
-- new joint types
-- Toa Mistika looking zilch like ol' Nuva
-- Takanuva's size


Story

Pros:
-- return of the Nuva
-- great Makuta characters
-- tons of revelations and hints
-- DID and BIA rock
-- OOMN-BOM war
-- fantastic conclusion
-- return of the Makuta for good
-- Mata Nui awakened, risen, and revealed
-- no more Matoran universe!

Cons:
-- fairly dull progress until the end of the year
-- Dark Mirror
-- lack of spiffyness and power in fights
-- horribly dull setting
-- poor Matoran characters
-- lack of Rahi
-- lack of exploration
-- too sci-fiey until the end
-- stark good/evil contrast
-- too predictable, never feeling anxious for the characters
-- rather dull Awakening and interior of the Codrex


All in all? A fairly good year, with by far the biggest problem being the dullness and unability to feel empathy for any of the characters. Gorast and Krika were, all things considered, the only ones that invoked any kind of feeling when reading about their actions. Without a doubt the biggest pro of 2008 is that it wraps up the first Bionicle saga in such a fitting way and sends us off to a year that looks awesome!

-Ikk

Edited by Ikki o' Moopyville, 15 December 2008 - 03:19 AM.

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#8 hewkii9

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Posted 15 December 2008 - 03:30 AM

View PostKakihara Smile, on Dec 14 2008, 08:03 PM, said:

they were outsmarted by teridax, a weak villain who has been beaten almost a dozen times already). Seriously, a villain like teridax does not do bionicle justice, not anymore anyway. He just ended up be as lame a disappointment as he was in 04
Name these near-dozen times, will you? the Makuta's a villainous badass on par with Darth Vader [except we didn't see him as a wussy kid and a teen chock-full-of-angst-grr].

I really liked 2008, there were some weak bits [Ignika solving the story again] but it really won out in the end. Very bold of Greg to end it the way he did.

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#9 Kakihara Smile

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Posted 15 December 2008 - 04:03 AM

The fact teridax was defeated AT ALL makes him weak... He was the ultimate master of shadow and then he just fell so very short of actually living up to that. And I don't care what greg wrote and what greg didn't. The movies were made, they exist, and they can be considered in all their badness. Also, look at any fight with the makuta... They never actually have the upper hand they claim too. Not only have the makuta not been able to win but a few battles, they've only won against non main characters (like botar). They, like teridax, have failed to fill the shoes left out for them.

08 failed to me. It failed hard and it failed long. I'm actually annoyed the site hasn't reset yet so we can get it over with. Still, I wonder if I had loved 08, if anybody would have responded to my post...
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#10 Gunnar

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Posted 15 December 2008 - 04:18 AM

Quote

-- rather dull Awakening and interior of the Codrex
CODREX INTERIOR WAS NOT DULL

#11 Bfahome

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Posted 15 December 2008 - 06:03 AM

View PostKakihara Smile, on Dec 14 2008, 11:03 PM, said:

The fact teridax was defeated AT ALL makes him weak... He was the ultimate master of shadow and then he just fell so very short of actually living up to that. And I don't care what greg wrote and what greg didn't. The movies were made, they exist, and they can be considered in all their badness. Also, look at any fight with the makuta... They never actually have the upper hand they claim too. Not only have the makuta not been able to win but a few battles, they've only won against non main characters (like botar). They, like teridax, have failed to fill the shoes left out for them.

08 failed to me. It failed hard and it failed long. I'm actually annoyed the site hasn't reset yet so we can get it over with. Still, I wonder if I had loved 08, if anybody would have responded to my post...
You don't dub a character "weak" because he was defeated "AT ALL".  And especially since after that he took over the universe.  Weak characters don't usually do that.

#12 Ikki o' Moopyville

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Posted 15 December 2008 - 07:59 AM

View PostGunnar, on Dec 15 2008, 05:18 AM, said:

CODREX INTERIOR WAS NOT DULL
Okay, I admit I forgot about this awesome specter. :tongue: But even so, we got hints of super-advanced machinery in BL10, and all it does is activating an elevator. I'd also hoped to see that closed-off half of the Codrex mentioned in the Mata flashbacks... unless that was the bottom section, in which case there's some severe lack of consistency between books. xD

-Ikk
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#13 JINZONINGEN73

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Posted 15 December 2008 - 01:05 PM

Story? Meh. Maybe it was good, maybe it wasn't. You see enough scifi junk a few decades and it all starts looking the same.

