No Limits Buggy with Custom Electronics

[JJ2]

IMG_0560 by JJ2Sam, on Flickr

Hello,

Here is my new MOC I named "No limits",

It features

• Traxxas Titan 380 motor
  
• Tenergo 5000Mah 7.2V battery
  
• HobbyWing Quicrun ESC
  
• Futaba Standard Servo motor
  
• Custom CNC milled aluminum parts by Brick Machine Shope
  
• 3D printed 4bevel gear differential by kind Efferman :)
  
• FlySky remote + receiver
  

When I first build this it had full independent suspension but it was melting the CVjoints and UJ's I was using so I settled with a pendular rear suspension for rigidity and a single spring independent suspension for the front. Overall the suspension works well on pavement as well as on loose dirt or gravel terrain. Effermans custom differential works very well and has never ground gears even after my brutal driving and the high RPM's it is spinning at.

IMG_0557 by JJ2Sam, on Flickr IMG_0555 by JJ2Sam, on Flickr

The single spring front suspension really helps the performance because it basically allows one wheel to go up and the other down in the same motion much like a bogie but still allows up and down movement. One thing I am not happy about it is the HORRIBLE geometry since the top beams are monger then the bottom ones making it have a negative camber angle. The pendular rear suspension was the only choice since I dont have Effermans custom CV joint parts that would allow full independent suspension with drive.

IMG_0558 by JJ2Sam, on Flickr

IMG_0559 by JJ2Sam, on Flickr

I mounted the ESC and receiver up high to allow air flow to cool the parts and have easy access to them. The battery was mounted very low with only 2 plates protecting it from the ground kept the SOG really low so I could do full-throttle 90 degree turns without flipping over.

Overall it performs VERY well and has not flipped over ever and has broken the Lego speed record by doing 32kph

IMG_0586 by JJ2Sam, on Flickr

Hope you enjoy and please leave a vote on the poll on how you like the use of custom electronic parts.

Edited June 4, 2016 by JJ2

[schraubedrin]

Nice build!

i personally wouldn't build with third party, perfomant Motors and ESC.

For me that's not my purpose of building with LEGO.

Can you post pictures of destroyed or heavily used parts?

[nerdsforprez]

Valuable post and valuable discussion. Here are my thoughts:

If the adding of third party elements is to enhance Lego performance and simply increase the amount of customization allowed in LEGO then I am all for it. That is fun and simply because LEGO has limited parts does not mean that builders have to limits themselves as they build. I have mentioned this before..... personally, I like to build and create things. LEGO simply appears to be the best (IMO) medium for me to achieve that on the scale, budget, and time that I have. If I find other mediums that are better or offer more variety, they I use them. I engage in RC building, model building, and other hobbies as well. But don't engage in any quite as much as I do with LEGO. It simply, for me, is the best medium to accomplish what I want to do.

I have already tinkered with several projects similar to the one above

Tons of fun.

Here is the caveat though..... if one is doing such building to replace the fun or performance of RC then I think this is a bad move. If I recall correctly, someone on the Porsche thread mentioned they were going to throw a brushless system in the Porsche. Blakbird kindly requested pics of all the melted ABS :laugh: - and I could not agree more. LEGO plus third party parts will never reach the realm of RC racing/rock crawling. Attempts to match such performance will simply require too much third party to be used that the build no longer is LEGO and the builder may as well turn to RCing. That is what happened to my RC version of Sheepos mustang. Once it got going fast at all the back end bounced all around The videos I made didn't even reach the limit of the motor. The LEGO shocks were simply not strong enough to manage all the weight. I would have had to redo the whole suspension to reach the limits of the motor.

That being said.... I find no problem wanting to enhance the performance of LEGO MOCs, PF is simply too limiting. But do it for the fun of building, not to try and match the performance of RC.

Edited June 4, 2016 by nerdsforprez

[Lakop]

I vote no, simply becuase if I wanted a remote control buggy i would buy one (I actually do have one). My Lego is a hobby and I like to see what I can do with the parts provided. Having said that, I like the idea of having lights on lego mocs so third party lighting on a moc I would approve of. i'm sure we have seen that before on this forum. in the end it's upto the individual.

H

[JJ2]

Video is done! updated first post.

Nice build!

i personally wouldn't build with third party, perfomant Motors and ESC.

For me that's not my purpose of building with LEGO.

Can you post pictures of destroyed or heavily used parts?

Not many parts ere melted but one 7L beam that had a 4L axle through it that I didn't lube was fused to the beam.

Valuable post and valuable discussion. Here are my thoughts:

If the adding of third party elements is to enhance Lego performance and simply increase the amount of customization allowed in LEGO then I am all for it. That is fun and simply because LEGO has limited parts does not mean that builders have to limits themselves as they build. I have mentioned this before..... personally, I like to build and create things. LEGO simply appears to be the best (IMO) medium for me to achieve that on the scale, budget, and time that I have. If I find other mediums that are better or offer more variety, they I use them. I engage in RC building, model building, and other hobbies as well. But don't engage in any quite as much as I do with LEGO. It simply, for me, is the best medium to accomplish what I want to do.