Now the sets? Pretty much beautiful parts piles.

And that doesn't mean squat unfortunately when the quality control drops down to points you'd see out of the plastic from Chinese knock-off toys that you'd pick up at a flea market.

I'm hoping. I really, really am hoping, that the bad plastic we had the past 2 years (or more) was just cost-cutting in anticipation of jacking quality up for the impossible-to-fail 2009 sets.
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#14 Refia

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Posted 15 December 2008 - 09:48 PM

The sets were okay, the Phantuka were good, Toa Ignika FANTASTIC, Krika was great and Takanuva was a great Titan as well. Icarax was just good and all other sets I was "meh".

The story was pretty okay. I didn't feel that much for the Nuva, though I liked them better as character than the Inika/Mahri. The Makuta were nice characters, but the absolute SAVING GRACE and BEST CHARACTER EVER this year AND BEYOND has to be Toa Ignika. Bionicle has yet to create a better character than our cute Toa of Life (though I have high hopes for Mata Nui) and it's sad his story had to end the way it did.

Most serials were okay as were the characters in it. Miserix takes the cake in that area. However, I felt there were too much unnecesary, random deaths (Carapar, Ancient). The mystery introduced in the serials is nice (The Shattering, Spherus Magna) but it gets a bit much lately, IMO.

The Makuta taking over was a nice twist, but it didn't come as a surprise to me, somehow. I had expected it, to be honest.

All in all, 2008 was an okay year, with Toa Ignika being the absolute highlight of this year and Bionicle so far (and probably forever). But 2009 looks better and far more interesting setting-wise. Sorry, but Karda Nui was dull. Insanely so. It's a big cave. With a swamp in it. Bara Magna looks so much better. Hopefully it'll stay that good in summer and hopefully LEGO won't mess up Toa Mata Nui.

Edited by Refia, 15 December 2008 - 09:48 PM.

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#15 Visorak-kal

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Posted 15 December 2008 - 09:57 PM

EDIT:  Refia, I laughed out loud when I saw your thoughts on Karda Nui.  Take a look at this:

This is your quote:  

Refia said:

Sorry, but Karda Nui was dull. Insanely so. It's a big cave. With a swamp in it.

And this is what Mutran says of Karda Nui:

The Mutran Chronicles, on Entry 10:, said:

Karda Nui – how to describe its glory, its wonder, its sheer beauty? How to capture the feeling one gets at the first sight of it? It isn’t easy, but let me try.

It’s a big cave. With a swamp in it.


I actually thought BIONICLE 2008 was an excellent year, and an excellent way to end the past eight years.  Of course, that is providing the Toa Nuva eventually wake up Mata Nui, contolled by Mata Nui.  That would be a nice way to end the saga when it eventually does end.  

Set-wise, the Phantoka were a little more like the Inika than I would have liked; I was hoping for possibly the re-introduction of a new Nuva torso.  Fortunately, though, the Phantoka did look like their old Nuva forms.  All the Makuta were great sets this year, especially the Phantoka Makuta, I thought they were some of the most villainous sets we've had in a while.  (The Piraka were sort of...smiley, the Barraki were mutants, and the Visorak and Vahki were swarms).  The last sets to give me that same villain feel were the Rahkshi.  So I did like the early sets, and the Titans and the vehicles were great (though Vultraz was a little puny).  I was disappointed by the regression of the Matoran to mere 14-piece action figures with no construction, especially after what I thought were spectacular 2007 Matoran sets.  The Mistika Toa, as has also been said here, were all disapointing.  They looked too little like themselves, even though Tahu and Onua did have minor (MINOR) resemblance.  I'm sure others echo me in saying, "GALI, what have they done to THEE!"  I was very glad to have the most complex Titan humanoid we've seen in YEARS; Takanuva even manages to be more complex than 2004 sets, and that's saying a lot.  The vehicles were also great, and of course the next step is Rahi with that kind of bulk and complexity.  

Story-wise, also great.  I really enjoyed all three books this year, and I thought the characters as a whole were nice.  Antroz, Chirox, and Vamprah were a little lacking in personality, especially Vamprah, but Mutran and Icarax were cool, and Bitil, Krika, and Gorast made up for it with a lot of personality insight during Bionicle Legends 10.  There was even a whole section in which each Makuta explored their inner thoughts.  

And the end was very epic.  The suspense, especially during the Icarax versus other Makuta fight, was intense.  Just the thought of something bad if the Toa awaken Mata Nui versus Icarax destroying the Toa Nuva and thereby (probably) giving the Bionicle universe a better chance was interesting in and of itself.  Krika had, IMO, by far the best character of the year, while I just HATED Gorast's character.  I don't mean that her characterization was bad, she was just the most unlikeable character of all, especially since she killed Krika AND Icarax and then went mad.  

The serials, as Grievous said, were also a HUGE step up from 2007, where it took all of one second to read a serial.  Now we have more to enjoy and to contemplate about.  

While many are disappointed by the ending of 2008,  I thought it clearly necessary.  I didn't want the original Toa and Matoran just dumped, I don't think any of us would have appreciated that 2001-2008 be forgotten completely, so something needed to be tied in.  Makuta taking command just makes him more awesome, and though it stinks that some cool characters like Mutran and Antroz had to die, it was all to make Makuta Teridax THE Makuta again.   And that's always a good thing.

Plus, 2008 I think has really set up the story to go in a new direction, and 2009 looks to be even better.  (Not to take anything away from 08.)  

On the subject of breaking pieces, I haven't had a single broken part in 2008.  However, I do not MOC, nor do I take my sets apart at all.  Several times one of the arms from Jetrax Antroz popped off (my own fault, I pulled too hard) and they did not break.  For me, 2005 was the worst year in respect for breaking pieces, I had TONS of broken pieces from 2005, and later 2006.  Things have improved for me since 2007, and here is to hoping that the hands and joints do not break for ANYONE in 2009!  

I remember when I felt like this before. I was somewhat young when I first saw the Lord of the Rings, the Fellowship, in theaters (the live-action movie).  I think it came out in winter of 2001, and I went to go see it with my father.  I remember how, when the movie ended (unbeknown to us) , we were both moving around in our seats, all pepped up, waiting for the next part to begin.  (We had never heard of Lord of the Rings before that and had no idea it was a three-part series).  That is how I feel now at the end of the 2008.  It is the end, in a way, but now here I am moving around in my seat, hardly being able to wait for the next part to begin.  


VK

Edited by Visorak-kal, 15 December 2008 - 10:01 PM.

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#16 matanui911

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Posted 16 December 2008 - 12:26 AM

Thanks for the comments guys.  I havent been on this thread for a while, an d I was looking at all of the posts and I saw this one, and I would like to comment.

View PostIkki o' Moopyville, on Dec 14 2008, 10:17 PM, said:

Sets



Cons:
-- grey and silver
-- clones and rehashed designs all over
-- floppy necks and limbs
-- low-quality plastic
-- boring vehicle designs
-- new joint types
-- Toa Mistika looking zilch like ol' Nuva
-- Takanuva's size

BORING VEHICLE DESIGNS?????

They are the most amazing vehicles I have seen!  Do not ever diss the mistika veicles!

Mataniu911 out

Edit: I mean for that to be a quote.  I guess i did it wrong.  Look above for who posted it if you wanted to know

EDIT: You forgot the closing tag. ; )

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Edited by JINZONINGEN 73, 16 December 2008 - 02:42 PM.


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#17 ShaddowCroc

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Posted 16 December 2008 - 07:27 AM

2008 was an overall awesome year at first, then in the middle it sagged, and I stopped paying attention. But the ending was EPIC AMAZAWESOME. Teridax is the greatest BIONICLE character ever (Yes, somehow better than Vezon.) and to see him finally win is awesome. There seriously needs to be more stories where the bad guy wins.

I see all the times Teridax has been defeated as showing him realistically. Nobody gets everything right all the time, and Teridax had to go through a lot of hard to get to the ultimate good.
And the Phantoa, and Mistoa (Except Gali) were awesome.
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#18 Ikki o' Moopyville

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Posted 16 December 2008 - 08:16 AM

View Postmatanui911, on Dec 16 2008, 01:26 AM, said:

Thanks for the comments guys.  I havent been on this thread for a while, an d I was looking at all of the posts and I saw this one, and I would like to comment.