I have already tinkered with several projects similar to the one above

Tons of fun.

Yes Your Mod was a heavy inspiration to this vehicle and motor choice, along with your awesome description on MOCpages.

Here is the caveat though..... if one is doing such building to replace the fun or performance of RC then I think this is a bad move. If I recall correctly, someone on the Porsche thread mentioned they were going to throw a brushless system in the Porsche. Blakbird kindly requested pics of all the melted ABS :laugh: - and I could not agree more. LEGO plus third party parts will never reach the realm of RC racing/rock crawling. Attempts to match such performance will simply require too much third party to be used that the build no longer is LEGO and the builder may as well turn to RCing. That is what happened to my RC version of Sheepos mustang. Once it got going fast at all the back end bounced all around The videos I made didn't even reach the limit of the motor. The LEGO shocks were simply not strong enough to manage all the weight. I would have had to redo the whole suspension to reach the limits of the motor.

That being said.... I find no problem wanting to enhance the performance of LEGO MOCs, PF is simply too limiting. But do it for the fun of building, not to try and match the performance of RC.

Well that might have been me in the Porsche thread and I totally agree with the opinions of using the 3rd party parts to enhance performance going out of the realm of just using a few custom parts many except.

I vote no, simply becuase if I wanted a remote control buggy i would buy one (I actually do have one). My Lego is a hobby and I like to see what I can do with the parts provided. Having said that, I like the idea of having lights on lego mocs so third party lighting on a moc I would approve of. i'm sure we have seen that before on this forum. in the end it's upto the individual.

H

Like I said to Nerdz I understand your opinion

Edited June 4, 2016 by JJ2

[z3_2drive]

You saw my comments on YouTube-really like this project, now for the discussion. I voted yes for obvious reasons :) And in the future I might try something like this, and I support those who do, as long as it is well thought out and not messy (least possible Lego parts mangled) which is hard when non Lego motors are thrown into the mix. This is where I've drawn the line with my past builds, because with non Lego motors it just feels not so Lego anymore. My last model only needed the motor controller to be attached to 2 5x7 frames with strong adhesive tape, which can still be removed. The pneumatic cylinders were the only truly modified Lego parts, everything else was original or printed. When builds like yours are done with respect to the original parts, I fully appreciate it. Can you explain or provide picture of how the drive and servo motors combine with the frame? If I attempt this in the future I will try to use printed or aluminum replicas to merge the non Lego motors to the Lego frame. Epoxy should be a 'if nothing else works' option. One last point: for me, I only need a couple more parts to make something like this, so it isn't a issue of cost, but for someone to attempt this for the first time, the required costs would be better spent towards an actual hobby RC project or RTR, if performance is what they're after. But, if they still enjoy the experience of building their project from scratch and challenging themselves, then doing something like this is fully respectable. Also, Lego speed record is a flexible term, maybe we should categorize it by original parts, custom electronics and power source, and custom electronics including motors :D

[Leonardo da Bricki]

That is pretty impressive! But I like to test the limits of pure Lego, although I accept 3rd party lights, cause Lego's lights are not that great IMO.

[BusterHaus]

The video was very fun to watch. It's exciting to see the how far ABS can be pushed. My building philosophy is very purist, but I really enjoy combinations of Lego with non-Lego components, be it RC components or pneumatics, like nerdsforprez has done in his recent projects. Great job.

[JJ2]

You saw my comments on YouTube-really like this project, now for the discussion. I voted yes for obvious reasons :) And in the future I might try something like this, and I support those who do, as long as it is well thought out and not messy (least possible Lego parts mangled) which is hard when non Lego motors are thrown into the mix. This is where I've drawn the line with my past builds, because with non Lego motors it just feels not so Lego anymore. My last model only needed the motor controller to be attached to 2 5x7 frames with strong adhesive tape, which can still be removed. The pneumatic cylinders were the only truly modified Lego parts, everything else was original or printed. When builds like yours are done with respect to the original parts, I fully appreciate it. Can you explain or provide picture of how the drive and servo motors combine with the frame? If I attempt this in the future I will try to use printed or aluminum replicas to merge the non Lego motors to the Lego frame. Epoxy should be a 'if nothing else works' option. One last point: for me, I only need a couple more parts to make something like this, so it isn't a issue of cost, but for someone to attempt this for the first time, the required costs would be better spent towards an actual hobby RC project or RTR, if performance is what they're after. But, if they still enjoy the experience of building their project from scratch and challenging themselves, then doing something like this is fully respectable. Also, Lego speed record is a flexible term, maybe we should categorize it by original parts, custom electronics and power source, and custom electronics including motors :D

The motor mount was copied from TechnicRobots video for using custom motors the servo motor was just fitted inside a 5x7 frame and some little nubs on the servo were sanded off for it to fit properly.