View PostIkki o' Moopyville, on Dec 14 2008, 10:17 PM, said:

Sets



Cons:
-- grey and silver
-- clones and rehashed designs all over
-- floppy necks and limbs
-- low-quality plastic
-- boring vehicle designs
-- new joint types
-- Toa Mistika looking zilch like ol' Nuva
-- Takanuva's size

BORING VEHICLE DESIGNS?????

They are the most amazing vehicles I have seen!  Do not ever diss the mistika veicles!

Mataniu911 out

Edit: I mean for that to be a quote.  I guess i did it wrong.  Look above for who posted it if you wanted to know
:laugh: I think I need to clarify this a bit. I love the inctricate builds of the vehicles, the way clever techniques are used all over and how pieces fit together, However, as far as the actual LOOKS of the sets go -- their very appearances -- they are dreadfully dull. Two thirds of them resemble flying armed refridgerators, and only the Jetrax is remotely interesting in this aspect. I want vehicles with an actual design, vehicles that ideally are based off beasts. That is what rocked about the Vahki transport seen in LOMN or the Boxor or the absolutely fantastic Swamp Strider. I am a great fan of the way the vehicles are constructed, but their appearances strike no chords with me.

BTW, fix'd your quote tags. :wink:

-Ikk
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#19 Phaz-Ing

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Posted 16 December 2008 - 06:03 PM

Not really--I think because bionicle 2008 was so interconnected with bionicle 2001~2008, its fair to say that it didn't fail as an ending. As a set-year, I think the Nuva designs were dissapointing. I was expecting a redesign of the loved 2002 Nuva.

#20 matanui911

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Posted 16 December 2008 - 09:45 PM

View PostIkki o' Moopyville, on Dec 16 2008, 03:16 AM, said:

BORING VEHICLE DESIGNS?????

They are the most amazing vehicles I have seen!  Do not ever diss the mistika veicles!

Mataniu911 out

Edit: I mean for that to be a quote.  I guess i did it wrong.  Look above for who posted it if you wanted to know

:laugh: I think I need to clarify this a bit. I love the inctricate builds of the vehicles, the way clever techniques are used all over and how pieces fit together, However, as far as the actual LOOKS of the sets go -- their very appearances -- they are dreadfully dull. Two thirds of them resemble flying armed refridgerators, and only the Jetrax is remotely interesting in this aspect. I want vehicles with an actual design, vehicles that ideally are based off beasts. That is what rocked about the Vahki transport seen in LOMN or the Boxor or the absolutely fantastic Swamp Strider. I am a great fan of the way the vehicles are constructed, but their appearances strike no chords with me.

BTW, fix'd your quote tags. :wink:

-Ikk

I still love them


I meat for the I still love them to be outside the quote

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#21 Ikki o' Moopyville

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Posted 16 December 2008 - 09:52 PM

And I think that's great, because the more people who buy 'em, the more likely LEGO is to produce such large and intricate sets in the future! I simply prefer another style of sets. :classic: On a side note, I can't wait to see the Bara Magnian vehicle designs. Given the wilderness of the land, I hope I'm not setting my dreams to high when wishing for legged and winged crafts!

-Ikk
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#22 matanui911

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Posted 16 December 2008 - 10:59 PM

All we can do is wait  :sweet:

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#23 Umbra

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Posted 17 December 2008 - 05:59 PM

In 2008 Quality of Plastic has been Worse. Sets were great but allmost all my 08 Bionicle sets have broken parts. And now Lego Don't send me new pieces because they think that I have get too many pieces from Them....

#24 Algernon

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Posted 17 December 2008 - 07:51 PM

Good climatic ending, but otherwise this year is one of the worst for Bionicle. I've never missed 2001 more.

#25 matanui911

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Posted 17 December 2008 - 10:12 PM

View PostUmbra, on Dec 17 2008, 12:59 PM, said:

In 2008 Quality of Plastic has been Worse. Sets were great but allmost all my 08 Bionicle sets have broken parts. And now Lego Don't send me new pieces because they think that I have get too many pieces from Them....

My pieces have never broken....  I keep hearing about this

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