The video was very fun to watch. It's exciting to see the how far ABS can be pushed. My building philosophy is very purist, but I really enjoy combinations of Lego with non-Lego components, be it RC components or pneumatics, like nerdsforprez has done in his recent projects. Great job.

Thanks I am kind of a Lego purists in some ways and don't like using illegal building Techniques but I also like trying new things like this even if it is not %100 Lego if that makes any sense.

[PorkyMonster]

Nice creation there

My view in using 3rd party parts/components is simple - I see Lego as a highly versatile tool for us to create any object that we can imagine, and creativity and imagination has no boundaries... so why let Lego itself limit us? (and I'm pretty sure that the creator of Lego didn't want our creativity to be bounded by Lego as well...)

Edited June 4, 2016 by PorkyMonster

[PorkyMonster]

Here is the caveat though..... if one is doing such building to replace the fun or performance of RC then I think this is a bad move. If I recall correctly, someone on the Porsche thread mentioned they were going to throw a brushless system in the Porsche. Blakbird kindly requested pics of all the melted ABS :laugh: - and I could not agree more. LEGO plus third party parts will never reach the realm of RC racing/rock crawling. Attempts to match such performance will simply require too much third party to be used that the build no longer is LEGO and the builder may as well turn to RCing. That is what happened to my RC version of Sheepos mustang. Once it got going fast at all the back end bounced all around The videos I made didn't even reach the limit of the motor. The LEGO shocks were simply not strong enough to manage all the weight. I would have had to redo the whole suspension to reach the limits of the motor.

Interesting points there and I want to share my experience in tackling these challenges - (1) I've melted some parts too in my attempt to incorporate a brushless (oops! :laugh: ), but not any more after I've using ball bearings and applying silicone lubricant to the right parts... (2) there are many ways to improve the lego shocks' ability to handle weight - e.g. use multiple shocks in parallel, use 3rd party springs, use pneumatic parts from lego, etc. for me, I added 3rd party springs in parallel with part 32181c02 for damping in order to prop up my 4kg truck .

Granted that if the objective is to compete with RC, then we should just buy RC... but for me, the fun is in the process of creation itself... and solving challenges as they come along - first see if Lego has the necessary parts or whether I can work around by putting more parts together, if not, 3rd party components is the way to go, rather than discarding the entire creation just because I'm limited by Lego...

[AndyCW]

:thumbup: :thumbup:

[Lego Dino 500]

I voted yes. I'd like to see aftermarket RC components in technic MOCs, but it'd have to be with some caveats though. The problem is the parts simply can't tolerate the stress of such amounts of power and heat on them. If I had things like custom milled aluminum liftarms, motor mounts, and bearings I could mount axles and driveshafts in, then I would do this in a heartbeat. Or for example the CV axles, if someone could design some sintered aluminum replacements that could tolerate the stresses that'd be awesome.

[TheMindGarage]

I'm not a fan of custom electronics. The fastest I've ever managed to get a vehicle going was around 20kmph, but that was literally three EV3 Large motors, an EV3 brick (fitted with 1.5V batteries rather than my usual 1.2V rechargeables), some wheels and a couple of gears. It couldn't steer, and took ages to accelerate. I could probably have gotten slightly higher speeds by using the RC motors - this would avoid the need for massive gearing up.

I have however come close to matching the 0-60 time of a supercar through scaling. Some time ago, I made a 1:10 Koenigsegg One:1. It didn't have a gearbox (just drive, steering and suspension), but it did 0-6mph (remember this is 1:10 scale) in 2.7 seconds - very similar to the real car's 0-60.

[JJ2]

Interesting points there and I want to share my experience in tackling these challenges - (1) I've melted some parts too in my attempt to incorporate a brushless (oops! :laugh: ), but not any more after I've using ball bearings and applying silicone lubricant to the right parts... (2) there are many ways to improve the lego shocks' ability to handle weight - e.g. use multiple shocks in parallel, use 3rd party springs, use pneumatic parts from lego, etc. for me, I added 3rd party springs in parallel with part 32181c02 for damping in order to prop up my 4kg truck .

Granted that if the objective is to compete with RC, then we should just buy RC... but for me, the fun is in the process of creation itself... and solving challenges as they come along - first see if Lego has the necessary parts or whether I can work around by putting more parts together, if not, 3rd party components is the way to go, rather than discarding the entire creation just because I'm limited by Lego...

You creation does sound interesting! It would be cool for you to post a topic about this.

:thumbup: :thumbup:

I voted yes. I'd like to see aftermarket RC components in technic MOCs, but it'd have to be with some caveats though. The problem is the parts simply can't tolerate the stress of such amounts of power and heat on them. If I had things like custom milled aluminum liftarms, motor mounts, and bearings I could mount axles and driveshafts in, then I would do this in a heartbeat. Or for example the CV axles, if someone could design some sintered aluminum replacements that could tolerate the stresses that'd be awesome.

You can buy all this stuff I used on the internet for about ~$80 depending on where you live, or if you get lucky with a sale, maybe even less depending on which battery you buy.

[PunkTacoNYC]

I think its cool and definitely unique with its custom, pro-rc parts. I would not, however, say that this breaks the previous speed record for Legos as it's performance relies 95% upon non-Lego batteries, motors, escs, etc. For example, I found this

a while back that was super cool, easily breaking all other (at the time) Lego speed records with its ~25 MPH limit. Although it did not actually break any Lego speed records as it had a modified M motor and non-lego battery, there is certainly something to be said for the performance of it, pure lego or not.

Keep 'em coming!

pt

[JJ2]

I think its cool and definitely unique with its custom, pro-rc parts. I would not, however, say that this breaks the previous speed record for Legos as it's performance relies 95% upon non-Lego batteries, motors, escs, etc. For example, I found this

a while back that was super cool, easily breaking all other (at the time) Lego speed records with its ~25 MPH limit. Although it did not actually break any Lego speed records as it had a modified M motor and non-lego battery, there is certainly something to be said for the performance of it, pure lego or not.

Keep 'em coming!

pt

Yes the Lemans was another inspiration to this but I never said this breaks the Lego speed record because I crossed out the Lego

Lego speed record by doing 32kph

[PorkyMonster]

You creation does sound interesting! It would be cool for you to post a topic about this.

I guess... we'll get there (am just afraid that the lego purists will shoot me down fast and furious :cry_sad: :grin: )

[Mantarri]

The only custom electronics I might use would be perhaps an SBrick, and custom converter cables to hook up PF to Mindstorms [NXT].

[JJ2]

I guess... we'll get there (am just afraid that the lego purists will shoot me down fast and furious :cry_sad: :grin: )

Don't worry about the purists! You can do two things, put a warning in the video like I did or Since everyone has their own personal opinion just be entitled to yours.

[JJ2]

For the curious here is how I mounted the Servo motor to Lego

IMG_0589 by JJ2Sam, on Flickr

IMG_0598 by JJ2Sam, on Flickr

IMG_0599 by JJ2Sam, on Flickr

and also after remembering I took these photos here are two of the very early prototypes

IMG_0342 by JJ2Sam, on Flickr

IMG_0541 by JJ2Sam, on Flickr

that was the 3rd and 4th prototypes or this (Don't have pictures of the 1st and 2nd)

[__________________________]

For the curious here is how I mounted the Servo motor to Lego

IMG_0589 by JJ2Sam, on Flickr

IMG_0598 by JJ2Sam, on Flickr

IMG_0599 by JJ2Sam, on Flickr

and also after remembering I took these photos here are two of the very early prototypes

IMG_0342 by JJ2Sam, on Flickr

IMG_0541 by JJ2Sam, on Flickr

that was the 3rd and 4th prototypes or this (Don't have pictures of the 1st and 2nd)

Ah thanks, I have never seen an explanation of how to connect servo.

[PorkyMonster]

For the curious here is how I mounted the Servo motor to Lego

IMG_0589 by JJ2Sam, on Flickr

Nice! When I mount my servo I didn't think of this, and didn't have 3L axles with stud at that time either. But this looks less bulky than my method.

Maybe I'll use this method in my next build .

Edited June 10, 2016 by PorkyMonster

[iLego]

Wonderful use of custom electronics to improve performance. Can you please provide some tips on how to mechanically mate 3rd party motors with lego, especially the driving motor with lego gears.

I live in a region where lego PF components are not available. And buying from bricklink is too expensive due to international shipping and import duties. So I want to try out non-lego motors and see how far I can go.

[JJ2]

Wonderful use of custom electronics to improve performance. Can you please provide some tips on how to mechanically mate 3rd party motors with lego, especially the driving motor with lego gears.

I live in a region where lego PF components are not available. And buying from bricklink is too expensive due to international shipping and import duties. So I want to try out non-lego motors and see how far I can go.

Thanks for your feedback.

Technic robot made an excellent way to do this

But since Traxxas and other RC brand motors have a notch in them so when you get the copper tube I would recommend crimping it to fit the shaft tightly and cut two notches in the tube for less chance of it braking. This might take a few tries to get it right so don't get discouraged (It took me about 5 times to get it right) it might take you less though. Second I would recommend using a 550 motor because the motor I was using was in high stress, also be very heavy handed with the lithium grease to keep parts lubricated, or use barrings if you have access to them.

Hope I helped,

JJ2